New BH bosses Aba/SoT

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Comments

  • Sakubatou - Sanctuary
    Sakubatou - Sanctuary Posts: 4,001 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    Xainou - Sanctuary wrote: »
    How is it selfish to get more people an opportunity to get books via bh versus the ones who got a sin who can solo the cave...?

    My point wasn't really to call you selfish, it was that you shouldn't be calling him selfish for wanting to make money farming books. But to answer your question it can be considered selfish to want to take away his market so that you can get your books for less money.

    And as for squad diversity, no BH requires aps. The only one that comes close is metal since he hits harder the long he takes to kill. However casters can easily kill him since if a caster tanks he only does ranged magic attacks which don't hit too hard against AA (links 50 cleric, psy, and wizzy videos soloing Metal).

    The new bosses actually require a more specific squad set. Aba is best done with high dd and killing before he buffs, so many squads now want 2 sins and a bm I've noticed. Much more aps preference for Aba now than there was before. Seat requires a high hp char with decent pdef. Even my 11k hp bm has trouble with him, same with my 12k hp seeker. I've seen just about every class tank him, but any class not HA has had to be r9 or G16 so the gear elitism is much higher now or you require a barb. The only classes that have really taken a jump in being prefered is veno for purges and "we need a barb."

    Don't get me wrong, I like the new techniques the bosses have. I just don't think they solved aps preference or created much more diversity. No one wants an archer for soloing towers in Aba, they just want a barb and a veno for boss now instead.

    One thing they have solved is people needing wine for every BH cave.

    Oh, and I like not having Mountain Finger on the way in BH aba. I hated that cave because every BH you either had a sin who would straight stealth to Finger and solo while the rest of us cleared, or you would have a person or two head towards the tower (somehow, I normally got stuck soloing on my bm) and 3-4 people going straight for Tower to get the drops. Even though he wasn't required for BH. That always irked me and created a little confrontation.

    What was this thread about again? Oh! Should the new BH bosses drop books! I think they should, just to add incentive to doing the BH and working with a squad. Many people ignore BH, as a result some lose the ability to perform in a squad. I think BH is an excellent time to practice squad dynamics and improve your abilities. Nothing improves my technique more than running with an idiot who causes alot of Osht! moments. Even if it is a pain sometimes its the funnest part of a BH.
    Seven 100+ characters leveled the hard way. Free to play. Mystic, Psychic, and Wizard left to level. b:victory
  • Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear
    Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear Posts: 2,385 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    Miugre - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Way to bring PVP into this when the entire thread is about PVE boss drops.

    How is that PVP... if I spend 10x the amount that you did... i better get 10x the benefit as you would in BOTH pvp and pve. While I understand that it probably doesn't scale up in a linear fashion. I am pretty adamant that i am getting more out of "it" then people who spent less then me in BOTH pvp and pve.
    Miugre - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    It's easy to say everyone else is entitled if you're the person who can farm the same boss a hundred times faster than a person without your particular advantage. :P Even more so if you can solo the boss and not have to split the drops six ways. Maybe if today's aps farmers chose to run with normal squads and split the drops evenly despite their gear, this whole "entitlement" argument would hold more water.

    No problem... spend 5k gold gearing up your character and i'll gladly run with you. Don't think I ever at any point recouped the amount of gold that I spent on my archer/sin in terms of drop earnings. If I am spending 100 or even 10x more then you are... I better be entitled to a bigger piece of pie.
    1. If I kill you; do something about it yourself, don't go complaining to my wife.
    2. If you have less kill counts then me, don't expect me to take pk advice from you.
    3. If you are hiding behind an alt, don't expect me to acknowledge your existence.

    Tokichiro - Heavy Armor Fish / Kiyoshi - Dual Blade Elf
  • Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973
    Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973 Posts: 7,881 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    The new BH bosses actually drop quite a lot. I think on 2x I was getting around 300k worth of random gear to NPC which is plenty considering it only takes a few minutes to do the BH.
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  • Miugre - Heavens Tear
    Miugre - Heavens Tear Posts: 2,390 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    How is that PVP... if I spend 10x the amount that you did... i better get 10x the benefit as you would in BOTH pvp and pve. While I understand that it probably doesn't scale up in a linear fashion. I am pretty adamant that i am getting more out of "it" then people who spent less then me in BOTH pvp and pve.

    No problem... spend 5k gold gearing up your character and i'll gladly run with you. Don't think I ever at any point recouped the amount of gold that I spent on my archer/sin in terms of drop earnings. If I am spending 100 or even 10x more then you are... I better be entitled to a bigger piece of pie.
    You're not entitled to jack. Nobody is. If you want to spend $5k on a video game just to pretend you're awesome, that's your prerogative. But the minute the devs decide to change anything about the game, you've got no more say in it than anyone else. P2W doesn't mean pay-to-influence-the-devs (especially not our devs who virtually never hear anything we say here anyway). So if they changed the BH boss to drop books one day? Tough ****. You can whine about entitlements all you like, but in the end all you'll be doing is putting yourself on the pile of complainers you apparently hate so much.

    Look, I understand you've got this whole social darwinism thing going on, and if you want to embrace the pay-to-win mentality, I'm not stopping you. But you've got to realize you are severely, severely in the minority by doing so. Pretty much no sensible person would embrace that kind of game design. Y'know what spending 5k gold should entitle you to do? The same runs and the same drops as anyone else. "Why would anyone spend 5k gold then," you ask? Good question. Maybe if you couldn't buy endgame gear in the CS in the first place, we wouldn't have this problem. :P Still doesn't mean there's an entitlement, though.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Yes, I'm still a stubborn holdout in favor of the old game. Haters gonna hate. ;]

    Other Active Characters:
    LigerKing (Barb), Girasole (BM), Shamsheer (Sin), ArborSoul (Mystic).
  • Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear
    Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear Posts: 2,385 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    Miugre - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    You're not entitled to jack. Nobody is.

    You might not think I am entitled to anything... I agree with you. But I am also not the one complaining about not getting drops. As far as I an concerned... I am getting everything I need in game... with little to no time constraints. In that aspect... i am entitled.
    Miugre - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    If you want to spend $5k on a video game just to pretend you're awesome, that's your prerogative. But the minute the devs decide to change anything about the game, you've got no more say in it than anyone else.

    So I guess I got to cut back on a few lunches. Of course I got not more say then anyone else when/if pwi decides to change anything. PWI comes out with packs... I got pack gear. PWI put rep in packs... I got r8. PWI puts r9 on sale... I get r9. Don't really see the problem here.
    Miugre - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    P2W doesn't mean pay-to-influence-the-devs (especially not our devs who virtually never hear anything we say here anyway). So if they changed the BH boss to drop books one day? Tough ****. You can whine about entitlements all you like, but in the end all you'll be doing is putting yourself on the pile of complainers you apparently hate so much.

    Who cares what PWI changes the drop rate to. I tank my own bh before and after the change. PWI add books to the drop table... I get books on my solo run. Not sure what there is to whine about.
    Miugre - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Y'know what spending 5k gold should entitle you to do? The same runs and the same drops as anyone else. "Why would anyone spend 5k gold then," you ask? Good question.

    Of course spending n amount of money doesn't entitle me to additional or special runs... it just gets my run done faster. Kind of just like vip tickets... no need to wait in that 5 hour line... I get to move to the front. People spend the gold to get stuff done faster... simple enough.
    Miugre - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Maybe if you couldn't buy endgame gear in the CS in the first place, we wouldn't have this problem. :P Still doesn't mean there's an entitlement, though.

    Who cares if end game gear is in cs or not. Before anni packs ever came out... I was already one of the better geared archers... with my TT90/99. After packs and gear... I am still one of the better geared archers. Nothing really changed.
    1. If I kill you; do something about it yourself, don't go complaining to my wife.
    2. If you have less kill counts then me, don't expect me to take pk advice from you.
    3. If you are hiding behind an alt, don't expect me to acknowledge your existence.

    Tokichiro - Heavy Armor Fish / Kiyoshi - Dual Blade Elf
  • Miugre - Heavens Tear
    Miugre - Heavens Tear Posts: 2,390 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    You might not think I am entitled to anything... I agree with you. But I am also not the one complaining about not getting drops. As far as I an concerned... I am getting everything I need in game... with little to no time constraints. In that aspect... i am entitled.
    Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Who cares what PWI changes the drop rate to. I tank my own bh before and after the change. PWI add books to the drop table... I get books on my solo run. Not sure what there is to whine about.
    Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Of course spending n amount of money doesn't entitle me to additional or special runs... it just gets my run done faster. Kind of just like vip tickets... no need to wait in that 5 hour line... I get to move to the front. People spend the gold to get stuff done faster... simple enough.
    So now you're telling me that you don't care about what drops books or not? Is that it? So you wouldn't be at all bothered by the fact that, if the new bosses dropped books, those books would increase in supply and you (or whoever does this) would be making less of a profit from your solo runs?

    I'm glad you agree, then. The note you entered this thread on seemed to suggest otherwise, though. "Oh, just make a sin or don't complain." :P
    Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    So I guess I got to cut back on a few lunches. Of course I got not more say then anyone else when/if pwi decides to change anything. PWI comes out with packs... I got pack gear. PWI put rep in packs... I got r8. PWI puts r9 on sale... I get r9. Don't really see the problem here.
    Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Who cares if end game gear is in cs or not. Before anni packs ever came out... I was already one of the better geared archers... with my TT90/99. After packs and gear... I am still one of the better geared archers. Nothing really changed.
    Nothing except that, what was once accessible through good old-fashioned dilligence running with common squads, is not so accessible today. The barriers to entry for acquiring what many (or certainly you) would consider proper endgame gear are drastically higher than they were before packs. Your TT99 gear wouldn't have afforded you nearly the kind of farming advantages that your r9/aps gears do today. So you can wear whatever you like in order to call yourself better geared, but don't pretend it's not broken in comparison to what came before it.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Yes, I'm still a stubborn holdout in favor of the old game. Haters gonna hate. ;]

    Other Active Characters:
    LigerKing (Barb), Girasole (BM), Shamsheer (Sin), ArborSoul (Mystic).
  • Empu - Sanctuary
    Empu - Sanctuary Posts: 1,154 Arc User
    edited October 2012
    Sakubatou - Sanctuary wrote: »
    The new bosses actually require a more specific squad set. Aba is best done with high dd and killing before he buffs, so many squads now want 2 sins and a bm I've noticed. Much more aps preference for Aba now than there was before. Seat requires a high hp char with decent pdef. Even my 11k hp bm has trouble with him, same with my 12k hp seeker. I've seen just about every class tank him, but any class not HA has had to be r9 or G16 so the gear elitism is much higher now or you require a barb. The only classes that have really taken a jump in being prefered is veno for purges and "we need a barb."

    Don't get me wrong, I like the new techniques the bosses have. I just don't think they solved aps preference or created much more diversity. No one wants an archer for soloing towers in Aba, they just want a barb and a veno for boss now instead.

    Actually, I think most of the "must haves *insert random class*" and "best tactics" seem to be left overs from the "need 5 aps for everyting" periode. I agree it didn't solve the aps preference, mainly because (imo) ppl became so obsessed with it that they will always search for a way to do it most efficiently based on aps. As for needing HA to tank bosses (unless it's r9/G16 +10), I actually find that more then normal really. The "need barb" is (imo) the exact same as wc for ages for a 5 aps +10 or lvl11 amp. Bms with 8k+ hp can tank Seat with 2 healers, but that will be a bit slower because you loose 1 DD spot and in most cases the bm will have a bit less aggro then a barb. Bms with 8k+ hp and physical marrow are easy to find, it's just a pitty many don't have the guts to even try and won't get a few maiden chests for hp-buff pills. Seekers I agree are a bit scr*wed over, as their defence lvls are worthless on the new bh bosses b:laugh

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