Should pwi players be compensated for server and developmental issues?

Boomz - Harshlands

Issues such as these random server crashes are rather annoying and take away from the players that enjoy this game. Although not all people pay to play this game, I think pwi has a responsiblity as a game provider to compensate for when stuff like this happens, this is a simple poll for those that may or may not agree with me.

SHIMBERLY - Heavens Tear

Uhhh no because then I want compensated for the 8 hours a day I miss from this game when I go to work because it isn't right.

X5 years

opkossy

Should it be an obligation of theirs? No. Stuff happens that can be out of their hands sometimes. Just like how we don't get compensation at a supermarket for them needing to temporarily close due to unforseen circumstances.

Would it be nice if they did? Yes... and they do have a history of doing so for when the issues wind up lasting long enough. Which is why I really don't see the point of this thread at all.

Boomz - Harshlands

This is about pwi having issues with their game, not your personal life issues.

Boomz - Harshlands

OPKossy wrote: »

Should it be an obligation of theirs? No. Stuff happens that can be out of their hands sometimes. Just like how we don't get compensation at a supermarket for them needing to temporarily close due to unforseen circumstances.

Would it be nice if they did? Yes... and they do have a history of doing so for when the issues wind up lasting long enough. Which is why I really don't see the point of this thread at all.

Programming is not unforseen circumstances, I know this because I also do some coding from time to time. When code is made correctly for mmos, they will never have these problems. Truthfully, I have not been able to figure out why pwi has these problems or what in their code is causing core dumps that require resets. However if they cannot find the issue, I would suggest implementing a fail-safe code that automatically restarts the servers when parts of the map crash. This way servers will only be down a few minutes rather than hours.

Desdi - Sanctuary

Game code has nothing to do with the servers themselves though? as far as I know at least.

Azura - Lost City

Boomz - Harshlands wrote: »

Issues such as these random server crashes are rather annoying and take away from the players that enjoy this game. Although not all people pay to play this game, I think pwi has a responsiblity as a game provider to compensate for when stuff like this happens, this is a simple poll for those that may or may not agree with me.

I don't think they have the obligation to compensate because when we accepted the ToS of this game, they never promised to be able to run the game 24/7 without fail.

Stuff happens. When it happens just go outside and have a walk. If it's raining watch a movie or find another game to play with in the meanwhile.

Boomz - Harshlands

Desdi - Sanctuary wrote: »

Game code has nothing to do with the servers themselves though? as far as I know at least.

Code makes up all aspects of any game. A server is run by a processing system or systems in a certain location. That system will always run unless physically turned off or destroyed, in the case right now, it is neither. That system follows whatever code (or essentially "orders") that you give it. If you say in your code to randomly stop working, it will. Therefore your code has everything to do with the servers. I would give reference to other games, but I'm not allowed, however I can say that in other games I have played, those games do not have this kind of problem.

opkossy

Boomz - Harshlands wrote: »

Programming is not unforseen circumstances, I know this because I also do some coding from time to time. When code is made correctly for mmos, they will never have these problems. Truthfully, I have not been able to figure out why pwi has these problems or what in their code is causing core dumps that require resets. However if they cannot find the issue, I would suggest implementing a fail-safe code that automatically restarts the servers when parts of the map crash. This way servers will only be down a few minutes rather than hours.

What Desdi said when it comes to the servers.

As for code, how much large scale code have you done? At the level it takes for a functional MMO, bugs are a relatively common thing that are bound to happen. And sometimes trying to find the cause can be harder than a person would think.

Your idea of a fail-safe, for instance, could easily cause massive problems with the slightest error in it. And that's without accounting for what happens when the machine physically crashes and there's absolutely nothing any amount of code can do to deal with that.

Rathofdemise - Sanctuary

I have to agree with boomz here, does pwi not have a quality assurance department(QA).
for those that dont know what that is QA test code and make sure it does not break and if it breaks they report and fix it.

Super Markets have issues that can effect it in rl. But code does not unless your being internally or externally **** or DOS or what ever and if that's the case you need to improve your securities I know GMs have no idea about this because your not developers but PWI does and maybe they should stop spending money on having a fun work environment and do there job(they list there work place info directly on there main corp site).

and as a company that has recently put it self up for public trading you would expect alot more from them since people are now invested in you and are watching what you do.

I can right a report on this Jesus. The main Point is that I been supporting pwi for 5 years on and off and expect allot more from them.
(Degree in Computer information systems)

OFate - Heavens Tear

OPKossy wrote: »

Should it be an obligation of theirs? No. Stuff happens that can be out of their hands sometimes. Just like how we don't get compensation at a supermarket for them needing to temporarily close due to unforseen circumstances.

Would it be nice if they did? Yes... and they do have a history of doing so for when the issues wind up lasting long enough. Which is why I really don't see the point of this thread at all.

I have to agree because companies can't even do this when their servers crash or have issues.

Xainou - Sanctuary

Oh yea, that must be the new code that just shuts the server down if theres too little cash shopping going on that day.

heerohex#3018

NO!

If you read the T&C it states this info in it. As server crashes are annoying but out of any control you cant set the blame on PWI. Their for they should not have to offer you anything as a result of loss of service.

Saying that!
If the systems where to be OFF-LINE for a long period of time im sure PWI would offer the community something again in the T&C.

defenderofdreams

Hey everyone,

This poll has merits and is something I've recently brought up with management. This week in particular has had quite its share of server difficulties, and I feel it would be most beneficial for everyone if we could provide at least some sort of compensation. Preferably, something on a larger scale or even brand new. (I actually have something in mind b:chuckle).

The best I can do right now though, is to randomly run events. I say random because I have to start them manually, which is why you unfortunately may not see them at regular intervals or at late nights.

This, however, is the best I can personally do. Hopefully you'll get a neat surprise in the coming weekends. Until then, please bear with us and we do value your decision to take enjoyment in our game, Perfect World International.

opkossy

DefenderofDreams wrote: »

Hey everyone,

This poll has merits and is something I've recently brought up with management. This week in particular has had quite its share of server difficulties, and I feel it would be most beneficial for everyone if we could provide at least some sort of compensation. Preferably, something on a larger scale or even brand new. (I actually have something in mind b:chuckle).

The best I can do right now though, is to randomly run events. I say random because I have to start them manually, which is why you unfortunately may not see them at regular intervals or at late nights.

This, however, is the best I can personally do. Hopefully you'll get a neat surprise in the coming weekends. Until then, please bear with us and we do value your decision to take enjoyment in our game, Perfect World International.

Anyone else really like this guy?

Yes, yes? Glad to see we're all in agreement!

FistToDeath - Dreamweaver

Triple our NW token rewards and I'll be satisfied. b:dirty

Anyway, good to know someone who actually works at PWI is reading the forums. Way to go, DoD.

FistToDeath - Dreamweaver

OPKossy wrote: »

Anyone else really like this guy?

Yes, yes? Glad to see we're all in agreement!

Yes, he should be made our permanent GM/CM.

Zoldi - Morai

Actually the best thing to do would be to fix those issues... but if someone from PWE wants to offer me +12 orbs I will accept them b:thanks

picolo08

One thing is...When you are paid for what u do...it MUST be 100%...if it is NOT...then close the doors of the place u work at and go home...think about it...and come back next day with a different mind set. It is that simple!

CUSTOMERS...which all pwi users are, including me...need to be pleased...if they are not...then expect criticism. If it is just that. I work in a firm...my father owns it...Customers give US money and we feel good about it. Becauze it's good to be payed for what u did right? But you know what...TOS is BS and ****!!! There is no TOS when u work FOR PEOPLE. How would anyone like to come to our firm and TRUST us to FIX their car, and do it good, make them happy, and them make US HAPPY to be paid and actually have the money to live with, if we would put a sign on the doors that would say: ''WE WILL DO OUR BEST TO FIX UR CAR BUT IF WE DO NOT DO IT CORRECTLY DO NOT EXPECT US TO FIX IT AGAIN''

They would turn away, and find ANOTHER firm that would be more kind to the ppl that are willing to PAY.

Idk really what the problem is. But i will admit, when i make a mistake, and customer comes back, and complains about work not being done well, i know EXCATLY wether the customer is giving me BS or they're real and i made a mistake. And i FIX it. On my own costs. Becauze that is what will make them COME BACK next time they will need something. With an attitude, and with lack of patience and tolerance you give people a bad feeling, and they tend not to like it. You want to lose your customer by giving out TOS? Idk what to say about it.

That is that. On the other hand i mentioned tolerance and patience in my speech. And Pwi has shown some of it. I do not expect anything even tho i am their CUSTOMER, but it would be proper and NICE!

Idk much about the problems they have, but i seek for finding understanding in myself for their mistakes. Ik a lil about codes and quite few things bout comps, but it's not what im pro at. Im pro at my profession and when i slack i put extra effort to get back on track.

And last but not least... remember this every day you wake up and every day you go to bed...

''Victory loves preparation''

Wickedbrew - Raging Tide

On a whole, I voted no as most issues or down time isn't really enough to expect compensation of any kind. It happens in MMOs. But from what I have been reading on the forums the past week of various issues, then I think its warranted to have some small measure of compensation. The game not accessible for a few hours is not much of a big deal, unless you really have nothing in life better to do except play PWI, but a string of issues, piling up over a weeks time goes a long way in the eyes of the playerbase to have problems acknowledged.

The biggest issue I see is not having a timely response from anyone from PWE at least letting the players know there was a problem, even if no timeline for a fix is given. It shows the players, the company is working on whatever the issue is.

FistToDeath - Dreamweaver

picolo08 wrote: »

One thing is...When you are paid for what u do...it MUST be 100%...if it is NOT...then close the doors of the place u work at and go home...think about it...and come back next day with a different mind set. It is that simple!

There's no place where everything works 100% fine all the time. Not even one. What one must strive is to make everything go well when possible, and to give some kind of satisfaction as to why bad things happened when they do happen.

CUSTOMERS...which all pwi users are, including me...need to be pleased...if they are not...then expect criticism. If it is just that. I work in a firm...my father owns it...Customers give US money and we feel good about it. Becauze it's good to be payed for what u did right? But you know what...TOS is BS and ****!!! There is no TOS when u work FOR PEOPLE. How would anyone like to come to our firm and TRUST us to FIX their car, and do it good, make them happy, and them make US HAPPY to be paid and actually have the money to live with, if we would put a sign on the doors that would say: ''WE WILL DO OUR BEST TO FIX UR CAR BUT IF WE DO NOT DO IT CORRECTLY DO NOT EXPECT US TO FIX IT AGAIN''

They would turn away, and find ANOTHER firm that would be more kind to the ppl that are willing to PAY.

If you go to a doctor, you'll pay him even if he can't cure you. You'll get the best treatment he can give you, nothing else. That's what maintaining a server is all about.Offering the best possible. Things may go out of the planned sometimes, as long as customers get to know what's happening.

Idk really what the problem is. But i will admit, when i make a mistake, and customer comes back, and complains about work not being done well, i know EXCATLY wether the customer is giving me BS or they're real and i made a mistake. And i FIX it. On my own costs. Becauze that is what will make them COME BACK next time they will need something. With an attitude, and with lack of patience and tolerance you give people a bad feeling, and they tend not to like it. You want to lose your customer by giving out TOS? Idk what to say about it.

PWI doesn't seem to be charging anyone to fix the game, so I'd say they're doing it on their own costs as well. The thing is, they're a company that survives with voluntary donations from players, who in return get items from the game boutique. If players get pissed enough, they'll stop charging money to the game. If they're not cashers, they might quit, which also affects their profits, since cashers can't do much without the rest of the free to play playerbase.

That is that. On the other hand i mentioned tolerance and patience in my speech. And Pwi has shown some of it. I do not expect anything even tho i am their CUSTOMER, but it would be proper and NICE!

Idk much about the problems they have, but i seek for finding understanding in myself for their mistakes. Ik a lil about codes and quite few things bout comps, but it's not what im pro at. Im pro at my profession and when i slack i put extra effort to get back on track.

Yeah, they're probably doing their best to fix it as well, since it hurts their profit when servers are not online. What kind of pisses me off is that they don't care much to explain what's happening. They just say they're aware of the problem and are trying to fix it, and even that they're usually late to let us know. Their problem is bad communication, not so much bad service.

And last but not least... remember this every day you wake up and every day you go to bed...

''Victory loves preparation''

Colors.

Jarkhen - Archosaur

Pretty much exactly what FistToDeath said, but I've got a point to add:

Programming is not unforseen circumstances, I know this because I also do some coding from time to time.

Anyone who programs with any sort of frequency knows that bugs happen. Sometimes, bugs get through your tests and into a production environment. It happens. AND - surprise! - PWI can't fix it. Bugs in the code are things Wanmei has to fix.


"Coding from time to time" or even having a degree in comp sci or information systems, or whatever else you want to claim, does not make you an authority on this subject. I can rather confidently say that the vast majority of people graduating from college right now haven't the slightest clue what a production environment is like.

Having experience in a large-scale software development environment is the important thing, which neither Boomz nor Rathofdemise seem to have.

Not to mention that you're complaining about the code to people that, uh, don't write itb:bye

Vhori - Harshlands

How about PWI offers a reward for those who feel they should be compensated, that way those who claim they do not, won't have to take it? b:bye

I bet everyone will go and take it.

Milfhound - Harshlands

Vhori - Harshlands wrote: »

How about PWI offers a reward for those who feel they should be compensated, that way those who claim they do not, won't have to take it? b:bye

I bet everyone will go and take it.

While gifts are nice and all, I would rather see the server problems go away.

Vhori - Harshlands

Milfhound - Harshlands wrote: »

While gifts are nice and all, I would rather see the server problems go away.

Ok? Me too ;o

Mezagis - Lost City

DefenderofDreams wrote: »

Hey everyone,

This poll has merits and is something I've recently brought up with management. This week in particular has had quite its share of server difficulties, and I feel it would be most beneficial for everyone if we could provide at least some sort of compensation. Preferably, something on a larger scale or even brand new. (I actually have something in mind b:chuckle).

The best I can do right now though, is to randomly run events. I say random because I have to start them manually, which is why you unfortunately may not see them at regular intervals or at late nights.

This, however, is the best I can personally do. Hopefully you'll get a neat surprise in the coming weekends. Until then, please bear with us and we do value your decision to take enjoyment in our game, Perfect World International.

Hell yes.

OPKossy wrote: »

Anyone else really like this guy?

Yes, yes? Glad to see we're all in agreement!

**** yes.

FistToDeath - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Yes, he should be made our permanent GM/CM.

Hell ****ing yes.

ovenusarmanio

DefenderofDreams wrote: »

Hey everyone,

This poll has merits and is something I've recently brought up with management. This week in particular has had quite its share of server difficulties, and I feel it would be most beneficial for everyone if we could provide at least some sort of compensation. Preferably, something on a larger scale or even brand new. (I actually have something in mind b:chuckle).

The best I can do right now though, is to randomly run events. I say random because I have to start them manually, which is why you unfortunately may not see them at regular intervals or at late nights.

This, however, is the best I can personally do. Hopefully you'll get a neat surprise in the coming weekends. Until then, please bear with us and we do value your decision to take enjoyment in our game, Perfect World International.

Cool! Glad to hear it. b:victory

STrickeeN - Harshlands

still waiting for events. hope it doesnt come when i am in school late in the night...

foley3k

OPKossy wrote: »

Should it be an obligation of theirs? No. Stuff happens that can be out of their hands sometimes. Just like how we don't get compensation at a supermarket for them needing to temporarily close due to unforseen circumstances.

Would it be nice if they did? Yes... and they do have a history of doing so for when the issues wind up lasting long enough. Which is why I really don't see the point of this thread at all.

Stuff does happen I agree. But with PWI "stuff" happens a lot. I have yet to see a company with as many issues as PW has. This past week has been the worse. How can someone **** up a simple server restart? I mean the events cant even start on time.

I really dont care if we are compensated or not. I would much rather have them come out and say who screwed up, why and what is going to be done about it. When it comes down to it, PW is a business, and right now business doesnt look good. But hey according to them there are lots of new players, i guess if the servers and game were more stable I would see them.

Wickedbrew - Raging Tide

Mezagis - Lost City wrote: »

Hell yes.



***** yes.



Hell ******** yes.

What are you like 14 years old? Was that really necessary?

JustAllEvil - Harshlands

I like DoD, I just give light ribbing to ease the frustration of server problems.

Anyways, yes they cannot foresee every possible bug or problem (we don't know what the problem is, for all we know it's a hardware problem and we're yelling at the wrong people) but as a business unhappy customers are customers that may leave/spend less money with business.

I don't see giving gifts to player as any different than say, a restaurant giving a free meal because their current one got screwed up.