sparkie!! Help please!

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Comments

  • slowwetkiss
    slowwetkiss Posts: 34 Arc User
    edited January 2015
    DEMHEALSMAN - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Well, did you read the part in the ToS that pretty much literally states that they can ban you for whatever reason, whenever, for however long they want?
    They can ban you if you **** if they wanted to. Theoretically of course.

    So believe it or not, there's nothing you can do about it.

    That isn't true, as it is a legal and binding CONTRACT. They also have an obligation to hold their part of the contract. And that means if they are going to hold some players to THE STANDARDS THEY CREATED, then they MUST hold ALL to those standards. Not just some.
  • DEMHEALSMAN - Dreamweaver
    DEMHEALSMAN - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,396 Arc User
    edited January 2015
    slowwetkiss wrote: »
    That isn't true, as it is a legal and binding CONTRACT. They also have an obligation to hold their part of the contract. And that means if they are going to hold some players to THE STANDARDS THEY CREATED, then they MUST hold ALL to those standards. Not just some.

    Ehm, no, read the ToS properly, they can apply it as they see fit.
    Soon™
    Well, maybe later, semi-retired.
  • Soulvoodoo - Heavens Tear
    Soulvoodoo - Heavens Tear Posts: 6 Arc User
    edited January 2015
    Every time I've submitted a ticket with a reasonable issue that has occurred PWI has most often then not resolved it to my satisfaction. Courtesy and patience goes a long way in getting matters resolved. Getting a lawyer is a waste of time and money. PWI does own any virtual property you have invested in over the course of your stay in the game. Your only recourse would be to go through through your financially institution ( Your bank and its not free to do), fill out all proper paperwork and recall all payments made on your account not to exceed 5 years. (Only effective if your banned) That's when you'll get a call from a member in the PWE finance department requesting payment. That's when the real negotiating starts. And yes this method is legal
  • slowwetkiss
    slowwetkiss Posts: 34 Arc User
    edited January 2015
    DEMHEALSMAN - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Ehm, no, read the ToS properly, they can apply it as they see fit.

    I think you are missing the point. I didn't go into this contact with myself. It also involves another- i.e., a company, entity, or its agent. They have obligations that they must also follow. Not just the players. If a company sets rules and standards that EVERYONE must abide by and adhere to, EVERYONE INCLUDES THOSE WHO SET THE RULES AND STANDARDS, which is PWI.

    As far as getting an attorney being money and time wasted, with respect, it is my money and my time. This isn't about monies spent in the game. The MAIN issue is about ToS. And why some people can violate ToS and be actioned, while others who do the same ToS violations and do it repeatedly and not be actioned after being reported WITH evidence being supplied in the form of screenshots. Then, when questions are raised and PWI is confronted by their inability to be unbiased and fair, the player(s) who have had to go through this razzmatazz are banned or have their accounts closed.
  • Soulvoodoo - Heavens Tear
    Soulvoodoo - Heavens Tear Posts: 6 Arc User
    edited January 2015
    slowwetkiss wrote: »
    As far as getting an attorney being money and time wasted, with respect, it is my money and my time.

    I should of rephrased that to being more cost effective. b:surrender
  • opkossy
    opkossy Posts: 11,177 Community Moderator
    edited January 2015
    slowwetkiss wrote: »
    *snip*

    Here's some key issues with trying to use the ToS against them:

    2.1 We may amend and/or modify these Terms, the Rules of Conduct, and any EULA at any time in our sole discretion.

    3.2 You agree that we are not responsible for any hardware, software or Internet access, quality, suitability or unavailability issues. We do not provide Internet access, and you are responsible for all fees relating to telephone and Internet access charges along with all necessary equipment, servicing, repair or correction incurred in maintaining connectivity to the servers.

    4.12 Please note that regardless of any notice, we reserve the right to discontinue the Service or to terminate or suspend your Account at any time in our sole discretion, for any reason, or for no reason.

    15.3 We may take any actions and impose any penalties we deem necessary to discourage and punish any violation of these terms or any other illegal or inappropriate conduct, all without prior notice or warning. The determination as to whether a violation has occurred and who is responsible for such act is solely within our discretion, and is based on what we deem best for the community and the Service. By using the Service, you agree you will be bound by our determination as to whether a violation has occurred and any penalty we choose to implement.






    Those are just some examples. The ToS thoroughly covers PWE's butt, to put it simply.
    (Insert fancy image here)
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  • slowwetkiss
    slowwetkiss Posts: 34 Arc User
    edited January 2015
    OPKossy wrote: »
    *snips you too* lol
    Those are just some examples. The ToS thoroughly covers PWE's butt, to put it simply.
    I see what you are saying. But how can they hold someone to a ToS violation, but not another for the same ToS violation? This is where Im confused b:surrender how can they NOT, at the very least, action BOTH?

    And honestly, by having my attorney go over this stuff, at the very least I'll gain some knowldge. And having knowledge is not a bad thing and would be worth every penny spent. At least to me it would.
  • SylenThunder - Twilight Temple
    SylenThunder - Twilight Temple Posts: 7,908
    edited January 2015
    slowwetkiss wrote: »
    I see what you are saying. But how can they hold someone to a ToS violation, but not another for the same ToS violation? This is where Im confused b:surrender how can they NOT, at the very least, action BOTH?

    Because they are very inconsistent. It's what happens when you only have 25 interns working support for 19 games 24/7.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • slowwetkiss
    slowwetkiss Posts: 34 Arc User
    edited January 2015
    SylenThunder - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Because they are very inconsistent. It's what happens when you only have 25 interns working support for 19 games 24/7.

    I cant accept that, as everyone involved is on the same server. It wouldn't be that hard to ban both players. If they take the time and are in game to ban one, it isn't that hard to take another 20-30 seconds to ban the other while they are there. Seems to me there is favoritism in this suituation, wouldn't you?
  • SylenThunder - Twilight Temple
    SylenThunder - Twilight Temple Posts: 7,908
    edited January 2015
    slowwetkiss wrote: »
    I cant accept that, as everyone involved is on the same server. It wouldn't be that hard to ban both players. If they take the time and are in game to ban one, it isn't that hard to take another 20-30 seconds to ban the other while they are there. Seems to me there is favoritism in this suituation, wouldn't you?

    No, because it's not the same person handling both, and you don't have to log into the server to ban people. It's all done via a web console.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • slowwetkiss
    slowwetkiss Posts: 34 Arc User
    edited January 2015
    SylenThunder - Sanctuary wrote: »
    No, because it's not the same person handling both, and you don't have to log into the server to ban people. It's all done via a web console.

    ok, if said GM handling the ticket is banning 1 player involved in the ticket then he/she is aware of the other player. Especially if more than 1 ticket had been submitted on the players. Usually before a ban is set in place, the GM will do an overview of the tickets each player has sent in. And usually, more often than not, each one has sent in tickets on the other. So again, I cant accept that.
  • SylenThunder - Twilight Temple
    SylenThunder - Twilight Temple Posts: 7,908
    edited January 2015
    slowwetkiss wrote: »
    ok, if said GM handling the ticket is banning 1 player involved in the ticket then he/she is aware of the other player. Especially if more than 1 ticket had been submitted on the players. Usually before a ban is set in place, the GM will do an overview of the tickets each player has sent in. And usually, more often than not, each one has sent in tickets on the other. So again, I cant accept that.
    You haven't dealt with PWE's support system much in the past two years have you?
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • ovenusarmanio
    ovenusarmanio Posts: 6,695 Community Moderator
    edited January 2015
    slowwetkiss wrote: »
    I know what I can, and cannot, post. I know how to post threads, and in threads. I know how to copy and paste, and how to remove information that would be considered against ToS. I am well aware of ToS, have read it more times than I can count, as I wanted to be sure of what I'm working towards. I'm not asking for you to judge the situation. Nor, do you need to.

    But, I will tell you this much. Over the last couple of years I have played this, I have seen a few players (who shall remain nameless, so don't ask) violate multiple areas of ToS, were reported with screenshots, and never received even a slap on the wrist. I have also seen other players, in defense of themselves or others, and/or question the inaction of GMs of said player(s), or do exactly the same thing as the inactioned player(s), get a temporary ban (3 days), a ban (3 months or more) or had their accounts closed. I have watched these player(s) fight very hard for some fair treatment, only to have their account closed because they asked for some accountability, on both PWI and the inactioned player(s). I just don't understand how PWI can be so insconsistent with accountability. Why are some player(s) actioned for something other player(s) get away with on a regular basis? The people who have lost their accounts were treated very badly, IMHO, as was I when I started to ask questions (i.e. having customer service hang up on me when I called and asked to speak to someone in a position of authority).

    Now that you have the information, I hope you got some satisfaction with this knowledge. Now, can we get back to what this thread is about? And that is the very bad treatment of this community by the people who are supposed to make unbiased, fair, and consistent treatment to ALL players regarding ToS. Not just some.

    You posted that it was against the TOS to post a ticket response, which is only half true. I felt the need to clarify because it was only half true. IF you knew that already, great. But other people following this thread might not realize that's what you meant. And based on your statement, I couldn't have known that was what you meant. So it only made sense to clarify the rule isn't as strict as it seemed by that statement.

    As for whether or not your ticket is relevant. I will say this. You posted the ticket number in your thread and asked for a specific response to your ticket. The entire first page is how you felt you were personally wronged by the ticket support team. You also called on others to "rise against the machine," as if your ticket response was a symbol of a larger issue we should all "band together," against. You're the one that brought your ticket up, rather than just make it about support in general. If you don't feel that makes your individual ticket relevant, than fine. But you're the one who brought your ticket into the discussion, from the title and the first line of the post.


    As for different people getting different support. I will say this much. Support not being perfect is a massive understatement. They have been woefully inconsistent, and can and should improve. But their TOS does give them to right to apply bans the way they see fit. It's not just the fact a violation occurred, they evaluate the totality of the circumstances surrounding each incident. There may be mitigating circumstances, there may be some type of private disciplinary action you didn't see occur. They may have chosen not to take a harsh punishment on something, until it was determined for the good of the overall user base that harsher penalties would be necessary to curtail some specific behavior going forward in the future.

    That's one I've certainly seen them do before. The second time around PK in SP was enabled, when the CM was v4liance, the penalties for PK'ing in there was much more severe. Based on the overall user base reaction, and the bad environment going soft on everyone caused the first time around. Some people found themselves in trouble for things they had seen other people get off easy on in the past, but it wasn't unfair. It was announced as bannable from the start, and whenever you take part in a bannable behavior, you are doing so at your own risk. People didn't take it seriously but learned really quick. And the overall effect was a much happier userbase overall. That's an example of different punishments being a good thing.

    I can't speak to the specifics of your ticket. Based on PWE's history, I wouldn't be surprised if support was just bad. It's happened before, it will happen again. Their service really needs improvement. But I also don't think that this idea that punishment can't change, or that some people shouldn't be punished more than others based on the circumstances, is also ridiculous. If you are a problem customer harassing the staff, then of course staff should be able to make it clear that's unacceptable behavior. Add to that, the fact that they flat out tell us in the TOS that this how the game is going to be.
    PWE TOS wrote:
    The determination as to whether a violation has occurred and who is responsible for such act is solely within our discretion, and is based on what we deem best for the community and the Service

    And I gotta say that while I agree their customer service needs a lot of work, I really don't think you're going to get anywhere with this lawsuit. It may or may not be fair (I can't speak to your individual circumstance) that your ticket was closed without further discussion. BTW, my views are my own and in no way represent PWE. I'm not an employee even.

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  • slowwetkiss
    slowwetkiss Posts: 34 Arc User
    edited January 2015
    SylenThunder - Sanctuary wrote: »
    You haven't dealt with PWE's support system much in the past two years have you?

    Even 1 time is more than sufficient to see that they suck at their job. And I see your point too, Venus and thank you for your input. But this is something Im going to pursue anyway. Even if the only thing gained by doing so is knowledge, then it is worth my time and my money b:pleasedb:thanks
  • teikiatsu11
    teikiatsu11 Posts: 98 Arc User
    edited January 2015
    I think it depends on who sees your ticket and how it's worded.

    I've had good and bad experiences with customer support. I've had them tell me no and that "we don't have the ability to correct the problem" and after talking to a friend who had gotten help with the same issue I was having, I decided to try again and with some re-wording and waiting they corrected the issue that they had previously told me was beyond their abilities.

    Can't say they have a very helpful customer support but with how little I submit tickets it doesn't effect me as much as others.

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