Thicket

Brillance - Raging Tide

CapnK - Sanctuary's Avatar
CapnK - Sanctuary
Perfect World User

Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 557

# 1 Thicket for Brillance
Today, 09:05 AM


First of all, Thicket is not a good source of damage. It's not. Yes the spell description sounds like it does a lot of damage, but it doesn't. It's divided up into multiple hits and each hit gets reduced by the enemy defenses so it doesn't end up being much at all.

Thicket is a control skill. It has a high chance to seal and freeze the enemy (and curse if you're demon). I don't know why you say Thicket doesn't seal since that's pretty much its reason to exist. Bosses can't be sealed but that doesn't mean you should be using it on bosses.

Name another spell that's better? Nature's Vengeance. On bosses you should be triple sparking and then spamming Nature's Vengeance until you can triple spark again. Yes it's boring and repetitive but it's the most effective damage you can do on a boss. Triple sparking and then using Thicket is pointless - Thicket is a plant and not affected by Triple Spark anyway.

There might be some situations where a demon mystic could Thicket a boss for the 25% curse damage. But a mystic who has acquired level 11 Thicket is usually tanking anyway and will be better served by just spamming NV to retain agro.

I think your post deserves a reply. Its good information, as were others on that thread.

Thanks to you, Nowitsawn, and Alexis for showing me something new. Will make my gameplay more interesting at least. b:thanks

I have level 11 Thicket, and you are right, it doesnt even feel as good as the one I had at level 85. Im sure its probably doing more damage and Im sure there's a reasonable explanation for that, but at this point I really dont care. If you can understand what Im saying, my char feels a lot weaker than she used to. Im not mad or anything, its just less annoying to not try to figure that kind of thing out. It is what it is.b:chuckle

More good information to follow...


Nowitsawn - Heavens Tear
Perfect World User

Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 4,547
# 5
Today, 09:01 AM

I feel sorry for myself for remembering all this despite quitting almost a year ago.

(1+1+1+1+1) * 0.5 = 2.5

5 * 0.5 = 2.5

See what I'm getting at?

You're still right, however. Thicket deals 12x weapon damage (character level + average weapon range + shards + rings), which would be about 3200 with a +12 r9 weapon.

(3200 * 12) + 6500 = 44900

Now let's take the average (unbuffed) attack range for that +12 weapon (does 23000~26000 sound about right?) and do that for Nature's Vengeance:

24500 + 3200 + 723 = 28423 BUT, with a 50% shorter channel and 33% shorter cast + no chi cost + benefits from cleric's M.Attk buffs (since this does not affect weapon damage) + benefits from sparks.



Alexis - Lothranis
101 petals

Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 198
# 11

Today, 09:55 AM


Not about having chi issues. It's about keeping the triple-spark attack buff up for as long as you can. A mystic can't keep it up for ever, like for example a 5 aps can, so trying to activate it as soon as you can increases your DPS.

For example even if you used a 2-spark chi pot. You have all the chi in the world with that. So you could say you could Thicket then activate the chi pot and triple-spark nv.
But instead of that you could triple spark then use the chi pot (+2 sparks) and gain another +1 spark by NV and then once triple spark buff wore off you can triple spark again immediately and that doubles the time for that 700% extra attack which is more then that Thicket at start can do.

Like I said it's all about efficiency.



Now its all there in one place, saved for posterity (or until the page whatever monster eats it), for any Mystic to read and learn from.

klys

stop spamming.

This is common sense info, anyone reading ingame descriptions would understand

Xainou - Sanctuary

You'd think common sense figures that spark>thicket unless youre like trying to pop a wave in delta...

_Decide_ - Sanctuary

okie thanks lol

Brillance - Raging Tide

Xainou - Sanctuary wrote: »

You'd think common sense figures that spark>thicket unless youre like trying to pop a wave in delta...

Funny, I would think, you'd think, common sense figures that spark is just a pretty light, and will not do damage in and of itself. Nice try though. *thumbs up*

Xx_BeLLa_xX - Harshlands

3 Spark->Lucky break->Gale force = everything dead

Thicket = ... 2 spark gone and mobs still up

Even 1 spark+GF without Lucky break do more damage than thicket.

Here's what I got on the Illusion of grandeur (the mob Smooth Antoine spawn):

Thicket = 70k (2 sparks)

NV = around 70k (No chi)

GF = around 75k (30 chi)

1 spark + GF = around 134k (1 spark and 30 chi)

1 spark + Lucky break + GF = 186k (1 spark and 80 chi)

3 spark + Lucky break + GF = 241k

So that pretty much to show that if someone have 2 sparks ready it's better to 1 spark and GF than thicket, if you are looking for damage.

Thicket in PVE should be use if demon for his bonus, other than that everything do more damage than that with less chi cost.

Also I'm sage and have all my skills sage (except freaking comforting mist), so for a demon, thicket does 1.5k damage less. (not a big deal, but to show that actually thicket is not doing that much damage)

For me as sage the utility of Thicket is PVP/TW wise and for when I want to CC from a longer range than with GF.

I'm not a huge fan of Cragg except in ws and sometime lunar, but at that point if you have 2 sparks to use in PVE, use it on Cragg before Thicket if you want damage.

Brillance - Raging Tide

Thanks Bella. I recently got a couple spells Ive been missing. Sage Thicket & Gaia's Blessing. Gaia's Blessing I havent really had a chance to use, except to see what it looks like.

Ive been playing with Thicket, and my first reaction when I used it was "That's it?" It does still burn, but it doesnt feel like much. I use GF on mobs, but again I dont spark - just RG + GF. Sometimes it lays mobs flat, sometimes not.

Still havent finished Chrono, so no Lucky Break here, lol. Just need TT3-2, TT 3-3, Abba, SoT and Full Delta, and what 120M coin for the spells? x.x xD

Only level 11 spell Im missing is Verdant Shell. Had a chance to get it recently, but didnt have the coin for it when I saw it - 35M. It will probably be another 2 years before I see it somewhere again. b:cry

I still like Thicket on bosses, simply cause its old school - but Im always looking for new stuff to try, and I confess actively working to keep triple spark up is something I havent done yet. b:surrender

Brillance - Raging Tide

klys wrote: »

stop spamming.

This is common sense info, anyone reading ingame descriptions would understand

You know what? I have no doubt you got all of that, including the Maths, from reading your ingame descriptions.

Do you mind if the rest of us try to have a non-EMO, intelligent conversation in this forum for once?

b:thanks

Xx_BeLLa_xX - Harshlands

Brillance - Raging Tide wrote: »

Still havent finished Chrono, so no Lucky Break here, lol. Just need TT3-2, TT 3-3, Abba, SoT and Full Delta, and what 120M coin for the spells? x.x xD

Nah it's more around 30m depend the price of the chrono pages on your server or less if you do the treasure map quest and are lucky enough to get many pages.

Culti is a pain, but 2 skills on 3 really worth the effort.

But yea usually boss don't need to be AOE and for mystics the single attacks + spark are the best option damage wise.

Xainou - Sanctuary

Brillance - Raging Tide wrote: »

Funny, I would think, you'd think, common sense figures that spark is just a pretty light, and will not do damage in and of itself. Nice try though. *thumbs up*

Wait, you're telling me you completely disregarded the skill description and just stood there? Geez, tell me you're trolling. One can't possibly be that thick(et).

Brillance - Raging Tide

Xainou - Sanctuary wrote: »

Wait, you're telling me you completely disregarded the skill description and just stood there? Geez, tell me you're trolling. One can't possibly be that thick(et).

You prove you are every time you see me post. I'm starting to think you are jelly. I completely disregarded the skill description?

On what? Celestial Eruption?

What you said is like posting Rapid Growth>Natures Vengence, lol. Okies, GL killing something with your Rapid Growth, alone.

Join the convo if you want Xainou, but do someone else the favor of the childish trolling. Maybe the Veno forum is lacking the wonderment of your inspiration?

You dont inspire much here. *shrugs*

Xainou - Sanctuary

Yep, I'm totally jelly of someone who doesn't even reach 1/3 of my post count or playtime, yet manages to be regarded as lolworthy by more than half of the forum.

You're comparing a blender to a knife. Of course the knife will be better if you just stare at the blender instead of using it like supposed to.

PotatoHeadQR - Dreamweaver

Xainou - Sanctuary wrote: »

Wait, you're telling me you completely disregarded the skill description and just stood there? Geez, tell me you're trolling. One can't possibly be that thick(et).

*sparks* *waits for mobs to die* *nothing happens* *cries over the lost 1k spirit*

Brillance - Raging Tide

Xainou - Sanctuary wrote: »

Yep, I'm totally jelly of someone who doesn't even reach 1/3 of my post count or playtime, yet manages to be regarded as lolworthy by more than half of the forum.

You're comparing a blender to a knife. Of course the knife will be better if you just stare at the blender instead of using it like supposed to.

EMO trolls are a dime a dozen, you can get em anywhere. *shrugs*

Stop stalking me, and misquoting yourself. If you plan to continue on this thread -


will a mod please lock this?

It seems Xainou needs attention - and it must once again be at my expense.

Xainou - Sanctuary

Stop ignoring the fact and and running to mommy mod again That's all you seem to do when you run out of arguments. lol

Nowitsawn - Heavens Tear

Now now, these forums seem pretty dead already. No need to regard any kind of discussion as ''spam'', otherwise they might as well close the place down for good.

To me (who has barely touched a mystic and also not played in almost a year), Thicket seems like a decent option for burst damage if you don't think you'll be able to get off NV + AS.

But that depends on a few factors I don't really know:
-Is it affected by attack levels? Since the damage seems to come from very short summons.
-Are all hits affected by lucky break? Or just the first? Or none at all?
-Is it affected by Invigorate?

However, I do know that it doesn't scale with your magic damage. Just your weapon. So whether you are full VIT, Heavy armor or full MAG, it won't matter. So if you got a pretty +50 MAG tome (or whatever's the best by now), +22 MAG engravings on your rings, it's all wasted money when you decide to use this skill.
Unless you feel short on MP, but I doubt that.

Xainou - Sanctuary

Nowitsawn - Heavens Tear wrote: »

But that depends on a few factors I don't really know:
-Is it affected by attack levels? Since the damage seems to come from very short summons.
Probably since normal summons are effected by them.
-Are all hits affected by lucky break? Or just the first? Or none at all?
Only the next hit. However, with GF that is a full crit aoe.
-Is it affected by Invigorate?
Wouldn't think so.

My main issue is that both proc the same CC conditions (freeze+seal), with GF having way more possibilities to be amped. That's talking aoe situations ofc. The damage you can deal with lucky+GF alone will be greater than thicket on normal mobs. And you didn't even use a whole spark there. On [?] mobs like delta thicket would probably win. However, its range is small.

On single target discussions there's no argument. Both thicket and GF easily get surpassed in damage by spark and spamming NV even.

Xx_BeLLa_xX - Harshlands

Nowitsawn - Heavens Tear wrote: »

But that depends on a few factors I don't really know:
-Is it affected by attack levels? Since the damage seems to come from very short summons. Yes
-Are all hits affected by lucky break? Or just the first? Or none at all? No
-Is it affected by Invigorate? No

Answers in red.

Alexis - Lothranis

It's affected by half of your atk lvls, same as pets.

klys

Herpa derp derp. Brilliance: the person who thinks rapid growth changes summon stats, the person who thinks summons are a waste in tw, the person who thinks flying around trees is a legit method to evade archers.

You have NO desire to learn- you post some stupid BS question, or try to give some stupid BS advice, and someone comes along and either answers your question, or calls you out on giving shetty advice- then you continue to respond in contradiction despite the fact that game mechanics go against everything you're saying.
How do you expect people to react to you posting when your methods have not changed? You're too ignorant or troll-like to learn.

You're either spamming to get post count up, or you like to see your self important sob stories about how unique you are littered everywhere.

ovenusarmanio

closed at the request of the OP