Are BMs inferior to psychics?

MsDominatrix - Heavens Tear

Had a little run in with an arrogant psychic who said that BMs suck in general. This came after I lost a duel with said psychic. Granted, I'm not the best at duels or PVP, so just wanted opinions from the more experienced BMs?

_Mg_Zr - Heavens Tear

What point of view are you taking this from, if it was from a pve point of view then bms are better but in pvp psychics have a better advantage

TheDan - Sanctuary

At end game R9 +12 they're 1 shot-able in black voodoo, but it's all based on genie set up and timing.

Maelael - Heavens Tear

What Dan said, and check out his PvP Guide.

Until you get experienced (Example: Dan), you tend to have a hard time with some of the classes (Example: Me), Psys are one of them for sure.

Ideally:

-Find a buddy Psy and do some test duels with them.

-Check out the psy skills in http://www.ecatomb.net/skillpwi.php.

-Get to know the status effects of Soul of Stunning, Soul of Retaliation, Soul of Vengeance, Black Voodoo, and White Voodoo. Also learn about Psychic Will.

Also, a lot of Psy are arrogant, and in many cases, rightfully so. There are two on HT I really, really, really despise (In a friendly gaming way) due to being constantly destroyed in TW by them

T_i_m - Dreamweaver

Yes, bm's are inferior.

SpazzMcAps - Harshlands

T_i_m - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Yes, bm's are inferior.

^that

_Mg_Zr - Heavens Tear

Maelael - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Also, a lot of Psy are arrogant, and in many cases, rightfully so. There are two on HT I really, really, really despise (In a friendly gaming way) due to being constantly destroyed in TW by them

I know more than two on HT that sound like that

Drunken_Chu - Dreamweaver

PVE - BMs > Psychichs
PVP - BMS < Psychics

Hexalot - Dreamweaver

TheDan - Sanctuary wrote: »

At end game R9 +12 they're 1 shot-able in black voodoo, but it's all based on genie set up and timing.

Maybe so but with extremely high soul force and assuming equal skill... the Psychic should still win the vast majority of fights between the two. There is simply a built in imbalance between the two classes that BMs in general can do little about.

TheDan - Sanctuary

Hexalot - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Maybe so but with extremely high soul force and assuming equal skill... the Psychic should still win the vast majority of fights between the two. There is simply a built in imbalance between the two classes that BMs in general can do little about.

Maybe I've never fought someone with equal skill then, (trolololol j/k). All jokes aside, yes, with raw skills, psychics do have an advantage - BUT, all imbalances can be made up for with genies. I'm mostly +11 and have fought top ranked +12 psychics and had only minor difficulties taking them down (the rare exception happened to be demon psychics that kept chi draining me oddly so I couldn't really combo). Then again, my 91LP + 105 dex genie has a 2.5 second regen and a 30% reduction wind shield and 90% badge of courage rate so they can be tanked pretty easy.

If you can be quick and catch them in black voodoo they are very very squishy. Observe carefully; psychics will often switch from white to black voodoo after you're stunned. During the duration of their white voodoo I just build chi off of them with my purge spear and spam meteor rush/aoelian blade for no chi loss. If you have badge, you can pop out of stun and counter-stun while they are black voodoo'd and my favorite combo - dragon bane + extreme poison + zerk crit away. Use HF + extreme poison sparingly, as it costs 2 sparks and they can immune pot it, so only use it if you know their genie / apoth are in cool-down.

MsDominatrix - Heavens Tear

TheDan what you are suggesting is an incredible amount of timing and precision that comes with loads of practice.

Probably will have to try mass PVP in west Arch soon.

Maybe, just maybe. I don't have the confidence too. Everyone seems so overpowered in terms of gear.

ineye11

Yes.

Psychics in black would just apot and laugh at your miserable attempt to stun them.

For real dumb nuts here it comes with commentaries:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JsZPHsTCwms

It's kay to have faith bro

Maelael - Heavens Tear

MsDominatrix - Heavens Tear wrote: »

TheDan what you are suggesting is an incredible amount of timing and precision that comes with loads of practice.

Probably will have to try mass PVP in west Arch soon.

Maybe, just maybe. I don't have the confidence too. Everyone seems so overpowered in terms of gear.

MsD you have mail.

Maelael - Heavens Tear

ineye11 wrote: »

Yes.

Psychics in black would just apot and laugh at your miserable attempt to stun them.

For real dumb nuts here it comes with commentaries:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JsZPHsTCwms

It's kay to have faith bro

ineye, you have no idea what you're watching, do you? Your choice of Youtube video practically invalidates your response.

TheDan - Sanctuary

I could point out several flaws with that video:

- That video is a full buffed 1v1 (main flaw)
- The BM is a vit BM
- They never leaped
- They never used chi drain
- They didn't have badge or whirlwind on genie

I wouldn't consider anything other than self buffed 1v1 official. My analysis of 1v1s between classes are based off self buffs because no one 1v1s full buffed. Whoever purges first would auto-win, that's dumb.

MsDominatrix - Heavens Tear wrote: »

TheDan what you are suggesting is an incredible amount of timing and precision that comes with loads of practice.

Probably will have to try mass PVP in west Arch soon.

Maybe, just maybe. I don't have the confidence too. Everyone seems so overpowered in terms of gear.

I guess it's coming from someone who's had years of practice so it may be easier said than done, but not impossible.

ineye11

Dude ... I must be the best dumb nut baiter in the world

@malalel: I must admit I have no idea what's going on. My ears are disconnected from my brain .. so even if i hear something I don't understand it ! Real nut !!
But that is just a full buffed R9 BM with 20k HP gettin toyed around.
U must be so good ... I am sure you would do better right ?

-> 1/ Since when vits stone is fail ?
-> 2/ BM use whirlwind as soon as he catch the psychic in black ? But guess what psychic has a genie too ... Oh woo that is a surprise !
-> 3/ Wtfkinhell badge's gonna change seriously ?
-> 4/ Without those cleric buff he'd be one shot or maybe half one shot no ?

I'm not gonna argue anymore

I quit !

b:surrender

Maelael - Heavens Tear

ineye11 wrote: »

Dude ... I must be the best dumb nut baiter in the world

@malalel: I must admit I have no idea what's going on. My ears are disconnected from my brain .. so even if i hear something I don't understand it !!!
But that is just a full buffed R9 BM with 20k HP gettin toyed around.
U must be so good ... I am sure you would do better right ?

-> 1/ Since when vits stone is fail ?
-> 2/ BM use whirlwind as soon as he catch the psychic in black ? But guess what psychic has a genie too ... Oh woo that is a surprise !
-> 3/ Wtfkinhell badge's gonna change seriously ?
-> 4/ Without those cleric buff he'd be one shot or maybe half one shot no ?

I'm not gonna argue anymore

I quit !

b:surrender

ineye, Im a PK noob and I even know better.

TheDan - Sanctuary

ineye11 wrote: »

Dude ... I must be the best dumb nut baiter in the world

@malalel: I must admit I have no idea what's going on. My ears are disconnected from my brain .. so even if i hear something I don't understand it !!!
But that is just a full buffed R9 BM with 20k HP gettin toyed around.
U must be so good ... I am sure you would do better right ?

-> 1/ Since when vits stone is fail ?
-> 2/ BM use whirlwind as soon as he catch the psychic in black ? But guess what psychic has a genie too ... Oh woo that is a surprise !
-> 3/ Wtfkinhell badge's gonna change seriously ?
-> 4/ Without those cleric buff he'd be one shot or maybe half one shot no ?

I'm not gonna argue anymore

I quit !

b:surrender

1. Vit BM =/= Vit stone sharded BM, that is purely attribute stat points. There's no reason to have anything other than 3 base vit unless they lack gear. I have 23K HP buffed with 3 vit, vit is not necessary at all.
2. That's already assuming they use genie skills - expel or their immune phys skill, whirlwind then roar can stun through physical immune.
3. Badge means pretty much everything... Soul of stunning can be a 10-12 second stun if they have enough soul-force as a sage. That's enough for someone to land a full triple spark worth of attacks on you. Why the f*** wouldn't you have badge?
4. The BM would lose 60% magic defense compared to the psychic losing 135-150% physical defense from combined aura of golden bell / vanguard spirit. Full buffs clearly favor the psychic more.

/...

ineye11

It's okay bro u must be rite ...

Will surge (if fist)/Law breaker (if R9/G15 zerk axes), Badge, AD, Extreme Poison, whirlwind, windshield lv10, holy path, chi siphon or cloud eruption in that order of priority

I just love how u pick every single genie skill hmm on a dex genie:

Badge: 75 energy
AD: 135 energy
Extreme Poison: 50 energy
Whirlwind: 45 energy
windshield lv10: 62 energy
holy path: 70 energy
chi siphon: lmao
cloud eruption: 130 energy

The only single moment u can land a kill, u would need to use 1/2 genie skill => genie is depleted.

Not including the energy u would use to survive ... If u can take more than 1 hit that is.

Ok let's assume you got that stun on expel or psychic will.

Expel 9sec > psychic will 8sec > drake bash 7.5sec > demon roar 6sec

Not speaking of channeling time so you don't be mad too much.

Not speaking of apots so you don't be mad too much aswell.

I mean psychic gotta love running around in black yes ?

b:kiss

IronCloud - Lost City

Psychics are ridiculously hard to kill and hit like trucks. They have insane utility and control skills. However, with r9 axes highly refined and some know-how, bm can actually ruin a psychics day. But there's always an element of luck or chance because of zerks and crits. A good genie makes all the difference imo.

MsDominatrix - Heavens Tear

Maelael - Heavens Tear wrote: »

MsD you have mail.

Really? I'm so honored!

Maelael - Heavens Tear

Pfft don't be. I just don't like to bash people too much on open forums (its not aimed at you, obviously).

CrusherJam - Dreamweaver

Bms suck hard (sarcasm off)

btw. thanks Tim for my cape :-)

Maelael - Heavens Tear

CrusherJam - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Bms suck hard (sarcasm off)

Hey now, when Im on the corner down by south tele...

DemShadow - Raging Tide

Maybe I'm a bit late to post this but maybe I'm not.

People of all servers in this game long took Humans out of the equation and exiled them as complete ****. This is wrong as no class is truely a bad class. BMs are no different. BladeMasters are probably one of the most unique classes put into the game and with the right person and strategy behind one, can take on anything. There's a reason they were used much more before the TideBorn and EarthGuard showed up... Hate if ya want to, but you know I'm right.

CrusherJam - Dreamweaver

Maelael - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Hey now, when Im on the corner down by south tele...

Bahahah

TheDan - Sanctuary

ineye11 wrote: »

It's okay bro u must be rite ...



I just love how u pick every single genie skill hmm on a dex genie:

Badge: 75 energy
AD: 135 energy
Extreme Poison: 50 energy
Whirlwind: 45 energy
windshield lv10: 62 energy
holy path: 70 energy
chi siphon: lmao
cloud eruption: 130 energy

The only single moment u can land a kill, u would need to use 1/2 genie skill => genie is depleted.

Not including the energy u would use to survive ... If u can take more than 1 hit that is.

Ok let's assume you got that stun on expel or psychic will.

Expel 9sec > psychic will 8sec > drake bash 7.5sec > demon roar 6sec

Not speaking of channeling time so you don't be mad too much.

Not speaking of apots so you don't be mad too much aswell.

I mean psychic gotta love running around in black yes ?

b:kiss

I gave different genie set up skills based off of what build the BM is, you don't get both cloud and chi siphon, it's one or the other. That's why they have a "/" or "or" next to them, it indicates you don't get both. /facepalm

R9 +12 BMs can 1 shot a R9 +12 Psy in black voodoo, I've zerk crit R9 +12 psys for 18.5k no spark no HF in black voodoo self buffed 1v1, meaning I could have hit for 37K with HF. Psychics would be lucky to 2 shot a R9 +12 BM while triple sparked. You tell me who needs to use more energy to stay alive - 75 energy badge or 125 energy expel. Not to mention BMs can build chi off psychics while they can't attack back, and psychic will can't be casted while stunned. Better stay in white voodoo bro. b:bye

ineye11

R9 +12 BMs can 1 shot a R9 +12 Psy in black voodoo

I very highly doubt this, or maybe on fail psychics without pdef ornaments which is fail indeed and nothing to be pride of.

I really would like to know how to one shot this http://pwcalc.com/c8270564a478ddc3 with your amazin 2sec channeling skills and not get facerolled in a one shot.

Not to mention BMs can build chi off psychics while they can't attack back

This is funny too, because you're not dealin any damage to the white psychic. You're gettin stunned/silenced/immobilized all day. U won't drain faster than they chi up with your fail dex genie which is more fail since it doesn't drain properly.


Those are miserable attempts to justify failures choices.

TheDan - Sanctuary

ineye11 wrote: »

I very highly doubt this, or maybe on fail psychics without pdef ornaments which is fail indeed and nothing to be pride of.

I really would like to know how to one shot this http://pwcalc.com/c8270564a478ddc3 with your amazin 2sec channeling skills and not get facerolled in a one shot.

I can post triple sparked builds like a punk too. And yeah, 12.5K isn't very hard to hit on 8K phys def at all; maybe you've never played a psychic in a proper 1v1 before with self buffs. My 18.5K was dealt on a +12 jaded psy with +10 cv magic rings and a G16 + 12 neck, with just extreme poison and drake bash zerk crit with jones on and an attack rune. The +12 G15 might rings would add 2K phys def or 12% reduction, big whoop. It'd also lower your base magic attack by 10%.

http://pwcalc.com/1e13a171cf4dff5a

ineye11 wrote: »

This is funny too, because you're not dealin any damage to the white psychic. You're gettin stunned/silenced/immobilized all day. U won't drain faster than they chi up with your fail dex genie which is more fail since it doesn't drain properly.

I concur, it's funny, because you think you know what I'm talking about, but you really don't. The silences don't proc when psychics don't take damage with expel up, so they are a chi toy for a BM to quickly change to fists and WoB. And the point of a dex genie isn't to chi drain. Chi drain skills only go well with str build genies, the point of the dex genie is badge. I guess everyone knew except you. Mo zun taunt is good enough as it cools down twice as fast as master li's to cancel out triple spark with vac powder.

ineye11 wrote: »

Those are miserable attempts to justify failures choices.

Spoken like a true failure.

Dai_Viper - Archosaur

ineye11 wrote: »

I very highly doubt this, or maybe on fail psychics without pdef ornaments which is fail indeed and nothing to be pride of.

I really would like to know how to one shot this http://pwcalc.com/c8270564a478ddc3 with your amazin 2sec channeling skills and not get facerolled in a one shot.



This is funny too, because you're not dealin any damage to the white psychic. You're gettin stunned/silenced/immobilized all day. U won't drain faster than they chi up with your fail dex genie which is more fail since it doesn't drain properly.


Those are miserable attempts to justify failures choices.

why would u try to tank as a psy?

XCableX - Archosaur

Dai_Viper - Archosaur wrote: »

why would u try to tank as a psy?

I beat Dai_Viper all day with +4 GXs... untill the PK tourney happens and I don't expect him at all.


haha, kidding, I love you too.b:cute