Genesis Leader - Aurellius

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Aurellius - Heavens Tear
Aurellius - Heavens Tear Posts: 42 Arc User
edited December 2008 in Etherblade (West)
Hello Perfect World,
Assuming that the majority of people visiting these forums are among the more respectful or mature crowd, I would like to share some words.
I'm responding to the slander and mockery that has been presented towards myself and my guild, so whether my attempts at defense are in vain or not I will give it my best none the less. I simply ask the respect that you all will read keeping all judgments aside until the end.

Word has traveled around that I had stolen money from my own factions territory war funds. This rumor is not true, its basically my word against the rumor.
When Genesis was first made, the money used was my own hard earned money along with assisted donations. I was just over level 20 when I decided I wanted to make a faction for the soul purpose of having fun.
The guild was finally made and upon the hands of about 8 willing people we grew into a larger faction. I wont go into the full depth of history behind Genesis, but I will share that it was alot of hard work and effort to create its reputation.
A large majority of people shared their respects towards me and I returned the favor. My members reflected the pride I had in Genesis after looking at the fine group of people working together.
When Territory Wars became a possibility in our eyes, my only fear was the thought of us possessing a material object.

Money became a desire among some of my members, to the point where many only came for money. It turned into an object that wasnt looked upon as a gift, but instead an expectation.
I kept all the money secure in my bank not paying people because greed became a large issue and a root of many quarrels. Territory wars was something that was intended for fun, and some members began to see it as more of something you should get paid to do.
I kept the funds while my officers and I consulted on a more productive way of distributing the funds in a way to build community.
Although the temptation was present, I did not take a single dime from the vault. Letting myself fall prey to such desire would make me become the monster I worked to prevent my members into becoming.
I looked at myself holding the funds as a possible way to weed out members who were here for money. Almost how addicts react when they enter into withdraw, they want to savor their desire.

More members than I expected left, some among those I trusted.
I got constant private messages on how I was a bad leader for not paying people money they thought they deserved. I was also insulted for no apparent reasons at all, just out of pure disrespect.
Many of my trustworthy members told me they would always stay in contact with me, but sadly few have even talked with me.
Instead, everywhere just about, that I travel in perfect world, someone somewhere enjoys speaking about how I stole my guilds funds and spent it on myself.
157,000,000 gold was how much was kept in our vault at the time of this event. The odd number was due to our money using for territory wars in general. I gave every penny of it to the members I had with me still, not to try and prove something but out of frustration at how a material thing can cause so much damage. I was tired of having the responsibility of managing an object that shot me in the foot.
I spent hours working on Genesis, trying to recruit and speak with the members, work out issues at hand. In the meantime handling college and my job, Genesis became a faction that I had devoted alot to.
For people to assume that I would undermine something I spent so much time with, is beyond me.

I know that despite what work may be done, any atmosphere you go in, someone will dislike you for unknown reasons.
In my defense and my guilds defense, the immaturity expressed towards us has gone on quite enough.
I enjoy this game and my guilds company, but when people mock me through ignorance or because they cannot tame their own selfish desire, that is appauling.
Genesis Guild has not died, it will not die, despite what pressures lay against us we will continue forward.
You might ask why in the world would we bother?
Anything good whether it be great or small, in real life, or not, is something that this world rarely sees.
It is like a candle in a dark room, no matter how small the flame, it can still offer comfort and joy.
I've witnessed the world with my own eyes, and can say that all that is good I have found worth fighting for.
Perfect World is a fake atmosphere, full of real people that at most lack accountability.
Genesis is a guild where you are accountable for your actions.
Genesis is a guild that is founded on community, not for selfish reasons, but for the purpose of making friends you will have for years to come.
We dont base ourselves on material things such as territory, money and power.
Strength of character is something that overpowers even the most strong of brute forces in existence.
The slanders and mockery against my guild, I ask for you to stop.
The insults towards us are often done with ignorance and a self-seeking mind on the other end.
For those who still hold us in regard, my thanks goes to you.
Despite how loud your voice may be, support even in the smallest form can help lift even the lowest spirit.

I wont continue on this wall of text any longer, but know perfect world.
This defense was not for myself, but mainly for my guild. Me being the Genesis representative found it my duty to make things clear to atleast those willing to find the truth.
I appreciate your time and willingness to read,

~Aurellius
Genesis Leader

Happy gaming everyone, and have a Merry Christmas
Post edited by Aurellius - Heavens Tear on
«13

Comments

  • Yukiko - Lost City
    Yukiko - Lost City Posts: 178 Arc User
    edited December 2008
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    First of all, the General Discussion section does not read "Heavens Tear, put all your quarrels here".

    Second of all, people DEPEND on TW money to help them finance their characters. If you misplaced greed for need then yes, you are a bad leader, and I am not surprised many people left.
  • vagrant0
    vagrant0 Posts: 290 Arc User
    edited December 2008
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    First of all, the General Discussion section does not read "Heavens Tear, put all your quarrels here".

    Second of all, people DEPEND on TW money to help them finance their characters. If you misplaced greed for need then yes, you are a bad leader, and I am not surprised many people left.

    First. read the post, you only make yourself look like a fool when you don't, and make whatever assumptions you want after reading the first sentence.

    He said that he DID NOT take money, but that there were those who were claiming that he did. While this is his word against others, who are not in his guild, he probably wouldn't have taken the time to write this post, or still retained what members he did if it were true. I have not personally dealt with him, but have had the chance to do some FB runs with some Genesis members in the past. They even helped me do a boss when my guild was not able. From my dealings with Genesis, most of their members are trustworthy, so I doubt that many of those people would leave over just a rumor. If they did, they were fools, and obviously more concerned about their own benefit than any loyalty to the guild they were part of. If I remember correctly, at the time they were having problems with RoC and Empire or something, so naturally, those two factions would have something to gain from all this. Yay for internet drama.

    And, as far as people NEEDING TW funds for their character, I beg to differ. People should try to get to where their character can manage on their own funds, before anything additional should be factored in. As you pretty much need to be in the level 70+ range to do anything TW related on Heaven's Tear, that's 70+ levels that you will need to be able to do without additional financial backing (TW funds). TW funds are mostly as a bonus, to make your character that much better, such as buying charms and exp scrolls to zhen, or buying extra skills. If you can't grind without losing money, chances are that you are doing something wrong, or are a Barb who has not yet discovered selling mats. Even my level 56 archer can pull some sort of profit at the end of the day grinding, even before I start selling materials. Since there are only a few guilds with territories at this point, that statment is obviously false since there are obviously people who are able to perform even when their guild does not have territories. Maybe this is different on Lost City, but this thread isn't talking about Lost City. But that is an entirely seperate argument.

    Anyway, good luck with this. Hope people can finally put this drama to rest and just play the damn game.
  • Hisui - Heavens Tear
    Hisui - Heavens Tear Posts: 1,369 Arc User
    edited December 2008
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    It's not greed at all. It's just natural people would want to get paid so they can upgrade their gears, and things like that. If you withheld their pay, that shows how little you think of them. What right do you have to "weed out" guildies in such an underhanded method? The term "weed out" means you have distrust.

    A guild is about everyone respecting everyone else's goals and helping every guildie realize the goal. It's not about a bunch of people working to be a model nice player to reach his/her guild master's expectations in ethics.

    Why didn't you just pay your guildies so everyone can be happy? If money doesn't mean anything to you then just give your share to the guildies who do. You have no right to judge how others want to play the game.

    Imagine on the first day of the semester your Discrete Math professor announces to everyone that the highest grade he is going to give is a C. Then after many people withdraws from the course he announces that what he did was merely a test to weed out the students who do not have true passion for the subject and was only aiming for an easy grade. But in reality, not only did he weed out the students as specified by himself, but also the students who did not like the professor's pompous and self-righteous attitude.

    I believe it happened in Genesis as well.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    私の番ですよ。- Sig by Symour

    Check out ForsakenX 's sig thread O_O
    Enrage - We Eat.
  • Tomiko - Heavens Tear
    Tomiko - Heavens Tear Posts: 416 Arc User
    edited December 2008
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    gg Aurellius haha.. well too bad you lost your territories, but at least you still have your loyal guildmates and I bet their happy with their share. Posting in forums doesn't change anything, but at least you still did~ *thumbs up*
  • Saitada - Sanctuary
    Saitada - Sanctuary Posts: 3,220 Arc User
    edited December 2008
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    A guild is about everyone respecting everyone else's goals and helping every guildie realize the goal. It's not about a bunch of people working to be a model nice player to reach his/her guild master's expectations in ethics.
    If a faction member of mine doesn't adhere to my factions guidelines and ethics, as I set them, I remove them. I EXPECT my members to be decent people who are there to have fun, help one another out, and others as well. I also EXPECT they will be honest and upstanding people in their dealings with others.

    My Expectations as a Faction Leader are what shapes my faction and it's members. If I have no expectations, then what I get are rude, inconsiderate and disrespectful players that will give my faction a bad name.

    I respect my Faction members goals, and help where I can to promote them, so long as those goals are concurrent with my Factions Goals. I have, and most likely will in the future removed individuals from my faction who fell or have fallen below MY standards of what makes a good player if they are unable to or unwilling to improve themselves.

    Saitada
  • Aurellius - Heavens Tear
    Aurellius - Heavens Tear Posts: 42 Arc User
    edited December 2008
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    Firstly, to respond to some of the replies.
    Thanks for replying, sorry for posting in the wrong place.
    Me holding back funds in territory war wasnt because I was trying to attempt to control the way people play a game.
    It was because this so called fake money turned into something more than it should have, to the point that trust was being compromised.
    Trust isnt something you can buy, therefore the ones who I trusted that were turning on me evidently had their priorities in the wrong place.
    I spoke afterwords saying, yes perhaps it would of been wise to just give away the money and let it be done.
    As I've witnessed in the past, doing something like that just feeds the flame.
    I'm still human when it comes down to the end, and I tell every one of my members, my actions in the guild are done for what I think is best for the guild.
    I said a few of my trusted members left, this was due to other things as I later was told, but it started the chain reaction.

    Call me a bad leader if you so desire, insult me, mock me if you will, I'm still human and have error.
    I will say though, what I do for my faction is what I think is best, it is not for my own personal gain. If that kind of mindset were true, I'de be nothing more than a tyrant.
  • andyboi
    andyboi Posts: 83 Arc User
    edited December 2008
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    Firstly, to respond to some of the replies.
    Thanks for replying, sorry for posting in the wrong place.
    Me holding back funds in territory war wasnt because I was trying to attempt to control the way people play a game.
    It was because this so called fake money turned into something more than it should have, to the point that trust was being compromised.
    Trust isnt something you can buy, therefore the ones who I trusted that were turning on me evidently had their priorities in the wrong place.
    I spoke afterwords saying, yes perhaps it would of been wise to just give away the money and let it be done.
    As I've witnessed in the past, doing something like that just feeds the flame.
    I'm still human when it comes down to the end, and I tell every one of my members, my actions in the guild are done for what I think is best for the guild.
    I said a few of my trusted members left, this was due to other things as I later was told, but it started the chain reaction.

    Call me a bad leader if you so desire, insult me, mock me if you will, I'm still human and have error.
    I will say though, what I do for my faction is what I think is best, it is not for my own personal gain. If that kind of mindset were true, I'de be nothing more than a tyrant.


    I praise your high morals and ethics, but you are a dying breed. In the gaming world nowadays, there is no trust. The only form of trust you have is how you can use one another for mutual gains, like TT runs etc. Sadly, a guild with such high expectations of its members will never be on the top. There isnt enough of those players around for you to recruit. And to stand against other guilds in TW, you need a large player base.
  • Hisui - Heavens Tear
    Hisui - Heavens Tear Posts: 1,369 Arc User
    edited December 2008
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    If a faction member of mine doesn't adhere to my factions guidelines and ethics, as I set them, I remove them. I EXPECT my members to be decent people who are there to have fun, help one another out, and others as well. I also EXPECT they will be honest and upstanding people in their dealings with others.

    My Expectations as a Faction Leader are what shapes my faction and it's members. If I have no expectations, then what I get are rude, inconsiderate and disrespectful players that will give my faction a bad name.

    I respect my Faction members goals, and help where I can to promote them, so long as those goals are concurrent with my Factions Goals. I have, and most likely will in the future removed individuals from my faction who fell or have fallen below MY standards of what makes a good player if they are unable to or unwilling to improve themselves.

    Saitada

    I said expectations in ethics.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    私の番ですよ。- Sig by Symour

    Check out ForsakenX 's sig thread O_O
    Enrage - We Eat.
  • Hisui - Heavens Tear
    Hisui - Heavens Tear Posts: 1,369 Arc User
    edited December 2008
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    andyboi wrote: »
    I praise your high morals and ethics, but you are a dying breed. In the gaming world nowadays, there is no trust. The only form of trust you have is how you can use one another for mutual gains, like TT runs etc. Sadly, a guild with such high expectations of its members will never be on the top. There isnt enough of those players around for you to recruit. And to stand against other guilds in TW, you need a large player base.

    I read Genesis' rules for the luls once. They are indeed a guild of high ethics but I never knew Aurellius pulled a weeder outer stunt like this. This kind of reminds me of the ex TE leader BlazeofGlory, who is a good person but loves to adheres to a weird code of conduct. It always seems as if she is out to get test you and get ya.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    私の番ですよ。- Sig by Symour

    Check out ForsakenX 's sig thread O_O
    Enrage - We Eat.
  • Aurellius - Heavens Tear
    Aurellius - Heavens Tear Posts: 42 Arc User
    edited December 2008
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    If being on top in everyones view point were my focus, then I wouldnt be where I am at today.
    I dont consider myself part of a dying breed, since everyone Ive met has a value of character. The problem I see is that either they are ashamed to show it, or too lazy, or feel its worth fighting against. Too many people out there are just pretending to be something their not to impress someone else doing the same thing.
    My guild was made with the intention that you can come and open your personality without someone pressing you back.
    Some personalities werent appropriate for the environment, but none the less they werent mocked for being who they are.

    If people think they are all big and bad for pointing the finger despite how just the cause may be, they should consider something.
    Anyone can point the finger, hate, lie, cheat, deceive, mock, steal and so on. It however, takes someone with character to be willing to forgive such offenses despite whether it fights the worlds view on reason.
    Evil is the absence of good, just as darkness is the absence of light.
    It doesnt matter how small the light may be, darkness cannot overtake it.
    Funny thing is, all the light has to do shine, so few seem willing to do such a task..
  • andyboi
    andyboi Posts: 83 Arc User
    edited December 2008
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    I read Genesis' rules for the luls once. They are indeed a guild of high ethics but I never knew Aurellius pulled a weeder outer stunt like this. This kind of reminds me of the ex TE leader BlazeofGlory, who is a good person but loves to adheres to a weird code of conduct. It always seems as if she is out to get test you and get ya.

    I dont think his intent was to test, as he already has mentioned. He was put in a situation where players in the guild were arguing over the "pay" from TW. He had 2 options, pay or not pay. And he chose that latter because he felt the former went against his guild ethics.
  • Hong - Heavens Tear
    Hong - Heavens Tear Posts: 332 Arc User
    edited December 2008
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    So, you spent over $100 for your +5 70 HH Magic sword with double Inflam or how did you get it? Found it on the floor? How about your crazy fashion set, got about every piece. Found it on the streets or?

    157m in guild bank *drools* I'll tell you how to spend it. Massive recruit till you get about 160 mill refund. We'll be so surprised that you actually managed to get 160mill refund of power. Bid all your 157m on our territory and we'll let you win.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    www . rochq .net
  • ISLEOFPEN - Heavens Tear
    ISLEOFPEN - Heavens Tear Posts: 48 Arc User
    edited December 2008
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    lol, so you just admit to stealing the TW money. this doesn't change the fact the people wasted charms, money and time to get genesis territories and all the money is still on your account.

    edit:my bad, didn't see that u split the money with whoever is left in the guild. you should of kept all off the money or shared it in the first place, changing your mind is bad. now you just lost money and some people won't trust you at all.
  • brendenlume
    brendenlume Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2008
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    It's not greed at all. It's just natural people would want to get paid so they can upgrade their gears, and things like that. If you withheld their pay, that shows how little you think of them. What right do you have to "weed out" guildies in such an underhanded method? The term "weed out" means you have distrust.

    that would be commmon sens for most people but maybe its not for him
  • Keilani - Heavens Tear
    Keilani - Heavens Tear Posts: 17 Arc User
    edited December 2008
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    Removed by request.
    Keilani
    Cleric
    Heaven's Tear
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Keilani - Heavens Tear
    Keilani - Heavens Tear Posts: 17 Arc User
    edited December 2008
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    Removed by request.
    Keilani
    Cleric
    Heaven's Tear
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Aurellius - Heavens Tear
    Aurellius - Heavens Tear Posts: 42 Arc User
    edited December 2008
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    Hong, I spent my hard earned cash on those clothe items, looking back i am like damn... alot of money for a game, but none the less it was my own money no one elses.
    I have the receipts to prove it...
  • Hong - Heavens Tear
    Hong - Heavens Tear Posts: 332 Arc User
    edited December 2008
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    good man 10 chars
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    www . rochq .net
  • Zahara - Heavens Tear
    Zahara - Heavens Tear Posts: 44 Arc User
    edited December 2008
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    Good luck Genesis. Radiance wishes you the best. And hopes that ur group of friends will have fun in game ^^.

    All in all not every guild fits every person. There's different personalities, playstyles, tolerances, ideals, and opinions.

    Aurellius as a leader, made his own decisions. As long as he didn't use the coins for himself; whether withholding it temporarily was right or wrong, members will either chose to stand by him or chose to leave. That's not neccessarily pass or fail in a guild, thats a matter of whether particular members fit the style of the leader or not.

    As for if he stole the coins or not. He holds firm that he did not, so that's for each individual member of his faction to decide. Since I'm not a member of his guild, I personaly hold no judgement.

    In the end it's about having fun. So to those who left, I hope you found a guild that you're happy with. And to those who didn't, I hope you continue to have fun in Genesis.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Ricecake - Heavens Tear
    Ricecake - Heavens Tear Posts: 156 Arc User
    edited December 2008
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    You wanna know why he has the +5 on his weapon? Because I sent him the shards. Everyone friggin happy now? As far as his fashion goes he's been collecting it. Now get off his **** about the shards -_- ffs.

    They were sent in a package that was titled "RANDOM" and the body of the text was "RANDOM RANDOM RANDOM" with the shards attached. Drop it.

    lol it was just yesturday in the game that Ssenogaurd said he gave them to aurellius, now you did it? damn how many shards does Aurellius have?

    I recommend you get your stories straight in the guild before making posts like that :P
    [SIGPIC]http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=13490001&dateline=1268988639[/SIGPIC]

    I used to be a cleric like you, then I took a Plume Shot to the knee.
  • Clunker - Heavens Tear
    Clunker - Heavens Tear Posts: 162 Arc User
    edited December 2008
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    Aurellius being a good person doesnt automatically make you a good leader/member. remember that people spent charms, xp scrolls for grinding, and other stuff for Genesis and of course they'd expect at least to feel the fruits of their labor other than having free teleports and the color purple in the map.

    @Keilani
    wait, aren't you from Maui?
  • Drivel - Heavens Tear
    Drivel - Heavens Tear Posts: 8 Arc User
    edited December 2008
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    It's somewhat pointless to argue about this, but since Aurellius has brought it up I may as well point out some facts.

    - It's not Aurellius's money. The guild members earned every coin that went into the "guild bank". It was absolutely not his right to decide to weed out members after they wasted coins for him in TWs.

    - Aurellius claims he paid people for TWs, which is true. After we had completed about 5 PVE TWs and had already participated in 3 or so PVP TWs, the guild was finally paid. I received 800k at level 67ish for a month's worth of TWs. As a veno my upkeep is very low, but I was forced to waste HP charms every week, 800k doesn't cover that, I can't imagine how much the tanks lost. Everyone that stayed was paid a second time when they stopped TWs, but I doubt it covered their overall repair/repot/recharm fees.

    - Most of this would have been fine if Aurellius was more open about his personal decisions. Two and a half weeks after we had our first territory I asked "Does anyone know when we'll be getting paid?" and he replied with something like "Just have patience", we were finally paid a few weeks after that. I heard that a couple members were kicked for asking about the money.

    After I left Genesis I formed a small guild, I have more money now than I ever did wasting my coins and 5 hours (2 hours for pre-war meetings) of my time for every TW.
  • Bookman - Heavens Tear
    Bookman - Heavens Tear Posts: 165 Arc User
    edited December 2008
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    - It's not Aurellius's money. The guild members earned every coin that went into the "guild bank". It was absolutely not his right to decide to weed out members after they wasted coins for him in TWs.
    .

    gg end of thread
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • kittykat
    kittykat Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2008
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    While I was by no means a good leader in my short tenure as one here, I will give some advice based from my experiences both as a guild leader in PW-USA and as a regular "grunt" in PW-MY of competitive TW guilds.

    The three most important traits a guild leader needs to demonstrate are honesty, fairness, and transparency. These will go a long way in preserving the longevity of a guild.

    Aurellius, what you need to understand is that TW income is NOT EVER the property of the guild leader. It is the result of hard work by the entire guild. Yes, you may have put in more than your fair share of time and energy into the guild, but as soon as you cross the line and think that you deserve a bigger share of the TW income, it all goes downhill. I'm not saying you ever did cross that line, but many guilds that have failed is because their guild leaders did cross that line.

    Look at real life, and you can find many examples. When a CEO gives themselves $20 million bonuses, while the "grunts" get minimum wage, there is obviously going to be some resentment. When the taxpayers (through Congress) give Paulson $350 billion, and no one knows what the hell happened to all that money, people will obviously get pissed.

    Thus, there are simple things to avoid that, with the most important being regularly paying your guild members for their hard work in TW in a fair and honest way. Guild members who want to be paid for TW aren't disloyal; they just want what's fair. In many instances, the money spent on charms for TW is actually more than TW salary.

    Just as important, all guild members should have easy access to the following:

    1) how much money is in the guild bank

    2) how much each guild member got paid

    3) the method (reasoning) for why each member got paid a certain amount
  • Keilani - Heavens Tear
    Keilani - Heavens Tear Posts: 17 Arc User
    edited December 2008
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    Removed by request.
    Keilani
    Cleric
    Heaven's Tear
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Stickygreen - Heavens Tear
    Stickygreen - Heavens Tear Posts: 2,158 Arc User
    edited December 2008
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    stop hating on genesis, you guys need to relax.... go get laid.... well... idk if you guys can, so go pick up a hooker on 5th street or something. <3 aurellius.
    Less QQ more Pew Pewb:thanks

    "Don't argue with an idiot. They bring you down to their level, and beat you with experience."

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Drivel - Heavens Tear
    Drivel - Heavens Tear Posts: 8 Arc User
    edited December 2008
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    @ Keilani - Were you even in any of the TWs? I was in every TW from the last PVE TW that Genesis failed, all the way to the second or third defense against TheEmpire.

    The TWs might not be listed as "mandatory" on the rarely-used forums, but when the faction chat is full of "EVERYONE come to Etherblade", "EVERYONE come into TeamSpeak", and "EVERYONE form into groups"... it sure sounds mandatory.

    I did have fun, but I spent a lot of money and just wanted some compensation. It's really hard to feel like I'm part of a guild that keeps all decisions secretive, isn't open to suggestions, and doesn't compensate you for your hard work.

    Keep your broad generalizations to yourself, I'm not lazy, greedy, or butt-hurt. Aurellius was trying to stretch the truth about paying his members and I'm merely telling my side of things.

    Edit:
    157,000,000 gold was how much was kept in our vault at the time of this event. The odd number was due to our money using for territory wars in general. I gave every penny of it to the members I had with me still
    As far as the money goes...it was decided amongst the officers and Aure that the money would remain with Aurellius and that it would be spent to help the players in the guild evolve into stronger classes.

    Interesting.
  • Ricecake - Heavens Tear
    Ricecake - Heavens Tear Posts: 156 Arc User
    edited December 2008
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    kittykat wrote: »
    While I was by no means a good leader in my short tenure as one here, I will give some advice based from my experiences both as a guild leader in PW-USA and as a regular "grunt" in PW-MY of competitive TW guilds.

    The three most important traits a guild leader needs to demonstrate are honesty, fairness, and transparency. These will go a long way in preserving the longevity of a guild.

    Aurellius, what you need to understand is that TW income is NOT EVER the property of the guild leader. It is the result of hard work by the entire guild. Yes, you may have put in more than your fair share of time and energy into the guild, but as soon as you cross the line and think that you deserve a bigger share of the TW income, it all goes downhill. I'm not saying you ever did cross that line, but many guilds that have failed is because their guild leaders did cross that line.

    Look at real life, and you can find many examples. When a CEO gives themselves $20 million bonuses, while the "grunts" get minimum wage, there is obviously going to be some resentment. When the taxpayers (through Congress) give Paulson $350 billion, and no one knows what the hell happened to all that money, people will obviously get pissed.

    Thus, there are simple things to avoid that, with the most important being regularly paying your guild members for their hard work in TW in a fair and honest way. Guild members who want to be paid for TW aren't disloyal; they just want what's fair. In many instances, the money spent on charms for TW is actually more than TW salary.

    Just as important, all guild members should have easy access to the following:

    1) how much money is in the guild bank

    2) how much each guild member got paid

    3) the method (reasoning) for why each member got paid a certain amount


    Biggest thing I respected about Radiance was yeah they showed how much each member was paid and explained why they were paid that much, and if you were in the tw and for whatever reason decided to quit the guild you were still paid for being in that TW.

    Props to Radiance for treating there members so well.

    and @drivel, thats what im talking about, they need to get there stories straight before making posts like that. :)
    [SIGPIC]http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=13490001&dateline=1268988639[/SIGPIC]

    I used to be a cleric like you, then I took a Plume Shot to the knee.
  • Aurellius - Heavens Tear
    Aurellius - Heavens Tear Posts: 42 Arc User
    edited December 2008
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    I know alot is stressed on my lack of communication, but I think all who were in Genesis hold this responsibility.
    It has been my first time experience dealing with territory wars, since I never got that far during the malaysian game.
    I however, talked to all the members as best I could about talking to me if they had any problems.
    Few ever mentioned the money, although I knew some feelings were being exchanged about it, no one cared to communicate to me their stresses.
    I'm not trying to flee from my mistakes, everyone makes them, I did try though guys to work with my members on fixing them.
    No one ever mentioned any of whats being shared now, so whether that be my responsibility or everyones, it none the less was a flaw that could of been avoided somehow.

    Anyways, look, I wasnt intending to start a flame war here everyone.
    I came on to acknowledge and share that I'm not arrogant enough to overlook my flaws.
    There is no pride issue on my end that prevents me from recognizing that I have made mistakes.
    Its still a learning experience for me as leadership always is, and perfect world is a place of constant change.
    The other top guilds out there may have a good system down, but even they cannot deny that it took time and effort to construct.
    I came from a background that involved a completely different style of leadership than perfect world does, so im constantly learning.
    The whole money thing, yah I admit, I didnt handle it in a proper way, other options could of been done that were later brought to light. As for what you hear from my other guildies in my defense, they are just being loyal to me and honorably trying to prevent more mockery towards me.

    I stand by the fact that I did not steal from my own faction, I am mature enough to know that only doing that would bring more harm than good. That outcome is already presented as you can see what has become of a rumor.
    So Genesis may not be the most liked guild, for some they may hate us.
    I will say this, place your disrespect towards me and not my members, it is not their responsibility that this kind of reputation preceeds me. As far as I'm concerned what reputation I once held has been smashed and trampled, so to deepen the bruising any further will to me be of no change.

    Genesis is still a faction I am loyal to and always will be, not because of what it once was or how it could of been, but what it is.
    The men and woman that share their time with me in my faction I hold in high regard, whether they are the ones who crack jokes, or are very timid. Despite what pressures people have laid against my faction, this family of mine has stood by my side thick and thin.
    They are the reason I made this post, it wasnt to attempt to redeem myself or justify my mistakes.
    I'm asking you perfect world, that if you hold any blame or ill-feeling towards my faction, let it be towards me and no further.
    I can handle stress and mockery, that kind of responsibility is something I am accustomed to in my past line of work.
    To those of you who were previously in Genesis, I'm sorry..
    Not because you didnt get what you desired, but because of my action or lack of, things didnt work out in the best form that they could of.
    To those disembodied from Genesis, if you hold disrespect or issues because of your removal then aim your frustrations at me, not my members.
    Lastly, to those who arent even a part of Genesis, I appreciate the support from selective people in perfect world. To the ones who dont like us, or dont care, your feelings are your own, when the opportunity of slander arises, I ask out of respect you refrain.

    Perhaps in some peoples eyes I may appear to be a failed leader, in others maybe just an inexperienced one.
    In my eyes, throughout my entire time of leadership roles, I have found my most important concentration is on condition of every member in my guild. Whether it be emotionally or troubles at home, members who have left Genesis but have spoken with me I feel cannot deny that I was intent on their well-being.
    Maybe it is because of that mindset I fall short in the professionalism and handling of other tasks due to my priorities.
    If such a way of leading is destined to failure, If I am unable to change to success, my focus on success then will be the fact that I at the least, tried.

    At the end of the day though, we are only human, to expect more than that, is expecting disappointment...
  • julio69
    julio69 Posts: 159 Arc User
    edited December 2008
    Options
    It turned into an object that wasnt looked upon as a gift, but instead an expectation.

    A gift?! Of course it's not a gift, are you ****ing idiot? Are you?

    If I were in your guild I wouldn't think twice before leaving, the leader is full of **** and members don't get nothing for TW which they spend a lot to go (hieros, pots, etc.).
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    RageQuit Inc.
This discussion has been closed.