So how about this...

Saethos - Raging Tide

Current gear: http://pwcalc.com/378dd106c27edcd3

That's exactly what I have right now. The r8 recast looks exactly like that minus 2 differences...Difference one being that for some reason on PWcalc the 3 piece bonus is 15% elemental resistance bonus, but on the actual game, that 3 piece bonus is "Reduce Magic Damage Taken 15%". The other difference being that the full set bonus is 12 attack levels as that came in an update but was not updated in PWcalc.

Goal: http://pwcalc.com/d6ccce9d665ae63e

Both are unbuffed

Treat this as a FAQ <_<

Why not go r9 for that amount of money?
Easy answer. I pretty much didn't pay a thing for the r8 recast, I know I can get the r9 with the cost of refines and shards alone, but this is way cheaper since getting the r9 and the sharding and refines would boost the cost up a lot more...This is actually a pretty cheap build.

Why not go for the t3 axe since it has more overall DPS?
Sadly, I got my r8 recast axe before the t3 Nirv came out...If I knew they'd have that, things would be different. I'd be all over that t3 axe if I could go back. But I already have this, so it is what it is...

What about APS?
APStards can't understand this, but I'm built for TW (Thus the odd amount of dex purely for the sake of accuracy)

Why the jungle belt and not the Warsong belt?
I have no good reason, I cannot lie...2 attack levels is nice and all, but...meh...Not too significant...




Anyway, I just wanted thoughts/comments...The r8r isn't changing, maybe I can farm a t3 axe once I finish my refines and shards, but for now, that stays. Also, the belt is subject to change to a warsong...As for the cape and helm, those are flexible.

Shards I'm not so flexable on. I want good shards, but I can't afford Jades...So vit stones are my optimal choice. DoT's I find to be useless for my playstyle...

Thoughts?

Jaabg - Sanctuary

Are you keeping the ring engravings or going to change them?

If sticking with the jungle belt, g16 might be a cheaper option as a potential. Can be farmed, or acquired slowly.

After you get all your gear, see if you can get 160 dex as opposed to 157 dex (minor detail).

If you see yourself playing for some time ahead, might want to think of starting to farm a higher necklace grade.

Saethos - Raging Tide

Jaabg - Sanctuary wrote: »

Are you keeping the ring engravings or going to change them?

If sticking with the jungle belt, g16 might be a cheaper option as a potential. Can be farmed, or acquired slowly.

After you get all your gear, see if you can get 160 dex as opposed to 157 dex (minor detail).

If you see yourself playing for some time ahead, might want to think of starting to farm a higher necklace grade.

I don't know about ring engraves yet. Maybe reroll tl I get str or vit, but not worrying about that just yet.

t3 cape and helm are a 6-12 dex chance, 6 being the minimal, so 160 dex is easily obtainable.

Jaabg - Sanctuary

A T3 axe will have similar expense to a r9 axe. The extra cost will be 100k rep, ring. It might seem 2x the original amount, but you get the best of everything. Attack lvls, gof and some good add on. It takes a bit of patience to farm/merchat to it though, while it is far easier to obtain the T3 axe compared to the R9 axe. You mentioned this was a tw build, was about to mention the morai weapon b:shutup, time to sleep b:bye.

Maelael - Heavens Tear

If its mainly a TW build, Go with Nirvana stage 2 helm and cape. Better MR, Attack Levels, and crit.

Tradeoff is like 1100-1200 hp and some damage, but not as much as 5 attack levels and crit since max stats is extremely unrealistic.

If youre gonna go for a lv 6 tome, I think you should do Pan Gu. Better utilization in case you want to do the APS route. However if you're dead set against utilizing it for APS, take a look at Concubine's Laugh too, that 2% crit again allows more zerk crit, which is by far more useful - plus has Vit for some more HP.

This is my oddball way of looking at it:
35 Str = 35 stat points
9 Str 9 Vit 8 Dex 1 Crit = 26+20 stat points (kinda) [The mag is just a bit of MR]
13 Str 12 Vit 2 Crit = 25+40 stat points (kinda)

Just food for thought on that.

Warsong belt over Jungle belt. It's better overall defensively, you're getting more solid of a build outta that over the Jungle belt. Like I compare what I would gain overall, defense and offense, vs gear choices, total it up - and whichever wins out numbers or reasonable wise (like we need all the MR we can get without sacrificing anything core), I go for.

I also say don't go too nuts pouring coin into refining those rings - we're not AAs, so Pdef isn't as huge as MR is.

Overall though, if I had your toon and had to take next steps:

N2 Helm.
Skip Belt and Tome upgrade, skip ring refines.
Get Armor to +10 for the HP.
Get Neck/Belt to at least +6 or +7. Decide if you wanna go Warsong Belt at this stage (I would)
Get Vit stones, or wait till after +12ing weapon if you need more damage atm.
Get Weapon to +12 (It's a huge, noticeable difference)
Get Neck/Belt to +10

Saethos - Raging Tide

Maelael - Heavens Tear wrote: »

If its mainly a TW build, Go with Nirvana stage 2 helm and cape. Better MR, Attack Levels, and crit.

Tradeoff is like 1100-1200 hp and some damage, but not as much as 5 attack levels and crit since max stats is extremely unrealistic.

If youre gonna go for a lv 6 tome, I think you should do Pan Gu. Better utilization in case you want to do the APS route. However if you're dead set against utilizing it for APS, take a look at Concubine's Laugh too, that 2% crit again allows more zerk crit, which is by far more useful - plus has Vit for some more HP.

This is my oddball way of looking at it:
35 Str = 35 stat points
9 Str 9 Vit 8 Dex 1 Crit = 26+20 stat points (kinda) [The mag is just a bit of MR]
13 Str 12 Vit 2 Crit = 25+40 stat points (kinda)

Just food for thought on that.

Warsong belt over Jungle belt. It's better overall defensively, you're getting more solid of a build outta that over the Jungle belt. Like I compare what I would gain overall, defense and offense, vs gear choices, total it up - and whichever wins out numbers or reasonable wise (like we need all the MR we can get without sacrificing anything core), I go for.

I also say don't go too nuts pouring coin into refining those rings - we're not AAs, so Pdef isn't as huge as MR is.

Overall though, if I had your toon and had to take next steps:

N2 Helm.
Skip Belt and Tome upgrade, skip ring refines.
Get Armor to +10 for the HP.
Get Neck/Belt to at least +6 or +7. Decide if you wanna go Warsong Belt at this stage (I would)
Get Vit stones, or wait till after +12ing weapon if you need more damage atm.
Get Weapon to +12 (It's a huge, noticeable difference)
Get Neck/Belt to +10

Maelael, I always love reading your critiques because you support each argument fully.

The main reason I would go t3 cape and helm is simply because anything there that isn't rank gear can be account stashed onto my barb and seeker. Although, the seeker would also benefit from the attack levels more than HP and my barb...isn't exactly my favorite, so I can see this being a viable alternative...I'll put some thought into it.

On tomes: I'm dead set against aps. As my sig says, not because it's fail (though my sig does make a bit of an overstatement). There are some BMs on my server that prove APS to be god when you use it right, I just don't think that APS is right for me personally after having tried it. It completely owned in PvE but I couldn't seem to work it right in PvP. APS just doesn't really fit my style...

The belts I'm completely up for more ideas since I'm not concrete set on that. I'm kinda wavering towards the warsong belt

On Rings: I slapped that on there as one of those "Things to eventually get done" though realistically speaking, that's probably the last on my list and for if I happen to have the spare cash, Maybe the highest I'll ever get them is about 6, maybe I can get 10, but it's just on there for the sake of if I can do it, I will.

Thanks for the advice. I've also taken the liberty of comparing the two on PWcalc...

With your suggestions: http://pwcalc.com/32911c0384b6a869

That 20 base attack level (Missing 4 attack levels from r8 recast update) is quite tempting. It's hard to read the M.Def value since the r8 recast on PWcalc is broken, the set bonus doesn't actually increase M.Def by 15%, it instead simply reduces the magic damage you take by 15%...The base attack is a little less (less str, but as you said, max stats on t3 are unrealistic) but the attack levels and increased crit rate make up for that loss. The HP loss isn't a big concern of mine, I'm already considered a high-HP BM on my server (most BMs here being APS with maybe +5s on armor) and even if I were concerned, that's not a very high HP difference. Less than 1000.

The more I look at that tome the more it becomes tempting, though. I'll put some thought into things you said while I work on bracer refines. Thanks!

EDIT: I'd also probably re-engrave my rings for dex or str with your suggested gear and as stated above, go for 160 dex for 1 more additional crit.

Maelael - Heavens Tear

Saethos - Raging Tide wrote: »

Maelael, I always love reading your critiques because you support each argument fully.

The main reason I would go t3 cape and helm is simply because anything there that isn't rank gear can be account stashed onto my barb and seeker. Although, the seeker would also benefit from the attack levels more than HP and my barb...isn't exactly my favorite, so I can see this being a viable alternative...I'll put some thought into it.

On tomes: I'm dead set against aps. As my sig says, not because it's fail (though my sig does make a bit of an overstatement). There are some BMs on my server that prove APS to be god when you use it right, I just don't think that APS is right for me personally after having tried it. It completely owned in PvE but I couldn't seem to work it right in PvP. APS just doesn't really fit my style...

The belts I'm completely up for more ideas since I'm not concrete set on that. I'm kinda wavering towards the warsong belt

On Rings: I slapped that on there as one of those "Things to eventually get done" though realistically speaking, that's probably the last on my list and for if I happen to have the spare cash, Maybe the highest I'll ever get them is about 6, maybe I can get 10, but it's just on there for the sake of if I can do it, I will.

Thanks for the advice. I've also taken the liberty of comparing the two on PWcalc...

With your suggestions: http://pwcalc.com/32911c0384b6a869

That 20 base attack level (Missing 4 attack levels from r8 recast update) is quite tempting. It's hard to read the M.Def value since the r8 recast on PWcalc is broken, the set bonus doesn't actually increase M.Def by 15%, it instead simply reduces the magic damage you take by 15%...The base attack is a little less (less str, but as you said, max stats on t3 are unrealistic) but the attack levels and increased crit rate make up for that loss. The HP loss isn't a big concern of mine, I'm already considered a high-HP BM on my server (most BMs here being APS with maybe +5s on armor) and even if I were concerned, that's not a very high HP difference. Less than 1000.

The more I look at that tome the more it becomes tempting, though. I'll put some thought into things you said while I work on bracer refines. Thanks!

Gracias on the compliment, I always try and think of it as what kinda reply would I want.

Cape & Hat: Barb wise, I like the higher HP due to the HP buff and Form. But you don't get that in BM and Seeker. In this case you really could go either way, but if the BM is the main guy you're TWing with...I really say N2.

Tome: Yea, APS is a style in PvP - axes are better. I utilize both worlds in PvE and take up 14 hotkeys due to it...but I feel its worth it. TW Im all axe, with odd situations for pole. Im too busy using other skills with Axe really to mix anything else in.

But, as said, look at the options past 35 strength - some balance is good and needed.

Also, +12 that weapon! You will not regret it. Id say skip N3 as you already have a freakin sweet weapon that is comparable, and in PvP terms, better than N3. Lets face it, you're lookin for crit zerks, not base raw damage, to kill people. All the crit you can get to support that zerk is a good idea.

Zarkin_Baxil - Raging Tide

May I make one suggestion, it's really minor and kind of petty. Hit 102 and put the 5 points into dex, it bumps your accuracy to 3k. I miss more that I would like to admit but when I have base buff and max accuracy rune I cant hit almost 4k accuracy. Full disclosure, I'm a full str bm with g12 ambers in my axes and just enough dex to use r8 pole (75 dex base/ 100 dex in armor).

Maelael - Heavens Tear

Zarkin_Baxil - Raging Tide wrote: »

May I make one suggestion, it's really minor and kind of petty. Hit 102 and put the 5 points into dex, it bumps your accuracy to 3k. I miss more that I would like to admit but when I have base buff and max accuracy rune I cant hit almost 4k accuracy. Full disclosure, I'm a full str bm with g12 ambers in my axes and just enough dex to use r8 pole (75 dex base/ 100 dex in armor).

I don't think that's petty at all, I think thats sound. I had the option to get rid of some dex (Im riding at 200 in R9) and really, I like my accuracy and crit. I know of two PK Axe BMs who miss - a lot - and its cause of exactly what you stated. Sure they hit a bit harder, but those misses add up - especially when you want to HF that whole crowd.

Even if I hung up the fists I'd keep the high dex or find a way to reach the same accuracy levels, if not accuracy and crit levels.

Saethos - Raging Tide

Maelael - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Gracias on the compliment, I always try and think of it as what kinda reply would I want.

Cape & Hat: Barb wise, I like the higher HP due to the HP buff and Form. But you don't get that in BM and Seeker. In this case you really could go either way, but if the BM is the main guy you're TWing with...I really say N2.

Tome: Yea, APS is a style in PvP - axes are better. I utilize both worlds in PvE and take up 14 hotkeys due to it...but I feel its worth it. TW Im all axe, with odd situations for pole. Im too busy using other skills with Axe really to mix anything else in.

But, as said, look at the options past 35 strength - some balance is good and needed.

Also, +12 that weapon! You will not regret it. Id say skip N3 as you already have a freakin sweet weapon that is comparable, and in PvP terms, better than N3. Lets face it, you're lookin for crit zerks, not base raw damage, to kill people. All the crit you can get to support that zerk is a good idea.

Yeah, not to mention sage true form for my barb. However, if I really wanted to I could just go with 2 different pieces of the n3 armor instead of making it the cape and helm...after I finish my BM ofc.

At first glance I kinda looked at the vit+10 and reduce Physical Damage 6%...Reason being that as the leader of the TW defense squad of my faction, I encounter a wide mixture of classes, and archers and sins and BMs typically try to stun me as long as possible since I can do the same to them, but I think that in the long run that wouldn't be worth it. My r8r is pretty tanky as is, especially in the P.Def department.

+12ing my weapon would be so much work etc etc QQ moar b:chuckle

Ok, I'll +12 my weapon before i refine my rings past what I get with mirages, deal?

Saethos - Raging Tide

Zarkin_Baxil - Raging Tide wrote: »

May I make one suggestion, it's really minor and kind of petty. Hit 102 and put the 5 points into dex, it bumps your accuracy to 3k. I miss more that I would like to admit but when I have base buff and max accuracy rune I cant hit almost 4k accuracy. Full disclosure, I'm a full str bm with g12 ambers in my axes and just enough dex to use r8 pole (75 dex base/ 100 dex in armor).

Actually currently (slowly) working on 102, more than halfway there!

Maelael - Heavens Tear

Saethos - Raging Tide wrote: »

Yeah, not to mention sage true form for my barb. However, if I really wanted to I could just go with 2 different pieces of the n3 armor instead of making it the cape and helm...after I finish my BM ofc.

At first glance I kinda looked at the vit+10 and reduce Physical Damage 6%...Reason being that as the leader of the TW defense squad of my faction, I encounter a wide mixture of classes, and archers and sins and BMs typically try to stun me as long as possible since I can do the same to them, but I think that in the long run that wouldn't be worth it. My r8r is pretty tanky as is, especially in the P.Def department.

+12ing my weapon would be so much work etc etc QQ moar b:chuckle

Ok, I'll +12 my weapon before i refine my rings past what I get with mirages, deal?

Honestly, how much true worrysome damage are you taking from Phys? Not that much, save from Archers. Really idea is to find a better balance and up your mdef - or go the "both ways" and get more def levels. Really your pdef is fairly meaty, I wouldn't be too concerned.

If you're on def squad duty, instead of strike/push, you definitely wanna hit harder than be more tanky. The faster you get down the barb's support the better. Be a threat to them. A low damage tanky BM, not so concerning - big whoop anti stun and purge the HF.

A higher damage BM that can take out AAs and even Archers with no HF? Thats a problem. True, you need enough to survive some hits while you're putting someone down or slowing down the crew/barb, but the key word is "Enough". Once they think you're a problem, they focus even more on you and ignore your DDs - and you know where it goes from there. And in the end, that's why Pan Gu invented IGs.

Now add in our swiss army knife of slows, stuns, freezes, seals...even more problematic.

Be perceived as a threat, and be a threat. Thats the key in my experience. I typically find I'm ignored for the first few pushes/etc during TW, until I start takin people out and lead the pushes with the other "noticed" BMs. Then I get purge-involuntary-rear-entried constantly.

In terms of Archers, just have antistun/etc genie skills, rush em (Really, do that with all ranged DDs I say) Sins, take a quick lol and critzerk em or just tank it and sigh at the fact they aren't taking out AAs and Archers cause they are dumb.

But yea which brings to the main point of that rant: +12 your Axe. I had a sin friend convince me to do it before even +11ing my armor, and dear god, was he right. Theres a certain satisfaction of turning around and Drake Ray 1 hitting people. I wasn't really doing that at +10.

Saethos - Raging Tide

Maelael - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Honestly, how much true worrysome damage are you taking from Phys? Not that much, save from Archers. Really idea is to find a better balance and up your mdef - or go the "both ways" and get more def levels. Really your pdef is fairly meaty, I wouldn't be too concerned.

If you're on def squad duty, instead of strike/push, you definitely wanna hit harder than be more tanky. The faster you get down the barb's support the better. Be a threat to them. A low damage tanky BM, not so concerning - big whoop anti stun and purge the HF.

A higher damage BM that can take out AAs and even Archers with no HF? Thats a problem. True, you need enough to survive some hits while you're putting someone down or slowing down the crew/barb, but the key word is "Enough". Once they think you're a problem, they focus even more on you and ignore your DDs - and you know where it goes from there. And in the end, that's why Pan Gu invented IGs.

Now add in our swiss army knife of slows, stuns, freezes, seals...even more problematic.

Be perceived as a threat, and be a threat. Thats the key in my experience. I typically find I'm ignored for the first few pushes/etc during TW, until I start takin people out and lead the pushes with the other "noticed" BMs. Then I get purge-involuntary-rear-entried constantly.

In terms of Archers, just have antistun/etc genie skills, rush em (Really, do that with all ranged DDs I say) Sins, take a quick lol and critzerk em or just tank it and sigh at the fact they aren't taking out AAs and Archers cause they are dumb.

But yea which brings to the main point of that rant: +12 your Axe. I had a sin friend convince me to do it before even +11ing my armor, and dear god, was he right. Theres a certain satisfaction of turning around and Drake Ray 1 hitting people. I wasn't really doing that at +10.

Once again backing your arguments with a valid explanation.

Yeah, it didn't take long to shrug off the physical resistance tome. I find myself magic marrowing against a fair few archers is it is so there really is no point to it...

What I do when a sin appears on me instead of AA characters: (Explicit language) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-DLVojdo8Qk&feature=related

Crit zerking APS sins for 10k when on my server it's typically good weapon, **** for armor. I'm talking +5 at best. I lol. But it happens a bit too often...

So, I'll trust your judgement and here's what my plan will be...

I'll get my n2 helm, worst case scenario, I don't like it and go with the n3 later, though I no longer see a reason to pick one over the other. Would it be better to finish my +10 and vit stones and then do the +12 weapon or do the +10 armor, then the +12 weapon, then the vit stones?

Zarkin_Baxil - Raging Tide

I say for the price go with Vit stones 1st. They will bump you hp up and your base def also since Jades are out of your price point. Its 2 for the price of 1 for you. I would then +12 the weapon since refinnig the armor will only give you more hp. Then work on the armor at your leisure. I'm also thinking of restating some str into dex so I can use t3 dual swords just to mess around with. I will still have over 500 str and I will have 21% crit and not have to use so many amber runes.

Jaabg - Sanctuary

Since we are all fellow bms here, i might have a suggestion to your refining issues.

Ask your friends to give you mirages, as many as they can. If ever they do the heroic chests again, buy the rep, sell the rep cheap, and keep those mirages and dq points. Sell the dyes by offering the service cheap, 20~60k per dye. Sell the items inside for 200k~500k. This will cover your costs of getting that r8 easily and make profit.

Keep those coin of chest, and wait for 2x dq reward points, turn them in. Set up shop somewhere (1k or at arch elder) and buy chest of coins cheap. Turn those in at 2x dq rewards as well.

The above should net you about 20~60 demon/sage cards. That is 1k~3k event gold. You can +8~+10 your armour pieces with that much event gold. Only drawback would be mirages, so get as many mirage as possible, my aim was 10k, only got 5k right now. I +8 my sins's armour and +9 the weapon from heroic chest stuff only.

That will cut down how much you have to spend on +10 orbs to get the gear.

+12 orbs, and +11 orbs. Some people gamble and use a tisha at +10 to get +11. Sometimes it works, if that is too risky, get the orbs. Normally the orbs will cost around 400~500m, depending on server prices. The best time to make those orbs, when in december if they have the super orb sale, 0.45 gold for 10 orbs, 1 star. Buy 3060 orbs, 1 star. For roughly 300m, you can +11 and +12 your weapon. That cost is similar to getting 9 ocean orbs. That means 3 armour pieces will miss out on being +10. But if you refined your gear to +8~+9 with mirages, and tisha, that is a small price to pay for +12 axes.

I would love to be able to one shot people with skills only in tw, but for now i have to be patient and gather money and be a squishy bm that is a nuisance b:pleased.

Maelael - Heavens Tear

Saethos - Raging Tide wrote: »

Would it be better to finish my +10 and vit stones and then do the +12 weapon or do the +10 armor, then the +12 weapon, then the vit stones?

Zarkin_Baxil - Raging Tide wrote: »

I say for the price go with Vit stones 1st. They will bump you hp up and your base def also since Jades are out of your price point. Its 2 for the price of 1 for you. I would then +12 the weapon since refinnig the armor will only give you more hp. Then work on the armor at your leisure.

Given current pack sales/2x Canny prices/2x TT prices, I agree with Zarkin. Vit stones and Hat first, do the refines when the right sale comes around. If you're comfy with your HP at the time of the orb sales, +12 weapon first then +10 to +11 the armor. If you feel you really need some more beef, +10 the armor first then +12 the weapon then +11 the armor.

Jaabg - Sanctuary wrote: »

*snip*heroic chests*snip*

+12 orbs, and +11 orbs. Some people gamble and use a tisha at +10 to get +11. Sometimes it works, if that is too risky, get the orbs. Normally the orbs will cost around 400~500m, depending on server prices. The best time to make those orbs, when in december if they have the super orb sale, 0.45 gold for 10 orbs, 1 star. Buy 3060 orbs, 1 star. For roughly 300m, you can +11 and +12 your weapon. That cost is similar to getting 9 ocean orbs. That means 3 armour pieces will miss out on being +10. But if you refined your gear to +8~+9 with mirages, and tisha, that is a small price to pay for +12 axes.

Heroic Chest promotion is the best promotion in the world. You pretty much can sell the rep at even/just below even pricing, make 25% of your coin invested via mirages, and get like 60-80k DQ points during 2x DQ. Just takes a while to open those GD chests. The rep if priced aggressively goes in about 2-3 days.

Now lets talk refining, and expand on what Jaabg said. I'll do a quickie on it, every time I write a big one the internet eats it so I aint goin that far.

1-3: Mirages
4-5: Tienkangs
6-7: Tienkangs or Tishas
8-10: 10*
11: Two options, see below Tisha and 11*
12: 12* orb. Don't try the tisha.

Tishas for +11, and have a bunch of 10* to get back up to 10 if it fails.

I did this on my BM, and saved nearly 400m. *had* I stopped at 4 successful pieces and not pressed my luck, I would have saved like 600m+. However, I know people who have lost at this method bad. I didn't risk it on my Barb given I think the game is stacked against 3rd Stage Nirvana.

Of note, some do 1-2 Mirage, 3-4 Tienkangs, and 5-7 Tishas. Personally Ill mix in some Tishas at 5-7, but mostly I do straight Tienkangs. If Im impatient Ill Tienkang 3-7.

Saethos - Raging Tide

Zarkin_Baxil - Raging Tide wrote: »

I say for the price go with Vit stones 1st. They will bump you hp up and your base def also since Jades are out of your price point. Its 2 for the price of 1 for you. I would then +12 the weapon since refinnig the armor will only give you more hp. Then work on the armor at your leisure. I'm also thinking of restating some str into dex so I can use t3 dual swords just to mess around with. I will still have over 500 str and I will have 21% crit and not have to use so many amber runes.

Alrighty then, this seems reasonable.

Jaabg - Sanctuary wrote: »

Since we are all fellow bms here, i might have a suggestion to your refining issues.

Ask your friends to give you mirages, as many as they can. If ever they do the heroic chests again, buy the rep, sell the rep cheap, and keep those mirages and dq points. Sell the dyes by offering the service cheap, 20~60k per dye. Sell the items inside for 200k~500k. This will cover your costs of getting that r8 easily and make profit.

Keep those coin of chest, and wait for 2x dq reward points, turn them in. Set up shop somewhere (1k or at arch elder) and buy chest of coins cheap. Turn those in at 2x dq rewards as well.

The above should net you about 20~60 demon/sage cards. That is 1k~3k event gold. You can +8~+10 your armour pieces with that much event gold. Only drawback would be mirages, so get as many mirage as possible, my aim was 10k, only got 5k right now. I +8 my sins's armour and +9 the weapon from heroic chest stuff only.

That will cut down how much you have to spend on +10 orbs to get the gear.

+12 orbs, and +11 orbs. Some people gamble and use a tisha at +10 to get +11. Sometimes it works, if that is too risky, get the orbs. Normally the orbs will cost around 400~500m, depending on server prices. The best time to make those orbs, when in december if they have the super orb sale, 0.45 gold for 10 orbs, 1 star. Buy 3060 orbs, 1 star. For roughly 300m, you can +11 and +12 your weapon. That cost is similar to getting 9 ocean orbs. That means 3 armour pieces will miss out on being +10. But if you refined your gear to +8~+9 with mirages, and tisha, that is a small price to pay for +12 axes.

I would love to be able to one shot people with skills only in tw, but for now i have to be patient and gather money and be a squishy bm that is a nuisance b:pleased.

http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=541751

Maelael - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Given current pack sales/2x Canny prices/2x TT prices, I agree with Zarkin. Vit stones and Hat first, do the refines when the right sale comes around. If you're comfy with your HP at the time of the orb sales, +12 weapon first then +10 to +11 the armor. If you feel you really need some more beef, +10 the armor first then +12 the weapon then +11 the armor.




Heroic Chest promotion is the best promotion in the world. You pretty much can sell the rep at even/just below even pricing, make 25% of your coin invested via mirages, and get like 60-80k DQ points during 2x DQ. Just takes a while to open those GD chests. The rep if priced aggressively goes in about 2-3 days.

Now lets talk refining, and expand on what Jaabg said. I'll do a quickie on it, every time I write a big one the internet eats it so I aint goin that far.

1-3: Mirages
4-5: Tienkangs
6-7: Tienkangs or Tishas
8-10: 10*
11: Two options, see below Tisha and 11*
12: 12* orb. Don't try the tisha.

Tishas for +11, and have a bunch of 10* to get back up to 10 if it fails.

I did this on my BM, and saved nearly 400m. *had* I stopped at 4 successful pieces and not pressed my luck, I would have saved like 600m+. However, I know people who have lost at this method bad. I didn't risk it on my Barb given I think the game is stacked against 3rd Stage Nirvana.

Of note, some do 1-2 Mirage, 3-4 Tienkangs, and 5-7 Tishas. Personally Ill mix in some Tishas at 5-7, but mostly I do straight Tienkangs. If Im impatient Ill Tienkang 3-7.

I just checked the price of vit stones being at 45m right now...That doesn't seem quite right since while only 1 pack is on sale I see people selling them for 35-40m <_<

But this all seems reasonable. Also, all my armor I got to +6-7 with just mirages and aids, no orbs...Other than that damn belt! That belt is cursed, I swear!

Maelael - Heavens Tear

Saethos - Raging Tide wrote: »

I just checked the price of vit stones being at 45m right now...That doesn't seem quite right since while only 1 pack is on sale I see people selling them for 35-40m <_<

But this all seems reasonable. Also, all my armor I got to +6-7 with just mirages and aids, no orbs...Other than that damn belt! That belt is cursed, I swear!

Pack items are in flux, you should be able to buy one outta WC or a quick catshop sell at 40 then. On HT, Vit stones during normal sales are 45-50, with super pack sales (like now) they tend to fall to 40-45, which is where they are now. I rarely see em under 40 on sale (buy is 37-40 right now). DoDs flux differently...

Unfortunately the anniversary event has raised prices of gold and items due to the influx of coin. Gold prices will recover, pack items may not. 40-45 may be your best bet.

Saethos - Raging Tide

Maelael - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Pack items are in flux, you should be able to buy one outta WC or a quick catshop sell at 40 then. On HT, Vit stones during normal sales are 45-50, with super pack sales (like now) they tend to fall to 40-45, which is where they are now. I rarely see em under 40 on sale (buy is 37-40 right now). DoDs flux differently...

Unfortunately the anniversary event has raised prices of gold and items due to the influx of coin. Gold prices will recover, pack items may not. 40-45 may be your best bet.

Well that's a pain. Guess I better dust off the old TM69 and see if I can sell that to make a pretty penny.

Zarkin_Baxil - Raging Tide

OH dear lord yes! please do tm69, I can send 9843750983475098127436 people your way. I have done it so much it gives me nightmaresb:cry

Saethos - Raging Tide

Zarkin_Baxil - Raging Tide wrote: »

OH dear lord yes! please do tm69, I can send 9843750983475098127436 people your way. I have done it so much it gives me nightmaresb:cry

Haha, I plan on it. I have a sage barb for buffs, a sage sin partner, and we did a test run and did it fast enough. Youi can send them my way provided my partner is on at the same time, which is typically around 21:00 Server time