g16 for pve?

abcssdaa

so like i have a g16+12 dagger , and i don't know what set to go for if i pvp. Should i go for a rank 9 set for the atk / def lvls ( although i need the dagger for the full set bonus )or should i go for a full g16 set? also will getting an r9 dagger make a big diff? and is it worth it goin for that since i already have my g16s

My g16 daggers are bound since i made em from TT so yeah ><

EDIT: i was meant to write pvp instead of pve lol

Sirrobert - Dreamweaver

If you had ever seen PvP, you would not need to ask this.

abcssdaa

still new to pvp so i don't know. anyway yeah, whatever advice you guys can give would be appreciated

Sirrobert - Dreamweaver

And that's the problem
Even with +12 G16 daggers you are to cicken to enter PvP mode.

If you do go in PvP, you'll probably never leave stealth until you see an unbuffed caster that's afk

abcssdaa

its not that I'm too chicken, its that i want advice on what better gear to use than the normal 'aps set'. I still pvp here and there but id like to be able to tank a lil more. anyway what you're saying is irrelevant to the topic, I'm just asking about gear advice not about wether I'm too chicken to pvp or not -.-

Sirrobert - Dreamweaver

Go read a guide, watch a PvP video, TRY IT

Buff_me - Raging Tide

G16 for pvp is cool, coz it doesnt eat ur hp with GoF and have almost same average dmg as R9. I would say, if you already have your G16 +12, get some shards and refines on armor and stay with aps set, since G16 with skill spam set is pretty pointless to make. But R9 still is the best setup for pvp on sin

truekossy

Buff_me - Raging Tide wrote: »

G16 for pvp is cool, coz it doesnt eat ur hp with GoF and have almost same average dmg as R9. I would say, if you already have your G16 +12, get some shards and refines on armor and stay with aps set, since G16 with skill spam set is pretty pointless to make. But R9 still is the best setup for pvp on sin

GoF is not a negative in PvP.

Buff_me - Raging Tide

truekossy wrote: »

GoF is not a negative in PvP.

Yeah, actually i am little wrong, its more negative in pve with low refines, then in pvp

abcssdaa

cool thanks for the advice

_Skai_ - Raging Tide

G16 daggers are good for solid damage in PvP, but R9 dagger's GoF makes a lot of difference.

abcssdaa

yeah thats what i was thinking, so i don't know if i should go for r9 or not.. that was basically what i wanted to know lol, cause i know r9 makes a huge diff with the gof, but i already have my daggers at +12 so.. would you think it'd be worth it to go for it?, could probably use r9 for pk and g16 for pve but still, just wanted your thoughts on this. The armour is of course a nice bonus but for the daggers as buff said it wouldn't do as good in skill spamming pvp

Sakubatou - Sanctuary

G16 daggers in PvP will hit harder than r9 daggers 80% of the time. You just won't have the spike damage 20% of the time. Since yours are +12 and G16 refines better than r9 I'd prefer the G16. Zerks are great, and zerk crits even better, but Sins really don't need them to win in pk. Especially if they're hitting weaker 80% of the time. Stay with G16 +12, r9 aren't worth it.

And G16 vs R9 armor. G16 will give you more defense and hp, R9 will give you more defense and attack levels. I'd say r9 wins for an LA class, especially one based off of killing before the other person can kill you first.

Play around with pwcalc and you'll find a good combo of R9 and G16 thats better than either single one.

I_sage_i - Harshlands

for pvp r9 is best even though you allready have +12 g16 daggers they will perform nicely in pvp but i still think nothing beats a zerk crict :P zerk cricts help alot when ur fighting a bm or a barb

abcssdaa

thanks for the replies, i really appreciate your thoughts, so as for now the best thing would be to go for a mix of r9 and g16? i suppose i could eventually get into the r9 dags later on( a lot later on b:chuckle ) since id have the ring why not go for the weapon too right? id love some zerk/zerk crits but i suppose i could hold that off for now lol :P.

_Skai_ - Raging Tide

Well Saku that depends if they're going for full r9 or not, as the 6th piece set bonus is 20 attack levels, effectively putting r9 daggers at a 50 base attack level rating, which is greater than that of g16.

Azzazin - Dreamweaver

How often does a sin zerk crit one shot a bm or a barb? Almost never. If you are a dps build, saying 'zerk crit' is the reason r9 should be chosen over g16 is utter nonsense. There is a very good reason why r9 should be chosen, but zerk crits is NOT it.

The #1 reason to choose r9 is because of the +2 range. That means that important skills like deep sting and rib strike get bumped up to 4.5meter range, and your normal attacks are also all at 4.5meter range. I use g16 all the time, (I keep a pair of tt99 with +2 range handy for when I need the range), and the +2 range helps a ton. Examples of where the range is useful:

-hitting a bm or barb outside of their attack range with auto attacks
-teleporting (not stun) to somebody who is moving, and managing to hit them with deep sting before they are out of range (impossible for 2.5 range daggers)
-hitting somebody who didn't jump quite high enough into air before you tele stunned or occult iced them with auto attacks from ground
-in sin vs. sin fights, the +2 range is huge advantage over a sin who doesn't have it; having been on the wrong end of that matchup many times, I can attest to the advantage the +2 range gives.

The #2 and LESSER reason is for the spike damage. The spike damage is that random factor which sometimes ends fights early. However, it is not necessary on an aps build, as I can also attest to, after having switched from g15 zerk daggers to g16 daggers. An interesting fact about the g16 daggers is that your normal crits hit really hard with chill of the deep in; hard enough to one shot a lot of arcanes and some light armor peoples.

However, the people with armor weak enough to die from a random zerk crit (while say, auto attacking), are definitely easy enough to kill without NEEDING the zerk crit. If a target has 8k hp and you zerk crit for 10k, it'd still take only a mere second or 2 of dps to kill said target who takes that sort of damage... not difficult to manage. As well, the higher defense and hp targets (full jades r9s, bms, barbs, seekers) simply don't die to any sort of zerk crit unless they are debuffed to hell and purged (lol). In cases such as those, the superior dps of g16 is an advantage.

Of course, none of this applies to sage full r9 sins, for whom zerk crits are the whole essence of how they fight (dph mode).

Full r9 is gonna be better for you than full g16; if you are going full r9 OR g16, you lose your interval; and if you are losing your interval, that means you'll be fighting dph style (skill-spamming). That means, you definitely want the spike damage from zerk crit, no two ways about it. Thus, you need r9 armor set, not g16, should you choose to adopt the dph style.

Points in favor of dph style:
-great survivability against everybody (assuming you have jades, which you SHOULD)
-good advantage over aps sins
-good in tw

Points against dph style:
-more difficulty killing super well geared targets (high def/hp bms, barbs, seekers especially)
-have to watch their chi more carefully (relative to dps sins)

Cheers,

Azzazin

abcssdaa

thank you for the awesome replies, i just have 1 last question.. do you think my daggers would be good for skill spamming? i know r9 are way better for the cause of gof but yeah ><

_Skai_ - Raging Tide

Yeah they'll be sufficient enough. Though as Azzazin stated, the +2 range makes a huge difference in PvP. That was the main reason I went r9.

Skill spamming with what you have right now does better DPS/DPH than regular R9 (not full R9) daggers 80% of the time (as Saku stated), but lacks the range. When full R9 comes into play, the R9 daggers overpower the T3 Nirvana.

R9, without the full set, does a lot more damage than T3 Nirvana 20% of the time, and when combined with full R9 (or even combined with 4 pieces of the set), it does more.