give bm their stuns back

Shidoshi - Lost City

i'm sorry but you need to give the bm roar of the pride paralyes and not stun. i'm tired of using the roar and just watching the enemy just immune pot. bm are getting a bum rap and it need to stop. besides barbs bm are the only class that has to be on the target to do any skills, and if your not r9 3rd cast its impossible. and if you don't beleive me make a bm and fight as a bm.

Slivaf - Dreamweaver

Its not pots that are **** bms over left and right.

Its the purify proc that is **** bms over an extraordinary amount/rate, among other things, but that proc is stupid ridiculous, and has on numerous occasions ruined everything thrown at a caster. The fact that it removes debuffs, also removes stuns, speeds them up, and even prevents stuns on a caster really screws bm's over and then some.

Still despite that we do have one of the, if not the best way to counter that with Blade Hurl and now we also have the new Dragon Rising though with the fact that each costs chi, and the cooldowns on them, a casters proc can still wreak an obscene amount of havoc under the right circumstances, specifically in mass pvp. (Edit: come to think of it I believe bms were the only class prior to the recent expansion with a semi reliable way to "counter" it... still it was/still is stupid difficult to counter while its out there.) Every skill that a bm uses that is actually making the bm seem like he's actually being semi useful take anywhere from 15 chi -a full 2 sparks, or even triple sparks. Hell the only skills that can be used/are somewhat useful in mass pvp that don't costs chi is marrows, and bell, they are even the only 2/3 that builds chi without a target. (Other than genies/apo of course) They use an insane amount of chi with very little return for what they do. At least while alone. (To be fair some of the new primal skills may be actually somewhat useful... but I really don't know. I like so many other bms (or at least seemingly so) have left my bm behind due to mass pvp/nw. As I said before if it wasn't for nw, I wouldn't be arguing for bms.. it is sad that there is an instance out like nw with the rewards that you can get from there. Even if we all end up earning the same amount of tokens, provided we're in the same gear/really able to absorb an insane amount of damage. )

I know its sad that we have to go out of the way to learn those skills/use them in combos to potentially take out a caster, and there are still times where you do everything right, and yet the caster survives, and is able to do stupid **** thanks to the purify proc that others just aren't capable off, no matter how well geared they may be. (As in soloing an insane amount of well geared/semi decently skilled people.)


When it takes that amount of chi to get near/lock someone down/be of assistance to others, and it can be taken away by the purify proc time and time again, it does get extremely frustrating on a bm. Really though as TheDan says, while undergeared bms are extremely underpowered.

---


Either way prepare for major backlash, it really doesn't matter if what we say is true, people will jump at you, and more specifically me, they absolutely feel that bm are fine as is, and do not need ANY boost oncesoever. It's fine, they're entitled to their belief/they do indeed have their own reasons/'facts' for claiming that bms are fine. Though really it doesn't matter which side is right... or wrong... only the devs can ultimately decide whether or not bms.or any class/proc needs a change, be it a change for the better or worse.


And with that said, I am likely not going to reply to this thread again regardless of what is said, or at least I am going to do my best to avoid replying again.

Euthymius - Heavens Tear

I wouldn't mind Paralyze being unable to be purified so long as it can be resisted like other stuns and control skills are. At least this way, it can be countered reliably while still allowing guaranteed followups by the user should it land.

That said, I'm on the fence about putting such an effect on RotP (leaning towards a no, though), but if they allow Paralyze to be resisted in such a manner, I wouldn't mind it as much...

TZoner - Raging Tide

I'm a bm and i DON'T approve of this. TBH even I have a problem with the way paralysis works and i don't think its helping the game any. BM stuns work fine...and you have Dragon Rising for Paralyze. BMs real issue isnt our stuns its our damage and accuracy. If youre gonna QQ for a change to make bms better at least be reasonable. Making Roar of the Pride a paralyze skill would be a too much.

Jaabg - Sanctuary

Accuracy is starting to be an issue for my bm. Drake bash seems to miss more and more on every character. Be it wizard, cleric, mystic, psy, barbs, last nw, it missed way too often. Could be my bad luck, but meh.

As for roar of pride having paralyze effect = game over for everyone in mass pvp beside bm.

Often times i have run into groups, stunned, hf'ed, aoe, and killed people. If two three bm do this, other players will not be able to do a single thing. This will make it too OP.

If using roar of pride, increased your accuracy and evasion by 700%, i wouldn't mind thatb:dirty.

Marengo - Lost City

*rolls eyes*

Vedovis - Lost City

Marengo - Lost City wrote: »

*rolls eyes*

*joins in the eye rolling*

I am hoping this is a troll thread.

seitori

Marengo - Lost City wrote: »

*rolls eyes*

Vedovis - Lost City wrote: »

*joins in the eye rolling*

I am hoping this is a troll thread.

b:pleased >> Personally, I think that If more people like the rest of us, all continue to *roll their eyes* at this threads crazy idea of an OP qq subject, then this thread can actually become PWi forum's first ROLL THREAD instead....b:laugh{b:victory}b:laugh

Viktorian - Archosaur

Marengo - Lost City wrote: »

*rolls eyes*

Vedovis - Lost City wrote: »

*joins in the eye rolling*

I am hoping this is a troll thread.

To Mr./Mrs/Ms Marengo and Mr./Mrs/Ms. Vedovis,

I on behalf of the PWI community would like to thank you for your insightful and helpful contribution to our game. Your eye rolling is a great insight on this topic.

Shidoshi - Lost City wrote: »

i'm sorry but you need to give the bm roar of the pride paralyes and not stun. i'm tired of using the roar and just watching the enemy just immune pot. bm are getting a bum rap and it need to stop. besides barbs bm are the only class that has to be on the target to do any skills, and if your not r9 3rd cast its impossible. and if you don't beleive me make a bm and fight as a bm.

I like what your doing but giving roar a paralyze is a bad idea. For one, it makes it a near unstoppable aoe stun. Besides the bad reaction from the casters community, which dislikes bms in the first place, the community as a whole dislikes paralyzes. When barbs got mighty swing (no chi cost 50% success rate) and abused it, the community as a whole disliked it instantaneously. BMs having one paralyze is something many arent happy about but can live with due to two things.
1 its high chi cost. The 1 spark chi cost isnt something we have in a few seconds(without using genie and be honest, in TW/NW with all the casters magic attacks coming at you are you using CE or AD?)
2 It is a single target skill. If roar became an aoe, all a bm has to do is target the barb or a central person get close and cast. Thats a good number of people unable to move or defend themselves outside of genie. Whereas a single target skill only becomes truly effective in a 1v1 situation.

Instead of making roar a paralyze, I suggest lowering the chi cost on Roar of the Pride and Drakes Bash(not Dragon Rising). Eliminate the chi cost on Roar of the Pride and lower it to 50 on Drakes Bash. This gives all bms a stun that isnt a % chance or costs chi and gives rb1 and lower bms a fighting chance in 1v1s.

Scrog - Sanctuary

lol omg lol wtf are you talking about as a caster with full r999. You must really suck I get stun locked all the time with my op purify proc weapon. stunned to death I say think maybe you need to reexamine your abilities. flame away I probably won't read this thread again since its like the billionth one about casters weapon.

XXHotXx - Morai

a QQ thread by one of the 3 classes that got buffed with the last update while the others got nerfed?

seems legit...

have you ever been in a TW where if you paralyze the target, whoever he is, whatever purify proc, he will be therefore dead?

Viktorian - Archosaur

ok scrog gunna take ur post point by point and see if i cant clear things up/ counter them.
first point.
you said u get stun locked all the time. if you are getting stun locked with a rrr9 weapon and ur weapon isnt procing, its pure luck. altho i do hope u come back to this thread because id like to know a few things. such as how long the stun lock is lasting and how mny hits the bm is getting in between those stuns. also ur hp barb buffed and unbuffed. plus gear stats (refines etc)
second point
u said its the billionth one about casters weapon. that doesnt say anything to you? that many ppl have started threads about a weapon that is disadvantageous to certain other classes (aka melee classes). also this isnt just about casters weapons. its about wat ideas can the PWI playerbase bring to the table that would help balance the bm class and make it viable in mass pvp/single pvp situations.

like i said i hope u return to this thread as ur opinions and ideas on topic are good feedback and who knows maybe china will agree with us and change something.

EDIT:
my apoligies hot i didnt see your post when i made the above comments. yes i have been in tws and the only people i see paralyzing anyone are barbs. bms are saving chi for more important things such as roar hf blade hurl and the possible reel in on clerics/barbs. also would like to point out that this was not started as a QQ thread but interpreted that way by others. it was started as a suggestion to the cm to put to the devs. technically should be in the suggestion box but threads that go there tend not to get seen as often.

To all others: opinions on the suggestions made and ur ideas please. were trying to find a good compromise so everyone giving feedback is needed!!!

KuruTu - Harshlands

1. One of the tankiest classes in the game due to marrow (mdef debuffs basically have no effect, because passives+marrow = 200% buff u gotta eat through)
2. OP CC that can be countered only with faith, AD or ig pot (and only preemptive way, no way to remove it)
3. OP dmg (seriously BMs QQing about their dmg? +12 r9rr BM zerk crit me for 10-11k with 30k pdef, they are as hard to tank as sins, maybe even more difficult)

And there are people who complain about BMs still? If roar of pride paralyzed, I would quit this game with smile, because that would have been so broken. Note that Cursed Jail does not paralyze at least. Nothing against Dragon Rising, that skill has cd, is single target, has chi cost and I can deal with it (I actualy complain about barb mighty swing, because costs no effort to cast (gives chi, spammable) and I even had to faith to get out of tt99 barbs stunlock once lolz. BMs are perfectly fine now though. If youre not capable of tanking/CCing/killing on them now, problem is either between chair and keyboard or your gear (or both b:chuckle)

LilyWinters - Archosaur

Jaabg - Sanctuary wrote: »

Accuracy is starting to be an issue for my bm. Drake bash seems to miss more and more on every character. Be it wizard, cleric, mystic, psy, barbs, last nw, it missed way too often. Could be my bad luck, but meh.

As for roar of pride having paralyze effect = game over for everyone in mass pvp beside bm.

Often times i have run into groups, stunned, hf'ed, aoe, and killed people. If two three bm do this, other players will not be able to do a single thing. This will make it too OP.

If using roar of pride, increased your accuracy and evasion by 700%, i wouldn't mind thatb:dirty.

Are you taking into account that because of titles and cards all classes are getting evasion boosts? Not saying that the miss chance hasn't gone up, just wondering if that was considered.

ablabahabla

Viktorian - Archosaur wrote: »

ok scrog gunna take ur post point by point and see if i cant clear things up/ counter them.
first point.
you said u get stun locked all the time. if you are getting stun locked with a rrr9 weapon and ur weapon isnt procing, its pure luck. altho i do hope u come back to this thread because id like to know a few things. such as how long the stun lock is lasting and how mny hits the bm is getting in between those stuns. also ur hp barb buffed and unbuffed. plus gear stats (refines etc)
second point
u said its the billionth one about casters weapon. that doesnt say anything to you? that many ppl have started threads about a weapon that is disadvantageous to certain other classes (aka melee classes). also this isnt just about casters weapons. its about wat ideas can the PWI playerbase bring to the table that would help balance the bm class and make it viable in mass pvp/single pvp situations.

like i said i hope u return to this thread as ur opinions and ideas on topic are good feedback and who knows maybe china will agree with us and change something.

EDIT:
my apoligies hot i didnt see your post when i made the above comments. yes i have been in tws and the only people i see paralyzing anyone are barbs. bms are saving chi for more important things such as roar hf blade hurl and the possible reel in on clerics/barbs. also would like to point out that this was not started as a QQ thread but interpreted that way by others. it was started as a suggestion to the cm to put to the devs. technically should be in the suggestion box but threads that go there tend not to get seen as often.

To all others: opinions on the suggestions made and ur ideas please. were trying to find a good compromise so everyone giving feedback is needed!!!

since bms got paralize it became the most important thing for them to do on major targets, if u didnt realize this by now gg.
rotp is just to keep people frm attacking for a few sec or lure them to use up their genie, bladehurl can be used for such too or can be used to keep tanky casters from purif procing when focused. Reel-In for real? u waste half a spark on might haveing luck to pull someone and afterwards cry about chi?
btw take a look at our new skills we got if u dont know what i mean take a look at this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-aPujZI-SBI&feature=youtu.be

so stop complaining about chi as bm just buy some low lvl npc sowrd to gain 50 chi in a every few sec

+ to all wanna be super awesome dd players that roll bms, bms are a supportclass although its said in class description that they would be dds. Get used to be support or go reroll some dd as mage psy ea or sin.

Jaabg - Sanctuary

LilyWinters - Archosaur wrote: »

Are you taking into account that because of titles and cards all classes are getting evasion boosts? Not saying that the miss chance hasn't gone up, just wondering if that was considered.

I didn't consider that. Thanks.

Reason why i didn't consider that, people i miss on are barbs for example. I hit them for 4~7k normal hits. That means bad armour usually, against the axe. If i one shot a cleric usually, but the drake bash misses.

It could be my bad luck, and their cards/title, but it seems unlikely that was the case with most people i fought who were easy to kill.

That being said, i do have lag, issues with using skills. For example i stand next to a person, i use blade hurl. The skill will not activate. After clicking like a monster, it activates after 4~7 seconds.

Sadly i can't see enemy character info in nw. Will keep a look out for people and ask them about their evasion numbers.

On well geared archers and sins, i know drake bash misses often.

Vedovis - Lost City

BMs finally got a boost to counter puri, after much QQing, and you lot still aren't satisfied?

What more do you want? Every skill paralyzes? Get over yourself.

Sevchenko - Dreamweaver

Not possible.
The chinese love to overpower wizards over all other classes, don't ever expect them to nerf a wizard or to give anyone else chances against a wizard.

It is funny when a veno captures the flag, because the ***** has an almost cooldownless speed buff and gets even more speed/antistun when hitted.

Viktorian - Archosaur

ok setting this back on track for those that obviously havent read the comments after the OP.
we have since discarded the more paralyzes idea. that ship has sailed. stop posting comments about y we want more paralyzes. ablahabla or w.e that name is. that video is about as usefull to this arguement as XCableX stunlock vid. notice 1 that the wizzy whos name i cant make out isnt doing anything. even when he messes up and the stunlock is broken she doesnt move or AD or anything. had u shown a fight where the bm was doing this while in an actual 1v1 or mass pvp situation woulda had more value.
ok now that that is taken care of back to the revised idea.
Roar of the Pride- no chi cost other then that still do the same thing. STUNS NOT PARALYZE
Drakes Bash-50 chi cost reduction (so 50 chi to use) will not effect Dragon Rising.(aka dragon rising will still cost 1 spark to cast/use and still paralyzes)

can we start with that now?

Sevchenko - Dreamweaver

Purify spell is the stupidest and most overpowered aspect of the game.

XXHotXx - Morai

Sevchenko - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Purify spell is the stupidest and most overpowered aspect of the game.

want to trade my purify for your sage tidal?

also "if you spam stuns on a wiz and purify doesnt proc he is just having bad luck"

you serious? purify proc is 8% chance, if you spam CCs on a wiz, the wiz is lucky if purify procs ffs

and moreover, the OP just needs to know how to "use his class full potential"

cause **** like reeling a barb from a flyer in TW then paralyzing him mid air will let the barb get killed either lose the catapult <- this sh.t breaks game mechanics

Colum - Raging Tide

Roar is good as it is... at öeast wprls as AOE-interrupt even if others can get out of it fast.

Eoria - Harshlands

XXHotXx - Morai wrote: »

want to trade my purify for your sage tidal?

also "if you spam stuns on a wiz and purify doesnt proc he is just having bad luck"

you serious? purify proc is 8% chance, if you spam CCs on a wiz, the wiz is lucky if purify procs ffs

and moreover, the OP just needs to know how to "use his class full potential"

cause **** like reeling a barb from a flyer in TW then paralyzing him mid air will let the barb get killed either lose the catapult <- this sh.t breaks game mechanics

iirc, puri proc on r9rr was tested to be like 14% or so. It's r8r that's 8%.

Also, what cata barb is ever on his flyer in TW?


As for the topic, guys, there's a reason why the only AOE paralyze in the game has a 180sec cd, 1 spark cost, only lasts for 2secs, and is a % chance based on soulforce. Come on now. If they made Roar into a paralyze, they would need to nerf the duration, put a much higher chi cost on it, and a longer cd.

XXHotXx - Morai

Eoria - Harshlands wrote: »

iirc, puri proc on r9rr was tested to be like 14% or so. It's r8r that's 8%.

Also, what cata barb is ever on his flyer in TW?


As for the topic, guys, there's a reason why the only AOE paralyze in the game has a 180sec cd, 1 spark cost, only lasts for 2secs, and is a % chance based on soulforce. Come on now. If they made Roar into a paralyze, they would need to nerf the duration, put a much higher chi cost on it, and a longer cd.

thats the point the barb is not on the flyer...

the bms is tho... -> reels in the on-ground barb from flyer -> paralyze -> cata lost cause barb is midair -> stunlock-> AA -> barb dead midair GG TWs

Eoria - Harshlands

XXHotXx - Morai wrote: »

thats the point the barb is not on the flyer...

the bms is tho... -> reels in the on-ground barb from flyer -> paralyze -> cata lost cause barb is midair -> stunlock-> AA -> barb dead midair GG TWs

If your cata barb is getting stunlocked in the air, your guild is doing something horribly wrong.

XXHotXx - Morai

Eoria - Harshlands wrote: »

If your cata barb is getting stunlocked in the air, your guild is doing something horribly wrong.

hello?

Reel In its a 25 meters grab -> roar -> paralyze (barb loses cata at this point) -> more CCs -> eventual AA and the barb is dead cause he cant take any action being glitched midair

i've seen this being done quite a few times in different factions, and trusts me its gamebreaking.

Doom_Panda - Harshlands

xxhotxx - Morai wrote: »

hello?

Reel In Its A 25 Meters Grab -> Roar -> Paralyze (barb Loses Cata At This Point) -> More Ccs -> Eventual Aa And The Barb Is Dead Cause He Cant Take Any Action Being Glitched Midair

I've Seen This Being Done Quite A Few Times In Different Factions, And Trusts Me Its Gamebreaking.

Ad Ftw?

Eoria - Harshlands

Doom_Panda - Harshlands wrote: »

Ad Ftw?

Not to mention purify from the cata clerics? Liek...

Also venos could literally just Bewitch the BM out of the air.

Shidoshi - Lost City

Vedovis - Lost City wrote: »

*joins in the eye rolling*

I am hoping this is a troll thread.

i like how they roll their eyes when we are right. if your going to contirbute don't be stupid. and for EVERYONE that don't like to read. doesn't matter what a bm does reel in, roar of pride. you hit that immune pot and bm are recked. qand for drake bash our paralyzing skill it cast a spark but i'm sorry its not enough. blade master are not the tank character EVEN WITH marrow. we hit marrow then seeker hitting hard. you know what the most tank's and over power character are in this games. veno's! their purify spell skill on weapon their insane pdef in fox form and their running skills. that damn stunning monkey. their ability to turn you in to animals and purging skills. chi burns bramble gaurds. this game is so over balance to the mage class side its pointless to be a bm.

Colum - Raging Tide wrote: »

Roar is good as it is... at öeast wprls as AOE-interrupt even if others can get out of it fast.

the problem is you half to be up in front of the person to use it. most the bm skill requires you to be directly on the target to even cast. the only good intrupe skill we have is smack

Eoria - Harshlands wrote: »

Not to mention purify from the cata clerics? Liek...

Also venos could literally just Bewitch the BM out of the air.

the problem with air bms is they lose their speed advantage. so its easy to run away from them and the air to ground damage nuff.

Vedovis - Lost City wrote: »

BMs finally got a boost to counter puri, after much QQing, and you lot still aren't satisfied?

What more do you want? Every skill paralyzes? Get over yourself.

no we are not satisfied even tho will paralyze you. the damn stupid monkey gets use stun negating the paralyze effect.

Viktorian - Archosaur wrote: »

To Mr./Mrs/Ms Marengo and Mr./Mrs/Ms. Vedovis,

I on behalf of the PWI community would like to thank you for your insightful and helpful contribution to our game. Your eye rolling is a great insight on this topic.



I like what your doing but giving roar a paralyze is a bad idea. For one, it makes it a near unstoppable aoe stun. Besides the bad reaction from the casters community, which dislikes bms in the first place, the community as a whole dislikes paralyzes. When barbs got mighty swing (no chi cost 50% success rate) and abused it, the community as a whole disliked it instantaneously. BMs having one paralyze is something many arent happy about but can live with due to two things.
1 its high chi cost. The 1 spark chi cost isnt something we have in a few seconds(without using genie and be honest, in TW/NW with all the casters magic attacks coming at you are you using CE or AD?)
2 It is a single target skill. If roar became an aoe, all a bm has to do is target the barb or a central person get close and cast. Thats a good number of people unable to move or defend themselves outside of genie. Whereas a single target skill only becomes truly effective in a 1v1 situation.

Instead of making roar a paralyze, I suggest lowering the chi cost on Roar of the Pride and Drakes Bash(not Dragon Rising). Eliminate the chi cost on Roar of the Pride and lower it to 50 on Drakes Bash. This gives all bms a stun that isnt a % chance or costs chi and gives rb1 and lower bms a fighting chance in 1v1s.

i see what you said but the fact is one imuune pot and your stun is now useless.