squad work
first let me say mystic is my only toon n this my first game.
lvl'd up by quests n grinding, mostly solo work but had high lvl m8 who kinda helped me a bit too much so relatively new to squad work
when im in squads n a cleric is there, why is it that i appear to be faster at healing? i dont wanna heal when cleric is there i love to dd but when squad same level, the cleric (i've played with several) doesnt seem to heal fast enough. i see hp bars go down to 50% so i start healing (i include falling petals here) as well as dd'ing if i can. these clerics have good reputations is it cos they with mystic n feel they can be lazy (who'd blame em) n only throw up BB if needed, or is it that i'm not giving them the chance to do their job? my example is yesterday in Bh79 where linus is at, i had my heal plants out cleric's BB was up and i was still having to F.P. and B.i.t.C. and DD. This wasnt a balanced squad (1 cleric 100,3 sins,1 mystic,1 archer lvls 91-94) i admit, n only went cos o a m8. squad nearly got wiped out at 1 point, n i was shouted at by sin to DD, as i was just getting squad stable!b:surrender i continued to get squad stable, n THEN dd'd. was i wrong to do so? was i at fault, the cleric, or the sin?
constructive criticism/advice welcome ;)b:thanks
lvl'd up by quests n grinding, mostly solo work but had high lvl m8 who kinda helped me a bit too much so relatively new to squad work
when im in squads n a cleric is there, why is it that i appear to be faster at healing? i dont wanna heal when cleric is there i love to dd but when squad same level, the cleric (i've played with several) doesnt seem to heal fast enough. i see hp bars go down to 50% so i start healing (i include falling petals here) as well as dd'ing if i can. these clerics have good reputations is it cos they with mystic n feel they can be lazy (who'd blame em) n only throw up BB if needed, or is it that i'm not giving them the chance to do their job? my example is yesterday in Bh79 where linus is at, i had my heal plants out cleric's BB was up and i was still having to F.P. and B.i.t.C. and DD. This wasnt a balanced squad (1 cleric 100,3 sins,1 mystic,1 archer lvls 91-94) i admit, n only went cos o a m8. squad nearly got wiped out at 1 point, n i was shouted at by sin to DD, as i was just getting squad stable!b:surrender i continued to get squad stable, n THEN dd'd. was i wrong to do so? was i at fault, the cleric, or the sin?
constructive criticism/advice welcome ;)b:thanks
Post edited by lyrinx123 on
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Comments
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If the cleric is in BB, he/she can't do anything else. If more healing was necessary, it was up to you to provide it (one way or another).cleric's BB was up and i was still having to F.P. and B.i.t.C. and DD. This wasnt a balanced squad (1 cleric 100,3 sins,1 mystic,1 archer lvls 91-94) [...] squad nearly got wiped out at 1 point, n i was shouted at by sin to DD, as i was just getting squad stable!
But healing is not the only way to do it. If you use Befuddling Creeper, it will lower the PDef of opponents. This will cause the Sins to do more damage, which means they will get more healing from Blood Paint.
I would say the best benefit you could have provided to the squad would be to cast Befuddling Creeper and Lyse it every 18 seconds. Casting/Lysing Spidervine every 12 seconds would have further cut enemy damage output (but wouldn't have sped the kill). Vital Herb sounds like a good call since the Sin was losing more HP than BB could handle.
But you should learn what the other classes are capable of. In most cases, Mystics are not the best choice for debuffing PDef. This seems to be a rare exception.0 -
From the squad you said you had i guess the cleric used BB cause the aggro was probably playing ping ping on the the 3 sins and sins lvl 9x are extremly squishy, but normally a BB would be enough.
BB is not needed in BH79 since the boss don't AoE, but some clerics are lazy and just BB while IH is enough (plus the cleric could debuff the boss), probably the sins had terrible gears as well.
Normally a cleric should be able to solo heal everything, but more and more clerics become lazy or level too fast and don't know how to play their class.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
b:dirty "I **** rainbows and love everyone"-Longknife b:cute0 -
thankyou both for ya replies
very helpful advice ty both
i seem to remember a post saying not to use befudding when barbs n veno in squad, and spidervine when venos in squad is this correct? i cant find the info i once found. somat to do with overwriting n our debuffs not being as good as venos n barbs. i'm just thinking for other situations i may find myself in0 -
It's a bit more complicated than that. Is the boss primarily dealing physical damage or magic damage? Are the damage dealers primarily dealing physical or magic damage?i seem to remember a post saying not to use befudding when barbs n veno in squad, and spidervine when venos in squad is this correct?
Damage dealers doing primarily physical damage:
1. Venomancer (Myriad Rainbow or Iron Scarab)
2. Barbarian (Devour or Penetrate Armor)
3. Cleric (Dimensional Seal)
5. Mystic (Befuddling Creeper)
Damage dealers doing primarily magical damage:
1. Venomancer (Myriad or pet doing Howl)
2. Cleric (Elemental Seal)
3. Mystic (Befuddling Creeper)
Boss doing primarily physical damage:
1. Barbarian (Frighten)
2. Venomancer (pet doing Threaten)
3. Mystic (Spidervine)
Boss doing primarily magical damage:
1. Mystic (Spidervine)
Complication:
This advice is based upon what each class can do, not what the party member will do. For example, a cleric may be too busy healing to debuff. The venomancer pet might not have Howl or Threaten. The barbarian may be too busy maintaining agro to Frighten.
In addition to knowing what the other party members are capable of, you also need to communicate with them to know what they intend to do.0 -
first let me say mystic is my only toon n this my first game.
lvl'd up by quests n grinding, mostly solo work but had high lvl m8 who kinda helped me a bit too much so relatively new to squad work
when im in squads n a cleric is there, why is it that i appear to be faster at healing? i dont wanna heal when cleric is there i love to dd but when squad same level, the cleric (i've played with several) doesnt seem to heal fast enough. i see hp bars go down to 50% so i start healing (i include falling petals here) as well as dd'ing if i can. these clerics have good reputations is it cos they with mystic n feel they can be lazy (who'd blame em) n only throw up BB if needed, or is it that i'm not giving them the chance to do their job? my example is yesterday in Bh79 where linus is at, i had my heal plants out cleric's BB was up and i was still having to F.P. and B.i.t.C. and DD. This wasnt a balanced squad (1 cleric 100,3 sins,1 mystic,1 archer lvls 91-94) i admit, n only went cos o a m8. squad nearly got wiped out at 1 point, n i was shouted at by sin to DD, as i was just getting squad stable!b:surrender i continued to get squad stable, n THEN dd'd. was i wrong to do so? was i at fault, the cleric, or the sin?
constructive criticism/advice welcome ;)b:thanks
No, you didn't do anything wrong. Honestly, if the cleric slapped up BB, and the squad needed supplemental heals, I'd take care of them and then DD, not listen to the Sin who's ordering you to DD. No one has the right to order anyone around, so be confident in the fact that you helped support the squad by healing, and not healing and DDing instead. Squad support is complicated, but in the type of situation you described, you did the right thing.0 -
Mystics have a very powerful instant heal, Break in the Clouds.
Clerics also have instant heals, but they are not as powerful. Their most powerful heals take a second or 2 seconds and a half to kick in. The cleric may have been healing, but yours was just faster. Their multi-heal is 3.5 secs, which may be negligibly slower than our Comforting Mist.
I cant speak for clerics, because mine is only level 5, but according to a friend of mine that plays one - thats the difference.
Its been my experience that clerics that havent squaded with Mystics much want to test you out, and literally do nothing. Which is hardly fair to anyone in the squad, but it is what it is.
Sometimes they even cop an attitude thinking you are trying to out-heal them, not realising that to really play a Mystic good, you are doing everything that needs to be done.
Its not really laziness usually - they are just seeing what you can do, or think you are trying to challenge them in some way, or the speed of Break in the Clouds beat their heal to it by half a second.
I honestly prefer to squad with clerics because they allow me to be the best Mystic I can be. I'm not responsible for watching the health bars constantly - they are. b:chuckle
They win hands down on anything that needs to be Purified, as their Purify ability doesnt rely on sheer luck to happen.
Many classes HATE when you use your Thicket and Gale Force, because of their tendency to freeze and seal which scatters some mobs for a second, and its hard for melee classes to NOT chase the mobs.
They also HATE when you lysing certain plants, like Befudding Creeper, because you overwrite their stronger debuffs.
It might not be a perfect stradegy, but when Im squaded with a BM, I dont use Thicket or Gale Force, and only lysing Spidervine - if its appropriate for the mob.
In Caster's Nirvana, you are free to be your Mystic self usually, and use whatever you like with no complaints. You practically ARE the BM in Caster's when it comes to debuffs. b:victory0 -
Brillance - Raging Tide wrote: »Mystics have a very powerful instant heal, Break in the Clouds.
Clerics also have instant heals, but they are not as powerful. Their most powerful heals take a second or 2 seconds and a half to kick in. The cleric may have been healing, but yours was just faster. Their multi-heal is 3.5 secs, which may be negligibly slower than our Comforting Mist.
I cant speak for clerics, because mine is only level 5, but according to a friend of mine that plays one - thats the difference.
Its been my experience that clerics that havent squaded with Mystics much want to test you out, and literally do nothing. Which is hardly fair to anyone in the squad, but it is what it is.
Sometimes they even cop an attitude thinking you are trying to out-heal them, not realising that to really play a Mystic good, you are doing everything that needs to be done.
Its not really laziness usually - they are just seeing what you can do, or think you are trying to challenge them in some way, or the speed of Break in the Clouds beat their heal to it by half a second.
I honestly prefer to squad with clerics because they allow me to be the best Mystic I can be. I'm not responsible for watching the health bars constantly - they are. b:chuckle
They win hands down on anything that needs to be Purified, as their Purify ability doesnt rely on sheer luck to happen.
Many classes HATE when you use your Thicket and Gale Force, because of their tendency to freeze and seal which scatters some mobs for a second, and its hard for melee classes to NOT chase the mobs.
They also HATE when you lysing certain plants, like Befudding Creeper, because you overwrite their stronger debuffs.
It might not be a perfect stradegy, but when Im squaded with a BM, I dont use Thicket or Gale Force, and only lysing Spidervine - if its appropriate for the mob.
In Caster's Nirvana, you are free to be your Mystic self usually, and use whatever you like with no complaints. You practically ARE the BM in Caster's when it comes to debuffs. b:victory
DON'T BELIEVE ANYTHING BRILLIANCE SAYS.
Not really, she's just the whipping boy on mystic forum.AKA PermaSpark, Heartshatter0 -
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MrMelvin - Heavens Tear wrote: »He/She/It is just a stupid troll who spreads false information. I agree just don't listen to it and it will eventually go away.
But you won't. Melly is just a pimple, but a very important aspect of "the festering boil" in this forum.
Point out whats wrong with what I said, Uncle Fester. b:chuckle0 -
Brillance - Raging Tide wrote: »But you won't. Melly is just a pimple, but a very important aspect of "the festering boil" in this forum.
Point out whats wrong with what I said, Uncle Fester. b:chuckle
Oh you actually think I take the time to read the next load of **** you post? I'd rather be out catching an STD.0 -
MrMelvin - Heavens Tear wrote: »Oh you actually think I take the time to read the next load of **** you post? I'd rather be out catching an STD.[/COLOR]
LMAO, I have no doubt about that. Guess no one's ever interested since you are always here. b:laugh
Keep trying Uncle Fester! Never give up! You WILL eventually succeed. ^^0 -
Oh yeah I'm ALWAYS here... Good one0
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MrMelvin - Heavens Tear wrote: »Oh yeah I'm ALWAYS here... Good one
Well, you are whenever I am, Uncle Fester.
Maybe you should cut down on the Alphabet Soup? Might help make something you say memorable to someone. They might even look at you as more than just a pimple on the 'festering boil" of this forum's backside. b:chuckle0 -
I don't need to be remembered by anyone, I just give out advice to people who ask for it. Sometimes I'm wrong, sometimes I'm right and if I'm wrong I accept it and move on unlike you.
I'd rather not be remembered than be remembered as the person who spreads **** and chooses to argue their invalid point. Get over yourself please.0 -
MrMelvin - Heavens Tear wrote: »I don't need to be remembered by anyone, I just give out advice to people who ask for it. Sometimes I'm wrong, sometimes I'm right and if I'm wrong I accept it and move on unlike you.
I'd rather not be remembered than be remembered as the person who spreads **** and chooses to argue their invalid point. Get over yourself please.
Im sorry, you believe someone has asked you for advice here?
Meh...so infantile Im moving on now. Something on Huffington Post I need to read.
Maybe one day, when your flour-paste letters make sense, I'll respond to your constant need for attention. Some boil-babies need to grow more than a couple hairs. b:chuckle
Keep on Festering, Uncle. b:victory
Laters. b:bye0 -
Brillance - Raging Tide wrote: »Im sorry, you believe someone has asked you for advice here?
Meh...so infantile Im moving on now. Something on Huffington Post I need to read.
Maybe one day, when your flour-paste letters make sense, I'll repsond to your constant need for attention. Some boil-babies need to grow more than a couple hairs. b:chuckle
Keep on Festering, Uncle. b:victory
Laters. b:bye
You clearly don't understand how the forum works do you? Players make threads for others to read, some make threads seeking advice and players give advice, I never said people ask me for advice... Players certainly don't ask you for advice, they would get better information asking a potted plant.
The only person who comes on here seeking attention is yourself, do everyone a favour and go away, grow up and come back when you have been through pre-school and learnt that you are an idiot.0 -
MrMelvin - Heavens Tear wrote: »You clearly don't understand how the forum works do you? Players make threads for others to read, some make threads seeking advice and players give advice, I never said people ask me for advice... Players certainly don't ask you for advice, they would get better information asking a potted plant.
The only person who comes on here seeking attention is yourself, do everyone a favour and go away, grow up and come back when you have been through pre-school and learnt that you are an idiot.
It was short read, about Madonna being sued by Russia.
The only problem with your poo-filled post here, is it is not my thread, and you offered no advice to anyone on the topic posted by the thread author.
I see why you are so intimate with the idea of randomly calling people stupid, and continue to make yourself look that way. Everything you say is just diarrhea of the mouth - probably from all that pimple festering Alphabet Soup.
In short, you are an expert in pracitce! b:chuckle0 -
Phoenix_Eye - Heavens Tear wrote: »- Mystics that dont use mistress for AoE or Cragglord at FF pulls , instead insist that Chihyu is far useful , even ignoring the stun.
- Mystics that neglet use of salvation during hard bosses especially at scenarious where tank and DDs are lower lvl.
- Mystics that summon befuddling creeper on 1vs1 battles and dont even lyse it , thus their debuffs are far weaker than venomancers/clerics/assassins debuffs who actually do happen to use their skills.
- Mystics who dont use Salvation to shield the cleric in BB during FF pulls so no unfortunate deaths would happen. not using shield on puller either.
- Mystics that neglet the use of spidervine whose debuffs are far more rare on other classes (barbs are most of the time extinct and few pets carry lvled Threaten). Instead they prefer teaming Vital herb with healing herb which at higher lvls isnt needed as much especially if cleric is present.
- Mystics who dont buff themselves with with Verdant Shell (damn this is becoming common and common) thus losing lots of defences. they neglet rez buffs on tanks too , only focusing on cleric.
- Mystics who neglet the use of thicket and bramble tornado and instead spam NV. Pulls in FF dont count since seal with no freeze tend to makes magic mobs go away , though big room mobs are all physical.
- and my favourite , mystics who dont heal the ***** archer who kills the harpy in FF , just so they can save the little Mystic's *** from physical hits , and the mystics doenst even drop a lovely fallen petal on the archer (we dont even ask for full healing , fallen petal can last till harpy dies and the cost isnt THAT big since natural MP regeneration can cover it) thus making him wasting crabs and genie stamina which can be used elsewhere with better results and higher chances of survival (pulls , bosses)
Dont you all think that some of this little bit of prejudice against mystics is a bit justified in a very small part ???
When i am with a mystic alone in a squad , i always ask if he/she can solo heal , not cause i think mystis cant heal , but just cause i dont want to bring him/her and rest squad in a tough position , if the answer is negative i search for 2nd healer.
Many mystics cant cope with having so many roles and end up failing at everything while believing that they are actually good.
Then again there are the good ones. These should not only be insuranced , but be applied to friend lists for any situation
Just like clerics and sins. Prejudism is common , and will never cease to exist ....
Just some things people expect from a Mystic to happen and some of their common mistakes.
As for Clerics vs Mystics , they are classes designed to work together and reduce the stress in healing the squad. Plants help reduce Chroma spam or BB , and Summons and plants lets the cleric heal instead of DDing or Debuffing. Never jsut think of endgame lvls , there are the middle lvls too where people aren't that powerful.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
<--- MALE Veno ..... Moved to G W 2 or maybe not completely , don't know ...... PW addiction
{That TT xbow chain is one that describes someone's bowel movements after having too much spicy food. A loud **** (Thundercrack), then a burning sensation (Flash Fire), followed by an explosion of multi-colored poo-confetti (Blinding Radiance). Excellent...} By Quilue0 -
Phoenix_Eye - Heavens Tear wrote: »As for Clerics vs Mystics , they are classes designed to work together and reduce the stress in healing the squad. Plants help reduce Chroma spam or BB , and Summons and plants lets the cleric heal instead of DDing or Debuffing. Never jsut think of endgame lvls , there are the middle lvls too where people aren't that powerful.
Ignoring that inbred... Apologies to the thread starter on my part.
I wouldn't say that Mystics were designed to work with Clerics personally, I think they were created to get players to actually play the healer again. When the Tideborn were introduced I think it was obvious that the Cleric and Barb population went into major decline because everyone was making Assassins, with BP, Clerics were rendered useless in some cases with people favouring damage over safety...
This must have been noticed by the devs and they decided that they needed to make supporting more fun for players and then created Mystics. My personal opinion is that Mystics were created to revive the support healer role in a squad, plants which AoE heal meaning players can DD, AoE debuffs, strong pets and the ability to do major damage.
Same as I believe that Seekers were created to revive the tank role in a squad since Vortex is the damage dealing skill people seek and also fulfill their fun in tanking since chances are they will hold aggro in AoE situation and also huge swords - duh!
Although anyone with common sense can tell that having a Cleric/Mystic combo or a Seeker/Barb combo are equally awesome I don't think they were designed for it.
Again this is my personal opinion so I could be and am probably wrong ^_^0 -
MrMelvin - Heavens Tear wrote: »Ignoring that inbred..... Apologies to the thread starter on my part.
Your part? You're it - the full Monty! But, I applaud this singular, half-hearted attempt at an act of maturity - on your stand alone part. b:victory
On topic:
Ive always felt Mystics and Clerics were complimentary in a squad, as I previously said, I prefer to have clerics in my squad, and honestly believe they ARE the better healer.
That list of stuff looked at as fail I dont agree with for lots of reasons. As Pheonix Eye said, not everyone's a high level - and even some high-levels do not bother with certain skills. Some will tell me they never bothered to level Craggy, as in the first example on the list, because they only PK and find it useless. I can't imagine they didnt bother with FC at all while trying to get leveled up, either.
Mystics are variable & not pressed from a cookie-cutter, and in squads alot of other chars dont know how to react to them - like running away from a sheild buff on a big pull AFTER the Mystic has summoned Sally and transfered mana to it (which before summons were updated to spawn with some mana already, seemed to happen more often than not), but I would never say that tank was 'stupid' because of it - its not like he risked wiping the squad or anything.0 -
MrMelvin - Heavens Tear wrote: »
Although anyone with common sense can tell that having a Cleric/Mystic combo or a Seeker/Barb combo are equally awesome I don't think they were designed for it.
Again this is my personal opinion so I could be and am probably wrong ^_^
Not really wrong as it was my opinion as well .... maybe it is just me when i play cleric that i love having a good mystic in the squad to help me reduce my stress lvls ( i get overanxious when it comes to keeping people alive)
Whatever their reasons for creation , playstyle changed , still , if people continue the powerlvl business without at least searching what their new skills do , game will be tiring and tough.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
<--- MALE Veno ..... Moved to G W 2 or maybe not completely , don't know ...... PW addiction
{That TT xbow chain is one that describes someone's bowel movements after having too much spicy food. A loud **** (Thundercrack), then a burning sensation (Flash Fire), followed by an explosion of multi-colored poo-confetti (Blinding Radiance). Excellent...} By Quilue0 -
Phoenix_Eye - Heavens Tear wrote: »Not really wrong as it was my opinion as well .... maybe it is just me when i play cleric that i love having a good mystic in the squad to help me reduce my stress lvls ( i get overanxious when it comes to keeping people alive)
Whatever their reasons for creation , playstyle changed , still , if people continue the powerlvl business without at least searching what their new skills do , game will be tiring and tough.
I haven't actually been in a squad with a Mystic on my Cleric for FF (he is only 87) but I can see your point with the stressing out with keeping people alive. My very first character was at Cleric (different one from my current one) and it was a lot tougher back then with keeping squads alive, if someone run away I knew they were going to die. Playstyle has changed a lot I agree, with crabs become more available players can just run off and pretty much keep themselves alive which is why I prefer playing a Mystic over a Cleric just because I feel more relaxed healing since I can just drop a plant and with the added BP I rarely have to throw around a BiTC. Will be interesting to see how much healing changes when I get Verdant Blessing, being in hospital really made me behind with the dailies
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DON'T BELIEVE ANYTHING BRILLIANCE SAYS.
Not really, she's just the whipping boy on mystic forum.MrMelvin - Heavens Tear wrote: »He/She/It is just a stupid troll who spreads false information. I agree just don't listen to it and it will eventually go away.
+3 I'll even add to don't even bother read what she say.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
b:dirty "I **** rainbows and love everyone"-Longknife b:cute0 -
Xx_BeLLa_xX - Harshlands wrote: »+3 I'll even add to don't even bother read what she say.
+4 Amen.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Licensed tail brusher of ƙɑƙʊɱɑʊ ~ only the fluffiest
Outrunning centaurs since 2012~0 -
Quote:
Originally Posted by laloner
DON'T BELIEVE ANYTHING BRILLIANCE SAYS.
Not really, she's just the whipping boy on mystic forum.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrMelvin - Heavens Tear
He/She/It is just a stupid troll who spreads false information. I agree just don't listen to it and it will eventually go away.Xx_BeLLa_xX - Harshlands wrote: »+3 I'll even add to don't even bother read what she say.
I'll add that 1 + 1 =2, not three. But, then you have to realize the first one quoted is not a putdown to Brillance, but a comment on the reality I face posting in this forum.
So, that makes 0 + 1 = 1. You, of course, being one of the three Zeros. b:chuckle
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Next time practise your text formating ...... you are horribly painful to the eyes to read .....[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
<--- MALE Veno ..... Moved to G W 2 or maybe not completely , don't know ...... PW addiction
{That TT xbow chain is one that describes someone's bowel movements after having too much spicy food. A loud **** (Thundercrack), then a burning sensation (Flash Fire), followed by an explosion of multi-colored poo-confetti (Blinding Radiance). Excellent...} By Quilue0 -
Phoenix_Eye - Heavens Tear wrote: »Next time practise your text formating ...... you are horribly painful to the eyes to read .....
Have you seen an Eye Doctor about that? Seems a shame the lack of two little lines causes you horrible pain when you read. But, thanks for the tip, lol. b:thanks0 -
no intentions too offend ... sometimes bad formating is frustating , no because if difficulty of the eye to process the information , but the whole confusion between different sizes colors paragraphing blah blah blah[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
<--- MALE Veno ..... Moved to G W 2 or maybe not completely , don't know ...... PW addiction
{That TT xbow chain is one that describes someone's bowel movements after having too much spicy food. A loud **** (Thundercrack), then a burning sensation (Flash Fire), followed by an explosion of multi-colored poo-confetti (Blinding Radiance). Excellent...} By Quilue0 -
Phoenix_Eye - Heavens Tear wrote: »no intentions too offend ... sometimes bad formating is frustating , no because if difficulty of the eye to process the information , but the whole confusion between different sizes colors paragraphing blah blah blah
Okay, sorry to frustrate you. I thought "Multi-On" would allow me to quote like others do. But, its not working for me, if thats how you do it. I just recently became able to post smileys from the "more" section, and Im not sure why my clicks on those smileys in the past yielded nothing, then suddenly posted one recently. Maybe like some spells ingame from time to time dont seem to work when you just got them, I just have to keep trying and one day it will kick in too. Idk...
Sorry to be a newb. b:surrender0
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