mag class need running skill.

Stewartboy - Archosaur

hey guys. i just wanted to know what yall think of mag classes getting running skills.. afew pointers from my side is.. clerics: needed in almost every squad. without holypath they'll get left behind by alot of people and that means alot unless they could tank... pointer 2 mystic: people say they have instant heals and pets so they/we shouldnt get a running skill... i call bullshyt. unless we can ride our summons gtfo with that.. besides clerics mystics are also needed in squad for their heals (plants debuff.."not many people know this") and DD.. this is only in pve... in PVP its different.. having a barb run after u and cant outrun them is scary. sure u can use holy path or pots but if they catch you after all this runs out and is on CD then its death unless your gonna spam heal... pointer 3 wiz: they got the long jump sure but just like mystics without holypath=death if not tanky or dont have rrr9 weap.... so tell me guyz whats your take on this..

NOTE: no drama.. if your a phy class and dont know what you are talking about keep it to yourself...b:laugh

CapnK - Sanctuary

Demon version of Energy Leech lets you run fast but it's pretty bad. Only a 50% chance to proc and it doesn't last long. I get a bit of use out of it while running flags in NW but otherwise it's useless. At the very least should work 100% of the time since you're spending a spark on it.

Kendaichi - Dreamweaver

The ramifications this would have in a pvp setting.... is truly astronomical. It's hard to say exactly how much this would effect pvp play, such as nw/tw.

Also seriously... about the phys class comment? Sad that people say something like that regardless if it comes from a phys class saying 'no magic class' reply, or something similiarly stupid and asinine like saying 'no phys class reply if you don't know what your talking about.'

I do get the annoyance about having to use genies, but meh if it effects pvp too much then it would defeat the purpose of it. Although not all casters are r93r they do all get the super haxed/oped skill that is purify... and while that obviously needs someone to trigger it, it still has the built in holy path.

I wouldn't be opposed to all classes being able to use mounts in all instances.

Still people do indeed need to slow down a bit, but really if they die it's their fault not yours for not being able to keep up, and if they give you grief for not being there... well that is when the person (regardless of their class) doesn't have a clue about the game. IJS

b:avoid

Stewartboy - Archosaur

Also seriously... about the phys class comment? Sad that people say something like that regardless if it comes from a phys class saying 'no magic class' reply



didnt mean it like that.. there's a few people who barely know their class. that comes up n give a long speech about another class they never played.. it just doesnt make much sense.. so i should have said ( NOTE: only people who understand these classes)b:pleased

Mayfly - Dreamweaver

If melee leave you behind... they obviously don't want heals. (And no, you're not obligated to holy path after them. Often you have better uses for that genie energy/stamina.) An instance is not a race (exception: trophy mode), no extra points are given for finishing faster. And if they leave mobs behind blocking you... they are REALLY stupid.

And if they die in the middle of a bunch of mobs, beyond the reach of revive... let them be the ones to town for once.

MontRei - Dreamweaver

Casters hit from a distance and melee classes have speed skills to catch them. It's the little balance we have left in this game. Adding a speed skill to casters would turn the tides horribly, to make it fair they would have to give melee classes ranged skills, and when I say ranged it's not 10 meters, it would have to be the same distance of a magic hit, probably 26.5 meters or more.

I don't like getting hit by a melee class or when they reach me but it's the balance of the game. Anything other than that would be in my opinion game-breaking.

P.S I would be OK with a speed skill that only works in PvE or only inside instances, healers know how many times we have to holy path our butts off to reach everyone else, or when we get knocked out of an instance (FSP/WS) or have to release for whatever reason and go back in, catching up with the squad is really annoying.

bangis2010

yes can we give them a running skill please .. and also can the range attack minimize?

Zheii - Archosaur

How about no?

It's all over just a terrible idea, honestly. They don't have speed skills for a reason, those with RRR9 and puri proc are OP enough w/o them.

Please do imagine giving an RRR9 Wizzy a speed skill: combine Puri proc, their leap (Distance Shrink) and Arcane Defense.
You've just created a class that can kite you to the edge of the map and probably even keep going after that. And that is just one example, there are very valid reasons why our Arcane classes do not have speed skills, you should probably learn them .

Desdi - Sanctuary

MontRei - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Casters hit from a distance and melee classes have speed skills to catch them. It's the little balance we have left in this game. Adding a speed skill to casters would turn the tides horribly, to make it fair they would have to give melee classes ranged skills, and when I say ranged it's not 10 meters, it would have to be the same distance of a magic hit, probably 26.5 meters or more.

This~
It's kinda justified for Venomancers as they have to run up close to debuff. It would be way too much for the other classes though, especially considering they already have Purify proc.

Sucks for those without purify proc but let's not break the game more.

mrcharlytoo

Mayfly - Dreamweaver wrote: »

If melee leave you behind... they obviously don't want heals. (And no, you're not obligated to holy path after them. Often you have better uses for that genie energy/stamina.) An instance is not a race (exception: trophy mode), no extra points are given for finishing faster. And if they leave mobs behind blocking you... they are REALLY stupid.

And if they die in the middle of a bunch of mobs, beyond the reach of revive... let them be the ones to town for once.

This, with **** on.

Colum - Raging Tide

I have a barb icon, I must never have played a caster before. /thread

WannaBM - Archosaur

You got purify weapons and you think you need a running skill b:shocked

Every cleric is able to keep up with me when i pull full lunar of FW fire. I think that means there is no problem

Msdoomdesire - Sanctuary

What desdi said. Running skills on any other caster would just be broken. Venos use speed to debuff and dodge because we don't have reliable healing like a mystic/cleric/wizzy/psychic. Yes we have metabolic boost which has a cd as slow as molasses. Yes we also have soul transfusion, but unless you don't have chi it's risky using because it can take a whole spark. Every other caster has a proper healing skill that requires no chi with short cd. This is why other casters will not get a speed skill.

DarkSkiesx - Dreamweaver

Stewartboy - Archosaur wrote: »

clerics: needed in almost every squad. without holypath they'll get left behind by alot of people and that means alot

There's your problem. Holy path is your friend. Please use it.

The unfortunate consequence of requesting something to alleviate a 'problem' in PvE is that it can have serious ramifications for PvP. In PvP most casters are actually more mobile than archers (supposedly THE mobile class), in a Capture the Flag NW battle for example they are very hard to pin down and stop.

/thread

Evryn - Morai

Speed buffs are typically to allow melee characters to quickly close the gap with ranged ones. Kind of a rock-paper-scissor idea... The only outlier is the Venomancer with Summer Sprint, being a very fast caster class indeed. Personally I consider that a balance issue, but I ain't a dev :]

I also play cleric from time to time. Often I don't use holypath unless I'm walking over some clapping hands. If the squad rushes ahead and ends up keeling over, they'll have to wait anyway until I've caught up to res em... told off a few annoying BMs and Seekers a number of times (barbs can usually last until I'm there, ain't got a problem with agressive kittens): if you rush, you go without heals. You'd better be able to live without them.

Msdoomdesire - Sanctuary

Evryn - Morai wrote: »

Speed buffs are typically to allow melee characters to quickly close the gap with ranged ones. Kind of a rock-paper-scissor idea... The only outlier is the Venomancer with Summer Sprint, being a very fast caster class indeed. Personally I consider that a balance issue, but I ain't a dev :]

I also play cleric from time to time. Often I don't use holypath unless I'm walking over some clapping hands. If the squad rushes ahead and ends up keeling over, they'll have to wait anyway until I've caught up to res em... told off a few annoying BMs and Seekers a number of times (barbs can usually last until I'm there, ain't got a problem with agressive kittens): if you rush, you go without heals. You'd better be able to live without them.

Lol that's like me saying I consider your healing a balance issue... but I ain't a dev so. Veno Is part close ranged so...closing a gap. Speed helps close a gap or increase it. Sooner or later a melee class would get to u and what would be the point of them having running skills if every caster could run at their speed. Venos lack the proper healing of the other casters. Mystics have pets,spamm heals, plant debuffs, etc that's the class. If you want pet, debuffs, speed, etc as a caster then make a veno because those attribute to that class.

Alexis - Lothranis

Give the class with the only working knockback in PvP a 100% running skill. Sure that'd be fun.

For PvE there is absolutely no situation where I ever felt holy path wasn't enough. If you don't use it then that's kindah your problem is it not?

Msdoomdesire - Sanctuary

When every single respondent in the thread says it's a bad idea... then it must be a bad idea. You posted a message at the bottom and said no melee classes should respond when you should've said please nobody respond lol. Please don't tell people to not to state their opinions( pretty much what you did) it ruins the point of threads b:sad

ovenusarmanio

Holy Path is fine enough, casters don't need that. Also moving this to the suggestion box.

WannaBM - Archosaur wrote: »

You got purify weapons and you think you need a running skill b:shocked

Every cleric is able to keep up with me when i pull full lunar of FW fire. I think that means there is no problem

Purify is a gear trait, not a class trait. While every change to a class should keep pvp balance in mind, you also can't make things under the assumption that "everyone" has endgame gear. There are ways to keep that balance and solve problems for people who are not in endgame gear, which is the vast majority of the playerbase. For example, they could give a skill that only works in dungeons. But not in the world map, tourney, nation wars, or territory wars. Suppose it would make it a bit harder to kill morons on pvp servers when you drop squad but for the most part, that would not effect PVP while still aiding people in PVE. Such as skill could also change the genies of pve players and free up a skill that they can use for an extra debuff or protection skill which helps the whole squad. I still rather the GMs worked on other things though as I don't find this to be really as much of an issue anymore. People have better gear nowadays so you don't find yourself running towards a wipe nearly as often just because you lag behind a bit.

Safeng - Sanctuary

What about a running skill that only works when you're out of combat? Hardly breaks luring/pking but gets around faster.

Stewartboy - Archosaur

saw sumone said sum bout venos need running speed... i understand the purging part.. but the dodge part x.x... its not cod or sum we cant camp XD if u ever had an archer shoot u and try to dodge it u'll notice the arrows follow u... so i think they should nerf venoms speed or give mystics n clerics speed... not as fast as holy path but atleast fast as a sin running skill. b:laugh and i dont think there's a balance.. if there was this soo called balance for pvp.. when seekers came out.. bms would have quit... ijs its bullb:cute

Zheii - Archosaur

Stewartboy - Archosaur wrote: »

saw sumone said sum bout venos need running speed... i understand the purging part.. but the dodge part x.x... its not cod or sum we cant camp XD if u ever had an archer shoot u and try to dodge it u'll notice the arrows follow u... so i think they should nerf venoms speed or give mystics n clerics speed... not as fast as holy path but atleast fast as a sin running skill. b:laugh and i dont think there's a balance.. if there was this soo called balance for pvp.. when seekers came out.. bms would have quit... ijs its bullb:cute

*OP Totally ignores all of the valid reasons why Arcanes don't have speed skills*
If you're not willing to listen to other peoples suggestions as to why your suggestion is no good, then there is no point for us to listen to yours.

/CloseThread

ovenusarmanio

I saw someone said something about venos need running speed. I understand the purging part, but the dodge part? x It's not call of duty or something, we can't camp. XD If you ever had an archer shoot you, and tried to dodge it, you'd notice the arrows follow you. So i think they should nerf venoms speed or give mystics and clerics speed. Not as fast as holy path but at least fast as a sin's running skill. b:laugh And i dont think there's a balance.. if there was this so called balance for pvp.. when seekers came out.. bms would have quit... ijs its bullb:cute

I'm going to assume that the above is what you meant, forgive me if I got it wrong because of your chosen abbreviations.

There isn't dodging in this game, but there is kiting. Which is what I assume they meant. Venomancers need to be able to be better at this than other casters because they are a hybrid support class, and some of their most important skills requires them to get in close. Comparing clerics and mystics to them, when they do not have the same role or the same lack of ability to heal, is just like comparing apples to oranges. Venos need their speed buff, clerics and mystics do not.

By lacking other classes kiting skills, it allows melee to use their speed skill to close the gap and kill the melee. Casters shouldn't be untouchable by melee, that's not balance.

And when seekers came out some bms did reroll and quit their bm. But seekers are not bms, and they are very different. Despite the HA, I think seekers compare more to casters than they do BMs, to be quite honest.

Stewartboy - Archosaur

na zheii im listening to what others say.. makes alot of sense sure. but its just my take on itb:laugh and im not talking only about pvp im talking bout pve also. so dont mean to get anyone all mad but if u have a mag class w/o holy path u'll know what i mean its just kinda boring running around always using HP n still being last.b:laugh at least a wizzy jump skill would be good

Colum - Raging Tide

Stewartboy - Archosaur wrote: »

na zheii im listening to what others say.. makes alot of sense sure. but its just my take on itb:laugh and im not talking only about pvp im talking bout pve also. so dont mean to get anyone all mad but if u have a mag class w/o holy path u'll know what i mean its just kinda boring running around always using HP n still being last.b:laugh at least a wizzy jump skill would be good

Then get the friggin' holy path n stop whining.

Msdoomdesire - Sanctuary

The fact that everyone is saying "get holypath" and him still talking about a running skill for casters leads me to believe this is a troll thread b:chuckle. Besides that, yes get holypath it's not hard establishing a spot for it on your genie. Also you can even make a genie with holypath alone. So running definitly shouldn't be a problem if your talking about pve alone.

heerohex#3018

Im not gonna log this Sorry Reasons below.

Holy Path is more of a match for any skill, Doing this would make the game unbalance with all caster having a run skill. I know the Harder you hit in this game the slower you walk well to start with anyway. i can say i have never had an issue with this my self but im sure that's not the case with everyone.

Most people are saying not needed so im backing that,

Thanks,

Cursing - Sanctuary

Why does it have to be a skill. Why can't we just run? I don't know why magic classes have to be crippled. What is the point of that?

Evryn - Morai

Mayfly - Dreamweaver wrote: »

If melee leave you behind... they obviously don't want heals. (And no, you're not obligated to holy path after them. Often you have better uses for that genie energy/stamina.) An instance is not a race (exception: trophy mode), no extra points are given for finishing faster. And if they leave mobs behind blocking you... they are REALLY stupid.

And if they die in the middle of a bunch of mobs, beyond the reach of revive... let them be the ones to town for once.

This. When I'm in an instance on my cleric I usually stay behind with the back of the party - the folks who aren't top geared, and need heals the most. I've been yelled at a number of times for not healing on time when the seeker/sin (usually one of these classes who -think- they are a tank but can't quite make it as one) with some above average gear rushes ahead and bites off more then they can chew. I usually tell em "Stay with the party then. Solo rush is solo death."

As for speeding the party up - get an archer with you. Their evasion buff also has a movement speed bonus. Not one that'll beat holy path or cloud sprint or any of the melee speed buffs, but it sure helps in keeping up with those.

That said, I skill Holy Path on all my caster/ranged char genies.

Narcillatrix - Dreamweaver

As someone who plays nothing but caster classes, I'm gonna saaaaayy....No.
We really don't NEED any kind of speed bonus. If you feel like you NEED it then I'm going to say what everyone else has been saying, get holy path/apoth to help scoot you along.

And like mentioned before, if you are a healer and the rest of the squad blasts off 12479174 miles ahead of you, then they better be ridiculously tough and/or hold their own and NOT expect you to fly at a constant rate of 100 miles an hour just to keep up with their impatient butts. If they die that's their own fault for not realizing not everyone can go leroy jenkins at the speed of light as they please, and said speeding people should know that healers/most casters in general are slower, and therefore should not suddently lose 100 IQ points when in an instance and rush ahead leaving them behind.

Also side note to the rant, I find this a lot when I am the only healer in the squad, if there is one single healer in a 10 person squad, and everyone is scattered around all over the place, it can get a little difficult taking care of everybody and trying to be in 6 places at once. People taking off ahead of the group only to get walloped on while I'm still trying to take care of and heal the people around and behind me who are getting attacked as well do not help at alllll. x.x

X_volcano_y - Harshlands

thats why casters got puri on r9rr weps and clerics have gaurdian light....there are pots to boost speed+archer buff+holypath.
Edit: some gear add speed too