Im making a new char.

Ze_Great - Harshlands

I have got a seeker to lvl 20, and a sin to lvl 29. But I decided I wanted to make a healer since I normally dont use the healer class in MMOs. So what are some good build to use and how do I actully keep myself alive

Kavannas - Archosaur

I'm not an expert, but a good build for a beginner with be 6mag/1str/3vit every 2 levels. There are stickies at the top of the forum that can give you more information Remember, don't level Blessings of the Purehearted, Ironheart blessing with be your best heal.

Sakubatou - Sanctuary

You're going to be told different amounts of vitality for your build, personally I feel zero is the perfect amount to give you good heals, enough hp, and more survivability

So 1 str every two levels two wear arcane armor, only as much vit as you feel you need, and the rest into magic. My build was 9 magic/1 str every two levels and I survived perfectly fine. Others will say 8magic/1str/1vit in a 4magic/1str on odd levels and 4magic/1vit on even level pattern.

Look around, there are tons of threads about builds and even more arguing whether vit actually helps or hurts you.

Yin - Momaganon

I would suggest 1str/9mag every 2 level. Some prefer more vitality but I prefer pure magic build. Clerics won't take much hits in squads anyway.

And you can keep yourself alive by casting Ironheart blessing now and then. Usually you can kill mobs before they reach you tho. But for stronger mobs cast ironheart attack with cyclone and plume shot and cast ironheart again. Pretty simple. Later when you get little more mana you can use plume shell against physical mobs. Against magic mobs you don't have much problems since arcane armor gives good reistance.

VoItaire - Harshlands

I would suggest 50 vit until you have at least full +7 gear since you appear to be on a PvP server. Some people might say it'll make little difference, but that could mean the difference between being a 3 shot or a 2 shot, or letting a crit get the better of you.

SylenThunder - Twilight Temple

Kavannas - Archosaur wrote: »

I'm not an expert, but a good build for a beginner with be 6mag/1str/3vit every 2 levels. There are stickies at the top of the forum that can give you more information Remember, don't level Blessings of the Purehearted, Ironheart blessing with be your best heal.

VoItaire - Harshlands wrote: »

I would suggest 50 vit until you have at least full +7 gear since you appear to be on a PvP server. Some people might say it'll make little difference, but that could mean the difference between being a 3 shot or a 2 shot, or letting a crit get the better of you.

I'm sorry, but a pure build can solo nearly everything, including most of the bosses up until about 40. That much VIT is going to kill your magic damage AND your heal power.
Always Shard with garnets to boost your Pdef. After 40 or 50 refine everything up to +3 or +4 cheap with mirage and you'll get the vit without nerfing your base damage. 3-shot or 2-shot you're dead either way.

Yin - Momaganon

Honestly, vitality at lower level don't make much difference on damage. The weapon you are using does. At higher level you can notice the difference. I have made pure magic, vitality cleric and around 50 points in vit and also LA cleric. All does fine at begin but when getting little higher level magic build is the best and most comfortable to play. Can't say much about difference on PvE and PvP server but I do PK on PvE server and magic build is my favourite.

Decus - Dreamweaver

SylenThunder - Sanctuary wrote: »

I'm sorry, but a pure build can solo nearly everything, including most of the bosses up until about 40.

Really? I don't ever remember being able to solo Chi'in, Yasheng, or Farng in my 2x's. Only ranged-magic bosses, and I had vit in my build.

50 vit isn't going to kill your mdef/heal power enough to not be able to solo the soloable bosses. It was common practice for a LONG time (as you should know, given your time in the game) to put in ~50 vit anyway. Those clerics seemed to do just fine, even with a lower standard of gear (no elder's blessing or cheap, easily-acquired molds).

SylenThunder - Twilight Temple

Back then it was 30 VIT, I did that. Then I discovered that 30 points to VIT took 1k of damage off of my base stats. Made a new cleric for testing, and was happily surprised when I was able to very successfully solo nearly everything. Note that I said nearly. You've listed the exceptions. I was able to do those three by the mid 40's though, even pure.

Point is, the VIT isn't worth it. Remember what a pain those archer mobs were over by Sumor htat you get in the 40's? VIT build was a struggle to get them killed. Kept having to pot and stop to heal. Pure build killed each of them before taking any damage. We're talking about fighting them at the same level as you get the quest, not later. Personally, that's a huge difference. Struggling and spending your coin on pots, or taking them down before they can hit you. Which would you prefer?

Learn from the mistakes of those of use that already lived them. It's easier to refine for 300hp than to make up for a loss of 1000 points to your base damage range.

VenusArmani - Dreamweaver

SylenThunder - Sanctuary wrote: »

Back then it was 30 VIT, I did that. Then I discovered that 30 points to VIT took 1k of damage off of my base stats. Made a new cleric for testing, and was happily surprised when I was able to very successfully solo nearly everything. Note that I said nearly. You've listed the exceptions. I was able to do those three by the mid 40's though, even pure.

Point is, the VIT isn't worth it. Remember what a pain those archer mobs were over by Sumor htat you get in the 40's? VIT build was a struggle to get them killed. Kept having to pot and stop to heal. Pure build killed each of them before taking any damage. We're talking about fighting them at the same level as you get the quest, not later. Personally, that's a huge difference. Struggling and spending your coin on pots, or taking them down before they can hit you. Which would you prefer?

Learn from the mistakes of those of use that already lived them. It's easier to refine for 300hp than to make up for a loss of 1000 points to your base damage range.

I actually didn't have to stop and pot to heal them. Instead I got right up in there faces, instead of kiting them. Destroyed them after 2-3 hits. If I recall correctly the mobs actually got a damage penalty if you got close to them. Killed every mob within 2-3 hits, and barely ever potted. In fact, I tend to not kite as often, because my p.def and vit can absorb the blow, and I don't kill them fast enough to take time away to kite. Not that I can't kite, I can and do when the boss calls for it, like when I'm helping someone out with Krimson. It really does come down to playstyle here. And I don't think someone in their 40s should be bothering with refines anyway. I wouldn't recommend refining at all personally, until tt70, with the exception of the tt60 weapon.

Either way, if you're going to go either build you're going to have to find ways to compensate for it. If you're going vit, I would suggest refining your weapons starting with the level 40 mold. Your weapon is going to have to help make up for some of the weaker damage. If you go pure, in the lower levels it would be best to +3 your various armor sets to make up for the lack of vit. Once you get higher level, your survivability comes mostly from your gear and you should be investing in shards in everything. It's at this point you can decide whether or not to restat. I personally restated for a while but then went back to vit because I just didn't like it.

Jeremied - Sanctuary

Wow, crazy discussions going on here. <.<''

I'll just input this. I raised a vit (30-50 vit) cleric to level 60 three or so years ago, because everyone told me I needed vit. >:( And I hated it. I died a lot and my heals sucked.

When I started this cleric, I made sure to use the pure magic build (1str 9 mag every two levels), and even now I NEVER die when solo questing. I used the same crappy blue gear that was on my old cleric at level 60, same weapon and armor, and breezed through the quests that I struggled so hard with on my first one. It made my gameplay much more entertaining.

I now have 3k hp unbuffed purely from shards and armor refines, and I rarely die in squads now. =D

BUT what everyone else is missing is that you don't sound like you have much experience past level 29 or with arcane armor wearing classes. So, what I say is to try and cap vit at 10 or 20, then use the pure magic build from then on. See how you like that. If you feel you need more vit later, add it. If not, stay full mag.

The extra vit in the lower levels will help you until you get gear that is actually worth it to refine and add shards to, and get used to healing. Then the mag from the pure magic build will help strengthen your heals and your attacks until endgame.

Note, once you get to about 54-55 base str, you can literally just pour every stat point into magic. 55 str is the limit needed to equip arcane R9 gear, which you may not be going for, but it's nice to have that extra point just in case.

When questing, attack a mob at your max range. If they hit you before you kill them, throw in a heal on yourself before or after each mob. Blessing of the Pure Hearted, your first, heal, is absolute garbage once you get your second heal, Ironheart Blessing. Don't level Blessing of the Pure Hearted, level 1 will help you survive until Ironheart fine. Ironheart actually stacks with itself up to 4 or 5 times. That's a LOT of healing. One cast before taking on a mob basically auto heals you.

Later on, you'll get Wellspring Surge, a much faster version of BoPH. Definitely level Wellspring, it's great at later levels.

Be aware, you're on a PvP server, and other players can attack you. Spam healing yourself with Ironheart can basically make you invincible against players your own level, at least until level 60 or so. If they one hit you though, you're toast either way. b:chuckle

Now, to squadding. <.< I'll edit this in so I'm not ninja'd off the first page.
EDIT: DARN IT. b:angry

Anyway, squadding. You're the healer. You CAN attack some things in dungeons, but it's preferred that you don't (unless you're lvl80 and you're in a lower level dungeon, then go nuts). Even when I squad with other clerics, I'm always the healer. Mostly because I hate having Aggro.

Oh, heal aggro. If the person you're about to heal has aggro'd a monster, but hasn't actually hit it yet, you can get heal aggro if you try to heal them. In otherwords, the monster is going to come eat your face because you healed someone. Make sure the person fighting the mobs hits them all at least once (Like, an aoe, a barbs roar, or literally going around and smacking each one once)before you start healing, or that there's someone watching your back to take mobs off of you if you get aggro. You'll learn about a tank's aggro control if you pull heal aggro more than 3 times.

Basically, being a cleric isn't that complicated to explain. We heal. We can DD and debuff things to heck, too, but I believe our main priority is healing. Let the other's have the high repair bills.

Sakubatou - Sanctuary

VenusArmani - Dreamweaver wrote: »

I actually didn't have to stop and pot to heal them. Instead I got right up in there faces, instead of kiting them. Destroyed them after 2-3 hits. If I recall correctly the mobs actually got a damage penalty if you got close to them. Killed every mob within 2-3 hits, and barely ever potted. In fact, I tend to not kite as often, because my p.def and vit can absorb the blow, and I don't kill them fast enough to take time away to kite. Not that I can't kite, I can and do when the boss calls for it, like when I'm helping someone out with Krimson. It really does come down to playstyle here. And I don't think someone in their 40s should be bothering with refines anyway. I wouldn't recommend refining at all personally, until tt70, with the exception of the tt60 weapon.

Either way, if you're going to go either build you're going to have to find ways to compensate for it. If you're going vit, I would suggest refining your weapons starting with the level 40 mold. Your weapon is going to have to help make up for some of the weaker damage. If you go pure, in the lower levels it would be best to +3 your various armor sets to make up for the lack of vit. Once you get higher level, your survivability comes mostly from your gear and you should be investing in shards in everything. It's at this point you can decide whether or not to restat. I personally restated for a while but then went back to vit because I just didn't like it.

The flip side being a pure cleric is more likely to kill a mob before it gets to them and take zero damage, where a vit cleric is more likely to be hit.

Personally, I always considered pure to have more survivability. Typically I would throw one IH on myself and be good for 15 seconds because my heals were so strong I could heal 2 or 3 attacks with each IH tick, meaning I could tank multiple mobs with 1 IH and had 15 seconds of full health while I killed them. No need to kite either. So in this case stonger heals > hp.

Also, stating to magic will help your magic defenses more than stating vitality. Once you hit about level 60 a majority of mobs will stay ranged and use magic attacks if you are ranged. The same with most bosses. In these cases magic > vitality.

Wouldn't... recommend... refining... until 70+ ? So BH59 levels? I kept a +2 on most my gear and sometimes +3 if it was easy. Now that I have money even my nubs have +4 - +6 but thats more than anyone needs at a low level. Maybe the reason you added vit was because you don't believe in refining?

I do agree with you that "Either way, if you're going to go either build you're going to have to find ways to compensate for it" but I think for squad dynamics its better to be the cleric with stronger heals and compensate for 10% less hp, than to be the cleric with weaker heals that has to find ways to compensate for that. Having played a barb I know its not usually the cleric that compensates for the weaker heals, its the tank. As a barb I always guess what the cleric can heal me through and base my pull sizes and my... suicidality? on that.

Eoria - Harshlands

Why does everyone bring up PVE when talking about vit? Your build really doesn't matter when it comes to PVE.

VenusArmani - Dreamweaver

Sakubatou - Sanctuary wrote: »

The flip side being a pure cleric is more likely to kill a mob before it gets to them and take zero damage, where a vit cleric is more likely to be hit.

Personally, I always considered pure to have more survivability. Typically I would throw one IH on myself and be good for 15 seconds because my heals were so strong I could heal 2 or 3 attacks with each IH tick, meaning I could tank multiple mobs with 1 IH and had 15 seconds of full health while I killed them. No need to kite either. So in this case stonger heals > hp.

Also, stating to magic will help your magic defenses more than stating vitality. Once you hit about level 60 a majority of mobs will stay ranged and use magic attacks if you are ranged. The same with most bosses. In these cases magic > vitality.

Wouldn't... recommend... refining... until 70+ ? So BH59 levels? I kept a +2 on most my gear and sometimes +3 if it was easy. Now that I have money even my nubs have +4 - +6 but thats more than anyone needs at a low level. Maybe the reason you added vit was because you don't believe in refining?

I do agree with you that "Either way, if you're going to go either build you're going to have to find ways to compensate for it" but I think for squad dynamics its better to be the cleric with stronger heals and compensate for 10% less hp, than to be the cleric with weaker heals that has to find ways to compensate for that. Having played a barb I know its not usually the cleric that compensates for the weaker heals, its the tank. As a barb I always guess what the cleric can heal me through and base my pull sizes and my... suicidality? on that.

Well, it really depends on how much vitality you stat as well. There is a point where it gets too much. I did have more vit, but I've found any more than 50 and you start to get diminishing returns. You say you didn't get hit, and thats fine. The time I was pure, I didn't get hit that often either. But when I did get hit, it was for a larger chunk of HP, and I could take hits less often. I ended up dying much more often, and it just did not suit my playstyle at all. In the end the whole "dead cleric heals no one" debate boils down to, what can you personally survive in? I don't like pure builds, and I've been pure. Was for (what felt like) a long time (but admittedly wasn't, though it was after tt70). It sucked for me, but I know some amazing pure builds. I know some amazing vit builds. I've never had a problem healing tanks, and have clericed through normal pulls, small pulls, big pulls, and OMFG what's wrong with you pulls; I can't believe we all just survived that pulls. And healed fine through all of them. Things like player reaction time is also important. Can you tell when someone is about to get hit, or are your eyes glued to the squad's hp bar? Those types of things make a big difference. For example, a lot of clerics like to do cylcone, plume shot, then whatever. But I noticed that cyclone actually aggros a half second before it actually hits, and so I usually do plume shot then cyclone.


XxXxXxXxXxXx

BH59 is mostly in the 70s, with the exception of zimo being thrown in every now and then for the 60s BH. BH59 I agree you could use a bit of refines for, but you don't do that instance regularly until your 70s, at which point you should be using tt70. I didn't refine anything but my weapon through BH51, and as long as I stayed out of range of the aoes in BH51 I managed just fine. Nowadays You level so quickly in that level range with the addition of the tideborn quests+BH anyway, that I just personally don't see the point.

edit 2: Oh and forgot to add this class depended, on my assassin I refined starting at level 40 because it's very easy for them to take aggro without even trying. And chill lasts so long that it's better to learn to aggro manage and take damage instead of throwing that on, unless you absolutely have to do so.

X_Chanelle_x - Sanctuary

Decus - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Really? I don't ever remember being able to solo Chi'in, Yasheng, or Farng in my 2x's. Only ranged-magic bosses, and I had vit in my build.

50 vit isn't going to kill your mdef/heal power enough to not be able to solo the soloable bosses. It was common practice for a LONG time (as you should know, given your time in the game) to put in ~50 vit anyway. Those clerics seemed to do just fine, even with a lower standard of gear (no elder's blessing or cheap, easily-acquired molds).

Back when I played my Cleric, I do remember I could solo Yansheng, Farng, Qingzi, Calcid, Trioc, Krixxix and stuff and my build was 1 Str, 6 Mag, 3 Vit every 2 lvls, but I ended up finding I had way too much Vit, cuz I lvled my Cleric till 79 then, so I think I had more than 100 base Vit. I think you could solo those bosses with a little less hp too.
Now I've made a new Cleric, my build is 1 Str, 8 Mag, 1 Vit every 2 lvls, but as I always said, all builds are personal, but especially the Clerics build is. It's all about your own preferences, whether you wanna be a heal Cleric, battle or combined and if you're gonna PvP or only PvE or stuff. I never PvP, so I don't have any experience with that.