Clerics SPEND more on others, give them something in return

Chrisssss - Sanctuary wrote: »

LOL I'm going to be bias and say Heck Yeah, but the truth is I believe every class has to spend a lot veno have to spend what 25Mil for Herics, BM and Barbs prob have to spend a lot on HP charms, Wiz I assume MP charms and Archers I guess HP and arrows. We are all used and have a certain job to full fill and like some ppl said in this thread "If you don't like it, then switch class". I personally like being a cleric because all I have to do is sit back and hit my F4 (Iron Heart) Key 90% of the time.

And here people is the truth!! ^^ b:thanks Thank you chrisss for including everyone

If you do TT runs and know the ladder...

Subber, tank and cleric are the top 3 who get first pick,.. so if you are getting jipped... then I have no idea who you are running with.

Yes venos make money grinding since our pets take the hits but to get the tank we want and everyone else wants us to get is a herc.. and yes try spending 23-25m on a friggin pet.. not all of us can afford buying the sof from Boutique with irl money. Yes and those fast rare pets for quick luring...
Everyone has their ups and downs.. it is the way the game is ... every game is.. YOU CAN"T PLEASE EVERYONE NO MATTER HOW HARD YOU TRY!

and btw CHARMS ARE THE WAY TO GO!~

Well clerics do have a benifit. At first the cleric has verry low pysical defence and usually requires a squad to get the job done. This i have seen myself. Clerics ressurect us and buff us while venomancers, barbarians, archers, wizards, and blademasters assist them in many of thier quests. Therefore, we are giveing back to clerics. This truthfully is just a way for them to gain an excuse to get more out of us other players for thier characters own personal benifit. We do your FB's people isnt that enough.

Gaining rep or money for rezing is beyond abuseable. I can already see a bunch of faction members pooling characters, getting themselves killed then the cleric(s) rezing them, only being as slow as the cast and cool. A Cleric could quickly amass a large amount of rep and money in a very short period of time. A few spirit wouldn't be so bad since killing one monster would give you more making it hard to abuse.

Maybe gaining 1% of the exp you recovered up to a certain amount for the player instead would be a nice balancer instead since not often when a cleric is killed in a squad is there another one around. In most cases I've found being a cleric is a sure way to be killed since healing an agro'd player when nothing is actually attacking its is a fast way for the monster(s) to turn their focus on the squishy little healer. I've seen multiple clerics go down like this in say fb39 where a tank can end up with multiple monsters attacking them. So getting a little exp for saving someone elses exp seems a little fair. And since its a small amount of whats recovered, its hard to abuse, especially with a cap, maybe raise as the skill levels.

If not boohoo, shouldn't be a cleric if you don't like the problems that come with being a support class. Every class has problems. Like... no other class can rez other players. Sucks for them huh? Being able to res people is supposed to be a perk, not a burden.

As a cleric (my new main at only lvl 67) I agree that abuse could occur and don't support any reward system. However things in the game do need to change to make clerics not such a cash cow/sieve

- Reset the charm tick point on mp charms from 75% to 50 or 25% which would allow us to use pots and apoth to help stem the damage to our charms. I swear mine ticks at like 85% and I have zero change to pot before it ticks.
- Change BB, a defense based spell, so that it no longer puts you in attack mode when using so the mp regen rate is not reduced
- Allow pots and apoth to stack
- Create a rez skill that is obtainable only after getting level 10 rez (much like the AoE buffs) that allow a cleric to rez self and has a 1 hour cool down, but no mp use (for obvious reasons, i.e. you have none when dead)
-Give clerics a speed buff skill so they can keep up with tanks

I think these would go a long way in making the cleric more enjoyable and fiscally reasonable to play.

As another note I think mentality needs to change in game. Lets take fb59, a great fb to run, but it can be expensive. As a cleric I spam heal the tank. The tank attacks the boss and not once does their charm tick, however mine ticks constantly throughout the kill and basically gets ****. If the tanks hp charm ticks just once they complain and say we're not healing fast enough. Where is the reasoning in this? Why should my charm tick all day long and not the tanks? Well one is that tanks will have an expense in repairs to account for so equal ticking is not fair. Perhaps we should let the tanks hp charm tick once every 30 seconds to save our mp charm a tad? Sorry this last part here is just ranting and musing, but I think you all understand what I mean.

Cheers

As said earleir, if you dont like healling, buffing and resing people with no cost to them or any benefit to you, dont be a cleric.

EDIT: Also remeber as cleric you can buff and heal yourself, not just others.

MntMan - Lost City wrote: »

Perhaps we should let the tanks hp charm tick once every 30 seconds to save our mp charm a tad? Sorry this last part here is just ranting and musing, but I think you all understand what I mean.

See once again I see this charm idea... Charms should never be required to play the game unless your attempting something you normally couldn't w/o them. (Rebirth orders, Zhen groups, make sense) FB's shouldn't require use of charms.

So on one hand we've got this let the barb charm tick vs let the clr charm tick... yeah if my charm ticks that's 5.5k hp used on a 600k charm every tick.
if your charm ticks that's what 800 to 1.5k mana on a 900k mana charm every tick? is their some disparity in your math maybe? Doesn't the apoth 10 min mana regen cover most mana consumption?

10 ticks on HP charm would be 55k gone
10 ticks on MP charm only 15k ish gone
so by your logic every 30 sec let 1 charm tick average boss takes up to 5 min to kill in FB so yeah there you have the numbers.

Seeing any issues with your idea... Oh and if you let it tick then we get critted and your heal doesn't come in time everyone dies and you need to use your 40k res scroll? Is that sound logic?

I do like the BB idea of defensive spells shouldn't put you in attack mode but the Charms are PW-I's constant source of income so I don't think they'd implement this. I have heard that BB can be offset alot by using the 10 min apoth mana regen stuff.

Clerics are made to heal pretty much... If you don't like it I suppose you could change to an attack cleric build OR even better yet.... change classes.

You choose what class you wanna be and if healing isn't your thing then don't be a cleric.

BTW, sometimes if your real nice and all we do pay you back. I've died before, and when a cleric resurects me and I don't lose any exp or anything sometimes I give them like 10k or so.

Don't whine about healing on fb runs... Guess what, its your role in an fb. Barbs are for tanking and clerics heal and venos lure and bms/archers deal damage and wizards deal damage or they are a magic tank.
In an fb we all have our roles and as a cleric your role is to heal.

Basically, don't whine about wasting your mp or having to heal, its what you do. You might get a reward if you are nice and the person you're helping is nice but otherwise you don't get a reward.

I love the responses of "don't whine" or "don't be a cleric then".

You're completely missing the point of the post.

First it's just a game. I don't play a cleric because I have some personal real life unfulfilled need to heal and nurture people. I play one because it's an oft sought after class for most of the tasks required in this game (fbs, tt, word bosses, etc.) Pretty much everything you do outside of solo grinding requires a cleric. Being one assures I get my bosses done and helps me harvest rep more then possibly other classes. Being a good one almost guarantees it. So let's end the discussion about "don't be one if you don't like....etc."

Also I don't agree we should get any rewards for healing, buffs or rez etc. Although people should be aware that if I throw you a buff or two when I'm out questing it might give the ole charm a tick so it's costing me money. I still do it, but keep it in mind.

My complaint is how much money it can cost to play a cleric where it likely is not as expensive to play other classes. If you're a cleric and you want to do TT runs it's expected you have to have a charm. I've seen some try without and when BB busts and everyone is wiped then who do they look at?

So my suggestions are towards equalizing the playing field in terms of RL money and costs. To me the biggest two are changing the percentage of when a charm ticks to allow us more time to pot and making sure BB does not out you into attack mode. The other ideas would be nice, but not essential.

As for the math on letting a barb charm tick once every 30 seconds to me the only valid point you bring is the crit one. It was just a comment to get people thinking and not one I implement. A dead barb is nothing anyone in a group wants to see. Your math though is not exactly right. When you say 10 ticks on each is worth that money it's true. (or close enough to I'm sure) However in a 5 minute boss fight it would equate to 10 ticks for you, but well more then 10 ticks for a cleric. If I have to spam heal IH on a tank, my charm is constantly ticking. Not every 30 seconds. More like every 3-5 seconds. Especially if I'm laying down some pures (depending on boss) and maybe firing in a few debuffs on the boss to help speed up the kill. Let's just forget the **** BB does to a charm here as well. So the example I gave was more food for thought. I doubt anyone else blows through charms and the respective money as much as a cleric provided equal footing in game play. Meaning a bad player in any other class might burn though more, but assuming a good tank and a good cleric the cleric will spend more RL money then the tank. (We'll forget the other classes all together who are weighing in on opinions because they don't spend nearly as much) Obviously if it is a bad cleric and teh tank's charm is ticking away then it doesn't hold true.

All I want is the RL money required to play each class to be equal. I'm not asking for equality in leveling or PvP or anything like that, but if the game requires people to use a charm and RL money to reasonably continue game play then the amount each class should be reruired or recommended to spend should be near equal. I find it is currently not.

Also here is where we get the flames of "I've never spent a dime of RL money and I'm lvl 150...." Good for you. Also if you've kept your bank full of charms and not spent RL great. But remember since charms don't drop someone did spend RL money to provide those and therefore they become a requirement of the game inherently.

Cheers

As for

I swear it's amazing how right my teachers were about the 3 part theory on writing something people only seem to read the end of my stuff....

So a simple end: I agree that RL money should be = for the classes. But to stress my first statement

"Charms should never be required to play the game unless your attempting something you normally couldn't w/o them." Zhen groups is an example of this.

I agree Blue Bubble shouldn't be able to drain more the apoth items can handle... If you'd read my comments you'd see I'm not against some fixing of the classes by any means. But I disagree with the proposed methods.

If you want to see someone really burn trough mana check the consumption on lvl 10 Barrage of Arrows (Consuming 540 mana every 3 seconds)

@Witchburner - Sanctuary try reading all my comments before posting on a continued one.

You can get xp from getting materials and then even sell the materials, but it's so little that no one bothers to abuse it. So why not give small amounts of xp for healing and ressing? Such small amounts that it would be a waste to abuse it but just enough to stop people from complaining.

bowski2 wrote: »

You can get xp from getting materials and then even sell the materials, but it's so little that no one bothers to abuse it. So why not give small amounts of xp for healing and ressing? Such small amounts that it would be a waste to abuse it but just enough to stop people from complaining.

Really? I dig up every single mats while grinding AND I sell them does that count?

I think that's pretty much what all mats sellers do, or did I misunderstood your idea of abuse.

I was just implying they should get something for doing stuff like flying all over the place just for people, I dont particularly care what just tossing ideas. Yes I do think its worth the "coding effort" which would be what 2-3 lines of code copy pasted to all heals and 2-3 more for res whoo hoo hard work there, but what do I know about that I only spent 4 years in a school full of programmers. I always support the healer getting things because when I do play a healer class I like to play the pacifist healer who does nothing but heal, this is why I dont do it on here cus it flat out doesnt work, or in most MMOs for that matter, if you do that everyone you know is gonna be miles ahead of ya and youll be like lv10. I know thats not how things are done, but idealy a healer should be able to lv by only healing if they do so choose to grind that way, no its not very fast and its not much at a time, but are are we to tell someone the way they want to play a game and enjoy themselves is wrong?

I do believe clerics should also have a skill to regain some mp....other classes have a variation of mp or hp recovery skill. I think that would be a very good solution. Kudos to the brain that thought of that.....sweet and simple i like that.