Archers fail?

FoxMizore - Sanctuary · October 2009

Ive read so many comments about archers weakenesses and that they fail endgame.Is leveling my archer worth it? b:sad

Miugre - Heavens Tear · October 2009

What elements of the endgame are you specifically interested in? TT/Frost/Lunar? TWs?

I dunno, to me it's not about the endgame, it's about how much fun you have on the way there. :P

DarkSniper - Lost City · October 2009

Endgame is where everyone gets bored and quits so thats not really important.

Alliptica - Lost City · October 2009

archer is the best!

Transcend - Lost City · October 2009

It's usually the people that fail archers imo

Zirrila - Heavens Tear · October 2009

Transcend - Lost City wrote: »

It's usually the people that fail archers imo

Agreed b:victoryb:laugh

TigerLily - Lost City · October 2009

FoxMizore - Sanctuary wrote: »

Ive read so many comments about archers weakenesses and that they fail endgame.Is leveling my archer worth it? b:sad

Archers are really amazing endgame if you're rich. Its a very gear dependent class that don't really shine unless you're prepared to spend some to get a decent grade 13-14 weapon and refine gear. Its just like wizards... or squishy DD-classes in general in most MMOs, they cost money if you want them good.

Ppl that say archers can do just fine in regular gear, as long as you "know the strengths of the class" are either lying, they only pk lowbies or they play on the pve server. So if you don't plan on investing its not really worth leveling an archer, than i suggest just keep playing the veno ^.^

Unlike archers venos do just fine in mediocre gear, as long as you have a decent build, upgraded skills and a nix b:cute

KedgeSniper - Lost City · October 2009

But also a veno is expensive, gettin herd or nyx, it's around 20m+ n to be honest a veno without those, it's not so hard to kill..

Lily speak the truth, u really want high refines but any class does. A barb without refines easy to kill, such as bm, veno, cleric etc..

Watch transcend videos ^ he post before me.

They will give ya an idea of archer pvp

MagicHamsta - Lost City · October 2009

KedgeSniper - Lost City wrote: »

But also a veno is expensive, gettin herd or nyx, it's around 20m+ n to be honest a veno without those, it's not so hard to kill..

Lily speak the truth, u really want high refines but any class does. A barb without refines easy to kill, such as bm, veno, cleric etc..

Watch transcend videos ^ he post before me.

They will give ya an idea of archer pvp

(O.o)
venos can get herds?
of cows?
=O
nothing can stand against that!
(>.<)'

lol ya I see decent archers all the time.
And then there are fail archers.
DX
also it depends what you want to do.
anything involving a boss = archers = good. sharpen tooth arrow FTW~
xD

Sevas - Heavens Tear · October 2009

My second favorite class to have in a squad with me. When a barb fails a catch and there is no BM or the BM misses too, it's usually the archer that saves my **** next with their stun skill. I'm less squishy than other venos, but I still like it when I don't have to take a hit. Archers are near if not at the top of the list for highest DPS in game.

Accelerated - Sanctuary · October 2009

Archers are sloooooooooooooooooow when they're doing normal physical damage; hell, they're the slowest physical attackers. Unless they're using fists/claws. b:sleep Not my style of game play, in any way. But the girl archers do look purty b:dirty.

Ayano-chan - Sanctuary · October 2009

DarkSniper - Lost City wrote: »

Endgame is where everyone gets bored and quits so thats not really important.

Lawl , well said :P .

Tactica - Lost City · October 2009

Accelerated - Sanctuary wrote: »

Archers are sloooooooooooooooooow when they're doing normal physical damage; hell, they're the slowest physical attackers. Unless they're using fists/claws. b:sleep Not my style of game play, in any way. But the girl archers do look purty b:dirty.

Slow? Depends entirely what your using, and what your comparing it to.

Keeping in mind "slow" and "how hard you hit" go together nicely, no?

</biased opinion>

If you use -interval gear, you can get a decent attack speed, but honestly, if all you care about is attack speed, go roll a fist BM. >>

Bracers of Blood Moon / HH90/99 Gold bracers = -0.1
Rank IV chest = -0.5
Wind and the Clouds, Lv.69 mold slingshot = -0.1
and/or an event tome, which would get you an additional 0.01/0.05? don't quote me on the 0.05

Either way, that gets you around 0.87 off memory. Which is faster than axes, etc. and has a (generally) much higher damage range. Archers are 'slow', because they have a high damage range, and a high crit %, their skill damage is lower than some other classes to 'balance' it.

Tactica - Lost City · October 2009

Oh, and as for the 'fail at PvP', like all PvP, it's a case of what your up against, and how good your gear is.

Human error/input counts for some of it, gear, refines, etc., but Archer's are pretty decent, in my opinion.

Go figure, I made one.

Olba - Sanctuary · October 2009

Tactica - Lost City wrote: »

Bracers of Blood Moon / HH90/99 Gold bracers = -0.1
Rank IV chest = -0.5
Wind and the Clouds, Lv.69 mold slingshot = -0.1
and/or an event tome, which would get you an additional 0.01/0.05? don't quote me on the 0.05

Either way, that gets you around 0.87 off memory. Which is faster than axes, etc. and has a (generally) much higher damage range. Archers are 'slow', because they have a high damage range, and a high crit %, their skill damage is lower than some other classes to 'balance' it.

Ahem, Armor of Assassin gives you -0.05, not -0.5.

Also, you could just get the TT99 bracers, which add -0.1 and having another piece from the same set adds another -0.05, for a total of .91/sec.

And yes, for DPS, most Archer skills suck, other than some of the Demon skills, such as Quickshot.

Accelerated - Sanctuary · October 2009

Tactica - Lost City wrote: »

Slow? Depends entirely what your using, and what your comparing it to.

Keeping in mind "slow" and "how hard you hit" go together nicely, no?

</biased opinion>

If you use -interval gear, you can get a decent attack speed, but honestly, if all you care about is attack speed, go roll a fist BM. >>

Bracers of Blood Moon / HH90/99 Gold bracers = -0.1
Rank IV chest = -0.5
Wind and the Clouds, Lv.69 mold slingshot = -0.1
and/or an event tome, which would get you an additional 0.01/0.05? don't quote me on the 0.05

Either way, that gets you around 0.87 off memory. Which is faster than axes, etc. and has a (generally) much higher damage range. Archers are 'slow', because they have a high damage range, and a high crit %, their skill damage is lower than some other classes to 'balance' it.

Thank you for that enlightenment. Of course I'm saying this from a biased point of view. Thanks, I will roll a blademaster, holy ****! I am a blademaster :O. And please... Under the same or similar type of gears, an Axe blademaster can attack faster as well. Give or take, maybe getting lucky in crafting a pair of axes with -.1/-.05 interval to match up with the archer ranking bonus stats. Slingshots, which are, without a doubt the fastest archer weapon is considered 'slow' to the slowest weapon that blademasters can use, axe. Also, oh boo hoo. An archer can has Demon Quickshot. Well, Demon blademasters can get similar Quicken buff through Demon Cyclone Heel/ Demon Highland Cleave. A bit nerfed compared to Demon Quickshot; but still a Quicken buff.

If anyone got the impression that I also think archers fail, I didn't mean it as that. They are just the slowest class in-game.

truekossy · October 2009

From a statistical standpoint based purely on base speed, archer are the slowest attackers in the game.

The -Interval they use, however, does make up for that by quite a bit.

SilverCleric - Lost City · October 2009

Tactica - Lost City wrote: »

Oh, and as for the 'fail at PvP', like all PvP, it's a case of what your up against, and how good your gear is.

Human error/input counts for some of it, gear, refines, etc., but Archer's are pretty decent, in my opinion.

Go figure, I made one.

Agreed, The current #1# top Pker in Lost City is a archer, and archer's are one of the best Pkers in PvP. b:victoryb:pleased

Accelerated - Sanctuary · October 2009

SilverCleric - Lost City wrote: »

Agreed, The current #1# top Pker in Lost City is a archer, and archer's are one of the best Pkers in PvP. b:victoryb:pleased

The Ranking board proves nothing based on the skill of the players. That person may have achieved large portion of kills by pk'ing level 30's, or people that don't stand a chance in the first place.

MagicHamsta - Lost City · October 2009

truekossy wrote: »

From a statistical standpoint based purely on base speed, archer are the slowest attackers in the game.

The -Interval they use, however, does make up for that by quite a bit.

That was completely random.
Also are you sure your statistics are correct?
Ever see a wizard wacking stuff with his weapon? It's even slower.

Also that is completely irrelevant to whether or not they fail.

Which in my opinion they don't.

SilverCleric - Lost City · October 2009

Accelerated - Sanctuary wrote: »

The Ranking board proves nothing based on the skill of the players. That person may have achieved large portion of kills by pk'ing level 30's, or people that don't stand a chance in the first place.

Hmmm.. I forgotten thanks for pointing that out. b:embarrass

truekossy · October 2009

MagicHamsta - Lost City wrote: »

That was completely random.
Also are you sure your statistics are correct?
Ever see a wizard wacking stuff with his weapon? It's even slower.

Also that is completely irrelevant to whether or not they fail.

Which in my opinion they don't.

A patkia (slowest magical weapon) has an attack rate of 1/sec
A slingshot (fastest archer weapon) has an attack rate of 0.71/sec

As I said, based purely on base speed, archers have the slowest attacks in the game.

-Interval, as already stated, helps to remedy this.

And it was relevant to Accelerated and Tactica's discussion. ;P

Accelerated - Sanctuary · October 2009

MagicHamsta - Lost City wrote: »

That was completely random.
Also are you sure your statistics are correct?
Ever see a wizard wacking stuff with his weapon? It's even slower.

Also that is completely irrelevant to whether or not they fail.

Which in my opinion they don't.

You, my good hamster, sir, are mistaking the potential of a true end game wizard.
Wizards and any other classes may achieve 99% channeling reduction, if they truly wished it and had that vast amount of luck. Which is defined as the attacking speed for magic classes.

His statistics are correct. Normal crossbows attack at the speed of .62/s. That's almost equal to one half of an attack each second, which is just ungodly slow. However, crossbows do cause the largest damage from the archer weapon choices, and the most random(as they have the largest min to max damage intervals). Normal bows attack at the speed of .67/s. Which is only slightly faster than a crossbow, but the damage intervals are more stable and not as random. Even normal slingshots attack at the speed of .71/s(It is the fastest, but has the lowest min to max interval damage input and the lowest damage. I can tell you an in-depth review about regular melee weapons, but that's not necessary.

He was not as irrelevant as you'd think he was. The attacking speed of your character is a gigantic quality into making your character do the highest DPS possible at their current level. Tell me, if you compare a wizard with the channeling reduction of 50% to one of 99%; does the 50% wizard even seem all that good compared to the 99%? No, he doesn't.

MetalsSource - Lost City · October 2009

well yes they r totaly worth it becuz if u recognize they have alot stronger weapons and such so there almost the strongest class i have a lvl 39 bm and i wish i wouldve done an archer now that i see the damage they deal they r very powerful exept wen up close to an enimy of course :P

Technotic - Sanctuary · October 2009

archers are the super damage dealers. they do as much if not more than wiz's and have rediculous crit. they're not made for anything else

MagicHamsta - Lost City · October 2009

Accelerated - Sanctuary wrote: »

You, my good hamster, sir, are mistaking the potential of a true end game wizard.
Wizards and any other classes may achieve 99% channeling reduction, if they truly wished it and had that vast amount of luck. Which is defined as the attacking speed for magic classes.

His statistics are correct. Normal crossbows attack at the speed of .62/s. That's almost equal to one half of an attack each second, which is just ungodly slow. However, crossbows do cause the largest damage from the archer weapon choices, and the most random(as they have the largest min to max damage intervals). Normal bows attack at the speed of .67/s. Which is only slightly faster than a crossbow, but the damage intervals are more stable and not as random. Even normal slingshots attack at the speed of .71/s(It is the fastest, but has the lowest min to max interval damage input and the lowest damage. I can tell you an in-depth review about regular melee weapons, but that's not necessary.

He was not as irrelevant as you'd think he was. The attacking speed of your character is a gigantic quality into making your character do the highest DPS possible at their current level. Tell me, if you compare a wizard with the channeling reduction of 50% to one of 99%; does the 50% wizard even seem all that good compared to the 99%? No, he doesn't.

You Madam, Have mistaken me. I know full well the potential of all classes.
However his statistical data only takes into account regular attacking rate. As such it ignores all spells and buffs. Now when his strange logic is applied to wizards, I myself attack at a regular physical attack of 1.25 seconds; much slower then an archer.

*Note he said, "purely on base speed, archer are the slowest attackers in the game.

The -Interval they use, however, does make up for that by quite a bit." (Ever see an archer punch a pillar compared to an archer punching a pilar? You can actually notice the speed difference.)

All archers happen to use skills which goes along with regular attacks. (Yes my first character was an archer so I have first hand experience.)
No matter how you analyze it, short of a wizard using somehow either godlike gear or magically having permanent/near permanent essential sutra which is not exactly spammable what with the 30 second cool down and spark requirement, Archers attack faster.
Although if the wizard were to be given godlike gear then the same would have to go for the archer and so archers still attack faster.
d(^.-d)

um... I mean squeak. (>.<)'

(O.o) me agree with the above post that they are super damage dealers. What other class can rip out 16% of a bosses life in one hit? =O
But Wizards can hit multiple targets which could mean more damage dealt.
xD I shoot out BIDS for fun and watch the barbs and bm scramble to regain aggro.
well sometimes they don't and me end up dying. (>.<)'

O ya archers = less fail since they survive better.
(^.^)'

I like how he thinks Ancient Arbor (Magic Sword) which smacks at an interval of 1.25 is somehow faster.
Obviously he's pulling numbers out of his ****. Either that or he's never seen an wizard smack stuff.

Accelerated - Sanctuary · October 2009

MagicHamsta - Lost City wrote: »

You Madam, Have mistaken me. I know full well the potential of all classes.
However his statistical data only takes into account regular attacking rate. As such it ignores all spells and buffs. Now when applied to wizards, I myself attack at a regular physical attack of 1.5 seconds; much slower then an archer.

d(^.-d)

um I mean squeak. (>.<)'

1.5/s is 3 attacks every 2 seconds... That's EXTREMELY fast.

MagicHamsta - Lost City · October 2009

Accelerated - Sanctuary wrote: »

1.5/s is 3 attacks every 2 seconds... That's EXTREMELY fast.

DX
I got the number wrong. 1.25 Sowwy I didn't go in game to check, I went eating.
Still archers do shoot way faster then I smack with a melee weapon.

The reality that all classes have skills as well as the fact everyone with half a brain uses said skills renders his argument void.

Edit: Me am confoosed from too much food. But I can still reason better then truekossy.

(>.<)' this is why me don't use correct english. People like true don't understand logical reasoning. (-.-)'

Legerity - Sanctuary · October 2009

MagicHamsta - Lost City wrote: »

...

Ever see a wizard wacking stuff with his weapon? It's even slower.

...

MagicHamsta - Lost City wrote: »

...

However his statistical data only takes into account regular attacking rate. As such it ignores all spells and buffs. Now when his strange logic is applied to wizards, I myself attack at a regular physical attack of 1.25 seconds; much slower then an archer.

*Note he said, "purely on base speed, archer are the slowest attackers in the game.

The -Interval they use, however, does make up for that by quite a bit." (Ever see an archer punch a pillar compared to an archer punching a pilar? You can actually notice the speed difference.)

...

I like how he thinks Ancient Arbor (Magic Sword) which smacks at an interval of 1.25 is somehow faster.
Obviously he's pulling numbers out of his ****. Either that or he's never seen an wizard smack stuff.

???????????????????????????????????????

Archers have the slowest attack rate because ranged weapons have the slowest attack rate. (truekossy said "base speed" which obviously means normal hits, not channeling skills)

What are you on? Any magical instrument (minus pataka) hits faster than a ranged weapon even if the Archer stacked -interval gear. Highest you can get is 1 attack a second* (1/sec) with a bow and that's with 8jun armor and lunar cape+event tome and stacking pdef tt99 gold orns.

And yet what, an ancient arbor has an attack rate of 1.25/sec (because you said so).

Again, ????????????????????????????????

*bows will be 1/sec. slings can reach 1.11/sec. xbows will be 0.91/sec.

edit:

MagicHamsta - Lost City wrote: »

...

Still archers do shoot way faster then I smack with a melee weapon.

...

No they don't.

MagicHamsta - Lost City wrote: »

...

(Ever see an archer punch a pillar compared to an archer punching a pilar? You can actually notice the speed difference.)

...

No speed difference there.

MrConce - Harshlands · October 2009

SilverCleric - Lost City wrote: »

Agreed, The current #1# top Pker in Lost City is a archer, and archer's are one of the best Pkers in PvP. b:victoryb:pleased

He is also a heavy cash shopper. Dont roll archer, EVER, if u dont plan on spending big bucks. You'll be dissapointed if u just do with regular gear for pvp. I mean, Im barely starting to enjoy my archer at 90, and its only because i just dropped 25 mil on demon quickshot. Im planning on getting jun8 (rank8) in a near future, so that should let u know that if u dont have money, they arent worth it. Stay veno and get a nix. Still have to cashop to get the nix, but its way cheaper.

MagicHamsta - Lost City · October 2009

MrConce - Harshlands wrote: »

He is also a heavy cash shopper. Dont roll archer, EVER, if u dont plan on spending big bucks. You'll be dissapointed if u just do with regular gear for pvp. I mean, Im barely starting to enjoy my archer at 90, and its only because i just dropped 25 mil on demon quickshot. Im planning on getting jun8 (rank8) in a near future, so that should let u know that if u dont have money, they arent worth it. Stay veno and get a nix. Still have to cashop to get the nix, but its way cheaper.

b:shocked
Me feel your pain~
DX

b:chuckle

Archers fail?

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