HA/AA veno in training

Ripokeke - Sanctuary

Hi all,

I restated my pure mag veno to be able to wear HA. Currently I can wear full AA, and HA with + stats rings, belt and neck. But only tt90. If I want to wear tt99, I need to get a helm with +10 str.

My main concern before restating is my damage output. After restating, I hardly feel much difference for normal pve. As for caster Nirvana, I pass chi to wiz/psy more often if I have extra (after cleric full chi)

Personally, I feel no difference as I'm still using my r8 weapon with 300 mag base stats.

Only problem I'm facing now is my low HP, only 5k in full tt90. (tt90 equips as no money to get tt99 yet)

Need to upgrade to tt99 before refining. I guess that is my only way for higher HP, after sharding. Any advice?

I must say, this build is expensive. Cause u need an AA set, and a HA set. Other than that, u need shards and refines to make up for the HP we lack. Not to mention the stats plus equips.

X_volcano_y - Harshlands

can u pls post a pwcalc i am intersted in seeing ur buildb:dirty

Ripokeke - Sanctuary

X_volcano_y - Harshlands wrote: »

can u pls post a pwcalc i am intersted in seeing ur buildb:dirty

my HA build

http://pwcalc.com/b70d4f919ec79dd1


this morning i still had two dream of reality rings, one with +15 dex and another with +13 dex. but got extra coins so decided to change them. i engraved those +6 str and +6 dex myself, spent around 10mill yet didn't get +7 stats b:sad

i got the helm for 2mill on AH, works better than warsoul of earth (except warsoul earth gives +str) will eventually get helm of holy punishment for +10 str, but that's very long way to go...

so my next course of action is to find a better belt, and slowly change tt90 to tt99...

my AA build

http://pwcalc.com/ec6db4e02d7bd63f

actually can be much better, but i can't wait to get my HA build! so... just have to make do with it. b:chuckle

tons of area for improvements, but currently broke after buying a galactic dolphin for 100mill. well, the coins could be much well spent on gears... but i just want the dolphin!! b:cute

there's still demon purge, malefic crush and lastly parasitic nova spells to get for my full collection of demon spells... b:surrender

Desdi - Sanctuary

Not much to say about the build but I wanted to mention something. It might be better to keep Malefic Crush at level 10.

I know you're probably like me who's obsessed and wants every single skill made demon but I was convinced to keep Malefic Crush as it is. That's because the cooldown at lvl10 is broken and it's 6 seconds (or so) instead of 30 seconds. Once you make it demon, it goes back to how it should be.

You can spam it more that way but your choice :P

X_volcano_y - Harshlands

very nice build and gears but i have a few comments.
first u put 300base magic which i can see uget add a few points into str.
i suggest using warsol helm with ur ha set.
sell ur 2tomes and get a better stable 1.
the cape of elite leather is completly useless to u at this point i suggest either getting a tm cape-the hp one- or keep ur +status1 with AA set
the belt u putted in ur ha set really suck i recommend using the eye of the jungle-lvl40- which will give u 1extra point as well as a nice bunch of hp.
finally u did great i am sure u can get tt99 easily.
and rember u dont have to go extreme all the time u should mix AA/HA so u get a perfect fit and u only have to swap a few pieces depending on the situation.

Ripokeke - Sanctuary

X_volcano_y - Harshlands wrote: »

very nice build and gears but i have a few comments.
first u put 300base magic which i can see uget add a few points into str.
i suggest using warsol helm with ur ha set.
sell ur 2tomes and get a better stable 1.
the cape of elite leather is completly useless to u at this point i suggest either getting a tm cape-the hp one- or keep ur +status1 with AA set
the belt u putted in ur ha set really suck i recommend using the eye of the jungle-lvl40- which will give u 1extra point as well as a nice bunch of hp.
finally u did great i am sure u can get tt99 easily.
and rember u dont have to go extreme all the time u should mix AA/HA so u get a perfect fit and u only have to swap a few pieces depending on the situation.

Thanks for the helpful advice!

I do have a warsoul helm of earth, but it's refined to +4. I tried swapping in and find the phy def drop like 500 points, with not much boost to HP. So I'm currently keeping it in bank until next time.

The cape was from when I was pure AA, still using it for normal pve, I use the tt cape for caster tho.

I'm using the current belt as it's +str and +dex, I'm thinking of re-engraving my +str seal ring until I get +dex too... But that have to wait till I get more expendable coins.
b:surrender

Desdi - Sanctuary wrote: »

Not much to say about the build but I wanted to mention something. It might be better to keep Malefic Crush at level 10.

I know you're probably like me who's obsessed and wants every single skill made demon but I was convinced to keep Malefic Crush as it is. That's because the cooldown at lvl10 is broken and it's 6 seconds (or so) instead of 30 seconds. Once you make it demon, it goes back to how it should be.

You can spam it more that way but your choice :P

Thanks for info! First time I hear this thing... Will go back and have a try on the timerb:chuckle

Raziyal - Archosaur

http://pwcalc.com/8fba58044656872f

My Ha build.

Ignore the magic yes i know theirs a -100 but if their are some smart people i've origanally have 289 magic on my veno (in game) i still need to take off 11 str which i have been lazy to do to get my 300 magic and put my r9 wep on haha! (my tome gives the boosted str i need to tak off 11 magic or more) and since the pwi calc doesn't show engravings i got max engravings on my rings.

Yes teir are still hicups but that build works since i have it just pwi calc doesn't show certain things !!

X_volcano_y - Harshlands

very good gear but wtf a +10luna and archangel ?
i would say if u r rich enough to do a +10 on all gear get urself a cube neck and warsong belt-elemental if u r ha only- those will actually boost ur hp greatly.

Regenbogen - Lost City

just curious your unbuffed base magic attack went from 13k(~500mag) down to 9k(300mag) and you dont see any difference? b:shocked

Sakubatou - Sanctuary

I'd suggest a few things.

~Number one is use magic ornies with an HA build. One of the biggest percs about HA armor is you can refine -channeling ornies and get the benefit of mdef and -channeling. A typical AA veno will carry two sets of ornies, a -channeling for DDing and a pdef set for defense. I usually recommend AAs wear the pdef ornies, but an HA veno can wear the -channeling all the time. Craft some in OHT with -chan and + stats. One way HA venos makeup for less points in magic is we're more available to use -channeling gear for faster/more attacks without it hurting our overall defenses
~Always go for a 2 stat tome, you get more stats. You went for +15 str, but the Adventures and Mishaps tome offers you 17 stat points.
~TT90 is great armor, but it offers you very few +str, +mag, or +dex adds. Its heavy on the +vit, +hp, and + pdef which is nice, just not what you need. G16 is ideal but obviously a ways off.
~Band from Heaven's Jail rings = +14 stats. I'd pick phys rings or magic ring based on your playstyle, though. I still tend to favor magic rings (for +magic attack and +mdef refines) so ultimately you want an endgame caster ring like Sign of Antiquity: Chaos, Cloud Stir, R8, or R9 with a good ring engraving on it like +10 str or magic.
~Aim for G15/G16 helm early. Only 153 str req but offers str and dex.
~If you can't upgrade that belt (search AH) to an mdef with -channeling and +stats then try the Mogwai Belt. Its a free g10 physical quest belt that potentially offers 15-18 stat points in str, dex, and magic. Its kind of a long quest chain that starts with Mysterious Jar quest and goes on about 6 quests.
~Some Morai pieces offer excellent +stats. The Hellblaze Greaves offer 10-12 str, same with the free AA Leggings of Twilight offering 10-12 magic. The G13 Morai pieces can offer even more +stat pieces for very cheap.

truekossy

I wouldn't advise a multi-stat tone until after the majority of gear was dealt with, excluding the obvious pan gu and love up and down. Yes, you get more stat points... but the additional points are in vit and can't be restat into str, dex, or mag. And dealing with that is a primary concern until you've figured out the relative gear you want.

The rest I do agree with overall, though.

Ripokeke - Sanctuary

Sakubatou - Sanctuary wrote: »

I'd suggest a few things.

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~Some Morai pieces offer excellent +stats. The Hellblaze Greaves offer 10-12 str, same with the free AA Leggings of Twilight offering 10-12 magic. The G13 Morai pieces can offer even more +stat pieces for very cheap.

thanks for the good suggestions!

reason i didn't choose Band from heaven's jail because it is a phy ring, i think i will still cast spells for dd even when i'm in HA in future. i believe the two seal rings will be my end-game HA rings cause they add the stats i want. i may replace them after i get everything and have enough stats to get rings without stats plus for better magic attack.

i'm currently saving up cannies for HA tt cape/helm, depending on whichever comes first. i already got the awakened lionheart greaves mold sitting in bank. hoping to get 2 pieces of the set for +900 hp. b:chuckle

as for the belt, i already npced it long ago when the quest first came up. thought it was a useless belt until now... b:cry and yes, i'm checking AH everyday for a better belt, but haven't seen silver chained belt with +str/+dex yet... not too concerned abt -channeling tho as i'm demon, and most spells get reduced cool down or reduced casting for demon books.

i'm not really looking at morai gears as i want HA for server vs server in future. (as in, very long time into the future) this is just a start! i still have a long way to go to be average in HA gear wise...

Regenbogen - Lost City wrote: »

just curious your unbuffed base magic attack went from 13k(~500mag) down to 9k(300mag) and you dont see any difference? b:shocked

yes! thanks for mentioning this. those interested in HA build please read this! b:thanks

i ever made a thread as a AA pure mag build asking for input from HA/LA venos in caster nirvana, as it is my main concern.

i must say my average output drop around 30% from 5k to 3k plus, critical drop from 22k to 17k. BUT from my observation, wiz/psy/mys do an average of 8k damage and critical can go up to 40k...

now after restating from 460 mag to 300 mag, my damage multipler drop from 5.6times to 4times. i now focus more on debuffing and passing chi to clerics and wiz/psy more than sparking myself. which i find the squad perform faster in caster nirvana.

for normal pve, as a pure mag veno i used to have to wait until my herc gets enough hate before i can start casting. and if i critical, i have to run around in circle until my pet gets hate back while hoping i don't get 2 hits and die.

if there is any difference, i must say my herc gets hate back faster. and i have to cast 1-2 times more spells for mob to die. oh! and i use nature grace and boost more often now with reduced mp.

for now, the game play is not much difference for me as i haven't ripe the benefits of HA except for some reduced magic damage (expected down side which frankly speaking, is not such a big difference for veno). which may not be a bad thing too! b:pleased

thumbs

Ripokeke - Sanctuary wrote: »

now after restating from 460 mag to 300 mag, my damage multipler drop from 5.6times to 4times. i now focus more on debuffing and passing chi to clerics and wiz/psy more than sparking myself. which i find the squad perform faster in caster nirvana.

Do you understand: You're just confessing here that you were a fail veno before in the way you played?

for normal pve, as a pure mag veno i used to have to wait until my herc gets enough hate before i can start casting. and if i critical, i have to run around in circle until my pet gets hate back while hoping i don't get 2 hits and die.

There's things like sage soul degeneration, ironwood, and amp that help increase dmg and hate for herc. Also; most mobs can be aggroed from range and killed before they reach you if you have good matk.

for now, the game play is not much difference for me as i haven't ripe the benefits of HA except for some reduced magic damage (expected down side which frankly speaking, is not such a big difference for veno). which may not be a bad thing too! b:pleased

Veno mag dd should be great. Wiz and cleric are the weak sustainable dds.

Ripokeke - Sanctuary

thumbs wrote: »

Do you understand: You're just confessing here that you were a fail veno before in the way you played?



There's things like sage soul degeneration, ironwood, and amp that help increase dmg and hate for herc. Also; most mobs can be aggroed from range and killed before they reach you if you have good matk.



Veno mag dd should be great. Wiz and cleric are the weak sustainable dds.

umm... thanks for ur input and stating ur POV, but i stand by my view that venos are great debuffers and average nukers in general (i only played veno for so many years). yes, we can be great nukers with OP gears but after seeing R9 venos in caster... i gave up on pure mag build. b:sad

if u need to debuff normal pve mobs... i highly suspect ur mag attack is worse than mine b:embarrass

i'm not sure wat makes u think wizards are weak dds, but i'm currently leveling and alt wiz and cleric for fun. i hope to see wat u said are true, that they are really weak "sustainable" dds? not too sure wat that means, but i gather u mean they are weak...

b:cute

SashaGray - Heavens Tear

thumbs wrote: »

Do you understand: You're just confessing here that you were a fail veno before in the way you played?

There's things like sage soul degeneration, ironwood, and amp that help increase dmg and hate for herc. Also; most mobs can be aggroed from range and killed before they reach you if you have good matk.

how you are using "herc" as a point of argument at this point is mind-boggling

http://pwcalc.com/a5601fbc51042cbb

all ornaments/chest/wrist can be swapped out for chan gear.

the only reason i still have a herc is because i cant sell it.

Veno mag dd should be great. Wiz and cleric are the weak sustainable dds.

yeah, wizards crappy DD. can i buy drugs from you?

Sakubatou - Sanctuary

Having built a pure AA veno and played better geared friends venos, I can tell you they never reach the same nukeness of a wiz or a psy, or even a seeker, but they about average the same as a cleric.. I agree with you Ripo, Venos are mediocre nukers and great debuffers as a pure build. The amazing thing is as an HA build... they're still mediocre nukers and great debuffers, they're just less squishy and no one has to worry about them then.

btw Thumbs, OP is a demon veno. And if we're talking about sage SD, its 20% hp in 2.7 seconds to cast and I assume even a herc can knock of 20% hp in that time on mobs. Amp will help DDs grab aggro off of hercs.

Hercs aren't as important for HA venos anyways though. We're both our DD and our own tank.

Honestly, I'm probably gonna mix AA and HA all the time and do less of a HA build and an AA build. The goal is 400 mag from G16 pieces and G16 swords.

Another piece of advice, Lunar pieces have higher base defenses and give fox form more to multiply. Not that it matters when you go G16, though.

Mayfly - Dreamweaver

My current heavy gear

My arcane set is nothing to really write home about, being mostly OHT 2*, plus the 60 rank top. Once I get the last couple of Morai Heavy pieces I'll work on getting the Morai arcane set.

MANray_ - Sanctuary

As much as I hate the manners of a certain poster, and I hope no one sees this as taking his side, there is a point to be made for optimizing damage output. Perhaps, and for very practical reasons, we have all been too keen to focus on a veno's contribution to a squad's full damage figures and have to some extent neglected direct comparisons. I disagree with the idea of veno as a mediocre nuker, and this is when compared to same geared casters in other classes. As the troll often points out himself a veno's spark provides an enormous advantage. I would add to this that amp gains should be considered as part of a veno's nominal dps and that for long enough fights even the mind break effect of myriads could be factored in. Yes, in terms of spike damage it would go against all empyrical evidence to consider a venomancer on par with other classes, and I do suspect we cannot quite match the sustained output of wizards and psychics, but this is no reason to consider a veno's contributions as negligible in terms of dps output or even as being on a different range, a competent well geared veno can very well outdamage noobish same geared DD.

With the gold standard of caster vana taking out over 4khp out of a top performer's dps (veno using derjan's) there may be some bias against venomancer in this respect. Now, this doesn't mean that damage should become the sole consideration when discussing builds, but it certainly is one of the more important ones. Most venos using LA or HA have very specific reasons for doing so, and these builds do serve some very specific, often specialized purposes, but losses to attack figures ought to be kept to a necessary minimum, and full functionality, in terms of access to skills, should always be mantained.

Now, in this vein, I'm confused as to Mayfly's build as while I'll grant HA can remain viable in terms of PvE I fail to see its application. Morai implies other than PvP uses, and i may be missing which those may be as AA is certainly more effective in these scenarios. Which brings me to the OP as apparently I've missed what the purpose of her build will be. If this is a TW build perhaps a glaive or mag sword would make for more appropiate weapons.

Mayfly - Dreamweaver

Quite simply, my reason for going HA/AA was flexibility in defense... I can cast in arcane or melee in heavy as I deem appropriate (and it seems like I pull aggro off the herc quicker in fox than casting) and that is a magic sword in the build I linked.

MANray_ - Sanctuary

Thanks for your answer Mayfly and I do apologize if my post came off as aggressive. Yes you're absolutely right in that HA/AA does provide a good amount of flexibility in defense and the damage for foxform melee is not bad at all. Myself with what little str ive statted in order to wear arcane armor, and the negligible gains of protection neck and belt, have come to be surprised with how effective regular melee attacks can be while in fox. I usually do this while solo grinding, if I take a hit or two in order to use Leech to fill up my HP bar, mobs simply die faster than it takes the skill to cooldown if I autoattack. While I did not mean to imply this was a suspect choice, I was merely curious as to exactly which scenarios warranted a nominal reduction to DD capabilities, I do have to admit to the posibility that such reduction may not be as significant as I previously thought.

As for the weapon I apologize if i didn't express myself clearly in that I meant Ripokeke's. I do understand there is quite a bit of debate as to what the better weapon is for certain uses, so this was more about the rationale behind it and perhaps to reflect on better ways to fine tune a build for specific purposes. Yes, ideally every build should be able to serve a wide array of uses but there is also room for small adjustments.

thumbs

Lol? -Wizard good sustainable dd?

I have: wizard, mystic, and cleric on same account sharing all the same equips which include an S3 +10 sapp gem wand (some dolts think high end makes a difference).

My wizard isn't half the DD my Mystic is in most current circumstances and is only slightly better than cleric. If I left it at that; someone would just come along and ignorantly say I suck at playing wiz (which is pretty damned hard to do, but possible as I've seen it many times). So, up against R9+12 wizards in Caster; my Mystic is bouncing aggro or even holding (so wiz can DB on vampire boss). Now debuffs play a part in aggro; so it's not clear cut results, but pretty indicative. Now consider that if Mistress is able to DD w/o heals for a bit; it's hitting almost as hard every 2 secs (not counting crits and erupts).

My weapon is also trade-able so I'm able to toy with it on Veno as well. My veno in the past has been able to solo tank bosses in half the time my wiz did.

Wiz dd results can vary based on use of undine and it's effectiveness on it's target. Similarly resistances can play a part. Understanding this, and that my wiz is sage; I still can't see wiz as a strong sustainable dd. They are good 1-2 hit wonders, but even that seems like no biggie when veno gets 900% from erupt and the attack levels on weapons/ equips aren't factored into the weapon multipliers on wiz ulties, but they are added to Mystic summons.

Now if you're one of those idiots that are wowed by big numbers; don't even bother responding. In Caster it's those Mystics who pull out Cragglord, the Wizards using ulties that seem to be clueless on how to play PvE. Also; my argument isn't about how good you nuke. -It's about sustainable DD or who can bring bosses down faster.

SashaGray wrote:

how you are using "herc" as a point of argument at this point is mind-boggling

derp; addressing someone who brought up issue with herc and aggro

kisgyengusz

http://pwcalc.com/0d04df071587f03e
This is the current gear of my veno and i have a derjans ancient hatchling with claw added to that. Having a herc i think is useless now since im tanking and my pet is kind of a second weapon and hatchling is free. Im looking for a magic wep that has good pattack and put garnet shards in it but patakas have only 1aps b:sad but its only a plan. And i want http://pwcalc.com/1fcafad51ecc37c4 this to be my end gear...
I dont have any problems in caster no one complained about my dmg especially that sometimes i see 100~101 arcane chars in tt80-90...

thumbs

kisgyengusz wrote: »

http://pwcalc.com/0d04df071587f03e
This is the current gear of my veno and i have a derjans ancient hatchling with claw added to that. Having a herc i useless now since im tanking and my pet is kind of a second weapon and hatchling is free. Im looking for a magic wep that has good pattack and put garnet shards in it but patakas have only 1aps b:sad but its only a plan. And i want http://pwcalc.com/1fcafad51ecc37c4 this to be my end gear...
I dont have any problems in caster no one complained about my dmg especially that sometimes i see 100~101 arcane chars in tt80-90...

So your hatchling survives aoes better, and needs less heals than a Herc on AoE bosses?

kisgyengusz

I didnt say that, what im saying is 100kk for a herc or x gold just to get another tank what i dont need or having a free pet that is just as good dd as phoenix well im with the free solution.

Ripokeke - Sanctuary

MANray_ - Sanctuary wrote: »

As much as I hate the manners of a certain poster, and I hope no one sees this as taking his side, there is a point to be made for optimizing damage output. Perhaps, and for very practical reasons, we have all been too keen to focus on a veno's contribution to a squad's full damage figures and have to some extent neglected direct comparisons. I disagree with the idea of veno as a mediocre nuker, and this is when compared to same geared casters in other classes.
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Now, in this vein, I'm confused as to Mayfly's build as while I'll grant HA can remain viable in terms of PvE I fail to see its application. Morai implies other than PvP uses, and i may be missing which those may be as AA is certainly more effective in these scenarios. Which brings me to the OP as apparently I've missed what the purpose of her build will be. If this is a TW build perhaps a glaive or mag sword would make for more appropiate weapons.

i don't think i made myself sound as if i said "venos are mediocre nukers", if anyone reading feels that way, i apologise and clarify again...

venos are not mediocre nukers, just not the best. but venos are alway the best debuffers in pwi! b:victory

as for wat my build is, i'm trying to make a flexible build for server vs server in time to come. not sure wat weapon to get but pataka is the number 1 in mind right now. because pwi made it that pataka is our rank weapon...b:sad

thumbs wrote: »

Lol? -Wizard good sustainable dd?

I have: wizard, mystic, and cleric on same account sharing all the same equips which include an S3 +10 sapp gem wand (some dolts think high end makes a difference).
...
...
Now if you're one of those idiots that are wowed by big numbers; don't even bother responding. In Caster it's those Mystics who pull out Cragglord, the Wizards using ulties that seem to be clueless on how to play PvE. Also; my argument isn't about how good you nuke. -It's about sustainable DD or who can bring bosses down faster.

derp; addressing someone who brought up issue with herc and aggro

i refuse to believe ur conclusion b:cry

please post ur pwcalc, i believe more on numbers, logic and personal experience. if u say veno can do more in a squad than wiz, i agree. but if u say veno can do more damage than wiz, i have to disagree.

as for bringing down bosses faster, i still stick with wiz. i squaded with r9+12 veno and r9+12 wiz before, the time it took to complete caster nirvana is significantly different! even with my demon scarab of -30% wood resistance and demon amp, r9+12 veno is at best a well equiped wiz. while a r9+12 wiz is equivalent to 2 well equiped wizs. b:surrender

SashaGray - Heavens Tear

Ripokeke - Sanctuary wrote: »

as for wat my build is, i'm trying to make a flexible build for server vs server in time to come. not sure wat weapon to get but pataka is the number 1 in mind right now. because pwi made it that pataka is our rank weapon...b:sad

r8 pataka is definitly the best bang for your buck, considering what a jump it is over TT99 and how cheap it is.

right now as far as DD power, g16 nirvana sword or glaive is the best a HA veno can get, since r9 is only better if you have the full set. unless you spend the crazy money to get a tier 3 r9 weapon. The added bonus of g16 sword or glaive is that your melee attack speed goes up a lot, since patakas are the only magic weapon with a 1 aps base speed. Glaives have higher spikes than swords and lower lows on magic, and swords have a tighter magic attack range, but have much better physical attack.

If you are just casting with heavy armor, that doesnt make much of a difference though.

thumbs

Ripokeke - Sanctuary wrote: »

i refuse to believe ur conclusion b:cry

please post ur pwcalc, i believe more on numbers, logic and personal experience. if u say veno can do more in a squad than wiz, i agree. but if u say veno can do more damage than wiz, i have to disagree.

as for bringing down bosses faster, i still stick with wiz. i squaded with r9+12 veno and r9+12 wiz before, the time it took to complete caster nirvana is significantly different! even with my demon scarab of -30% wood resistance and demon amp, r9+12 veno is at best a well equiped wiz. while a r9+12 wiz is equivalent to 2 well equiped wizs. b:surrender

If you have issues; you show me wrong. You post your pwcalc.

Ripokeke - Sanctuary

SashaGray - Heavens Tear wrote: »

r8 pataka is definitly the best bang for your buck, considering what a jump it is over TT99 and how cheap it is.

right now as far as DD power, g16 nirvana sword or glaive is the best a HA veno can get, since r9 is only better if you have the full set. unless you spend the crazy money to get a tier 3 r9 weapon. The added bonus of g16 sword or glaive is that your melee attack speed goes up a lot, since patakas are the only magic weapon with a 1 aps base speed. Glaives have higher spikes than swords and lower lows on magic, and swords have a tighter magic attack range, but have much better physical attack.

If you are just casting with heavy armor, that doesnt make much of a difference though.

right, i will just see which weapon mold i get and slowly work towards it. it will be the last thing to upgrade though as i already got R8 weapon which is not that bad. (but got a cheap neon purgatory from catshop sitting in bank right now.) b:victory

thumbs wrote: »

If you have issues; you show me wrong. You post your pwcalc.

well, as i have said. i only have veno lvled and currently my wiz is lvl 30. i do suspect u are ill-treating ur lvl 101 wiz character with cheap/low level equips to come up with such biased conclusions.
b:bye

Desdi - Sanctuary

You'd have to place an equally geared Wizard and Venomancer to solo a boss and see which one can bring it down faster. Caster Nirvana isn't good for comparison since there are a lot of factors to be taken into consideration.

I personally don't really care who or what is the top magic DD as it depends on gear, build and if we're talking about squads; it also depends on the overall squad setup and debuffs that are present.

Venomancers have to pass chi to Cleric or other players if the situation calls for it, they also have to amp, purge etc. unlike a Wizard who can spark and DD to their heart's content. Should a Venomancer be in the position of a Wizard (eg. Caster Nirvana has a second Venomancer who focuses on debuffs and lets the better geared one DD) they can do considerable damage.

Mind you, I'm not trying to argue about Wizard vs. Venomancer DD power. I'm merely saying that a Venomancer can dish out quite the damage if they try/get the opportunity to. Also, even if the Venomancer has to do a lot of debuffing/chi passing they can still manage their skill (include genie skills) and spark and DD. Some Venomancers focus too much on support when they can offer some DD while others focus too much on DD and neglect their duties. The best is to find the balance between the two. Well, at least for PvE.

Not much into PvP so don't judge me there.

/off topic

thumbs

Ripokeke - Sanctuary wrote: »

i refuse to believe ur conclusion

please post ur pwcalc, i believe more on numbers, logic and personal experience.

If you have issues; you show me wrong. You post your pwcalc.

Ripokeke - Sanctuary wrote: »

well, as i have said. i only have veno lvled and currently my wiz is lvl 30. i do suspect u are ill-treating ur lvl 101 wiz character with cheap/low level equips to come up with such biased conclusions.
b:bye

So you're just a troll. b:bye

Ripokeke - Sanctuary

Desdi - Sanctuary wrote: »

You'd have to place an equally geared Wizard and Venomancer to solo a boss and see which one can bring it down faster. Caster Nirvana isn't good for comparison since there are a lot of factors to be taken into consideration.
...
...
The best is to find the balance between the two. Well, at least for PvE.

Not much into PvP so don't judge me there.

/off topic

right, i agree with ur post. maybe i'm also biased as the squad already have me as a veno debuffing, so i'm just comparing the damage output of veno and wiz with me passing chi to them.

thumbs wrote: »

So you're just a troll. b:bye

finally! u realized my off topic replies to ur off topic posts in my HA veno trainee thread? b:victory u are darn sharp... b:chuckle