Veno = Barb?

Psytrac - Dreamweaver
Psytrac - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,488 Arc User
edited January 2010 in General Discussion
ok, so this may be a bit of a rant, but I don't care..


I decided to do a Qingzi run for someone who needed it (not that I did, being a level 67 veno) and we get to Qingzi, I spell out clearly my shaodu has only level 1 flesh ream and not to attack for a while. The wizard decides to start wailing on him immediately and starts yelling at me to take agro back, well I only managed to do so after he died (we had 3 clerics, and they couldn't keep up with the damage being dealt to him) we rez him and he dismisses the squad, meaning we get to start all over again.

So we reform now with a psychic and an archer, and I stop and spell out clearly the same thing a second time, but neither would listen. In this case nobody died however. I went to their faction leader, who decided to approve of those actions by his faction members, so at this point, I will no longer squad with any of that faction.

What's the kicker here? well, the guy told me i was using a nix, in an instance. Yet he's said he plays all classes.

now my question: Should a veno be treated EXACTLY like a barb when tanking a boss?
I'm a guy, not a woman, that is all
"When you're on Team Bring it, every morning your feet hit the floor, the good lord says "good morning" and the devil says 'Oh **** they're up' " - Dwayne "The Rock" Johnson
Are you on Team Bring it?
Post edited by Psytrac - Dreamweaver on
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Comments

  • Ax - Harshlands
    Ax - Harshlands Posts: 58 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    The answer is obviously no. However with such level difference between you and the BHers, you could have just had on the the clerics healing you while you nuked Qingzi..quite easy given his slow magic attacks that he uses at range and your mdef.
  • Rillien - Heavens Tear
    Rillien - Heavens Tear Posts: 569 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Bottom line: At those levels there are tons of people who have little squad experience. They will either learn from their mistakes or fail repeatedly, but all you can do is move on and hope for a better squad next time.
  • Murloc/ - Heavens Tear63
    Murloc/ - Heavens Tear63 Posts: 3 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Veno does not = Barb. Period.

    tbh, You're a better person then me. i'd have just ditched squad and ported out while they all got killed.
  • tweakz
    tweakz Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    People never learn. There's Stygean in FB79, and wiz's still ignore that this boss is high pdef and ranged. Hercs have no reflect aggro, and lower dmg aggro on this boss and so many Wiz's still go all out despite how many times they die. b:chuckle
    Be kind: Help the GMs to depopulate the servers.
  • Reane - Sanctuary
    Reane - Sanctuary Posts: 140 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    well honestly if i was you, id say "my way or highway" because if they dont want to listen to the highered help then dont help em. I'd freaking ditch them and let them eat qingzis dirt
    Reane-archer-82
    HeavensRage-blademaster-65
    HeavenSorrow-venomancer-74
    Abby_G-assassin-57
  • DrunkWizard - Lost City
    DrunkWizard - Lost City Posts: 523 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    some ppl dont get than the big part of herc getting agro is by reflecting dmg if some1 steals is pretty hard for herc to get agro again unless he dies.
    thats why i atk after maybe 30-50k hp of boss n start with nukes at maybe 70% hp
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Psytrac - Dreamweaver
    Psytrac - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,488 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    well, the fact is I don't have a herc either. I use a shadou cub, the same pet I tank FUSHMA with.
    I'm a guy, not a woman, that is all
    "When you're on Team Bring it, every morning your feet hit the floor, the good lord says "good morning" and the devil says 'Oh **** they're up' " - Dwayne "The Rock" Johnson
    Are you on Team Bring it?
  • Saitada - Sanctuary
    Saitada - Sanctuary Posts: 3,220 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    level 1 FR on the cub is kinda hard, as you yourself stated to the squad, for your pet to get a good agro hold on the mob. That they were unwilling to listen, and got themselves killed for doing it is their problem, not yours.

    I have pulled bosses and had someone start all out on them. When the boss switches agro, I don't even bother to try and take it back, I just port out and let them wipe.

    If they are not willing to listen in the first place, then they are not worth my time or effort to help them.

    ~Saitada

    I have an admirer. See my post here about them.
  • Psytrac - Dreamweaver
    Psytrac - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,488 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    wow, you're mean bro lol

    but I'm starting to think I should start doing it too. (probably would have if it was not for the 3 clerics I was doing it for in the first place)
    I'm a guy, not a woman, that is all
    "When you're on Team Bring it, every morning your feet hit the floor, the good lord says "good morning" and the devil says 'Oh **** they're up' " - Dwayne "The Rock" Johnson
    Are you on Team Bring it?
  • Hemoglobin - Dreamweaver
    Hemoglobin - Dreamweaver Posts: 68 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    i kind of did in hh today what the wizzy in your squad did. b:sad i guess i attacked too soon and i stole agro from a 92 veno >_> maybe i should wait until hp is at 75%?
  • Psytrac - Dreamweaver
    Psytrac - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,488 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    typically vone wait till about 1/3 is gone. I always ask for half to be on the safe side, no one listens fully anyway
    I'm a guy, not a woman, that is all
    "When you're on Team Bring it, every morning your feet hit the floor, the good lord says "good morning" and the devil says 'Oh **** they're up' " - Dwayne "The Rock" Johnson
    Are you on Team Bring it?
  • Mayfly - Dreamweaver
    Mayfly - Dreamweaver Posts: 6,094 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Next time, if you're doing it for someone in particular, be squad leader, and kick the ones that won't listen. There's no need to have a full squad every time.

    You should also consider replacing flesh ream with bash, and leveling it up... flesh ream isn't all that great an aggro holder. (Has over twice the cooldown of bash.)
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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  • Giodia - Heavens Tear
    Giodia - Heavens Tear Posts: 475 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Last night, BH Zimo....

    Another archer in the team started Barrage on Zimo and yells "cover me"....

    Squad wiped... me being the last to die...

    When these people sux... they sabotage everyone in the team.

    There are high levels who condone the behaviours of these newbies while doing their BH for them, in which they can start nuking as soon as they could.

    No one told them it's wrong or they simply dismiss the comments. So for later Bh's they are doing the same thing, but getting everyone to suffer the exp lost with them.

    While serving BH duties on Bh 39 on my veno, these newbies wouldn't bother listening too. In the end, I just left squad halfway during Farren.
  • Saitada - Sanctuary
    Saitada - Sanctuary Posts: 3,220 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Mayfly - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Next time, if you're doing it for someone in particular, be squad leader, and kick the ones that won't listen. There's no need to have a full squad every time.

    You should also consider replacing flesh ream with bash, and leveling it up... flesh ream isn't all that great an aggro holder. (Has over twice the cooldown of bash.)

    Bash is pretty nice. My Herc uses it exclusively, and my Nix would have it if I hadn't leveled FR up as far as I have.

    Bash is like pouring gasoline on the mob and tossing a match at them, it really burns them up. XD

    ~Saitada
  • Jennalicious - Sanctuary
    Jennalicious - Sanctuary Posts: 1,073 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Giodia - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Another archer in the team started Barrage on Zimo and yells "cover me"....

    Squad wiped

    I LOL'd at this. Cover me! Pretty much the same as saying," I'm an idiot, so bail me out." Everyone will come across plenty of fail squads full of people who don't know how to play their chosen class. When part of a fail squad, let them do their thing, bail out, save yourself, and find a non-fail squad.
  • Giodia - Heavens Tear
    Giodia - Heavens Tear Posts: 475 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Jennalicious - Sanctuary wrote: »
    I LOL'd at this. Cover me! Pretty much the same as saying," I'm an idiot, so bail me out." Everyone will come across plenty of fail squads full of people who don't know how to play their chosen class. When part of a fail squad, let them do their thing, bail out, save yourself, and find a non-fail squad.

    It's either a long wait either way to get the BH done. Getting my guild to help may not always happen.

    Guess what happens? The 2 barbs in the squad who died repeatedly, ended up as DDs to the Herc.
  • Psytrac - Dreamweaver
    Psytrac - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,488 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Giodia - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    It's either a long wait either way to get the BH done. Getting my guild to help may not always happen.

    Guess what happens? The 2 barbs in the squad who died repeatedly, ended up as DDs to the Herc.
    Herc is a one-man army though
    I'm a guy, not a woman, that is all
    "When you're on Team Bring it, every morning your feet hit the floor, the good lord says "good morning" and the devil says 'Oh **** they're up' " - Dwayne "The Rock" Johnson
    Are you on Team Bring it?
  • MystiMonk - Sanctuary
    MystiMonk - Sanctuary Posts: 4,286 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Psytrac - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Herc is a one-man army though

    It all depends on the lvl of the Herc and the Veno controlling it.
    Originally Posted by Giodia - Heavens Tear View Post
    It's either a long wait either way to get the BH done. Getting my guild to help may not always happen.

    Guess what happens? The 2 barbs in the squad who died repeatedly, ended up as DDs to the Herc.
    I had no problem with my lvl 30 Barb forgeot what the sqd was made up of.
    Looking for a decent casual understanding Faction.
  • Psytrac - Dreamweaver
    Psytrac - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,488 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    MystiMonk - Sanctuary wrote: »
    It all depends on the lvl of the Herc and the Veno controlling it.
    truer words never spoken, but the assumption was a decent veno, not just any veno
    I'm a guy, not a woman, that is all
    "When you're on Team Bring it, every morning your feet hit the floor, the good lord says "good morning" and the devil says 'Oh **** they're up' " - Dwayne "The Rock" Johnson
    Are you on Team Bring it?
  • XxIfritxX - Lost City
    XxIfritxX - Lost City Posts: 170 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Like I always say if something went wrong blame the "Wiz"

    even if he still didn't get inside the Bh b:laugh

    just kdn I Love pissing off my wizzy frnds n archers by blaming them :P
    All my Goals in Life Turned to be Offside b:surrender
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Elronia - Heavens Tear
    Elronia - Heavens Tear Posts: 91 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Sadly a herc or veno herc will not ever replace a good barbarian for me on El. They need too be a good few levels higher an then i be very hesitant too attack for at least 1st 10% of the bosses health. I can pull aggro from barbs my level without trying so im really carful when Veno plays tank. Lower levels dont seem too realise this though an till they died a few hundred times they'll never get it.
  • Psytrac - Dreamweaver
    Psytrac - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,488 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    especially at your level, but with a level 103 veno tank pet like shaodu you could hold off a while longer than 10% and it would probably be able to hold agro, no?

    I'm talking about a 20 level difference, easily
    I'm a guy, not a woman, that is all
    "When you're on Team Bring it, every morning your feet hit the floor, the good lord says "good morning" and the devil says 'Oh **** they're up' " - Dwayne "The Rock" Johnson
    Are you on Team Bring it?
  • Lusca - Sanctuary
    Lusca - Sanctuary Posts: 754 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Giodia - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Last night, BH Zimo....

    Another archer in the team started Barrage on Zimo and yells "cover me"....

    lmfao
    i would of probably fallen out of my chair laughing if an archer did that in one of my bh
  • IDaun - Dreamweaver
    IDaun - Dreamweaver Posts: 261 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    ....b:cry

    tbh, just let the DDer die, then kick him from squad and continue killing for the people that know how to play. I'm tired of DDers 'defending' themselves with 'I can't help it' and 'it's the tank's issue, not mine'. Learn to play.

    Also... a wizzie that can't tank Qingzi with three clerics on him fails. I've had /archers/ in that level range tank him with that many clerics.
    [SIGPIC]http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=7660692001&dateline=1259283228[/SIGPIC]
  • _Aphrael_ - Sanctuary
    _Aphrael_ - Sanctuary Posts: 76 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    I routinely tank bosses in BH89 and you would be amazed how many lvl90+ players have no concept of how agro works. Even with lvl5 bash it is easy for a wiz or archer to take agro if they go all out and inevitably they call me noob when they take agro and die. Since I often do runs with no cleric I just leave them dead on the floor/running back from town and kill the boss anyway.
  • Psytrac - Dreamweaver
    Psytrac - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,488 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    _Aphrael_ - Sanctuary wrote: »
    I routinely tank bosses in BH89 and you would be amazed how many lvl90+ players have no concept of how agro works. Even with lvl5 bash it is easy for a wiz or archer to take agro if they go all out and inevitably they call me noob when they take agro and die. Since I often do runs with no cleric I just leave them dead on the floor/running back from town and kill the boss anyway.
    and both together, it's even easier..
    I'm a guy, not a woman, that is all
    "When you're on Team Bring it, every morning your feet hit the floor, the good lord says "good morning" and the devil says 'Oh **** they're up' " - Dwayne "The Rock" Johnson
    Are you on Team Bring it?
  • Vitenka - Dreamweaver
    Vitenka - Dreamweaver Posts: 4,125 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Yes, it is annoying that DDers expect you to take back aggro - and don't stop casting whilst they demand it!

    Do they think that our pet has some magical extra aggro skill we didn't already use?


    And what's really annoying? With 'roar' on the new default pet, this is actually going to be true. So we steal aggro back, and lose it on the wizards next cast. How are we gonna explain the 60s cooldown in a way they understand?
  • Lusca - Sanctuary
    Lusca - Sanctuary Posts: 754 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Vitenka - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    So we steal aggro back, and lose it on the wizards next cast. How are we gonna explain the 60s cooldown in a way they understand?

    ITZ R HAV 60 SECEND KOOL DAWN!1q!11
  • ChaoticTears - Harshlands
    ChaoticTears - Harshlands Posts: 323 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    Psytrac - Dreamweaver wrote: »

    now my question: Should a veno be treated EXACTLY like a barb when tanking a boss?

    No chance, pets suck at holding agro on normal bosses. The squad needs to control their DPS until the pet has firm agro.

    Simple rule: If you cant tank the boss yourself with no heals dont try and steal agro
    [SIGPIC]http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb311/gav-d29/Crithit.jpg[/SIGPIC]
  • Psytrac - Dreamweaver
    Psytrac - Dreamweaver Posts: 2,488 Arc User
    edited January 2010
    ChaoticTears - Harshlands wrote: »
    No chance, pets suck at holding agro on normal bosses. The squad needs to control their DPS until the pet has firm agro.

    Simple rule: If you cant tank the boss yourself with no heals dont try and steal agro
    I made that mistake once on rend, never will again.

    the sad truth is most DDs now don't know how to control themselves
    I'm a guy, not a woman, that is all
    "When you're on Team Bring it, every morning your feet hit the floor, the good lord says "good morning" and the devil says 'Oh **** they're up' " - Dwayne "The Rock" Johnson
    Are you on Team Bring it?

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