APS in next expansion.

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  • keihan007#7641
    keihan007#7641 Posts: 1,190 Arc User
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    nunuator wrote: »
    APS is by far from dead take a look at paiiins 1v1 against a full APS r8 sin with boundless belt/ring and weapon I'll link it once I get a chance

    That sin prolly cost double to what most endgame players are running with. Well maybe discounting NP players though I know they are also very close to that set too if not already gotten it.
    BlackList vs Frenzied 3/17

    https://youtu.be/RkkWkigYd3k
  • laddy111
    laddy111 Posts: 14 Arc User
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    saxroll wrote: »
    That sin prolly cost double to what most endgame players are running with. Well maybe discounting NP players though I know they are also very close to that set too if not already gotten it.

    That sin didnt pay as much as you think. To be realistic he paid so little for the set cause during that time players werent interest in the aps set. Its when he got it players started to demand. I have spoken with him multiple times about this so im 100% sure
  • keihan007#7641
    keihan007#7641 Posts: 1,190 Arc User
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    laddy111 wrote: »
    saxroll wrote: »
    That sin prolly cost double to what most endgame players are running with. Well maybe discounting NP players though I know they are also very close to that set too if not already gotten it.

    That sin didnt pay as much as you think. To be realistic he paid so little for the set cause during that time players werent interest in the aps set. Its when he got it players started to demand. I have spoken with him multiple times about this so im 100% sure

    Its +12 deity, now with almost NP if not full set, I was told they had all the promo tokens but I havent actually seen them wear the set. It has R9T3 set too, though I cant remember refines/shards on that. The R8r rolling also takes a **** ton of effort, which costs unless you are just super lucky I doubt.

    So compared to your average Morai/Warsong set R9T3+12 JOSD/Deity with 15 aptitude chart, yea, he has to have paid fair bit more. I use 15 aptitude for endgame player because there is maybe dozen players with 20 aptitude chart on Et. But unlike most ppl he actually has that 20 aptitude chart.

    I am not saying the build is bad but for the money he has spent on that toon he could of NPd any ranged class and be more effective in mass. Short of camping the full buffs with psy buffs hes impact isnt really that much larger than any other class with that much money on a toon would be. I am just trying to say, the build works because its sin with tidal/ulti/stealths and because its way ahead in gear compared to its opposition.
    BlackList vs Frenzied 3/17

    https://youtu.be/RkkWkigYd3k
  • laddy111
    laddy111 Posts: 14 Arc User
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    Idk what sins you talking about unless you mean mediocre sins in general. he has 5/6 NP tokens and yes he was relatively lucky. All that aside with a little brain players can achieve the same and maybe more. +11 is free from spend rewards only thing you truly pay for is the +12 and dot is roughly being bought for 60m each (4.3bil for all). With a little brain power can cut cost dramatically. You Must be talking like a pve sin xD or that doesnt play competivitely

    Said guy killed 4-6 of your mates at once 1v6 and hes not effective enough? my gawd. He can put in many different scenarios but for sure hes effect in all. If you were to mention xtw or tw, i dont think you have seen him play in those scenario so all you can do is assume that he isnt effect. Cant compare him to others cause quite frankly as you already stated he not your regular player.
  • firefraii
    firefraii Posts: 49 Arc User
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    nunuator wrote: »
    APS is by far from dead take a look at paiiins 1v1 against a full APS r8 sin with boundless belt/ring and weapon

    The 1v1 with him starts at 10:05

    This guy also won a 1v1 wearing lvl 1 npc gear are you saying that's far from dead as well? is everyone going to start pking in level 1 npc gear now?
  • eeepsilon
    eeepsilon Posts: 294 Arc User
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    Mmm what is the relation between PVP aps and nerfing aps on PVE? :D



    I am not really close friend of the guy on that video but if he is who I think he is, do you people realize that said person have almost all, if not all classes r9?

    What I am trying to say is that I highly doubt that the guy even care about nerfing aps on bosses..

    And while I actually consider that build not bad at all on pvp I don't really think that is the issue here.

    The problem on nerfing aps on those bosses would be for people who actually farm with aps build to earn money in game.

    But I guess due the state this game is, it will not really damage too much anything.

  • keihan007#7641
    keihan007#7641 Posts: 1,190 Arc User
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    laddy111 wrote: »
    Idk what sins you talking about unless you mean mediocre sins in general. he has 5/6 NP tokens and yes he was relatively lucky. All that aside with a little brain players can achieve the same and maybe more. +11 is free from spend rewards only thing you truly pay for is the +12 and dot is roughly being bought for 60m each (4.3bil for all). With a little brain power can cut cost dramatically. You Must be talking like a pve sin xD or that doesnt play competivitely

    Said guy killed 4-6 of your mates at once 1v6 and hes not effective enough? my gawd. He can put in many different scenarios but for sure hes effect in all. If you were to mention xtw or tw, i dont think you have seen him play in those scenario so all you can do is assume that he isnt effect. Cant compare him to others cause quite frankly as you already stated he not your regular player.

    I do wonder if my name has some effect, which forces ppl to ignore what I actually write in a boner to build strawmans. I only said basically any class with similar amount of money spent would be relatively as effective. Yes, the build is nice, I think I even said as much but it relies on sins being broken class and outgearing ones opponent drastically in mass.

    I dont really know what the cheap paths to gear have to do with anything in this discussion. Obviously if X is gonna take advantage of promos, Y will do the same on theoretical scenario when you compare things. But he does have things your average endgame player doesnt, which are damn expensive. The 20 aptitude chart alone is 3,5b+ on top of what 15 aptitude players have spent.
    BlackList vs Frenzied 3/17

    https://youtu.be/RkkWkigYd3k
  • nunuator
    nunuator Posts: 455 Arc User
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    I've gotten double interval on my seekers chest plate and DB chest plate and single interval on boots for both seeker and DB...
    The cost of this build is relatively cheap if you assume the cost of R9...
    Double interval on chest and single on boots is roughly 100-300mill depending on your luck... Seekers took barely 60mill DB took 306 casts which is roughly 150mill on twilight temple server
    People keep on ignoring the new items that pw puts into the game with 2 fortifications seals it's 1 cast with an option to keep your last roll...
    R8 Helm is 200mill if you just want it ASAP but, demand for them has gone down so I can easily pick 8 of them up at 15mill each

    The ring and belt are the most expensive part of this build but, still cost less than full R9R3 (200mill each piece to upgrade from R9R3)
    Weapon is already a given since no matter what build you go for most sins upgraded to the boundless weapon but, if this is your concern 1bill to upgrade from R9R3

    At this point the deity that he's using can easily be farmed during a 2x...
    Total cost of this build is... 2bill if you factor in the cost of the weapon...
    Now of course if you are a casher 4.3bill for deity if you don't farm it with easily an op build
  • laddy111
    laddy111 Posts: 14 Arc User
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    nunuator wrote: »
    I've gotten double interval on my seekers chest plate and DB chest plate and single interval on boots for both seeker and DB...
    The cost of this build is relatively cheap if you assume the cost of R9...
    Double interval on chest and single on boots is roughly 100-300mill depending on your luck... Seekers took barely 60mill DB took 306 casts which is roughly 150mill on twilight temple server
    People keep on ignoring the new items that pw puts into the game with 2 fortifications seals it's 1 cast with an option to keep your last roll...
    R8 Helm is 200mill if you just want it ASAP but, demand for them has gone down so I can easily pick 8 of them up at 15mill each

    The ring and belt are the most expensive part of this build but, still cost less than full R9R3 (200mill each piece to upgrade from R9R3)
    Weapon is already a given since no matter what build you go for most sins upgraded to the boundless weapon but, if this is your concern 1bill to upgrade from R9R3

    At this point the deity that he's using can easily be farmed during a 2x...
    Total cost of this build is... 2bill if you factor in the cost of the weapon...
    Now of course if you are a casher 4.3bill for deity if you don't farm it with easily an op build

    ^ pretty much this

    The move from 15-20 aptitude isnt that enough to where it matter tbh it cost more than it values, Like 10 aptitude vs 15 aptitude. Its only impact really is the cost and minor tweaking to stats. Im sure without that 20 aptitude chart hes just as effective xD. In the sceario he fought against all endgame players that had either +12 deity/josd
  • nunuator
    nunuator Posts: 455 Arc User
    edited March 2017
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    People are forgetting to take into account that if you want to be "end gamed" you are going to have a 20 aptitude star chart no matter what... The point here is that APS is not dead like this post was arguing... It's just not as useful as it used to be since of FSP bosses now getting anti APS buffs but, the point still remains APS still has its uses and PWCN should not kill APS for it is really fun to mess with
  • splendideyes
    splendideyes Posts: 328 Arc User
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    i currently have a deity +10 r8.2 set on my sin, is there a way to keep my refine and deitys and stats when i upgrade to r8.3?
  • nunuator
    nunuator Posts: 455 Arc User
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    If I'm not mistaken when you upgrade to r8 3rd cast with dustfall relics the stats shards and refines all transfer....
    Down side of this is no 4th stat is added until you run a ton of qsm and then you get terrible RNG
    Get the stats you want with 2nd cast and upgrade to 3rd cast
  • nunuator
    nunuator Posts: 455 Arc User
    edited March 2017
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    Any build with nuema portal rb2 is gonna be overpowered but also overpriced
    If I were to go for APS as an end game build I would build it deity with a JOSD R9 set to swap to on my DB. Like I currently am working on but, instead of JOSD using vit stones for 50k HP pool
    Something like this...
    http://mypers.pw/10/#541014
    Side note: getting the weapon today so a video showcasing the 5 aps DB will be up later tonight
  • eirghan
    eirghan Posts: 1,912 Arc User
    edited March 2017
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    Removed.
    Post edited by eirghan on

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  • eirghan
    eirghan Posts: 1,912 Arc User
    edited March 2017
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    Removed
    Post edited by eirghan on

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  • eirghan
    eirghan Posts: 1,912 Arc User
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    for some reason my posts keep disappearing...

    For the 3rd time...
    nunuator wrote: »
    People are forgetting to take into account that if you want to be "end gamed" you are going to have a 20 aptitude star chart no matter what... The point here is that APS is not dead like this post was arguing... It's just not as useful as it used to be since of FSP bosses now getting anti APS buffs but, the point still remains APS still has its uses and PWCN should not kill APS for it is really fun to mess with
    laddy111 wrote: »
    nunuator wrote: »
    I've gotten double interval on my seekers chest plate and DB chest plate and single interval on boots for both seeker and DB...
    The cost of this build is relatively cheap if you assume the cost of R9...
    Double interval on chest and single on boots is roughly 100-300mill depending on your luck... Seekers took barely 60mill DB took 306 casts which is roughly 150mill on twilight temple server
    People keep on ignoring the new items that pw puts into the game with 2 fortifications seals it's 1 cast with an option to keep your last roll...
    R8 Helm is 200mill if you just want it ASAP but, demand for them has gone down so I can easily pick 8 of them up at 15mill each

    The ring and belt are the most expensive part of this build but, still cost less than full R9R3 (200mill each piece to upgrade from R9R3)
    Weapon is already a given since no matter what build you go for most sins upgraded to the boundless weapon but, if this is your concern 1bill to upgrade from R9R3

    At this point the deity that he's using can easily be farmed during a 2x...
    Total cost of this build is... 2bill if you factor in the cost of the weapon...
    Now of course if you are a casher 4.3bill for deity if you don't farm it with easily an op build

    ^ pretty much this

    The move from 15-20 aptitude isnt that enough to where it matter tbh it cost more than it values, Like 10 aptitude vs 15 aptitude. Its only impact really is the cost and minor tweaking to stats. Im sure without that 20 aptitude chart hes just as effective xD. In the sceario he fought against all endgame players that had either +12 deity/josd

    original.jpg?w=800&h

    Source; https://a.disquscdn.com/uploads/mediaembed/images/3801/1966/original.jpg?w=800&h

    At 20 aptitude your chart uses the whole number to calculate your stats on your chart. Below 20 aptitude your chart rounds down to the nearest whole aptitude number. This is why people get 20 aptitude, it has nothing to do with "end game" and it can make quite a difference depending on your chart.

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  • eirghan
    eirghan Posts: 1,912 Arc User
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    Sorry, source should say: http://aster.ohmydays.net/pw/starchart/#8061500450496454100031c7XX88X

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  • nunuator
    nunuator Posts: 455 Arc User
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    I swear @Eirghan - Sanctuary only goal on forums is to flame me... I should make a video compilation of every time she does it xD
    The entire point of the star chart was to say either way people will have a 20 aptitude lvl 50 chart if they go for a maxed out build like people where QQing about the chart being one of the main reasons he was killing in PvP
  • sylenthunder
    sylenthunder Posts: 3,061 Community Moderator
    edited March 2017
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    eirghan wrote: »
    for some reason my posts keep disappearing...
    ...

    I blame the spam filter, It gets a little out of hand at times. I'll go check it.

    EDIT: Yep, they were in the filter. Pulled them out, and fixed that so it won't happen to you again.
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  • eirghan
    eirghan Posts: 1,912 Arc User
    edited March 2017
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    @nunuator if you take people posting information on threads and explaining why people think charts are op as flaming you youre in for a rough life on forums.

    @SylenThunder thanks for rescuing them. They are a bit spammy now though so i will just edit them down lol

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  • nunuator
    nunuator Posts: 455 Arc User
    edited March 2017
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    @Eirghan - Sanctuary
    This discussion has nothing to do with star charts but, with APS in the upcoming expansion I never was arguing that star charts are OP I was simply stating that a heavy casher or end game player is going to eventually get one... Your post had nothing to do with APS and instead was just for calling me out on star charts which has nothing to do with this post and is a complete derailment of this thread....
    This is not the first time where you have called me out on items that do not pertain to a thread just for the focus of legit picking at me... If you find joy in messing with others go for it but, if you are going to call me out on something like a star chart in an APS discussion at least post feedback about APS at the end.
    The proof being of you on your veno and Moo on her veno completely flamming me in world chat just minutes after I called you out on flamming me on the forums.... There was absolutely no reason to do so I was asking 700mill for a +10 NW Neck and if you don't like that pricing, keep it to yourself and don't flame me about it on an alt.
  • eeepsilon
    eeepsilon Posts: 294 Arc User
    edited March 2017
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    Guys, no offense but, as I said before: What the heck does PVP have to do with aps on Bosses (PVE)??


    Whoever started to derail this thread clearly seems to forget that this mainly affect to people who actually use aps on those bosses, not to ultra rich guys that have + 12 deity sins, with 20 aptitude charts and OP card sets for pvp.

    Here is the original OP question:
    sinchalla wrote: »
    HI fellow PWI's, just a quick question. WOULD love a GM to reply and tell me the actuall truth instead of just rumors.

    In the upcomming expansion, is it TRUE or FALSE that the little shield in DFSP/JFSP on the bosses, where if u aps it reduces the damage is coming to Twlight Temple, Warsong and Lunar instances?

    Pretty much making APS usless on the bosses.

    Thank you, hopefully a GM can reply so we can all GET TO KNOW THE REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEAL answer ahah!


    Back on topic, I second this question, but I also add the question I made on another thread.
    eeepsilon wrote: »
    One thing that never got answered on this thread was the ''revamp'' of older caves like Lunar or TT.
    My question is:
    Will it be a revamp for those instances? (like complete redesign of the cave with no access to the older one)
    Or will it be a new mode like when they add Judgment to FSP or Deicide to UP?

    here is the info that someone linked some time ago on this same thread:
    http://w2i.wanmei.com/news/gamenews/20161028/77740.shtml

    There was another one talking about TT but i don't remember the link at the moment.
    I ask this since it would be a bit Worrying if they decide to shot those down and turn them in to a UP like place.
    Specially considering that TT provides the core materials for what is the base of our current f2p gear.
    Not like many people care about this, but I know a few that are freaking out already. :D

    This is actually an important question believe it or not. If they make new modes in those caves, there will be really no problem, but if they decide to revamp them, all the people who is not OP will have problems farming those places and that can **** the economy even more than what it is now. This could even end up killing this game for good.

    I am aware that for many of the veteran players that are already rich in game, this don't seem to be of importance for now.
    However no matter if you are a casher or a wealthy merchant, you still need to sell your pack garbage, gold an other stuff for coin, just think what would happen if those little people that everyone ignore run out of every single way of farming and quit?



  • andyauditore
    andyauditore Posts: 52 Arc User
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    eeepsilon wrote: »

    This is actually an important question believe it or not. If they make new modes in those caves, there will be really no problem, but if they decide to revamp them, all the people who is not OP will have problems farming those places and that can **** the economy even more than what it is now. This could even end up killing this game for good.

    I am aware that for many of the veteran players that are already rich in game, this don't seem to be of importance for now.
    However no matter if you are a casher or a wealthy merchant, you still need to sell your pack garbage, gold an other stuff for coin, just think what would happen if those little people that everyone ignore run out of every single way of farming and quit?
    Basically what "eeepsilon" said. I'm an APS bm, with r8r, T2, T3. Yes, I have full T3 for PvP, but I can't solo TT or Lunar bosses with skills. I die. Or, I can waste 5 charms and spend 1 hour on each boss. Maybe that works, but who does that? So do not compare r9rr+12 ppl with players with only a T3 +7 weapon and g15-16 gear. With aps and bp, I can solo any boss from Lunar and TT without a charm. And in less then 5 minutes.

    So if they kill APS, we won't be able to farm anymore, only r9 people. Those who need stuff won't have money to buy them. The poor will remain poor, while the rich won't be able to sell their stuff. It's 2x drop, I can go farm TT and Lunar and make some good money to buy some GSTs, MOGs or packs. If they'll make the bosses anti-aps, I believe it's gonna hurt the economy.

    But let's hope it won't come to that.

  • blazerboy
    blazerboy Posts: 1,673 Arc User
    edited March 2017
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    Honestly I don't understand why this is an issue I mean in terms of farm I'm sure we recall before all the updates to increase atk and def we formed squads and farmed those instances. So idk why people are like "kill economy" if weaker ppl want a mat here's some teles and here's wc gl. TT mats used to be worth quite a bit now it's more like a mass surplus of it since those instances are literally soloable in minutes esp for sins.

    Look if anything it could mean a very profitable market for farmers and for new ppl? Hopefully guilds will start working towards helping ppl instead of just using ppl for TW xTW and actually build on our community agian. But saying it's ganna kill the economy is just wrong it just doesn't let full aps/ppl with too much a major edge vs ppl who don't have the luxury not everyone has a alt sin/bm/db in full aps. The only ppl who will suffer are new ppl of which can be mitigated if veterans take initiative and help. We already have a dying community it wouldn't hurt to stop complaining there's nothing to do but dailies and help ppl.

    Why drag pk into this even? The only aps pk I've seen in last yr that was a threat is a NP 20.0 aptitude chart spark and per hit got me for like 3k if it didn't miss some 5k ZC that's like super deletion xD fortunately not many go for that thank god.

    P.S quick side note 20.0 aptitude makes quite a difference at 13.ish I had like 46k phy atk max end fully buffed at 53k now full buffed with 20 I have 51k base atk and nearly 58.5k buffed at ZCs that can make a major diff but doesn't always mean Endgame seeing as I can still find I'm taking ppl who have 20.0 charts with x2 spirit on fate so in total will have like 700-800 more than me because of chart and I don't put spirit stones in orns at times and still take like 6k per hit buffed. So I can agree with @eirghan it depends on the stats
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  • eirghan
    eirghan Posts: 1,912 Arc User
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    @nunuator i have barely been in game for dailies let alone world chatting about... What? A cube neck? Especially after you commented i was at work. I work 7-5pst. So i think youre mistaken about the name of my veno... I have been playing other games and barely active in game Or forums. My comment was to do with the discussion of the aps build and why people see it as op. Others in the thread claim it is because of the chart. I was supporting that was a valid guess because 20 apt is more effective than most people think.

    I also have no history in my comments of flaming you or picking at you. Sorry you feel that way but that wasnt my intention.......... Only offering information that i felt pertinent to the discussion.

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  • nunuator
    nunuator Posts: 455 Arc User
    edited March 2017
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    @eirghan hmm very strange that the name of your veno, Anominity and the name of your veno that you use and say "I got the boundless weapon on my veno" and show testing of you hitting your veno in a video... But, k I guess that just confirms that you are going to keep on denying obviously messing with me... Cause Anominity is not your veno's name and you were at work...

    @kalystconquerer#0876
    Hmm maybe a GM should look into account sharing here since you are going to deny your veno being online with multiple witnesses seeing this happen
    Most I ask about you completely agree that you are just a female Joe of the forums...
  • eirghan
    eirghan Posts: 1,912 Arc User
    edited March 2017
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    nunuator wrote: »
    @eirghan hmm very strange that the name of your veno, Anominity and the name of your veno that you use and say "I got the boundless weapon on my veno" and show testing of you hitting your veno in a video... But, k I guess that just confirms that you are going to keep on denying obviously messing with me... Cause Anominity is not your veno's name and you were at work...

    @kalystconquerer#0876
    Hmm maybe a GM should look into account sharing here since you are going to deny your veno being online with multiple witnesses seeing this happen
    Most I ask about you completely agree that you are just a female Joe of the forums...

    I named changed from Anonimity (NOT AnoMINity). My venos name is IIiad and has been for about 6 months. You can see on my youtube channel. Heres a video https://youtube.com/watch?v=b-3YuIHXv_Y. Her weapon is still engraved "made by Anonimity" if there's any doubt. You were in Vengeful with my veno and we had a full conversation about APS when you were making an APS seeker. At 12:00 your toon is on top of mine in that video. Now you're on here trying to get me banned. Like wat.

    I never said anything rude to you. I've apologized twice if I upset you. Don't know what else I can do. If you really want to believe i'm flaming and messing with you that's your perogative...


    Edit: @kalystconquerer#0876 Feel free to IP check my accounts. I'm the only one with access to my accounts. Character names are Eirghan and IIiad (spelled with 2 capital is) If you would like the usernames feel free to private message me.
    Post edited by eirghan on

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  • blazerboy
    blazerboy Posts: 1,673 Arc User
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    Lmfao @eirghan playing no games with the "Don't come for me if I didn't send for you crybaby"
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