Who wants Veno Swimming Mastery back???

IceJazmin - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Since it only affects venos I would guess only venos want it back. Once they remove the bonuses from your true form, who do you think will want those bonuses back? An archer?

If they remove bonuses on true form, I'll QQ. b:angry

StormHydra - Sanctuary wrote: »

Yes i would. No seriously. If they did that it would affect the game so much it wouldnt even be funny. It would be alot harder to do a BH/TT/FB run

Well there you go. An archer will QQ about true form but not how fast THE most annoying class in the game swims b:victory

The thing is, swimming mastery is half useless in this game. Yes, it might be hard at lvl 50-60 at misfortune, but then you swim as fast as everyone else.

Water isn't a big deal, and venos are going to try to avoid water anyways because the selection of water pets blows, not to mention no legendary water pet for water. It's not a matter of it being half or even 90% useless.

Clerics dont QQ as much about their gimped running speed, (yes they fly fast, but can you fly in a dungeon where their skills are most needed? no) and they need faster running speed.

Ahh, but cleric run speed is a class stat just like the run speed of every class. Swimming mastery is an untamed racial ability just like flight mastery is for winged elves. A proper analogy would be like saying archers lost flight mastery just because. It's not an issue of the skill being powerful, it's about being consistent. If it's a racial ability it should apply to both classes in the race rather than just one. If it's a racial ability that's being moved to tideborn... fine, then remove it from both and be done with it.

Swimming mastery is only like 800 spirit or something (level 9 i think)

800 might be high at level 9 (not sure anymore honestly), but after playing for even a week 800 is nothing. I don't think the cost has anyone being rational about it upset.

oh, i dont know....i've always done a lot of leveling of my characters in the water, since the air and water mobs have better exp. and i always keep a turtle leveled up as much as i can, since there ARE quests that are in the water. its going to be interesting to see how he compares to the plumpfish, when i can get one.

so, yes, i was peeved them they took the ability away, with no word or explanation.

Brael - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Water isn't a big deal, and venos are going to try to avoid water anyways because the selection of water pets blows, not to mention no legendary water pet for water. It's not a matter of it being half or even 90% useless.

s1ic3r wrote: »

And the thing is, venos get their summer sprint at the same time barbs get their increased speed from true form (lvl 9)...correct? That means that, in order to keep the classes balanced (HA!), they had to take away swimming mastery from venos...it's as simple as that.

False in two ways, not counting your falsely based conclusion.

1: Venos don't get sprint until levels 29, 59, and 89 respectively for the first three levels. Barb true form comes at 9, 29, and 59 respectively for the first three levels. So Barbs will always have their peed boost faster than venos.

2: Sprint gives a lower speed boost than true form. 15% at level 1, 25% at level 2, and 35% at level 3. True Form is 20% at level 1 (20 levels before venos can even learn sprint), 35% at level 2 (so by the time venos get sprint, barbs are already running at what is, in essence, the speed of a maxed sprint not counting sage/demon), and 50% at level 3 (which beats the sage/demon sprint speed long before a veno can even get there).

Thus, if it were to keep classes balanced as you implied, it should be the Barbs who lost swimming mastery instead o venos.



On a relevant side note, barbs can get sage/demon true form at 89. Venos have to wait til 92 to get sage/demon sprint. Sage/Demon true form speed? 80% as long as they're in kitty mode. Veno sprint speed? 45% for 10 minutes. Plus only Demon veno gets the fox speed boost which only applies to 6 seconds after transforming, so to keep their speed continually like a barb can, they'd have to switch in and out of fox immediately after the cooldown... and tick their charm often (assuming they had one on) because they lose 20% of their max MP just by switching to fox form.

I voted Yes. Why add a skills if it has no effect? Makes no sense. And yes I bought it too when I was low lvl and it's annoying that it doesn't work.

Brael - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Ahh, but cleric run speed is a class stat just like the run speed of every class. Swimming mastery is an untamed racial ability just like flight mastery is for winged elves. A proper analogy would be like saying archers lost flight mastery just because. It's not an issue of the skill being powerful, it's about being consistent. If it's a racial ability it should apply to both classes in the race rather than just one. If it's a racial ability that's being moved to tideborn... fine, then remove it from both and be done with it.

They weren't born to swim and Elves were born to fly it is why we got flight mastery.There are those who don't even buy cashshop wings and keep the natural ones.

2: Sprint gives a lower speed boost than true form. 15% at level 1, 25% at level 2, and 35% at level 3. True Form is 20% at level 1 (20 levels before venos can even learn sprint), 35% at level 2 (so by the time venos get sprint, barbs are already running at what is, in essence, the speed of a maxed sprint not counting sage/demon), and 50% at level 3 (which beats the sage/demon sprint speed long before a veno can even get there).

Barbs are slower than Venos in always only in tigerform can they run faster.

I voted yes because I heard that someone decided that venos don't need swimming mastery.. Like they can decide what skills we need :S And if barbs can keep it, why not venos..?

btw,I dint bother to read all the pages so if someone had good answer why venos should not have swimming mastery, I didint read it.
And this thread is going to be closed more likely very soon.>.<

Ilenka - Harshlands wrote: »

How you know that??? + curious +

Well there is many thread like this in venomancer section. Idk if this is going to be closed but moved maybe.

Kitsuneh - Lost City wrote: »

Well there is many thread like this in venomancer section. Idk if this is going to be closed but moved maybe.

Kitsuneh=Wanna Be Mod....... But here is your downfall Kitsuneh your too rude. Atleast when I read your posts (in previous threads) it seems your a very rude person.


Back to Topic- Yes bring back Swimming Mastery

What's the point of this thread or any thread like this? When was the last time that a poll on the forum made a difference in what changes happen in the game?

I would like it back. Or give me a refund of my coin and spirit. Simply because I got it waaaay back in September of 2008, when it still worked. (Yes, the description was "N/A" but it DID actually work. Believe it or not.) There was no forewarning about it's removal. I merely noticed by going into the water and realizing I was having flashbacks to running like my cleric. b:shocked

Since then I've avoided water like the plague. If my water pet dies, I'm fish fodder, the end. I can't get out of the water fast enough, not even with the spacebar, nothing. Lol. I'm a Venokitty anyways, kitties have a natural fear of the water. It fits. b:chuckle


A few points on previous arguments in this topic:

1. The "shared race ability" for the Untamed is the ability to switch into defensive animal form. (Fox Form;True Form)

2. Do NOT remove the Barbs swimming speed ability. Why? What if the tank needs to grab aggro from a respawn/rogue mob fast? He's going to have to get OVER to it fast! He's not long-ranged. Lol. Swimming quickly for underwater tanking is a necessity when things go wrong. If you're going to remove the Barb swimboost, make sure True Form boosts swimming speed as well.

3. Randomly attacking "greedy venos" and going on about OP is irrational and an overdone point that has become mute. Get creative with your responses or even (better yet!) notice the Original Poster is an ARCHER. Not to mention, it negatively affects only VENOS. So who's going to be upset by it? VENOS. (And do not use True Form or anything that hurts multiple classes as a counterpoint example. If a change hinders ONLY one class, that class ALONE will by upset by it. Common sense.)

4. "Blah blah blah, Tideborn". Whether or not it has ANYTHING to do with Tideborn, we do NOT know because we do not work for PWE. Thus we do NOT know what's happening behind the scenes. So don't discuss it like it's FACT. If it were about the Tideborn, Barbs would have it removed too, because only the Tideborn would be able to swim fast if that were the case because it would be THEIR ability. Just like humans get Distance Shrink/Cloud Sprint and elves have Flight Mastery. There is an exception, explained below.


The way I see it (from point #4) is that they decided Elves would be faster in air, Humans on land and the Untamed in water (a conclusion I came to in '08 while looking at class skill charts.) But plans have changed since then (we can ONLY speculate on why.) Untamed still have their speed boost. Venos get Summer Sprint (human) and Barbs get True Form (tiger). I'm guessing the developers let Barbs keep their swimboost because of point #2 and they were too lazy to edit True Form and just removed the Veno swimboost. Sloppy and uncompleted work, yes, but isn't that so PWI anyways?



This is what they should do (in my opinion):
1. Edit True Form to boost swimming speed too.
2. Remove* and REFUND Barb swimboost.
3. Remove* and REFUND Veno swimboost.

*By "remove" I mean, do not even let us purchase it. Do not have the icon, nothing, nadda. It shouldn't even be in the Untamed skill charts. (Let's act like professionals, PWI! I know you ARE capable of that, even on the player's level.)

This way the Untamed would still have their speed boosts based on human/tiger form and Barbs wouldn't still get the swimboost when in non-tiger form, when they aren't being asked to tank. (At least, I hope none of you are tanking in non-tiger form.)


I still voted "Yes", because the poll implies nothing is done to the Barb swimboost, let alone their True Form. Nor does it mention refunds, etc. It is too limited on it's answers for my taste. So I'm more or less 'pinned' into voting "Yes". But I don't expect anything to be done. It's not the hugest issue at the moment. And PWI has a history of not fixing huge issues, let alone small ones. Lol.


EDIT: The reason only Barb speedboost should transfer over to swimming is because they're expected to tank with True Form. Venos aren't usually expected to tank in human form. o__O

StormHydra - Sanctuary wrote: »

...
If you could trade spirit, even I could refund the spirit and coin that you use to buy swimming mastery.

800 SPIRIT. 1000 COINS. BIG DEAL. It would take the same amount of time to kill mobs to get the spirit/coin back than it would make all these posts about it. Most of you are are lvl 40+...Easy

*ahem* No one said it was a big deal (as far as I remember), they said it would be nice and/or preferred.

It's only brownie points, which make a HUGE difference when handled by a faceless corporation. They don't have to bother with civilities (like proper exchange for a canceled result) but they do because they *gasp* might actually care about me? The player? Their potential customer? Lol.

It's not the end of the world. Duh. It would just be nice to see them go a tiny extra mile, as if they actually cared. And like I stated before, it's not expected of them.


If someone actually acted as if it were a big deal, they deserve that big wall of red text you threw out. Next time, quote them (so as to target them specifically) instead of throwing it at EVERYONE in the thread.

StormHydra - Sanctuary wrote: »

And People who said that the OP is an archer...Well Im a BladeMaster, a mage and a cleric as well. She probably made a veno and noticed it didnt work which is why she started this thread/poll. I only knew it was screwed up because of this thread.

Yes, you only knew it was screwed up because of this thread. You do NOT play a Veno. This is something that does NOT leak over to other classes. It does NOT affect you, so you do NOT care. We get it.

She does infact have a Veno. She has stated this. I would say the fact that she's posting as a level 61 Archer, goes to show that she could be negatively affected by the swimboost being re-implemented. She doesn't play ONLY a Veno. Do you see where I'm going with this? Do I have to keep explaining? Or do I have to spell it out for you?



EDIT: I just noticed your sig, and "amen!" to all that's in it! Lol. So true, so very true.