Thunder Shock metal debuff nerfed ?

freygin

Can anyone test Thunder Shock, it should debuff metal resistance by 50%, but it's only 10% on mine, wonder if anyone has the same problem.

Verenor - Morai

It's the debuff mechanic that PWI uses: it debuffs from the base stat, not the current stat.

So say someone has 10000 mdef, is buffed (+60%) -> 16000.
The 50% debuff would then take away 5000 mdef (the base 10k - 50%) = 11000 mdef left on the target.

From what you said it sounds like you targetted someone that also has the primal passive defense skill leveled. Let's say lv7: 56% passive defense bonus.

10000+60%+56%= 21600 mdef. The 50% debuff still only applies to the 10000, so the target keeps 16600 mdef. That's already a mere 30%~ debuff instead of 50%. On top of that you add more buffs or higher passive etc and eventually it can go down to your mentioned 10%

freygin

I'm aware of that, but this is really 10% after all calculations have been accounted for.

Here is my cleric stat fully unbuffed on the left, with lv 4 passives (7+8+8+8=31% buff, the description says 8% but calculation says 7% at level 1), then I use archer to debuff with Thunder Shock (right image).



Here is my calculator, I can calculate the same exact mdef from the game then I put 10% debuff in it and the result is the same in the game, that's Sage Thunder Shock from my Sage archer. With 50% metal debuff it should be 19.669.

Asterelle - Sanctuary

Interesting calc. Hover over the elemental resistance stat to see the breakdown per element. What you see in the charsheet is the average of the 5 resistances. Metal one will be lower than that.

freygin

You're right, thanks for pointing that out, it clears my confusion, lol I forgot that with horizon each element resistance is separated and shown when mouse is hovered there, while it shows average in 'c' window.b:thanksb:chuckle

XXHotXx - Morai

well still you can say that it's a nerf,

you have consider that back in time the same debuff was reducing targer metal res from a lower base metal res value, having a max res cap fixed to 90%, this resulting in a decent damage amp

now not only it reduces the metal res from a higher base coming from Cards nuemas meridians + the resistances rescale from 95% ... , but then this higher base value is even enhanced by its 80% more as a buff from lvl 10 defense passives

f.e.:

using thunder shock to someone pre-NH with 15000 metal resistance would've been reduced its 76ish% metal damage reduction down to 7500 that was like 60ish% for real a 60% damage amp

now using the same thunder shock on the same target with cards etch and lvl 10 passives its like:
base metal res from 15k to 18k + 80% passives = 32400 -> 89% damage reduction

u use thunder shock and it reduces the base 18k down to 9k+passives= 23.4k -> 85% damage reduction that is more or less 30% damage amp


and one could even say well that's legit, its not much


BUT NOW lets say you were delivering 1000 damage with your metal skill on your target:

non-debuffed damage = 1000-76% = 240 damage

debuffed damage = 1000-60% = 400 damage


now lets even say that with 2nd reborn cards nuema attack passives etch you deliver 1500 damage (half of your base damage more respect pre-nh, but i believe we hardly got more than just a 30% more base damage):

non-debuffed damage = 1500-89% = 165 damage

debuffed damage = 1500-85% = 225 damage

and that's where the real nerf is...

i have big hopes for PW2 to rework the debuffs mechanics because this aint gonna work, all the debuffs-based combos are pretty much screwed up (except demon ironwood)

freygin

Yea, it can be said a nerf in some way but imo it's probably more than that. They added more variables to damage formula with passive skill damage and spirit, our base damage is also increased. There are a lot of damage amp and damage reduction added with new horizons, we just have to adjust with the new changes.