Remove the AH Gold Bidding Limit!!!
Comments
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ailiadrake wrote: »So, remove these keys instead of taking off the gold cap?
Wouldn't this be a better idea than having prices increase to the moon?
EDIT: Wait... keys are a china thing, right?
The problem are not the keys or packs by themselves, but some of the items that generate coins out of nothing on that system.
Ex. could be: http://www.pwdatabase.com/pwi/items/52156
Even that item alone would not be big deal if it was something super rare and the keys not being so cheap as they used to be.
The combination of all those factors is what made gold prices skyrocket during the last few months.
Also another problem that those items can generate is that cashers or gold hoarders lose a bit of dependence from f2p players (or at least the illution of it). So they don't feel too much need to sell other stuff or the gold itself as long as they feel that those foils are giving them more coin than selling their gold/items to other players.
It is pretty much what dregenfox said In one of the previous post, PWE (or more like China devs) should had removed those foils, or at least nerf them.
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jamesburr36 wrote: »
It took literally 5+ years for gold to go from 1m to 4m, even with all the massive pack sales. Your argument makes no sense - people don't decide how much they can sell gold for arbitrarily and just succeed.
And it went from 4 mil to 6 mil in WC during one sale.
You just can't grasp the concept of supply and demand. LOL! Removing the cap will cause price of gold to go far beyond what it has been lately.
People who make threads like this are the same people who made threads about how killing botting will reverse the inflation caused by it. Little did they realize that nerfing the botting had no effect on gold prices at all. LOL!
You people think you have the answers for everything. LOLOL
The irony of your statement about supply and demand...can't fix stupid I guess ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.
LOL! Is this really all you got left?
Have you ever thought about who in the game has hoarded the most coin and what they do with it? It's the cash shoppers and they hoard it and use it to level and equip their alts. They have the coin to buy gold at 6 to 10 mil each or more when you remove the cap and they will to equip their alts.
You never really think about supply and demand at all. That is a driving factor in any economy. In this case the AH cap is acting like a 'governor' of sorts. removing it will alienate just about everyone but heavy cash shoppers. Maybe that's what people like you want.
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NO i actualy saw it in the auction house 8-9 mill that high not in wc i also saw some one literaly buying up all the gold and raising it that high in real time so yeah it can be done aparently pwi saw this and changed it back i was saleing mine for 6 mill some guy bought it all up i saw a number of gold go up and went straight to the 8-9 mill bundle literaly as fast as i pushed the button to put it up for sale so hell no0
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jamesburr36 wrote: »jamesburr36 wrote: »
It took literally 5+ years for gold to go from 1m to 4m, even with all the massive pack sales. Your argument makes no sense - people don't decide how much they can sell gold for arbitrarily and just succeed.
And it went from 4 mil to 6 mil in WC during one sale.
You just can't grasp the concept of supply and demand. LOL! Removing the cap will cause price of gold to go far beyond what it has been lately.
People who make threads like this are the same people who made threads about how killing botting will reverse the inflation caused by it. Little did they realize that nerfing the botting had no effect on gold prices at all. LOL!
You people think you have the answers for everything. LOLOL
The irony of your statement about supply and demand...can't fix stupid I guess ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.
LOL! Is this really all you got left?
Have you ever thought about who in the game has hoarded the most coin and what they do with it? It's the cash shoppers and they hoard it and use it to level and equip their alts. They have the coin to buy gold at 6 to 10 mil each or more when you remove the cap and they will to equip their alts.
You never really think about supply and demand at all. That is a driving factor in any economy. In this case the AH cap is acting like a 'governor' of sorts. removing it will alienate just about everyone but heavy cash shoppers. Maybe that's what people like you want.
Here's my suggestion on how to fix your stupid - read the previous posts before replying.
Also, take a good guess as to who are the ones who keep the game running, and supply you with all the R9 items and DoD's and other endgame items (which is the main reason you want to buy gold in the first place).0 -
Regarding Cross server AH, Might even give that supposedly third party with there ever flying cleric shop checker's a kick in the bumm...0
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Most sell through wc even when selling at 4mil per gold. I say keep the cap, remove the gold/silver and coin fees for gold trading at AH. I have friends that sell to me for 4mil a piece but they wont do it with AH because of the fees. Also, calm down peeps, different opinions don't have to be said with hate and putting others down
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The day they remove the 4m limit is the last day when you could buy anything from the boutique. 0
Ppl are greedy evils.0 -
jamesburr36 wrote: »jamesburr36 wrote: »
It took literally 5+ years for gold to go from 1m to 4m, even with all the massive pack sales. Your argument makes no sense - people don't decide how much they can sell gold for arbitrarily and just succeed.
And it went from 4 mil to 6 mil in WC during one sale.
You just can't grasp the concept of supply and demand. LOL! Removing the cap will cause price of gold to go far beyond what it has been lately.
People who make threads like this are the same people who made threads about how killing botting will reverse the inflation caused by it. Little did they realize that nerfing the botting had no effect on gold prices at all. LOL!
You people think you have the answers for everything. LOLOL
The irony of your statement about supply and demand...can't fix stupid I guess ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.
LOL! Is this really all you got left?
Have you ever thought about who in the game has hoarded the most coin and what they do with it? It's the cash shoppers and they hoard it and use it to level and equip their alts. They have the coin to buy gold at 6 to 10 mil each or more when you remove the cap and they will to equip their alts.
You never really think about supply and demand at all. That is a driving factor in any economy. In this case the AH cap is acting like a 'governor' of sorts. removing it will alienate just about everyone but heavy cash shoppers. Maybe that's what people like you want.
Here's my suggestion on how to fix your stupid - read the previous posts before replying.
Also, take a good guess as to who are the ones who keep the game running, and supply you with all the R9 items and DoD's and other endgame items (which is the main reason you want to buy gold in the first place).
Yeah. Me. I charged gold and paid for my own gear.
Oh, and I read the previous posts. How about you do the same before replying to my comment. LOL0 -
The coin limit only does 2 things:
1) It makes it much, much, MUCH harder for F2P people to buy gold.
2) It makes it slightly harder for P2W players to sell gold.
Talking about hyperinflation... When nobody ever sells gold in the AH because of the limit, and there's around 5k buy orders for the cap price, nobody wins. Then, people start selling items for coins/gold at around 6m, then AH gold trading system will never get used again.
If the gold sale cap was dynamic, it would make sense, and could combat inflation. If gold is going for 6m/each on the WC market, but the AH had the cap at 5.5m/each, it might actually help bring prices down. Having gold go for 6m/each on WC, and 4m/each on AH, then AH will simply never be effective at changing the gold market.
The huge problem with a dynamic cap is simple, though. PWE won't pay some moron to sit in front of a computer and actually do the work to maintain a dynamic cap, and it can't really be automated.
Oh, and back to my points at the top. The reason for #1 is very simple: P2W gold resellers know that gold prices are very unlikely to ever drop below 4m/gold, so they have dedicated a very large quantity of coins to jamming up the buy orders. AH is a first come, first served system, so if 200 P2W players put in MAXIMUM orders, and then 300-500 F2P players put in small orders, it takes FOREVER to fill the large orders, and helps keep the F2P people at the bottom of the list.
I charge and sell gold. I have a job. I don't have 20 hours a day to play PWI anymore. Farming stuff takes more time than I have to play. When I spend my own, hard earned money on gold, with the intent to sell it, if I see someone on WC buying gold at 5.8m/gold, there's NO WAY I'm going to dump it into the AH and sell it at a fraction of that.0 -
jamesburr36 wrote: »jamesburr36 wrote: »jamesburr36 wrote: »
It took literally 5+ years for gold to go from 1m to 4m, even with all the massive pack sales. Your argument makes no sense - people don't decide how much they can sell gold for arbitrarily and just succeed.
And it went from 4 mil to 6 mil in WC during one sale.
You just can't grasp the concept of supply and demand. LOL! Removing the cap will cause price of gold to go far beyond what it has been lately.
People who make threads like this are the same people who made threads about how killing botting will reverse the inflation caused by it. Little did they realize that nerfing the botting had no effect on gold prices at all. LOL!
You people think you have the answers for everything. LOLOL
The irony of your statement about supply and demand...can't fix stupid I guess ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.
LOL! Is this really all you got left?
Have you ever thought about who in the game has hoarded the most coin and what they do with it? It's the cash shoppers and they hoard it and use it to level and equip their alts. They have the coin to buy gold at 6 to 10 mil each or more when you remove the cap and they will to equip their alts.
You never really think about supply and demand at all. That is a driving factor in any economy. In this case the AH cap is acting like a 'governor' of sorts. removing it will alienate just about everyone but heavy cash shoppers. Maybe that's what people like you want.
Here's my suggestion on how to fix your stupid - read the previous posts before replying.
Also, take a good guess as to who are the ones who keep the game running, and supply you with all the R9 items and DoD's and other endgame items (which is the main reason you want to buy gold in the first place).
Yeah. Me. I charged gold and paid for my own gear.
Oh, and I read the previous posts. How about you do the same before replying to my comment. LOL
You are talking about supply and demand and wanting to limit both by making the AH system irrelevant, forcing players to buy/sell in WC. What exactly is that accomplishing? So you can hope to get lucky and buy a few pieces of gold at 4m every few weeks?
Just because you want gold to sell at 4 million doesn't mean players will sell at 4 million. They will just bypass the system. Sorry bud, that's not how supply and demand works.
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the gold limit/coin limit is there for a reason.. if the cap is broken.. . it will literally inflate everything. ..
4m is good price of gold.
criteria
how fast can u earn 4m?
if you can earn it within 2 hrs of playing the game. then its a good price.
if you can earn it less than 20mins of playing the game then you need to stick to the limit even more.
this is how u control inflation.
how much faster u can create coins
and how much faster u drain the coins.
this is my criteria on how much is the price of gold must be.
if people can buy it more than 4m ...
that means there is abundance of coins in the server.
this is based on my experience in playing pwi since the beginning when gold was 100k. i think the lowest was 20k. @ the very start.
well gold was raised when packs came.
the gold was raised again. when foils came.
foils should be removed coz it affects the market of item that is included in the foil.Post edited by limit1#4879 on0 -
sarrafeline wrote: »The coin limit only does 2 things:
1) It makes it much, much, MUCH harder for F2P people to buy gold.
2) It makes it slightly harder for P2W players to sell gold.
Talking about hyperinflation... When nobody ever sells gold in the AH because of the limit, and there's around 5k buy orders for the cap price, nobody wins. Then, people start selling items for coins/gold at around 6m, then AH gold trading system will never get used again.
If the gold sale cap was dynamic, it would make sense, and could combat inflation. If gold is going for 6m/each on the WC market, but the AH had the cap at 5.5m/each, it might actually help bring prices down. Having gold go for 6m/each on WC, and 4m/each on AH, then AH will simply never be effective at changing the gold market.
The huge problem with a dynamic cap is simple, though. PWE won't pay some moron to sit in front of a computer and actually do the work to maintain a dynamic cap, and it can't really be automated.
Oh, and back to my points at the top. The reason for #1 is very simple: P2W gold resellers know that gold prices are very unlikely to ever drop below 4m/gold, so they have dedicated a very large quantity of coins to jamming up the buy orders. AH is a first come, first served system, so if 200 P2W players put in MAXIMUM orders, and then 300-500 F2P players put in small orders, it takes FOREVER to fill the large orders, and helps keep the F2P people at the bottom of the list.
I charge and sell gold. I have a job. I don't have 20 hours a day to play PWI anymore. Farming stuff takes more time than I have to play. When I spend my own, hard earned money on gold, with the intent to sell it, if I see someone on WC buying gold at 5.8m/gold, there's NO WAY I'm going to dump it into the AH and sell it at a fraction of that.
Having a dynamic cap just to save players 10% of their coin makes no sense considering the cost of having to make those changes constantly will have huge impacts as far as game costs go.
Just cap the gold at an extremely high amount, and the economy will start moving again without having to spend a ton of money micromanaging every aspect of the economy.
I know it doesn't look like it will work but if you let a market sort itself out without administrative intervention, it ends up benefiting more people overall in the end.
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The gold cap is problematic because it does not motivate ppl to sell their gold at that price but instead they go to WC and get more for their buck. The reason there are ppl even selling gold in AH is the convenience of it, you cant get scammed etc. But as a result, if you can get gold trough AH you can make the easiest coin evern from it so everybody is jamming the AH gold trade.
The video was interesting, it really struggled for one reason though. There is no way to put a cap on gold prices other than selling gold at certain price by PWE, say 5m or something. This wouldnt alone be enough, there should be coin sinks too so ppl have reason for having coins.
All in all I would do the following things for the economy. Remove the gold cap, sell gold for say 5m per gold by PWE and add coin sinks that make it worthwhile to actually spend your coin to remove them from economy. As a result gold prices would drop under 5m, making that 5m "free gold" basically something that is very rarely used. But we would get economy where you can buy/sell gold easily and generally a lot better economy. This could be done w/o selling "free gold" too but it would require better coin sinks.0 -
You know whats the sad part?
We as players can make suggestions as much as we want. There are good arguments for and against it but all aggree something has to be done. Only PWI doesnt give a damn. When have we ever seen something that was suggested by us and them implemented? I cant remember anything. Be it a coinsink, economy changes, supply changes of certain mats or skill changes or what ever. Never is anything done. They do what they want and do not care.
We players, who play this game know certain things and their affects much better then any dev will ever know. But still they do not care.0 -
You know whats the sad part?
We as players can make suggestions as much as we want. There are good arguments for and against it but all aggree something has to be done. Only PWI doesnt give a damn. When have we ever seen something that was suggested by us and them implemented? I cant remember anything. Be it a coinsink, economy changes, supply changes of certain mats or skill changes or what ever. Never is anything done. They do what they want and do not care.
We players, who play this game know certain things and their affects much better then any dev will ever know. But still they do not care.
That's because the players make suggestions with a heavy bias in favor of their own situations. Most people are poor and wish they could have more gold for their coin, and seeing something become more expensive gives them a bad feeling so they make a suggestion to make the bad feeling go away.
They don't think about other parties when negotiating - only on their own desires and wishes, and since it is their idea they will convince themselves that their idea will make the game better. It might make their own life easier but would it be good for the game's income? Just ask around and see how the game's policies have pushed players to spend hundreds of their own money.
This game's population will decline regardless of the gold price because it's an aging game with little appeal to fresh gamers. Sure capping gold at 200k and having an NPC sell gold for 2m and etc and etc are all great for players, but would mean a huge loss in money for the company and will likely be flat out rejected by the Chinese devs.
They can't even be bothered to code in a cap increase because it doesn't affect their own china servers, thus they don't see a need to...my bet is that they see the US situation as something we did to ourselves and thus don't give a **** about it.Post edited by dregenfox on0 -
jamesburr36 wrote: »jamesburr36 wrote: »jamesburr36 wrote: »
It took literally 5+ years for gold to go from 1m to 4m, even with all the massive pack sales. Your argument makes no sense - people don't decide how much they can sell gold for arbitrarily and just succeed.
And it went from 4 mil to 6 mil in WC during one sale.
You just can't grasp the concept of supply and demand. LOL! Removing the cap will cause price of gold to go far beyond what it has been lately.
People who make threads like this are the same people who made threads about how killing botting will reverse the inflation caused by it. Little did they realize that nerfing the botting had no effect on gold prices at all. LOL!
You people think you have the answers for everything. LOLOL
The irony of your statement about supply and demand...can't fix stupid I guess ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.
LOL! Is this really all you got left?
Have you ever thought about who in the game has hoarded the most coin and what they do with it? It's the cash shoppers and they hoard it and use it to level and equip their alts. They have the coin to buy gold at 6 to 10 mil each or more when you remove the cap and they will to equip their alts.
You never really think about supply and demand at all. That is a driving factor in any economy. In this case the AH cap is acting like a 'governor' of sorts. removing it will alienate just about everyone but heavy cash shoppers. Maybe that's what people like you want.
Here's my suggestion on how to fix your stupid - read the previous posts before replying.
Also, take a good guess as to who are the ones who keep the game running, and supply you with all the R9 items and DoD's and other endgame items (which is the main reason you want to buy gold in the first place).
Yeah. Me. I charged gold and paid for my own gear.
Oh, and I read the previous posts. How about you do the same before replying to my comment. LOL
You are talking about supply and demand and wanting to limit both by making the AH system irrelevant, forcing players to buy/sell in WC. What exactly is that accomplishing? So you can hope to get lucky and buy a few pieces of gold at 4m every few weeks?
Just because you want gold to sell at 4 million doesn't mean players will sell at 4 million. They will just bypass the system. Sorry bud, that's not how supply and demand works.
Thanks for proving that you really don't read the posts before commenting on them.
I never stated I wanted to sell gold at 4 mil. I sell it for what people are willing to pay for it at the time I am selling it. Could be 4 mil or it could be 6+ mil. In other words I sell it for whatever gold is selling for at the time.
I also stated that leaving the cap at 4 mil acts as a 'governor' of sorts. Like a baseline price between price fluctuations. How often have you seen gold dropping below it recently?
LOL!0 -
jamesburr36 wrote: »jamesburr36 wrote: »jamesburr36 wrote: »jamesburr36 wrote: »
It took literally 5+ years for gold to go from 1m to 4m, even with all the massive pack sales. Your argument makes no sense - people don't decide how much they can sell gold for arbitrarily and just succeed.
And it went from 4 mil to 6 mil in WC during one sale.
You just can't grasp the concept of supply and demand. LOL! Removing the cap will cause price of gold to go far beyond what it has been lately.
People who make threads like this are the same people who made threads about how killing botting will reverse the inflation caused by it. Little did they realize that nerfing the botting had no effect on gold prices at all. LOL!
You people think you have the answers for everything. LOLOL
The irony of your statement about supply and demand...can't fix stupid I guess ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.
LOL! Is this really all you got left?
Have you ever thought about who in the game has hoarded the most coin and what they do with it? It's the cash shoppers and they hoard it and use it to level and equip their alts. They have the coin to buy gold at 6 to 10 mil each or more when you remove the cap and they will to equip their alts.
You never really think about supply and demand at all. That is a driving factor in any economy. In this case the AH cap is acting like a 'governor' of sorts. removing it will alienate just about everyone but heavy cash shoppers. Maybe that's what people like you want.
Here's my suggestion on how to fix your stupid - read the previous posts before replying.
Also, take a good guess as to who are the ones who keep the game running, and supply you with all the R9 items and DoD's and other endgame items (which is the main reason you want to buy gold in the first place).
Yeah. Me. I charged gold and paid for my own gear.
Oh, and I read the previous posts. How about you do the same before replying to my comment. LOL
You are talking about supply and demand and wanting to limit both by making the AH system irrelevant, forcing players to buy/sell in WC. What exactly is that accomplishing? So you can hope to get lucky and buy a few pieces of gold at 4m every few weeks?
Just because you want gold to sell at 4 million doesn't mean players will sell at 4 million. They will just bypass the system. Sorry bud, that's not how supply and demand works.
Thanks for proving that you really don't read the posts before commenting on them.
I never stated I wanted to sell gold at 4 mil. I sell it for what people are willing to pay for it at the time I am selling it. Could be 4 mil or it could be 6+ mil. In other words I sell it for whatever gold is selling for at the time.
I also stated that leaving the cap at 4 mil acts as a 'governor' of sorts. Like a baseline price between price fluctuations. How often have you seen gold dropping below it recently?
LOL!
It doesn't act as a governer buddy. You literally just said yourself that you will bypass the AH and sell gold for 6m if its worth that much. The cap will only keep the gold at 4m between fluctuations if the real value of gold is close enough that bypassing the AH isn't worth the trouble.
IDK what you're even trying to say at this point.
(BTW here's how it works - temporary fluctuations to 6/7m during key sales does not mean the gold price is actually going to stay at that price point. So don't panic man - it will drop back down once the sale is over. When you measure gold price over a span of years its best to take the average over a period of time - say 1 month)0 -
jamesburr36 wrote: »jamesburr36 wrote: »jamesburr36 wrote: »jamesburr36 wrote: »
It took literally 5+ years for gold to go from 1m to 4m, even with all the massive pack sales. Your argument makes no sense - people don't decide how much they can sell gold for arbitrarily and just succeed.
And it went from 4 mil to 6 mil in WC during one sale.
You just can't grasp the concept of supply and demand. LOL! Removing the cap will cause price of gold to go far beyond what it has been lately.
People who make threads like this are the same people who made threads about how killing botting will reverse the inflation caused by it. Little did they realize that nerfing the botting had no effect on gold prices at all. LOL!
You people think you have the answers for everything. LOLOL
The irony of your statement about supply and demand...can't fix stupid I guess ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.
LOL! Is this really all you got left?
Have you ever thought about who in the game has hoarded the most coin and what they do with it? It's the cash shoppers and they hoard it and use it to level and equip their alts. They have the coin to buy gold at 6 to 10 mil each or more when you remove the cap and they will to equip their alts.
You never really think about supply and demand at all. That is a driving factor in any economy. In this case the AH cap is acting like a 'governor' of sorts. removing it will alienate just about everyone but heavy cash shoppers. Maybe that's what people like you want.
Here's my suggestion on how to fix your stupid - read the previous posts before replying.
Also, take a good guess as to who are the ones who keep the game running, and supply you with all the R9 items and DoD's and other endgame items (which is the main reason you want to buy gold in the first place).
Yeah. Me. I charged gold and paid for my own gear.
Oh, and I read the previous posts. How about you do the same before replying to my comment. LOL
You are talking about supply and demand and wanting to limit both by making the AH system irrelevant, forcing players to buy/sell in WC. What exactly is that accomplishing? So you can hope to get lucky and buy a few pieces of gold at 4m every few weeks?
Just because you want gold to sell at 4 million doesn't mean players will sell at 4 million. They will just bypass the system. Sorry bud, that's not how supply and demand works.
Thanks for proving that you really don't read the posts before commenting on them.
I never stated I wanted to sell gold at 4 mil. I sell it for what people are willing to pay for it at the time I am selling it. Could be 4 mil or it could be 6+ mil. In other words I sell it for whatever gold is selling for at the time.
I also stated that leaving the cap at 4 mil acts as a 'governor' of sorts. Like a baseline price between price fluctuations. How often have you seen gold dropping below it recently?
LOL!
It doesn't act as a governer buddy.
* Yes it does. Remove it and gold price will creep up as it has already done. If what you say is true then gold would fall below the 4 mil cap but it doesn't and people still sell gold in WC when there is no high demand for it during sales. LOL!
You literally just said yourself that you will bypass the AH and sell gold for 6m if its worth that much.
* Yes and so? People willing to pay to get what they want in the boutique and I get spend rewards that way. Win, Win.
The cap will only keep the gold at 4m between fluctuations if the real value of gold is close enough that bypassing the AH isn't worth the trouble.
* Then that makes removing the cap a moot point, doesn't it? Removing it will only set that AH baseline higher. It will go up because those with the most coin on each server are willing to compete for it. LOL.
IDK what you're even trying to say at this point.
* Most likely because you see this issue through rose colored glasses.
(BTW here's how it works - temporary fluctuations to 6/7m during key sales does not mean the gold price is actually going to stay at that price point. So don't panic man - it will drop back down once the sale is over.
* Drop down to what? The 4 mil cap and that is my point. What do you think will happen if that cap is removed? Gold going below 4 mil? LOL!
When you measure gold price over a span of years its best to take the average over a period of time - say 1 month)
How about looking at the gold price trend for 8 years. It goes up and not down over the long run. LOL!
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jamesburr36 wrote: »jamesburr36 wrote: »jamesburr36 wrote: »jamesburr36 wrote: »
It took literally 5+ years for gold to go from 1m to 4m, even with all the massive pack sales. Your argument makes no sense - people don't decide how much they can sell gold for arbitrarily and just succeed.
And it went from 4 mil to 6 mil in WC during one sale.
You just can't grasp the concept of supply and demand. LOL! Removing the cap will cause price of gold to go far beyond what it has been lately.
People who make threads like this are the same people who made threads about how killing botting will reverse the inflation caused by it. Little did they realize that nerfing the botting had no effect on gold prices at all. LOL!
You people think you have the answers for everything. LOLOL
The irony of your statement about supply and demand...can't fix stupid I guess ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.
LOL! Is this really all you got left?
Have you ever thought about who in the game has hoarded the most coin and what they do with it? It's the cash shoppers and they hoard it and use it to level and equip their alts. They have the coin to buy gold at 6 to 10 mil each or more when you remove the cap and they will to equip their alts.
You never really think about supply and demand at all. That is a driving factor in any economy. In this case the AH cap is acting like a 'governor' of sorts. removing it will alienate just about everyone but heavy cash shoppers. Maybe that's what people like you want.
Here's my suggestion on how to fix your stupid - read the previous posts before replying.
Also, take a good guess as to who are the ones who keep the game running, and supply you with all the R9 items and DoD's and other endgame items (which is the main reason you want to buy gold in the first place).
Yeah. Me. I charged gold and paid for my own gear.
Oh, and I read the previous posts. How about you do the same before replying to my comment. LOL
You are talking about supply and demand and wanting to limit both by making the AH system irrelevant, forcing players to buy/sell in WC. What exactly is that accomplishing? So you can hope to get lucky and buy a few pieces of gold at 4m every few weeks?
Just because you want gold to sell at 4 million doesn't mean players will sell at 4 million. They will just bypass the system. Sorry bud, that's not how supply and demand works.
Thanks for proving that you really don't read the posts before commenting on them.
I never stated I wanted to sell gold at 4 mil. I sell it for what people are willing to pay for it at the time I am selling it. Could be 4 mil or it could be 6+ mil. In other words I sell it for whatever gold is selling for at the time.
I also stated that leaving the cap at 4 mil acts as a 'governor' of sorts. Like a baseline price between price fluctuations. How often have you seen gold dropping below it recently?
LOL!
It doesn't act as a governer buddy.
* Yes it does. Do you ever see the gold pricing fluctuate away from the AH cap after the crazy sales and high demand? LOL at your notion that the price will remain there after the cap is gone. just LAWL @ LAWL!
You literally just said yourself that you will bypass the AH and sell gold for 6m if its worth that much.
* Yes and so? People willing to pay to get what they want from the boutique at a competitive price and I get spend rewards. Win, win.
The cap will only keep the gold at 4m between fluctuations if the real value of gold is close enough that bypassing the AH isn't worth the trouble.
* Then that makes removing the cap a moot point, doesn't it?
IDK what you're even trying to say at this point.
* That's because you are looking at this issue through rose colored glasses and not the historical perspective.
(BTW here's how it works - temporary fluctuations to 6/7m during key sales does not mean the gold price is actually going to stay at that price point. So don't panic man - it will drop back down once the sale is over.
* Drop down to what? Lower than the 4 mil cap? LOL! Again supply and demand. Remove the cap and watch the baseline price of gold in the AH creep up to 5 mil, 6 mil, etc.
When you measure gold price over a span of years its best to take the average over a period of time - say 1 month)
How about you look at the gold price trend for the past 8 years. It's nothing but an incline. Again gold is priced at what people are willing to pay for it and guess what? Those on the server with the most coin are going to compete for it. That's why it always goes up and not back down.
Think about it.0 -
jamesburr36 wrote: »
How about you look at the gold price trend for the past 8 years. It's nothing but an incline. Again gold is priced at what people are willing to pay for it and guess what? Those on the server with the most coin are going to compete for it. That's why it always goes up and not back down.
Think about it.
You are just plain wrong in here. The main reason why gold prices go up is because there is more and more coins on server, mostly result of PWEs pack/key sales. Back when HS came out, gold prices started dropping because there were significant new coin sink in place. It was however only temporary sink as ppl havent had the need to invest coins on it since leveling all the buildings. And then PWE came out with pack spam, which drove gold at the cap again. Time goes by, gold prices start dropping a bit again as there are less and less influx of coins but then comes the key sales post foils. Which is the reason our gold market is how it is currently, w/o foils I doubt we would be much over 4m gold, least on Et.
We would need a massive coin sink to remove the coin foils threw into economy in order for gold prices to drop. But figuring out a sink, which PWCN pouts in their version as we are done getting special content, and which would also work is pretty tough task. The only thing I can think of is temporary gold trade for coins by the company at something like 4-5m. This will possibly affect their sales a bit but there are just no perfect solutions left. PWE themselves caused the issues with pack/key spam due their pricing. But realistically I am talking bout gold trade for coin because its the only sink I can think of CN accepting, endgame items for coins and we would be at a problem where server prices might be drastically, either affecting CN version by creating new cheap items for them or being completely ineffective as they would be priced too high here to remove any coins.
The one thing I know bout CN economy well is that gold there is 1m ea, despite having massive bot problems. The pricing in their boutique is also drastically different, meaning they got more coin on servers. This likely means their endgame items, say DoDs, DoTs, etc. cost more than in our version so adding DoD/DoT trrade for example to 90m, which is roughly what they would be removing coin from ET at is simply too low for CN version. Easiest way is to throw the company provided gold at cap or say 5m if ppl think 4m gold is too cheap cause nobody on CN would ever use it and thus would leave their version unaffected.0 -
jamesburr36 wrote: »
How about you look at the gold price trend for the past 8 years. It's nothing but an incline. Again gold is priced at what people are willing to pay for it and guess what? Those on the server with the most coin are going to compete for it. That's why it always goes up and not back down.
Think about it.
You are just plain wrong in here. The main reason why gold prices go up is because there is more and more coins on server, mostly result of PWEs pack/key sales. Back when HS came out, gold prices started dropping because there were significant new coin sink in place. It was however only temporary sink as ppl havent had the need to invest coins on it since leveling all the buildings. And then PWE came out with pack spam, which drove gold at the cap again. Time goes by, gold prices start dropping a bit again as there are less and less influx of coins but then comes the key sales post foils. Which is the reason our gold market is how it is currently, w/o foils I doubt we would be much over 4m gold, least on Et.
We would need a massive coin sink to remove the coin foils threw into economy in order for gold prices to drop. But figuring out a sink, which PWCN pouts in their version as we are done getting special content, and which would also work is pretty tough task. The only thing I can think of is temporary gold trade for coins by the company at something like 4-5m. This will possibly affect their sales a bit but there are just no perfect solutions left. PWE themselves caused the issues with pack/key spam due their pricing. But realistically I am talking bout gold trade for coin because its the only sink I can think of CN accepting, endgame items for coins and we would be at a problem where server prices might be drastically, either affecting CN version by creating new cheap items for them or being completely ineffective as they would be priced too high here to remove any coins.
The one thing I know bout CN economy well is that gold there is 1m ea, despite having massive bot problems. The pricing in their boutique is also drastically different, meaning they got more coin on servers. This likely means their endgame items, say DoDs, DoTs, etc. cost more than in our version so adding DoD/DoT trrade for example to 90m, which is roughly what they would be removing coin from ET at is simply too low for CN version. Easiest way is to throw the company provided gold at cap or say 5m if ppl think 4m gold is too cheap cause nobody on CN would ever use it and thus would leave their version unaffected.
Again, keeping the cap will do absolutely nothing to help newbies. Inflation is not an issue as long as it is steady and predictable. The price of gold has been rising for years with no issues until we hit that arbitrary 4m cap. Just because AH states gold is selling at 4m DOES NOT mean you will actually get gold at 4 million. The pack items being sold in catshops are also being priced accordingly to the actual gold price, not the AH price.
This is the reason why key price shot up from 800k to 1.2m+ even though AH price stayed at 4m.
Want to know why it's getting harder for f2p players? It's game design, not gold price. TT has been outdated for years, and it's barrier to entry is trivial due to gear progression. Nirvana is dead due to NW, and demand is low because it's also been outdated for years. There are time limits/entry limits to both FSP, UP, and farming glyphs. In addition, the price for glyphs have been plummeting due to larger and larger supply with decreasing demand, making farming even less worthwhile.
Want to fix things? Stop looking at inflation, and look at ways for people to farm up high-end gear instead of just getting everything through cash shop. You are just addressing an ancillary effect of the game system, not the actual root cause of the problem.
China doesn't have this issue because most of the gear is farmed via R8 upgrade system, and R9 isn't sold via cash shop.
The reason I haven't been suggesting this to the devs is because I know there's no way PWI will change our system. We are simply too invested and screwed ourselves with our boutique-heavy system. The only real solution is to let the gold price inflate so we can keep the AH relevant. Having a useless AH will only lower the quality of the game for everyone involved. I'm proposing workable solutions, not ideal dreams.
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Again, keeping the cap will do absolutely nothing to help newbies. Inflation is not an issue as long as it is steady and predictable. The price of gold has been rising for years with no issues until we hit that arbitrary 4m cap. Just because AH states gold is selling at 4m DOES NOT mean you will actually get gold at 4 million. The pack items being sold in catshops are also being priced accordingly to the actual gold price, not the AH price.
This is the reason why key price shot up from 800k to 1.2m+ even though AH price stayed at 4m.
Want to know why it's getting harder for f2p players? It's game design, not gold price. TT has been outdated for years, and it's barrier to entry is trivial due to gear progression. Nirvana is dead due to NW, and demand is low because it's also been outdated for years. There are time limits/entry limits to both FSP, UP, and farming glyphs. In addition, the price for glyphs have been plummeting due to larger and larger supply with decreasing demand, making farming even less worthwhile.
Want to fix things? Stop looking at inflation, and look at ways for people to farm up high-end gear instead of just getting everything through cash shop. You are just addressing an ancillary effect of the game system, not the actual root cause of the problem.
I have nowhere advocated keeping the cap but just releasing the cap and doing nothing else will not fix the issues. You cant farm coin reasonably from anywhere any longer as everything has been nerfed, the BH rewards for example are a joke with current gold prices. Even if they would come up with new instances to farm, the problem is there is barely any options for newbies to farm them to make coin and their quality of life in this game is really low. For that the lower gold prices are, the better for them. And low gold prices are not a problem for CSers when endgame items come down in price too, which they will if the value of coin is increased by bettering the rate it has for gold.
But lets imagine PWI came out with a new instance, which would drop something desired by endgame players. Do you really think it would be something your average N3s could farm? In its essence even introducing such instance would do nothing to better the life of newbies, which is why reasonable gold prices are very important for them. And like I said, as everything is basically tied to gold prices, dropping gold prices will not harm CSers at all as its one and the same what gold prices are if they get the same 5 DoDs for their 100$ for example. There would be ppl who have a lot of coins benefiting from this, sure, but is that such a issue when it would improve the economy quite a bit?
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Again, keeping the cap will do absolutely nothing to help newbies. Inflation is not an issue as long as it is steady and predictable. The price of gold has been rising for years with no issues until we hit that arbitrary 4m cap. Just because AH states gold is selling at 4m DOES NOT mean you will actually get gold at 4 million. The pack items being sold in catshops are also being priced accordingly to the actual gold price, not the AH price.
This is the reason why key price shot up from 800k to 1.2m+ even though AH price stayed at 4m.
Want to know why it's getting harder for f2p players? It's game design, not gold price. TT has been outdated for years, and it's barrier to entry is trivial due to gear progression. Nirvana is dead due to NW, and demand is low because it's also been outdated for years. There are time limits/entry limits to both FSP, UP, and farming glyphs. In addition, the price for glyphs have been plummeting due to larger and larger supply with decreasing demand, making farming even less worthwhile.
Want to fix things? Stop looking at inflation, and look at ways for people to farm up high-end gear instead of just getting everything through cash shop. You are just addressing an ancillary effect of the game system, not the actual root cause of the problem.
I have nowhere advocated keeping the cap but just releasing the cap and doing nothing else will not fix the issues. You cant farm coin reasonably from anywhere any longer as everything has been nerfed, the BH rewards for example are a joke with current gold prices. Even if they would come up with new instances to farm, the problem is there is barely any options for newbies to farm them to make coin and their quality of life in this game is really low. For that the lower gold prices are, the better for them. And low gold prices are not a problem for CSers when endgame items come down in price too, which they will if the value of coin is increased by bettering the rate it has for gold.
But lets imagine PWI came out with a new instance, which would drop something desired by endgame players. Do you really think it would be something your average N3s could farm? In its essence even introducing such instance would do nothing to better the life of newbies, which is why reasonable gold prices are very important for them. And like I said, as everything is basically tied to gold prices, dropping gold prices will not harm CSers at all as its one and the same what gold prices are if they get the same 5 DoDs for their 100$ for example. There would be ppl who have a lot of coins benefiting from this, sure, but is that such a issue when it would improve the economy quite a bit?
Introducing a coin sink will only help those people with massive amounts of coins even more. All the f2p players still don't have their houses even close to maxed out - some don't even have a house yet. F2p players have all they need to level up from the free drops from supply boxes/rewards. You can't expect a player to play free forever.
PWI would need to remove big notes and foils plus remove coin from TW in order to stop the inflation of coins, and this isn't gong to happen because china won't change something that doesn't affect their servers.
They actually did remove coin rewards from TW once but it was so unpopular that it was eventually changed back.0 -
Introducing a coin sink will only help those people with massive amounts of coins even more. All the f2p players still don't have their houses even close to maxed out - some don't even have a house yet. F2p players have all they need to level up from the free drops from supply boxes/rewards. You can't expect a player to play free forever.
PWI would need to remove big notes and foils plus remove coin from TW in order to stop the inflation of coins, and this isn't gong to happen because china won't change something that doesn't affect their servers.
They actually did remove coin rewards from TW once but it was so unpopular that it was eventually changed back.
I should of known better than to try to talk bout economy with you as clearly you lack any basic understanding of the subject.
By introducing a coin sink gold prices will go down, helping those who cant afford current gold prices. Yes, it will benefit ppl with a lot of coin as long as the coin sink is worthwhile to participate into but so what? What is the actual issue in it? These ppl who have a lot of coin will get something to use their coin into, boohoo? Meanwhile lower gold prices would actually help across the board and like I said, it would not make CSers charge any less if and when they get same amount of goodies they want as they did before, which is a given considering our economy is based on gold prices.
Its not a fix that will end all problems, we do need up to date farming options, but it sure will help a lot. Just throwing new endgame instance will do nothing for majority of players who are struggling even if we need one for our economy.0 -
If you do look at gold prices since 2008, then yes, they have gone up. In fact, they've gone from 100k to over 6m.
But if you look at the gold prices since 2011, they haven't gone up.
I'm talking about the average gold price. In 2011, the average was around 4.5m. Looking at 2016, the average price was around 4.5m. Yes, the price spikes up to around 6m during sales, but when there aren't any good sales, it drops. In fact, it sometimes drops below 4m. Last year, I charged and went to sell it for 3,999,900 coins as usual, and there were no buy orders that high. In fact, buy orders were around 3.4m, with sell offers just a bit higher. I ended up waiting for a sale, and sold my gold for 4.4m instead.
The cap in the AH really serves no purpose anymore. Besides, there's a selling fee, which actually makes it a bit of a ripoff. I could sell 10g on AH, and get 40m, but there's also the 20 silver AH fee. I could sell 10g on WC for 50m, and keep that 20 silver. Not really a huge dealbreaker, but... Even when gold prices are under 3,999,900, I still sell on WC unless I really need the coins instantly.0 -
Introducing a coin sink will only help those people with massive amounts of coins even more. All the f2p players still don't have their houses even close to maxed out - some don't even have a house yet. F2p players have all they need to level up from the free drops from supply boxes/rewards. You can't expect a player to play free forever.
PWI would need to remove big notes and foils plus remove coin from TW in order to stop the inflation of coins, and this isn't gong to happen because china won't change something that doesn't affect their servers.
They actually did remove coin rewards from TW once but it was so unpopular that it was eventually changed back.
I should of known better than to try to talk bout economy with you as clearly you lack any basic understanding of the subject.
By introducing a coin sink gold prices will go down, helping those who cant afford current gold prices. Yes, it will benefit ppl with a lot of coin as long as the coin sink is worthwhile to participate into but so what? What is the actual issue in it? These ppl who have a lot of coin will get something to use their coin into, boohoo? Meanwhile lower gold prices would actually help across the board and like I said, it would not make CSers charge any less if and when they get same amount of goodies they want as they did before, which is a given considering our economy is based on gold prices.
Its not a fix that will end all problems, we do need up to date farming options, but it sure will help a lot. Just throwing new endgame instance will do nothing for majority of players who are struggling even if we need one for our economy.
No, you're just not understanding how inflation works. When gold price goes up, the prices for all endgame items go up concurrently. It makes things more expensive but it also becomes easier to make money as well. This is why all real prices are compared after factoring in the price of gold after inflation.
The items that newbies want are relatively price-inelastic when it comes to gold inflation. TT mats/supply tokens/low refine orbs are all at pretty much rock-bottom prices that won't rise much even with inflation. A newbie nowdays can charge 5 gold and buy multiple gold TT mats and finish most of his gears - something that wasn't possible 5 years ago.
You can't make a coin sink that doesn't widen the gap between the haves and have-nots. People aren't stupid. They won't spend coin on something that isn't worthwhile. This is why we have a situation where F2p players are stuck without a decent home and no sigil income, while CS'ers have maxed out homes and are making 2m+ coin every day from sigil sales.
A worthwhile coin sink would be something like selling gold from an NPC for 3m each, or selling DoD/DoT for 50m per. Guess what? This would absolutely kill the need for all of the current CS'ers to ever charge gold ever again. Pretty much every CS'er in this game is sitting on billions of coins from opened packs/keys/etc. Guess who needs to take up the slack if the whales are suddenly gifted with 10000 free gold?
The new instance dropping tradeable glyphs, or the old FSP, are great example of farmers taking advantage of CS'ers massive coin base to make money for themselves in-game. Remove the limits on those like we did with old Nirvana, and we can go back to a time where you could trade time -> money and farm up to endgame through pve alone. FSP should have been uncapped from the start, with the drop rates halved to support PVE farmers.0 -
No, you're just not understanding how inflation works. When gold price goes up, the prices for all endgame items go up concurrently. It makes things more expensive but it also becomes easier to make money as well. This is why all real prices are compared after factoring in the price of gold after inflation.
The items that newbies want are relatively price-inelastic when it comes to gold inflation. TT mats/supply tokens/low refine orbs are all at pretty much rock-bottom prices that won't rise much even with inflation. A newbie nowdays can charge 5 gold and buy multiple gold TT mats and finish most of his gears - something that wasn't possible 5 years ago.
You can't make a coin sink that doesn't widen the gap between the haves and have-nots. People aren't stupid. They won't spend coin on something that isn't worthwhile. This is why we have a situation where F2p players are stuck without a decent home and no sigil income, while CS'ers have maxed out homes and are making 2m+ coin every day from sigil sales.
A worthwhile coin sink would be something like selling gold from an NPC for 3m each, or selling DoD/DoT for 50m per. Guess what? This would absolutely kill the need for all of the current CS'ers to ever charge gold ever again. Pretty much every CS'er in this game is sitting on billions of coins from opened packs/keys/etc. Guess who needs to take up the slack if the whales are suddenly gifted with 10000 free gold?
The new instance dropping tradeable glyphs, or the old FSP, are great example of farmers taking advantage of CS'ers massive coin base to make money for themselves in-game. Remove the limits on those like we did with old Nirvana, and we can go back to a time where you could trade time -> money and farm up to endgame through pve alone. FSP should have been uncapped from the start, with the drop rates halved to support PVE farmers.
Why dont you explain us dumdums how higher gold prices are supposed to make making coin easier? I know how its supposed to work in rl but you cant just take that and throw it into game, when certain mechanics are quite different. The ways newbies are going to make coin are not linked to gold prices so basically for them it doesnt matter what gold prices are, they are going to make the same X amount of coin each day. But with lower gold prices they actually get more for their time.
As for homes, would it not be stupid not to upgrade your home? You say ppl arent stupid but if you make say 2m a day from HS, wouldnt it not be smart to actually invest on it? Obviously having the base capital to start HS might be a problem but considering how cheap and easy its to make HS to start making coin for you thats really no good argument.
I dont understand why you keep making these strawman arguments. I even gave number examples on prices, you go halve them and attack those now halved numbers, lol. And 10000 gold, how many ppl do you expect to sit on 40-50b coin? There might be couple, some exceeding that amount but for vast majority of even the bigger McScrooges thats not the case. Or who on earth would charge if they had that sort of coin in the first place? NP promos would of been one reason, too bad they gone.
Considering the prices of FSP coins, least on Et, pre update, I would hardly call it taking advantage of "CSers massive coin base". They are obviously going up due supply getting hard hit but C packs used to cost more than twice on Archosaur what they are currently on Et.
Also nirvana had a key system unless you are forgetting but ppl did stack keys till 2x drops allowing them to run a lot of Nirvana - The limitations to said instance still existed. As for glyphs, didnt you say those were already dropping in price drastically with the limitations? So removing keys from DH would not actually fix much as the more there is supply the less things are going to cost as long as demand doesnt increase.0 -
No, you're just not understanding how inflation works. When gold price goes up, the prices for all endgame items go up concurrently. It makes things more expensive but it also becomes easier to make money as well. This is why all real prices are compared after factoring in the price of gold after inflation.
The items that newbies want are relatively price-inelastic when it comes to gold inflation. TT mats/supply tokens/low refine orbs are all at pretty much rock-bottom prices that won't rise much even with inflation. A newbie nowdays can charge 5 gold and buy multiple gold TT mats and finish most of his gears - something that wasn't possible 5 years ago.
You can't make a coin sink that doesn't widen the gap between the haves and have-nots. People aren't stupid. They won't spend coin on something that isn't worthwhile. This is why we have a situation where F2p players are stuck without a decent home and no sigil income, while CS'ers have maxed out homes and are making 2m+ coin every day from sigil sales.
A worthwhile coin sink would be something like selling gold from an NPC for 3m each, or selling DoD/DoT for 50m per. Guess what? This would absolutely kill the need for all of the current CS'ers to ever charge gold ever again. Pretty much every CS'er in this game is sitting on billions of coins from opened packs/keys/etc. Guess who needs to take up the slack if the whales are suddenly gifted with 10000 free gold?
The new instance dropping tradeable glyphs, or the old FSP, are great example of farmers taking advantage of CS'ers massive coin base to make money for themselves in-game. Remove the limits on those like we did with old Nirvana, and we can go back to a time where you could trade time -> money and farm up to endgame through pve alone. FSP should have been uncapped from the start, with the drop rates halved to support PVE farmers.
Why dont you explain us dumdums how higher gold prices are supposed to make making coin easier? I know how its supposed to work in rl but you cant just take that and throw it into game, when certain mechanics are quite different. The ways newbies are going to make coin are not linked to gold prices so basically for them it doesnt matter what gold prices are, they are going to make the same X amount of coin each day. But with lower gold prices they actually get more for their time.
As for homes, would it not be stupid not to upgrade your home? You say ppl arent stupid but if you make say 2m a day from HS, wouldnt it not be smart to actually invest on it? Obviously having the base capital to start HS might be a problem but considering how cheap and easy its to make HS to start making coin for you thats really no good argument.
I dont understand why you keep making these strawman arguments. I even gave number examples on prices, you go halve them and attack those now halved numbers, lol. And 10000 gold, how many ppl do you expect to sit on 40-50b coin? There might be couple, some exceeding that amount but for vast majority of even the bigger McScrooges thats not the case. Or who on earth would charge if they had that sort of coin in the first place? NP promos would of been one reason, too bad they gone.
Considering the prices of FSP coins, least on Et, pre update, I would hardly call it taking advantage of "CSers massive coin base". They are obviously going up due supply getting hard hit but C packs used to cost more than twice on Archosaur what they are currently on Et.
Also nirvana had a key system unless you are forgetting but ppl did stack keys till 2x drops allowing them to run a lot of Nirvana - The limitations to said instance still existed. As for glyphs, didnt you say those were already dropping in price drastically with the limitations? So removing keys from DH would not actually fix much as the more there is supply the less things are going to cost as long as demand doesnt increase.
Why are you so obsessed with taking care of the people that log in to do BH and nothing else while never contributing any money to support the game? BH gives an ecstasy card at most a couple times a week. The vast majority of coin income players make right now is from FSP and selling glyphs. Guess who buys those items? It certainly isn't the newbies making 100k coins a day.
My best guess is that the average endgame player is sitting on a couple billion coins. I think you're vastly underestimating how much dead money and inventory there is in the game right now due to the backlog in buying gold. And these players are the ones most likely to invest more money into the game, not the FSP-alt farmers or BH newbies.
Even back when Nirvana was making farmers a ton of money, nearly all of that income was from cash shoppers. Cash shoppers would open packs, make some big notes, give those coins to the farmers, and then sell pack items to farmers to get that coin back.
The only way to make a coin sink effective is to make it more attractive than buying gold. If you take a look at the key sales, PWI's income probably increased 5x with the simple act of introducing goldfoils into the packs. They changed literally nothing else. So this is obviously not going to go away. How exactly are you going to entice players to make trillions of their coin disappear without killing the revenue stream of the game or introducing massive gear inflation?
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Why are you so obsessed with taking care of the people that log in to do BH and nothing else while never contributing any money to support the game? BH gives an ecstasy card at most a couple times a week. The vast majority of coin income players make right now is from FSP and selling glyphs. Guess who buys those items? It certainly isn't the newbies making 100k coins a day.
My best guess is that the average endgame player is sitting on a couple billion coins. I think you're vastly underestimating how much dead money and inventory there is in the game right now due to the backlog in buying gold. And these players are the ones most likely to invest more money into the game, not the FSP-alt farmers or BH newbies.
Even back when Nirvana was making farmers a ton of money, nearly all of that income was from cash shoppers. Cash shoppers would open packs, make some big notes, give those coins to the farmers, and then sell pack items to farmers to get that coin back.
The only way to make a coin sink effective is to make it more attractive than buying gold. If you take a look at the key sales, PWI's income probably increased 5x with the simple act of introducing goldfoils into the packs. They changed literally nothing else. So this is obviously not going to go away. How exactly are you going to entice players to make trillions of their coin disappear without killing the revenue stream of the game or introducing massive gear inflation?
Obsessed? lol. What I dont understand is what harm there is making game more accessible to players outside of the top5% when doing it harms nobody. Ppl with billions and billions of coins are most likely not charging and if they do, they arent charging much. So even if they got "free" gold, what would it in fact change? They werent going to charge either way if and when there arent promos the kind of NP promo, which would motivate them charge due gold being difficult to buy in such quantities.
Tell me 1 good reason why somebody would charge if they had billions of coins just sitting around if they werent doing it for a promo? And PWE took those exclusive promos away, really leaving no reason to drop cash if you had the coin and didnt want to just support the game. This is because everything can be bought with coins as it is.
As for coin sinks, you are comparing apples to oranges. Coin sink can be very successful if it offers some endgame items at an reasonable rate. Say shards or orbs, whatever. But you seem to live with a mindset where everything should be locked behind gold in order for the game to survive. Talk bout buying into the **** PWE been doing, there are many other monetarizing options they could of taken instead of locking all of endgame gear behind gold.0 -
Why are you so obsessed with taking care of the people that log in to do BH and nothing else while never contributing any money to support the game? BH gives an ecstasy card at most a couple times a week. The vast majority of coin income players make right now is from FSP and selling glyphs. Guess who buys those items? It certainly isn't the newbies making 100k coins a day.
My best guess is that the average endgame player is sitting on a couple billion coins. I think you're vastly underestimating how much dead money and inventory there is in the game right now due to the backlog in buying gold. And these players are the ones most likely to invest more money into the game, not the FSP-alt farmers or BH newbies.
Even back when Nirvana was making farmers a ton of money, nearly all of that income was from cash shoppers. Cash shoppers would open packs, make some big notes, give those coins to the farmers, and then sell pack items to farmers to get that coin back.
The only way to make a coin sink effective is to make it more attractive than buying gold. If you take a look at the key sales, PWI's income probably increased 5x with the simple act of introducing goldfoils into the packs. They changed literally nothing else. So this is obviously not going to go away. How exactly are you going to entice players to make trillions of their coin disappear without killing the revenue stream of the game or introducing massive gear inflation?
Obsessed? lol. What I dont understand is what harm there is making game more accessible to players outside of the top5% when doing it harms nobody. Ppl with billions and billions of coins are most likely not charging and if they do, they arent charging much. So even if they got "free" gold, what would it in fact change? They werent going to charge either way if and when there arent promos the kind of NP promo, which would motivate them charge due gold being difficult to buy in such quantities.
Tell me 1 good reason why somebody would charge if they had billions of coins just sitting around if they werent doing it for a promo? And PWE took those exclusive promos away, really leaving no reason to drop cash if you had the coin and didnt want to just support the game. This is because everything can be bought with coins as it is.
As for coin sinks, you are comparing apples to oranges. Coin sink can be very successful if it offers some endgame items at an reasonable rate. Say shards or orbs, whatever. But you seem to live with a mindset where everything should be locked behind gold in order for the game to survive. Talk bout buying into the **** PWE been doing, there are many other monetarizing options they could of taken instead of locking all of endgame gear behind gold.
You still haven't offered an actual solution besides just stating basic stuff that everyone knows. The issue here isn't about understanding basic economic principles, it's about applying them effectively based on the environment and situation. You are talking about removing trillions of coins from the economy to help pure f2p players buy a couple gold easier, without explaining just how you're going to accomplish that.
What would be a reasonable rate to offer endgame shards at, and what kind of shards would you offer that would be acceptable for China? What would be the impact on pack sales or charge promos if you started selling DoD/DoT from an npc at 60m each? If you're not offering a solution that can be implemented by China, then that solution is useless. It's also not enough to lower gold under 4m - you'd need to do even more.
It's easy to say, for example, "Oh North Korea is super weak we can just nuke them, idk why Washington is so incompetent." Or, "Mexicans can pay for the wall if we just charge super high tariffs of them, easy". That's a very easy "basic" analysis anyone can make. Everyone thinks they could just fix everything if they got a chance to be President, because at the end of the day the actual solution is simple - the execution and consequences aren't.0
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