Caster Nirv

FatalFem - Heavens Tear

I am so tired of the hypocrites. All the casters whine and cry that no one wants them in regular Nirvana. (I take them myself by that isn't the point). They whine that people only want aps or that casters are too slow casting etc. What I continue to see is this:

Casters asking for peoples weapon refines in world chat and them only wanting specific classes to go on caster Nirvanas.

I'd like to know how this is ANY different from the people doing regular Nirvana discriminating against those who do not have aps or highly refined weapons? Its a double standard and I don't see why anyone would continue to complain that they aren't a caster wanted for regular Nirvana when they are specific in the weapon refine and type of caster they want for caster Nirvana.

Quit being hypocrites people!

RageKill - Lost City

I brought up this same exact point in a different caster nv thread. Ya figure since casters are discriminated against for regular nv they would be a little nicer with caster nv.. but nope.

_Nei_ - Sanctuary

I'm agree with you, during 2x times I see several times wc's asking for a good DD with +10 weapon and link the weapon....
I have to say I did just a few caster runs, and with a bad squad it takes ages and lots of deaths. Pretty much it happens when people do not know how to run a caster vana.

Sometimes a +10 weapon does not mean your going to be able to 'help' better in DD, sometimes is the player knowledge about his class and also the proper time to use debuff skills and genie debuffs on bosses.

MiniST - Sanctuary

the thing is, the longer it takes the more annoying caster vana gets. The first two bosses are ok, you can take your time. But from there on, without sufficient DD, it's gonna be so painful. For example, the fourth boss, it's attacks get stronger and stronger the longer you take. So, if you don't have enough DD, you are gonna fail. And the last boss is on a 10 min timer. So after the 6th buff it does, it just totally wipe the squad. I'm not saying you need r9+12, but you need sufficient DD or you are gonna fail. This ties into why some classes are asked and not other, it's because they already have the not asked class in squad. All classes have an role in caster vana.
Cleric: Heal
Psy/Wiz/Mystic: Major DD
Veno: Amplify (Now that every boss is ampable)

MoonsMyst - Heavens Tear

am from your server so i will replay u, yes i am one of those who wanna see someones wepon, minimum requirement is tt99 wepon and desired hp is 4500,
why link wepon coz we dont wanna have ppl with tt90 wepons in squad coz dmg is simple to small or those ppl who just got new map wepon.
kiling all those boses for us casters takes time, we cant do it fast as u aps-er so havin good wepon to kil it fast is nesecery.
its not like u aps ppl r saints, u2 ask for aps+link wepon.
And now this about clas, well we dont wanna have more than 2 clerics in squadd, 1 wizy is nesecery to same as 2 clerics r, if one bb is interupted other cleric set his bb up, wizy is mostly needed for number 3 bos mostly to DB adds, so thats 3 man, rest 3 can be any other caster clas.
edit: if u notice someone wanna +10 wepon on our server it can only be ppl from enrage who wanna do 3 or 4 man squad as mostly those major tw guilds have lots of greed in them self.

Queenofpower - Dreamweaver

The last boss in Caster Nirv has to be killed quickly as it starts hitting harder and harder.....atleast some casters with refined weps needed. When I make squads if we have 1 or 2 +12 then i invite even TT99 wep players. Though people in casters ask you to pm your wep....mostly people with OK refines get in. Normal nirvy however is ridiculous....nowadays not just +10 poor BMs even need demon HF.....and common casters is 6 people (99% squads) Normal nirvy squads being limited to 2-3.......Casters have all the rights to QQ atm.

SmurfJegeren - Dreamweaver

I find it way more hypocrite when a person ask for weapon link, and got a very poor weapon himself. I have as a rule to not join a squad if the person ask for a wep link(I PM class only wether they ask for wep link in WC or not), and quite oftenly come across a person forming with a very poor weapon. And then "rides" the run on the other peoples in squad.

For example:

Former: +3 TT99
First peep: +10 R8
Second peep: +7 G13 Nirvy
Third peep: +12 G15 Nirvy
Fourth: +10 R8
Fifth: +5 R8

If youre one of the weaker, I can see how you need some higher help to get where you need to be. But discriminating entirely because of weapon and refine when youre even a part of the group youre discriminating.. thats even worse b:bye

Takeva - Heavens Tear

OMG. Do the last boss in casters with a couple of you with tt90 weap +5. He's timed btw.

And just like you said you'd take some caster with you, your not majority of the player base who refuse. I only ask for tt99+. If you don't have your tt99 weapon then you shouldn't be doing nirvana yet. You should be doing the tts you need to get it.

If people do ask for higher then tt99 then, so what? That only means they want faster runs just like an aps class does. Just not MAJORITY of us are like that. Get through your head that most aps melee are a bunch of stuck people that are to good to have slow runs because of a caster. Your only one of the few that will allow anyone not 4.0+ in your squad.

SerenityCNB - Dreamweaver

It is a double standard, and you are right. Its not exactly fair, but as others have said, there is more of a reason as to why...given the nature of some of the bosses. I still agree that its not fair though, and not the way that things should be however.

@Smurf: I agree. If someone asks for a weapon link, I do ignore it. I ignore it even moreso, since my weapon is actually a TT99, +3 weapon. LMAO. I don't really feel like running with people who exclude others due to their weapon, gear, or what they can or cannot afford at the moment. Its just not my style, or suited to me, and I agree that some are riding the coattails of others, so I can't blame you for not joining either.

maocchi

MoonsMyst - Heavens Tear wrote: »

kiling all those boses for us casters takes time, we cant do it fast as u aps-er so havin good wepon to kil it fast is nesecery.

I don't know why some casters think just being 5aps automatically means high damage.
Someone could have a +3 weapon and be 5aps but it's practically worthless. A squad full of them would take just as long as a slow Caster Nirvana.

Everyone has the same mindset, casters and aps alike. Nobody wants slow runs, just completing the instance is never enough.

Takeva - Heavens Tear

maocchi wrote: »

I don't know why some casters think just being 5aps automatically means high damage.
Someone could have a +3 weapon and be 5aps but it's practically worthless. A squad full of them would take just as long as a slow Caster Nirvana.

Everyone has the same mindset, casters and aps alike. Nobody wants slow runs, just completing the instance is never enough.

This.

Fast runs are nice but I rather not exclude all of my friends I like to caster with. I just would like to do more. b:chuckle

Accalica - Heavens Tear

I'm on the same server as you and I don't really see these 'disciriminating squads' very often.
What you're refering to with classes is the balancing system. Then if there are some greedy people out there asking for weapon links that can't balance a squad properly without OP people, go ahead and bash them. Not every caster is the same tho as u just stated it.

Just because u see someone WC for a certain caster type, it doesnt mean they've banned the others. It most of the time means they already have them and are using the same system as me or one of their own to balance the squad out.

There's a certain way of setting up a caster squad for it to go as smooth as possible, but you don't necessarily have to. I bring all classes in the caster range, but yes, for the squads sake unless I know the players within it, I will not take more than 2 of any class because today alot of people straight out fail their job or being versatile with it. A cleric can be a 3rd DD if they use CE properly and spark/use their debuff, but if u end up with 2 clerics squad healing over a BB constantly and refuse to DD or the other way around, u're in big trouble in caster, hence I don't do it unless I know the players.

As for weapon ask PWI why they made the bosses frenzy or hit 2-4k while debuffing our channeling (which can't really be purified for longer than maybe 3seconds once u hit that bad state) take a combo of 4-6k hpd casters with slow chan and a BB that gets knocked. Once u've hit your pot and used your genie skill, BB will probably still not be up - it's a deadly combo that can only be solved by speed. There's the answer to the question why most of us squad makers chose players with tt99+ weps. It tells me that even if 1 out of the 6 decides to randomly afk 10sec between every hit of theirs, or the veno decides not to amp more than once each boss and no purging, we will still make it. It's mainly on my behalf a security issue more than discriminating anyone.

_Ink_ - Raging Tide

So funny..I've been thinking this very thing, so it's nice to know others have noticed. As a veno, people generally don't care about my gear. Let's face it, I'm basically a walking sage amp. But I've had a person QQ about my gear before. "Omg, tell me you have better gear and you're about to change into it."

I have R7 gear so far, it's not the best but it's by no means bad. So I just ignore people like that.

What I hate about going into Nirv are the people who play like they're Helen Keller and then try and tell me how to do -my- job. Yesterday there was a fool barb who apparently had it out for me. Yelled at me at the first boss because they went rushing in without saying a word just as the BM asked me for chi. So I gave him chi and holy pathed in and automatically he was on my ***, calling me "veno". When I told him I had a name I was informed that "Ink" is too difficult. >_>

And from there he proceeded to try and lecture me about using ironwood with amp, which is what I do every time since it's part of my macro.

So what I think this game needs is more people to pull their heads out of their bums and actually stop thinking they know everything and are better than everyone else. Not every squad needs to be 5APS or +10, we go into Nirv knowing there may be death. Having fun is the whole point of playing a game, and it seems like people have completely forgotten about that.

Nymphali - Dreamweaver

Thought it was another QQing thread b:embarrass

Desdi - Sanctuary

I'm not in favour of asking for a weapon link and I never ask for one but it's also true that if the DD power requirements for a successful caster nirvana aren't met, the run is bound to fail due to the way bosses are programmed, last boss in partcular. Note that I said DD power requirements, not speed. (omg need rank9 to do this!!11)

It has been stated, as well, that all classes are wanted in caster Nirvana but when x spot is filled they will obviously stop accepting the x class.

I've been to a couple of "slow" Nirvanas, so to speak. We ended up getting wipes a few times by the 4th boss, while the last boss ended up being undoable. Think of it like the 3rd boss in regular Nirvana.

Both Nirvanas require a certain amount of DD power in order to be successful due to the way the bosses have been programmed that clearly hint towards the logic of "the longer it takes to kill, the harder it gets.". Well, many bosses throughout PWI work like that but Nirvana ones are the worse (along with those particular TT3-x bosses after TT was changed to be more "challenging").

This leads to people wanting and asking for good weapons. The better weapons available, the higher the standard gets which leads to elitism and such. It's also because many many players are unaware of how good teamwork and coordination is the key; timing debuffs and skills, knowing what to do and when to do it.

Also, honestly if by lvl 100 you don't have a TT99 weapon then you need to stop powerleveling. It's not impossible to farm coins or TT mats to make TT99 weapon. If you have an FCC or Lunar one which you choose as your endgame weapon but have lowly refines, then you're doing something wrong there too. I'm not expecting people at lvl 100 with rank8 and whatnot but not having simple things anyone can farm is just....

Nareeah - Lost City

i try not to go with random squads
mostly it's a party from my FL and most of us have r8 +6 or more and we're a good team so we don't have problems in CNV but at the beginning i've had some fails.... it's virtually impossible to do 2 last bosses without enough DD hence why certain reqs need to be met.

I've seen lvl 100 EPs with 3k HP getting into pt and ended up being kicked. Why? Well would u take a 3k HP sin with u in squad? No u wouldn't cuz he/she WILL die. Fact. Call it elitistic or w.e but atleast 4.5k HP is desirable for a CNV run and atleast HH99 weap +5. IMO those are not unreasonable reqs for a lvl 100 caster - unlike 5aps 2nd cast NV +10 with demon HF BM or 2nd cast +10/r9 sin (and that is pretty much all u see on WC on Lost City).

gobroncos

I never wc for weapon link in my caster runs. Now having said that I have asked for random things to link like boots just to poke fun. I don't have a problem with people asking though because simply low DD not only makes for death in caster but with the timed last boss can cause a squad to fail.
Having said that though really caster squads only need maybe 2 decent DD's (say R8 ish with +6 or better). 1 cleric is ok but if they are not strong healers and quick to get back into BB when disrupted as well as healing when BB is in cool down a second cleric is desired. With low DD a veno is awsome to have especially since amp works on all boss's now b:pleased.

I only play a caster and do not, have not, and probably will not make a aps toon. I have NEVER gotten into a random regular nirvana. I stopped asking because I never got in. Caster gives us the opportunity to not rely on an aps toon to be generous and let us in their nirvana. To be truthfull I have let so far an archer and a BM in a few of my caster runs basically because we could.

Eniyo - Raging Tide

I've done many many nirvana runs - and only got asked once for a weapon link. so I linked my crappy-refined-R8 weapon, they took me with them.
Every class has a role in nirvana, I've never seen something like "oh you're a mystic? tchhhhh, sry we take wiz only" (or something like that)

I've also been to normal nirvana twice as a healer. The first time it was fun, although people died (since I'm only a little mystic) and it was ok for them, the second run was hell. I still tried to get into normal nirvana squads, but noone would let me. that's why caster is my only option.

And when it comes to caster squads I don't really see picky people. Even if they ask for R8, I'd still pm them with my TT99 weapon (that I don't use anymore since R8) and they would still take me.

Jadsia - Lost City

FatalFem - Heavens Tear wrote: »

I am so tired of the hypocrites. All the casters whine and cry that no one wants them in regular Nirvana. (I take them myself by that isn't the point). They whine that people only want aps or that casters are too slow casting etc. What I continue to see is this:

Casters asking for peoples weapon refines in world chat and them only wanting specific classes to go on caster Nirvanas.

I'd like to know how this is ANY different from the people doing regular Nirvana discriminating against those who do not have aps or highly refined weapons? Its a double standard and I don't see why anyone would continue to complain that they aren't a caster wanted for regular Nirvana when they are specific in the weapon refine and type of caster they want for caster Nirvana.

Quit being hypocrites people!

I fee ya, bro!!! Out of all the dozens of caster runs I've been on only 1, JUST ONE, invited an archer to caster NV!!! Can you F&^%*$G BELIEVE THAT ****????? WTH is it with these tight *ss hypocrits these days??? b:cry

Eniyo - Raging Tide

Jadsia - Lost City wrote: »

I fee ya, bro!!! Out of all the dozens of caster runs I've been on only 1, JUST ONE, invited an archer to caster NV!!! Can you F&^%*$G BELIEVE THAT ****????? WTH is it with these tight *ss hypocrits these days??? b:cry

Uh, I don't play an archer, so forgive me my noob question:
Do archers do mag dmg? O:

MoonsMyst - Heavens Tear

Tekeva am sure if u pm accalica in advance and ask her to take u in to caster she willb:pleased

FatalFem - Heavens Tear

MiniST - Sanctuary wrote: »

the thing is, the longer it takes the more annoying caster vana gets. The first two bosses are ok, you can take your time. But from there on, without sufficient DD, it's gonna be so painful. For example, the fourth boss, it's attacks get stronger and stronger the longer you take. So, if you don't have enough DD, you are gonna fail. And the last boss is on a 10 min timer. So after the 6th buff it does, it just totally wipe the squad. I'm not saying you need r9+12, but you need sufficient DD or you are gonna fail. This ties into why some classes are asked and not other, it's because they already have the not asked class in squad. All classes have an role in caster vana.
Cleric: Heal
Psy/Wiz/Mystic: Major DD
Veno: Amplify (Now that every boss is ampable)

Ok.. then maybe at this point casters can understand why it is that all the aps ppl want people who have aps and not casters. Its still a double standard, no matter how you slice it.

Eniyo - Raging Tide wrote: »

Uh, I don't play an archer, so forgive me my noob question:
Do archers do mag dmg? O:

Yes, Archers have metal skills! They also have a water skill and I can't remember what else as I quit playing my lvl 101 archer about 2 years ago. But they do have magic skills.

Celestyna - Heavens Tear

SmurfJegeren - Dreamweaver wrote: »

I find it way more hypocrite when a person ask for weapon link, and got a very poor weapon himself. I have as a rule to not join a squad if the person ask for a wep link(I PM class only wether they ask for wep link in WC or not), and quite oftenly come across a person forming with a very poor weapon. And then "rides" the run on the other peoples in squad.

For example:

Former: +3 TT99
First peep: +10 R8
Second peep: +7 G13 Nirvy
Third peep: +12 G15 Nirvy
Fourth: +10 R8
Fifth: +5 R8

If youre one of the weaker, I can see how you need some higher help to get where you need to be. But discriminating entirely because of weapon and refine when youre even a part of the group youre discriminating.. thats even worse b:bye

you see this in normal nirvana squads as well. they ask for 4-5 aps and link weapon.. then you join and they are +4 2.86 or some such. should start asking them to link thier weapon b:laugh

Jadsia - Lost City

Eniyo - Raging Tide wrote: »

Uh, I don't play an archer, so forgive me my noob question:
Do archers do mag dmg? O:

That run we did with an archer went rather well and quite fun. He was concerned that his channeling was too slow but hey, everyone's channeling seems like it's kind of slow when bosses take a while to die.

Also I've been in all types of NV caster parties. Last one had 4 wizards,an EP and a veno. We did pretty good there too. I suppose what matters is is how well geared we are and how we use pots, charms and our genie.

Vixter - Harshlands

well i think casters should have at least some specific classes in every run, such as, mage and psy - and cleric too of course xD and after that, your just left with 2 other caster classes so, its not like theres a really large range to choose from to begin with. you need to get it done in a timely manner, so weapon and classes do matter. they should all probably have at least a lunar or tt99, or higher weapon (i think).

personally, im just glad that there is a caster nirvana. ive recently started doing them (yea i never got to experience the bug or whatever) so im just glad i can actually DO nirvana without having a sin/bm alt.

Quilue - Sanctuary

Maybe if the bosses stopped sealing in regular NV, people wouldn't be as picky...but I'd imagine if that happened, casters would be QQing that it's made too easy.

MistaBwanden - Sanctuary

Make a squad full of people with TT90-TT99 weapons with low refines and then tell me you succeed. If you do, I'll take this thread seriously.

TCHP - Lost City

..... So why don't you buy a few tele and make a team. Make the requirement for your team like all the other. but instead of asking for +10 weapon. Ask for +3 or something....

It like some of my venomacer friends QQed that no one invited them in FC. I told them, find 6 veno and do what you can in FC. If 6 veno + pet can't manage to do some damage in FC I don't know what would. And to be on the safe side, 1 cleric 3 veno 2 mystic.... There ...

Further back I also remember people QQing, and like NO one want to make my FB. Then I invited them and Use 2 tele and made a team in 5 minute....

The next FB they came whit the same QQing. I told them, find me a barb and we will do your FB. Suddenly they got light in there head, Like OH YEAH I can make my own team ...

lazy people !...

Mingkeey - Lost City

caster nv sucks anyway..why make it once a day or twice if you have a bh tailsman.we should be able to spam it just like normal nv.devs are stuppy

FanFon - Dreamweaver

Mingkeey - Lost City wrote: »

caster nv sucks anyway..why make it once a day or twice if you have a bh tailsman.we should be able to spam it just like normal nv.devs are stuppy

If they so stuppy then lets get them to delete the whole thing and replace it with melee nirvy. Same as caster nirvy but magic immune bosses

FatalFem - Heavens Tear

MistaBwanden - Sanctuary wrote: »

Make a squad full of people with TT90-TT99 weapons with low refines and then tell me you succeed. If you do, I'll take this thread seriously.

The thread is about a double standard, not about refines. I think you missed the point of it.