Take fc back form seekers.

Reaperarm - Harshlands

Bleh its pointless.

Sakubatou - Sanctuary

Someone switched your h and f buttons over to d and g.

This is a fine technique for soloing, not great for squads. The main reasons are most clerics will have bb up and it really is your job to aggro outside first, while you triple spark others will attack the mobs and steal aggro, and if you HF you'll probably lose aggro since now you've amp'd the mobs for other dds. Not arguing against HFing, just arguing against doing it if you are the tank and want to keep aggro, although the hope is if you HF the mobs explode before they have a chance to go anywhere but thats dependent on the squads dd.

I would do a few things different:

-I like to aggro the mobs with a stun, so learn to slightly circle them to get them all together and then stun. Now you have aggro and breathing room while you run to bb. Your RoTP should be cooled down by the time you reach bb.
-I start with a Fissure to slow the mobs down and keep them from reaching me or running away at a dd, it also gives you a little bit of dd to prevent aggro change and it puts it in cd so it will be available again sooner.
-Stun again before you HF. This buys you a couple seconds to keep mobs from changing aggro to a dd.
-Bolt of Tyreseus. Chain it with your stun. This will keep mobs off your dds and still in your aoe range.

Reaperarm - Harshlands

Thanks for the input. And ya that nasty "dg" instead of hf has rubbed off me unfortunatly. I just gave up over the years after getting asked whats hf a million times lol. Your method is definitly more suited to a squad scenario and I thank you for clearing that up. Hopefully this helps a few of the newer bms out there. I've been lurkin these forums for a quite some time and usually never post but this problem with alot of players thinking only seekers can do it was bothering me so I felt I needed to speak up.b:thanks

Also, the solo method i described in my first post allows for much larger pulls and faster kills of those pulls when aoe grinding on the open map. For any newer bms that might be reading.

One more thing. My method even with just tt90 axes would have enough damage output to solo atleast half the room while keeping the bm completely healed from bp returns. The rest of the squad could literally sit there and do nothing if they wanted. I know from experience cause I have done it.

PotatoHeadQR - Dreamweaver

it's funny when you join a squad with something like cleric,bm, 3xwiz/arch/psy and someone asks "can we do the room without seeker?"

i'm like, no, we used to kill mobs one by one before seekers xD
but tbh, bp'ed seekers make it pretty easy.
http://www.quickmeme.com/meme/3p2yn4/

PheosNyx - Sanctuary

xD I've personally never had that problem of people calling for a seeker over a bm (granted my bm has been out of primary fcc range for the better part of two years, but i fcc all the time on 5 other toons). If they're not willing to take you chances are they're one of those people who powerleveled, too. BM ftw. The only time i've had a distaste for a bm puller is when they drag them right into my BB and my cleric is forced to tank mobs because of heal aggro and then utterly not only not gain any exp because I died but lost exp because I was forced to town/scroll (because of this I got to the point where I refused to BB until a hit had been made until I discovered AD, but alas this scenario was about just as long ago as fc on my bm lulz).

My only other thought on this is that I've been a few squads with 4k hp bm's because they're pure power-leveled apsers with no gear. Noobs have given us a bad name

Maelael - Heavens Tear

http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showpost.php?p=16348181&postcount=5
http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showpost.php?p=16408821&postcount=26

If people are demanding seekers for FF/FC/FCC, and picking a Seeker over a BM, they're doing it wrong and you should go FF/FC/FCC with better players who know their class.

PheosNyx - Sanctuary wrote: »

My only other thought on this is that I've been a few squads with 4k hp bm's because they're pure power-leveled apsers with no gear. Noobs have given us a bad name

And the noob Barbs with 7k, the noob seekers with 4k, the noob casters with 3k, yadda yadda. I'm not saying be an elitist buthead on gear, but at least be geared appropriately and take people geared appropriately. Undergeared and Underplayed = fail.

A GOOD, well played BM can pull that room at 4khp. Hell a GOOD, well played Psy can pull that room at 4khp. If the rest of the party is sitting there warming their thumbs with their behind when you bring in the room then the problem is the group...not the puller.

jabq

Maelael - Heavens Tear wrote: »

b:dirty
A GOOD, well played BM can pull that room at 4khp. Hell a GOOD, well played Psy can pull that room at 4khp. If the rest of the party is sitting there warming their thumbs with their behind when you bring in the room then the problem is the group...not the puller.

I never understood this, any class can pull the room. Just need speed skills and holy path for pulling. If the puller is a sin/caster, the bm just has to time their stun, cleric use AD/expel for safety and all is good. I do fcc with a friend, we are two bms, sure 100+, and have demon hf, but two characters aoe, kills them in under 9 seconds, so why can't the aoe from 5 people do it in 6~8 seconds? Assuming 80+ characters in class, and hoping for the off-chance that their max dd aoe skill is lvl 10 and not lvl 1

Kalish - Lost City

You know Seekers can triple spark, cloud erupt and vortex too? They can also have it set up and waiting for someone to drag the mobs into it too.

You aren't going to "take back fc" from them, they are simply the easiest class (I won't necessarily say best) for that one specific role in that one specific instance.

I do agree though, they certainly aren't needed and groups who won't do BR until they get one are stupid. I just don't see why this post was needed, the idiots that refuse to go without a Seeker are likely those very same idiots who do not research their class (or others) on the forums.

Reaperarm - Harshlands

Kalish - Lost City wrote: »

You know Seekers can triple spark, cloud erupt and vortex too? They can also have it set up and waiting for someone to drag the mobs into it too.

You aren't going to "take back fc" from them, they are simply the easiest class (I won't necessarily say best) for that one specific role in that one specific instance.

I do agree though, they certainly aren't needed and groups who won't do BR until they get one are stupid. I just don't see why this post was needed, the idiots that refuse to go without a Seeker are likely those very same idiots who do not research their class (or others) on the forums.

Ya I know they can do the same. Just tryin to help out some of the bms out there. The nice thing about the bm though is they can pull and do the aoeing without having somone pull the mobs to them. Unlike a seeker who if they tryed would mostly likely be interrupted quite a few times tryin to setup vortex and possibly die. My main point in my original post was to prove that bms can do it just as well and that a seeker is not required. Like you said though ( the idiots that refuse to go without a seeker) dont really deserve a skilled player of any sort in their squad imo.

laloner

If there's a BM and no seeker why doesn't the BM just stun and and then HF while the archer/wiz whatever AOEs.

Maelael - Heavens Tear

Reaperarm - Harshlands wrote: »

The nice thing about the bm though is they can pull and do the aoeing without having somone pull the mobs to them. Unlike a seeker who if they tryed would mostly likely be interrupted quite a few times tryin to setup vortex and possibly die.

By this post: you play with absolute idiots, or don't know the seeker class well/at all. Seekers can pull the whole room 80+, and setup vortex just fine/easy. Hell, I've watched an 82 seeker pull the whole room, setup vortex, and solo it with BP & BB. They weren't even overgeared either...TT80, +2/+3 refines.

Really, the people who "need to know this" are people who don't read the BM forums.

Rant away, though.

PotatoHeadQR - Dreamweaver

well, when i play my seeker i would prefer if someone else pulls; makes things easier. but it's not like setting vortex after pull is hard:

at the 3rd-2nd group before last activate hypers, blade affinity, apo (optional) hp to the last group and setup vortex

the chance to get interrupted by one group is pretty low and even if that happens you have a few secs to try again.

or you could just AD/sutra but usually my genie's energy is pretty low due to HP (if i dont have archer buff) and i use the pdef apo just to be sure.

the only drawback is that the rest of the group should move to you

Reaperarm - Harshlands

Maelael - Heavens Tear wrote: »

By this post: you play with absolute idiots, or don't know the seeker class well/at all. Seekers can pull the whole room 80+, and setup vortex just fine/easy. Hell, I've watched an 82 seeker pull the whole room, setup vortex, and solo it with BP & BB. They weren't even overgeared either...TT80, +2/+3 refines.

Really, the people who "need to know this" are people who don't read the BM forums.

Rant away, though.

I dont play with idiots lol. I dont even fc and havnt for a very long time.All you have to do is take a peek at my join date to realize that. The post was just to help the newer bms out that dont have a clue since i have many ask me ingame how to do it effectively. It makes no difference to me really and im not ranting lol. I guess its a lost cause. This is my last post in this thread.b:bye

Maelael - Heavens Tear

Reaperarm - Harshlands wrote: »

I dont play with idiots lol. I dont even fc and havnt for a very long time.All you have to do is take a peek at my join date to realize that. The post was just to help the newer bms out that dont have a clue since i have many ask me ingame how to do it effectively. It makes no difference to me really and im not ranting lol. I guess its a lost cause. This is my last post in this thread.b:bye

Not that Im saying you're a liar, you'll check the thread again. We all do that when we say it, which is why I dont say that anymore

YES, there are a lot of BMs who don't have a clue. If you really want to help them out, write a guide (or two), but phrase it something along the lines of less reactionary...and more about the BM class, and working with the other classes.

I've said many times I'd have a hard time putting into words how to manage FF/FC/FCC well. I think a video would be preferable imho, when I teach I just drag them through the zone with me (and I teach Barbs, BMs, and Seekers on my Barb or BM). If you think you can do it constructively, please do so. If you've got the passion, direct it well in the right light, and people will read it.

Speaking of, I should prolly do something with my guide to solo AOEing soon. Every time I do base quest, or go out and DQ grind I see BMs APSing down 5 mobs while I AOE 10 and am already rounding up 10 more.

Aasaf - Sanctuary

Maelael - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Every time I do base quest, or go out and DQ grind I see BMs APSing down 5 mobs while I AOE 10 and am already rounding up 10 more.

Guilty as charged, i have bp, i just auto attack, no mp being used. My axes are too weak to kill mobs in 2~4 hits, if i go with another friend or more. I hf, they aoe, mobs are dead, life is happy.

SpazzMcAps - Harshlands

.....--

supertroyman1

Reaperarm - Harshlands wrote: »

Thanks for the input. And ya that nasty "dg" instead of hf has rubbed off me unfortunatly. I just gave up over the years after getting asked whats hf a million times lol. Your method is definitly more suited to a squad scenario and I thank you for clearing that up. Hopefully this helps a few of the newer bms out there. I've been lurkin these forums for a quite some time and usually never post but this problem with alot of players thinking only seekers can do it was bothering me so I felt I needed to speak up.b:thanks

Also, the solo method i described in my first post allows for much larger pulls and faster kills of those pulls when aoe grinding on the open map. For any newer bms that might be reading.

One more thing. My method even with just tt90 axes would have enough damage output to solo atleast half the room while keeping the bm completely healed from bp returns. The rest of the squad could literally sit there and do nothing if they wanted. I know from experience cause I have done it.

yeah it is a very common misconseption that u HAVE to havea seeker to do bigroom. most ppl just prefer it cuz with vortex up they can let loose on there dd without worrying about drawing agro. bms can handle almost as good as barbs it just feels easyer with seeker. although once u reach 100+ none of that matters cuz mobs die instantly.

Saethos - Raging Tide

I've heard the "Seekers can tripple spark vortex like you can tripple spark HF too" argument far too often...

Well...I can tripple spark, use a god's tea (White tea is saved for TW) use my demon GS and get a chance to get 100% crits for 5 seconds (Hell, if it doesn't do the buff, that's still 50% defense reduction), cloud erruption, HF, and belt out AoEs like no tomorrow all in one macro...4 clicks... Usually able to pinch in 3 AoEs before the 100% crit runs out, then another 3~5 before HF runs ot (totaling between 6-8 skills with HF) and really, that combo will hurt just about anything...

Granted, squad work sometimes means ****** the macro, you gotta make with what you got, and running 99+ FC runs it doesn't matter who has aggro, mobs drop instantly in a pull...