APS Nerf Question.

Voldoo - Archosaur
Voldoo - Archosaur Posts: 27 Arc User
edited February 2012 in General Discussion
Is 4 AND 5 nerfed or just 5?

I've been hearing from both sides, can someone confirm which one is right?
Post edited by Voldoo - Archosaur on

Comments

  • Bobobejumbo - Raging Tide
    Bobobejumbo - Raging Tide Posts: 934 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Both, confirmed by Genotypist, I'll have to dig up the post.
  • Voldoo - Archosaur
    Voldoo - Archosaur Posts: 27 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Well then, **** you pwi.
  • sachelfunlol
    sachelfunlol Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Bobobejumbo - Raging Tide wrote: »
    Both, confirmed by Genotypist, I'll have to dig up the post.

    The quote is quite crptic tho
    Lets troll the forums together b:victory
  • sachelfunlol
    sachelfunlol Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Originally Posted by genotypist
    Hey guys. I wanted to chime in with a clarification.

    The APS damage and accuracy reduction is not reflected on your character panel. You will only see an appreciable change by checking your combat log below and above 4.0 APS.

    Equip gear to get yourself to 4.0 aps and start attacking. You'll suddenly see a string of 'misses' roughly 20% of the time, on top of any innate miss chance you have. Sorry if this wasn't communicated better, but you will not be able to verify this feature by simply looking at your character screen.

    The responce is quite a standard cryptic responce and did not answer the question if it effects 4aps just to test below and above 4aps in the first Sentences. The 2nd paragraph then changes to reflect 4aps as well. which is it? I noticed at 4aps base there is a difference but not one when sparked at 4aps. So... b:surrender
    Lets troll the forums together b:victory
  • Bobobejumbo - Raging Tide
    Bobobejumbo - Raging Tide Posts: 934 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    sachelfunlol wrote: »
    The responce is quite a standard cryptic responce and did not answer the question if it effects 4aps just to test below and above 4aps in the first Sentences. The 2nd paragraph then changes to reflect 4aps as well. which is it? I noticed at 4aps base there is a difference but not one when sparked at 4aps. So... b:surrender

    I don't see how you could interpret that as cryptic at all. It reads crystal clear to me. 4.0 and up is nerfed, whether sparked or not. Plenty of the forums best mathematicians and theory crafters have tested this and all concur that the 5% damage nerf is real. Jury is still out on if/how the accuracy nerf works.
  • Elenacostel - Heavens Tear
    Elenacostel - Heavens Tear Posts: 2,822 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Bobobejumbo - Raging Tide wrote: »
    Jury is still out on if/how the accuracy nerf works.

    We've figured it out:

    - Best theory-crafting: http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?p=16117521#post16117521

    - Actual PvE test with times and numbers: http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?p=16198201#post16198201

    - GM Genotypist's ambiguous wording: http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?p=16122731#post16122731
  • sachelfunlol
    sachelfunlol Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Bobobejumbo - Raging Tide wrote: »
    I don't see how you could interpret that as cryptic at all. It reads crystal clear to me. 4.0 and up is nerfed, whether sparked or not. Plenty of the forums best mathematicians and theory crafters have tested this and all concur that the 5% damage nerf is real. Jury is still out on if/how the accuracy nerf works.

    Thats the point, first it is stated it is above and below 4aps, meaning it effects anything above 4aps, not including it, then it is stated to test at 4aps, how is that not cryptic
    Lets troll the forums together b:victory
  • sachelfunlol
    sachelfunlol Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Elenacostel - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    We've figured it out:

    - Best theory-crafting: http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?p=16117521#post16117521

    - Actual PvE test with times and numbers: http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?p=16198201#post16198201

    - GM Genotypist's ambiguous wording: http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?p=16122731#post16122731

    Thanks the 2nd link helps tons more than cryptic responces, I am glad this was tested.
    Lets troll the forums together b:victory
  • Bobobejumbo - Raging Tide
    Bobobejumbo - Raging Tide Posts: 934 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    sachelfunlol wrote: »
    Thats the point, first it is stated it is above and below 4aps, then it is stated to test at 4aps, how is that not cryptic

    lol that's not cryptic, that's you not understanding what was said. It means the only way you will see a difference on the UI is to check your combat logs below 4.0 (meaning 3.33 and below) and then at or above (meaning 4.0 or 5.0).

    Meaning, your character menu (opened with "C" in game) won't reflect the damage or accuracy reduction, only your combat logs.

    Do you understand now?
  • sachelfunlol
    sachelfunlol Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Bobobejumbo - Raging Tide wrote: »
    lol that's not cryptic, that's you not understanding what was said. It means the only way you will see a difference on the UI is to check your combat logs below 4.0 (meaning 3.33 and below) and then at or above (meaning 4.0 or 5.0).

    Meaning, your character menu (opened with "C" in game) won't reflect the damage or accuracy reduction, only your combat logs.

    Do you understand now?

    I know what you are saying, but zeno did not state that, the statement was to check logs below and above 4 aps, not including it.
    Lets troll the forums together b:victory
  • Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973
    Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973 Posts: 7,881 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    The 4.0 5% penalty is pretty easy to see when using barehanded attacks.

    http://i.imgur.com/FlubS.jpg

    It doesn't show up in the charsheet but look at the combat log.
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  • sachelfunlol
    sachelfunlol Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Asterelle - Sanctuary wrote: »
    The 4.0 5% penalty is pretty easy to see when using barehanded attacks.

    http://i.imgur.com/FlubS.jpg

    It doesn't show up in the charsheet but look at the combat log.

    Thanks b:victory
    Lets troll the forums together b:victory
  • Sltryder - Lost City
    Sltryder - Lost City Posts: 18 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    this is also effected in PVP or just PVE?
  • sachelfunlol
    sachelfunlol Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Sltryder - Lost City wrote: »
    this is also effected in PVP or just PVE?

    Both it seems from another thread I read
    Lets troll the forums together b:victory
  • Bobobejumbo - Raging Tide
    Bobobejumbo - Raging Tide Posts: 934 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    sachelfunlol wrote: »
    I know what you are saying, but zeno did not state that, the statement was to check logs below and above 4 aps, not including it.

    Your lack of reading comprehension hurts my head >.<
  • Gnip - Raging Tide
    Gnip - Raging Tide Posts: 97 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    The nerf effects both: 4 and 5 aps. Tested on my sin, (w/ r9, and g13s)
  • sachelfunlol
    sachelfunlol Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Bobobejumbo - Raging Tide wrote: »
    Your lack of reading comprehension hurts my head >.<

    Sorry to here that, a better official statement could have been "effects 4 and above aps"
    If you ask the question what is above or below the letter 'b' do you answer a,b and c?
    The lack of pwi to ever give a straight answer bothers me more
    Lets troll the forums together b:victory
  • Bobobejumbo - Raging Tide
    Bobobejumbo - Raging Tide Posts: 934 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    sachelfunlol wrote: »
    Sorry to here that, a better official statement could have been "effects 4 and above aps"
    If you ask the question what is above or below the letter 'b' do you answer a,b and c?
    The lack of pwi to ever give a straight answer bothers me more

    It was his second paragraph in that same post that explained further in detail that it was 4.0 and up. You're still focused on the first paragraph it seems.
  • sachelfunlol
    sachelfunlol Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Bobobejumbo - Raging Tide wrote: »
    It was his second paragraph in that same post that explained further in detail that it was 4.0 and up. You're still focused on the first paragraph it seems.

    Yes I realize that b:surrender
    Lets troll the forums together b:victory
  • Cut_Bait - Heavens Tear
    Cut_Bait - Heavens Tear Posts: 29 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Asterelle - Sanctuary wrote: »
    The 4.0 5% penalty is pretty easy to see when using barehanded attacks.

    http://i.imgur.com/FlubS.jpg

    It doesn't show up in the charsheet but look at the combat log.

    It's interesting that your accuracy is higher in the 4.0 pic than in the 3.33 pic. What happened there? Wasn't accuracy supposed to be nerfed along with damage? And why is your DEX higher in the 4.0 pic, although I guess that could explain the additional accuracy. What other variables are affecting the results?
  • Bryanshrimp - Lost City
    Bryanshrimp - Lost City Posts: 72 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    neither. I see no dmg or accuracy differnce with 4.0 sage sin or 5.0 demon bm.
  • Mayfly - Dreamweaver
    Mayfly - Dreamweaver Posts: 6,094 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Cut_Bait - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    It's interesting that your accuracy is higher in the 4.0 pic than in the 3.33 pic. What happened there? Wasn't accuracy supposed to be nerfed along with damage? And why is your DEX higher in the 4.0 pic, although I guess that could explain the additional accuracy. What other variables are affecting the results?

    I'm guessing whatever gear she switched to to get the additional -int also had a +dex add (rank top, maybe?)
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  • Olbaze - Sanctuary
    Olbaze - Sanctuary Posts: 4,242 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Mayfly - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    I'm guessing whatever gear she switched to to get the additional -int also had a +dex add (rank top, maybe?)

    Can't be rank top, since those get 7~8 dex, yet she's missing 9.

    But yes, most likely. Quite a few bits of -interval do have +dex on them. Could be Ashura's boots.
    I am Olba. Not Ol, not Baze nor Blaze. And even less would I go by Olblaze. Please, take a second to read a person's username.
    If you see b:cute be sure to take a second, calm look at anything I said.
  • Salari - Raging Tide
    Salari - Raging Tide Posts: 2,102 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    still wonder what was used to keep the exact same base attack range in the char screen, or did they have a int item that did not change str/dex?
    Marine - Marshall - Raging Tides - Retired
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    DEMHEALSMAN - Dreamweaver
    Yes, because people really need 900+ dex or 1000+ magic just for the lulz
  • Olbaze - Sanctuary
    Olbaze - Sanctuary Posts: 4,242 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Salari - Raging Tide wrote: »
    still wonder what was used to keep the exact same base attack range in the char screen, or did they have a int item that did not change str/dex?

    Meet Rank 9 Leggings.

    b:cute

    Also, as you can see, the dex does change, but since it's barehanded, dexterity does not factor into the damage.
    I am Olba. Not Ol, not Baze nor Blaze. And even less would I go by Olblaze. Please, take a second to read a person's username.
    If you see b:cute be sure to take a second, calm look at anything I said.
  • Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973
    Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973 Posts: 7,881 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    I just took off Ashura boots for 3.33 which have some DEX. This did not affect barehanded attacks because that damage uses STR.

    In both cases my accuracy was exactly the expected result of 2*8*DEX

    2 = 1 + 2x 50% rings
    8 = archers get 8 accuracy per dex
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  • Salari - Raging Tide
    Salari - Raging Tide Posts: 2,102 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Thank you both
    Marine - Marshall - Raging Tides - Retired
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    DEMHEALSMAN - Dreamweaver
    Yes, because people really need 900+ dex or 1000+ magic just for the lulz
  • GallaxXIII - Sanctuary
    GallaxXIII - Sanctuary Posts: 201 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    like most the guys on this page probably said. after 4.0+

    5% damage will be taken off and 20% accuracy.

    and those are absolute true statements
    Objective: Complete
  • Nymphali - Dreamweaver
    Nymphali - Dreamweaver Posts: 449 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Cut_Bait - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    It's interesting that your accuracy is higher in the 4.0 pic than in the 3.33 pic. What happened there? Wasn't accuracy supposed to be nerfed along with damage? And why is your DEX higher in the 4.0 pic, although I guess that could explain the additional accuracy. What other variables are affecting the results?

    The accuracy nerf doesnt appear on the character status column.
    The accuracy was prolly higher cus she/he equiped a 0.05 int belt/neck which gives dexterity thus increasing aps to 4.0 and accuracy/evasion slightly.

    Edit: Just check out the Base attack and APS. The attack didnt change, the aps and the final damage DID, this just poofs that: Yes 4.0 gets nerfed.

    Also, lets state it: (4.0 x 1339 > 3.33 x 1410)

    Thats obvious and simple, this nerf nerfed no sheet, higher aps peeps still do more damage and gain lots more spark to keep permasparked.

    In the end, a nirvana boss is gonna take 5s~ more to die.. Oooh GIGANTIC difference u.u
  • Cut_Bait - Heavens Tear
    Cut_Bait - Heavens Tear Posts: 29 Arc User
    edited February 2012
    Asterelle - Sanctuary wrote: »
    I just took off Ashura boots for 3.33 which have some DEX. This did not affect barehanded attacks because that damage uses STR.

    In both cases my accuracy was exactly the expected result of 2*8*DEX

    2 = 1 + 2x 50% rings
    8 = archers get 8 accuracy per dex

    I see... thanks!

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