why pdef sux

deadwieght

im r9rr +6'ish. for a mod posting on an archer forum u either suck on ur archer or have never played one. as i posted before....r9rr psy or wizzies. the rest dont matter. and in an evasion build u actually have more magic defence then if u use the standard r9 ring and sky cover and g14 cube neck pdef neck.

my toon is currently unsharded except maybe 4 flawless citrines. i die to 3-4 clerics on my server (if their sleep works, elven alacrity). venos...u must be joking right? and mystics i know of 4 on my server that worth more than 3 arrows. so again, what am unprotected against? oh thats right...i alrdy told you.

decent amount of dex? do you have no idea that accuracy comes mostly from the two rings? even then it maxes around 10k-12k. dex. plz have the max 800 dex an archer can currently get and come try to hit an evasion build without the two ring. your 4800 accuracy will miss 84% of the time.

and to the 100% accuracy skills i think alrdy explained that. i did forget to mention seekers tho. they do a nice combo including a 100% accuracy skill (i think) and that is a tough one to avoid.

opkossy

You're unprotected against anything that meets the following two conditions.

1: Has a brain.
2: Is equal to (or obviously greater than) your gear level.



And the fact that literally every archer here that has plenty of experience and has actually done the math to have concrete numbers proving their experience is telling you this simply shows that you're the only one here with no clue what you're talking about.


Oh and http://pwcalc.com/5f44d03c588ada65 blows your archer out of the water with two, MAYBE three auto-attacks. Your evasion isn't going to do anything against anyone that's either in endgame gear or knows how to play. This is non-debatle fact.

Irca - Harshlands

OPKossy wrote: »

And the fact that literally every archer here that has plenty of experience and has actually done the math

this He has a very very good point in this sentence right here.

WnbTank - Archosaur

I find it amusing how completely clueless you are. I dont want to see the clerics on your server if you dont consider them a threat. Any even close to similarly geared compared to the pwicalc archer would 1shot said archer with plume shot.

As for kiting barbs? Yes, barbs can be kited though killing similarly geared barb really are going to get hit. For that build similar sage barb would run towards you in tiger with 36k+ hp, over 100 defense levels if using O`Malleys, add another 20 defense levels if he is weapon swapper and uses R8r hammer for closing in and never forget 9.0+ m/s. Oh yeah, such barb has no added vit = gonna hit like a freaking truck with those 100% accuracy skills.

So lets be serious, you arent going to solo that barb w/o purging even if its only selfbuffed barb. So what do you have? Aim Low and stunning arrow. Barb got 18m range skill which will lock you down for 8 seconds and never misses. Lets assume you fly when barb gets close? No you dont, the new morai skill:

"Attack all enemies within 20 meters of the target, dealing 120% of base physical damage.
Has a chance to knock flying enemies to the ground and prevent them from flying for 30 seconds.
You deal triple damage to targets in the air. The chance to ground opponents is approximately 80%.
The minimum success rate is 60% and the maximum success rate is 100%.
100 percent accuracy."

I first forgot this skill was also 100% accuracy. But ultimately this skill dmg is 1.2 times whatever is shown in C screen. You are in air, you take triple damage. R999+12 wep str barb has over 20k average damage on C screen. So on air, 3x 20k = 60k / ( 1 / 4 ) [PvP reduction] = 15k non crit/zerk. Such barb also has 20%+ crit, 20% chance for zerk. either happens, you get 1shot. On average such barb either zerks or crits 36% of the time. Just barb getting high end number for his attack is enough for the 1shot too, which I find incredibly funny.

Not to forget barb simply combining spark with ancestral rage can 1shot the pwicalc archer from 18m range. Yeah, barb totally never gets close to archer <.<. Its only true if archer outgears barbs heavily. Well I suppose you can stun barb from 30m range and holypath away but no, if you want to also kill the barb, not getting hit is plain absurd with equal gear.

Oh yeah, add in group PK and any ranged lock from enemy = barb is on you and gets "free" shot in, which results into 1shot archer way too damn often if he/she uses the build from pwicalc.

Ps. It doesnt matter jack **** if accuracy comes from rings, fact is they are common even among non R9 toons, R9 toon w/o is something pretty weird.

Hannsel - Dreamweaver

the op reminds us of demontroll

why hasn't this been closed yet?

Typhyse - Sanctuary

Hannsel - Dreamweaver wrote: »

the op reminds us of demontroll

why hasn't this been closed yet?

I kinda miss him. Yeah, this guy must be the offspring of Demon_troll and Morty (old assassin who paraded evasion/accuracy/'super dex build' in assassin sub-forum long ago).

kenpachikensai

Valirah - Sanctuary wrote: »

Your argument is ridiculous. You site examples that have been refined to +12, yet your point is frugality? The refines are the major cost concern, not the base item. Why spend good coin refining a ****?

WnbTank - Archosaur wrote: »

Barbs dont have 1 but 2 100% accuracy skills(One in both forms), 3 if you are demon like mine(+1 in human). Actually we got another 100% accuracy skill as chrono page skill(Tiger), hits like effing truck too with 18m range, 1min cd though. But I wouldnt count on every single barb having that skill.

"Within the range of 18 meters, let out a violent strike that
deals 200% of base damage to the target, immobilizing them
for 8 seconds. 100 percent accuracy."

R9 barbs can be counted on having that chrono page skill and honestly, R9 demon barb with 4 100% accuracy skills can just troll, WC flame, fool around and still kill that archer build. If you want to burn money and be easy kill for R9+ barb, I really cant think of a build which would give you better conditions for it. Heck, combining it with spark and there is a good chance it will 1shot the archer, as long as gear is somewhat similar.

Walpurga - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Congrats

you just put $20+K into a build with pdef equivalent to a TT90 with +3/5 pdef orns

now enjoy being oneshot by wizards anyways

now enjoy 3rd cast BMs hitting you for 15K with smack

oh and did I mention I get 24K evasion from condor yet get hit through it all the time by r9+ archers/sins autoattacking?

OH AND YOU'RE GOING TO SAVE MONEY BY GOING FULL R9T3 +12 WITH A 2nd CAST NW TOME? And completely disregard 30 ATK level bonus from R9T3 belt?

rofl

please don't do this and take away valuable ambers from non-aps barbs who need it for their weapons

EDIT: and of course you completely guard yourself against 1/2 of the classes in the game and leave your undefended, 43 def level (less if using jones) backside open to be ****ed by the other half

Going for the TT99 belt also makes you lose out on a whooping 30 atk levels on that build

coupled with the fact that it will cost $20K+

save money my ***

LMFAO! to be fair to the OP, this was my pwcalc link and was not meant to be taken seriously. but apparently it did. b:laughb:victoryb:thanks

deadwieght

http://pwcalc.com/34cf61ba6f81845c

tweaked it a little, just for giggles

Algiz - Dreamweaver

Heartz - Dreamweaver wrote: »

I'm ashamed to be in this guys faction. he even posted it on faction forum.. sigh..

I've always refrained from calling him out, i respect his choice wanting to have a special/unique build. But damn this time I actually think he has been smoking something - well I HOPE, cos if not I would gladly give him a sign above his head " Hello world, I'm noob" -- above faction/wedding title...

*bucket of ice cold water in his face*

you and Tempest have my condolences Heartz b:shutup

kenpachikensai

deadwieght wrote: »

http://pwcalc.com/34cf61ba6f81845c

tweaked it a little, just for giggles

uh, did you forget to save yours? cause the exact link of mines -.-

Badazmofo - Dreamweaver

Im going to be honest... im kind of sad to share the same class as anyone who thinks evasion is worth a damn.... Ever popped condor and gotten hit by a wizzy swinging its sword? Its kind of embaraseing to think that even after being told you are wrong through out 4+ pages of posts that you continue to argue your right.

You want cost effective? Get a tt90 gold neck and the OHT belt. Theres cost effective and it even gives you more defences and hp than your suggestion.

Omnicon - Dreamweaver

Says the one using a physical defense necklace and partially sharded in cits.

Tell ya what, try that idea of yours and see ya in Nation Wars bub.

Sint - Harshlands

WnbTank - Archosaur wrote: »

Barbs dont have 1 but 2 100% accuracy skills(One in both forms), 3 if you are demon like mine(+1 in human). Actually we got another 100% accuracy skill as chrono page skill(Tiger), hits like effing truck too with 18m range, 1min cd though. But I wouldnt count on every single barb having that skill.

"Within the range of 18 meters, let out a violent strike that
deals 200% of base damage to the target, immobilizing them
for 8 seconds. 100 percent accuracy."

R9 barbs can be counted on having that chrono page skill and honestly, R9 demon barb with 4 100% accuracy skills can just troll, WC flame, fool around and still kill that archer build. If you want to burn money and be easy kill for R9+ barb, I really cant think of a build which would give you better conditions for it. Heck, combining it with spark and there is a good chance it will 1shot the archer, as long as gear is somewhat similar.

He didn't post that himself, though. If you can't think of a build that would give you better conditions for losing to a barb, you're an imbecile. Any MDEF or EVA mage would outperform him at that. So would MDEF archers, and AA melee classes.

WnbTank - Archosaur wrote: »

I find it amusing how completely clueless you are. I dont want to see the clerics on your server if you dont consider them a threat. Any even close to similarly geared compared to the pwicalc archer would 1shot said archer with plume shot.

As for kiting barbs? Yes, barbs can be kited though killing similarly geared barb really are going to get hit. For that build similar sage barb would run towards you in tiger with 36k+ hp, over 100 defense levels if using O`Malleys, add another 20 defense levels if he is weapon swapper and uses R8r hammer for closing in and never forget 9.0+ m/s. Oh yeah, such barb has no added vit = gonna hit like a freaking truck with those 100% accuracy skills.

So lets be serious, you arent going to solo that barb w/o purging even if its only selfbuffed barb. So what do you have? Aim Low and stunning arrow. Barb got 18m range skill which will lock you down for 8 seconds and never misses. Lets assume you fly when barb gets close? No you dont, the new morai skill:

"Attack all enemies within 20 meters of the target, dealing 120% of base physical damage.
Has a chance to knock flying enemies to the ground and prevent them from flying for 30 seconds.
You deal triple damage to targets in the air. The chance to ground opponents is approximately 80%.
The minimum success rate is 60% and the maximum success rate is 100%.
100 percent accuracy."

I first forgot this skill was also 100% accuracy. But ultimately this skill dmg is 1.2 times whatever is shown in C screen. You are in air, you take triple damage. R999+12 wep str barb has over 20k average damage on C screen. So on air, 3x 20k = 60k / ( 1 / 4 ) [PvP reduction] = 15k non crit/zerk. Such barb also has 20%+ crit, 20% chance for zerk. either happens, you get 1shot. On average such barb either zerks or crits 36% of the time. Just barb getting high end number for his attack is enough for the 1shot too, which I find incredibly funny.

Not to forget barb simply combining spark with ancestral rage can 1shot the pwicalc archer from 18m range. Yeah, barb totally never gets close to archer <.<. Its only true if archer outgears barbs heavily. Well I suppose you can stun barb from 30m range and holypath away but no, if you want to also kill the barb, not getting hit is plain absurd with equal gear.

Oh yeah, add in group PK and any ranged lock from enemy = barb is on you and gets "free" shot in, which results into 1shot archer way too damn often if he/she uses the build from pwicalc.

Ps. It doesnt matter jack **** if accuracy comes from rings, fact is they are common even among non R9 toons, R9 toon w/o is something pretty weird.

Why do you insist on writing a wall of text to show us all you're dumb enough to get trolled by this? You're getting to the same conclusions all of us reached 5 pages ago, and you're trying to look like you invented hot water because you are. There is no need to write a retardedly lenghty post about this, and your wall of text serves no purpose, other than making you look like a moron (you are accomplishing this admireably). We all play Archers here, many of us on PvP servers, so please, refrain from telling all of us what we all already know.


Still kills 95% of all players on any server: http://pwcalc.com/04c991e4f65169cd

my 2 cents.

WnbTank - Archosaur

Sint - Harshlands wrote: »

He didn't post that himself, though. If you can't think of a build that would give you better conditions for losing to a barb, you're an imbecile. Any MDEF or EVA mage would outperform him at that. So would MDEF archers, and AA melee classes.

And I thought this was Archer forums, *shrugs*. Looking at the absurdness of builds you come up with it was quite clearly pretty absurd build against class it would of supposed to be most efficient. As for Mag.def sharding? Does nothing for physical damage, true, but I would still take it over evasion sharding, which really doesnt do anything against barbs either.

Sint - Harshlands wrote: »

Why do you insist on writing a wall of text to show us all you're dumb enough to get trolled by this? You're getting to the same conclusions all of us reached 5 pages ago, and you're trying to look like you invented hot water because you are. There is no need to write a retardedly lenghty post about this, and your wall of text serves no purpose, other than making you look like a moron (you are accomplishing this admireably). We all play Archers here, many of us on PvP servers, so please, refrain from telling all of us what we all already know.


Still kills 95% of all players on any server: http://pwcalc.com/04c991e4f65169cd

my 2 cents.

Silly me thought you were supposed to base your arguments on something, while all along you were supposed to throw in few one liners. I have always written in length explaining why I come to conclusions I come and I really couldnt care less what you think of it. I do find it quite amusing just who do you think read these forums. Yes, 10 players whom post most on this subforum, discounting trolls, quite likely know a lot bout this game. They really arent the only ones reading it though, likely a small minority as it always surprises me just how many silent readers forums have.

bolocactu

WnbTank - Archosaur wrote: »

And I thought this was Archer forums, *shrugs*. Looking at the absurdness of builds you come up with it was quite clearly pretty absurd build against class it would of supposed to be most efficient. As for Mag.def sharding? Does nothing for physical damage, true, but I would still take it over evasion sharding, which really doesnt do anything against barbs either.



Silly me thought you were supposed to base your arguments on something, while all along you were supposed to throw in few one liners. I have always written in length explaining why I come to conclusions I come and I really couldnt care less what you think of it. I do find it quite amusing just who do you think read these forums. Yes, 10 players whom post most on this subforum, discounting trolls, quite likely know a lot bout this game. They really arent the only ones reading it though, likely a small minority as it always surprises me just how many silent readers forums have.

my build http://pwcalc.com/36a2ba5c02504003

elekar

kenpachikensai wrote: »

http://pwcalc.com/34cf61ba6f81845c ijs...

b:dirtyb:dirty the worse isaw a pair of neackles like that whit that refine on archo b:laugh on a bm tho b:surrender

Troll_demon - Harshlands

i worry about damage and attack speed more than pdef, better kill faster as it best defense there. archer gets lowest pdef and evasion dont work anyway ;/ so why even bother?

Artymis - Dreamweaver

deadwieght wrote: »

i venos...u must be joking right?

i hope you know what you said here you are on my permanent pos list just 'cause it'll be funny killing you (not that you really deserve 1 tho :x)

b:cute

Decus - Dreamweaver

I wish this thread would get closed. It's just a blight on this sub-forum, kinda like that other dude that talks about using a sling, demon spark, and frenzy all the time.

Walpurga - Dreamweaver

You mean demon troll or troll demon or whatever?

I just kind of ignore him lol

XLoveDovex - Harshlands

ok so, just in sake of im not reading all of the responces. dodge is trash, only a moron will use it for one, a crit cannot be dodged, and magic don't miss. so hey if you're an archer and trying to die...with the swiftness then more power to you. but you need a mix of hp and defences yes the cube neck is pricey but um..go farm for it? ya know thats a possability just saying. pdef is one of your best friends, because a sin or bm that uses dags or fists is going to ** you up if you don't time your skills properly without pdef. yes they can do a small amount of magical dmg ofc but there dps pdmg spam is whats going to kill you. i've been playing since pw-cn so in sake of arguements I've been around since the closed beta I know a thing or two.

skaitavia

I'm not sure why this hasn't been closed yet, as both the original poster and others were throwing insults at one another, even while at a mod.

~closed.