Order

Dabdoub - Lothranis

I dont know what order is best for my wizard , any ideas? b:bye

AsimM - Raging Tide

I recommend joining Luminance to get your first 2 skills easily, then get Ice Prison.

Then switch to Shroud later on for Arcane Defense.

Then finally join Corona to reforge your PvE G13 gears.

Kthxbai,

Asim.

Mizuoni - Dreamweaver

Join shroud, get your auto blink
Put an alt in luminance, get your two skills

If you want ice world, get it after auto blink.

GG.

Mizuoni - Dreamweaver

oops.

HexOmega - Dreamweaver

i want ice world nao b:angry

John_Smith - Harshlands

Mizuoni - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Join shroud, get your auto blink
Put an alt in luminance, get your two skills

If you want ice world, get it after auto blink.

GG.

**** dat. I want my sin popping targetless AoE more than I want autoblink.

Mizuoni - Dreamweaver

John_Smith - Harshlands wrote: »

**** dat. I want my sin popping targetless AoE more than I want autoblink.

I find autoblink a bit more useful b:surrender

Cytte - Harshlands

John_Smith - Harshlands wrote: »

**** dat. I want my sin popping targetless AoE more than I want autoblink.

at the cost of 2 sparks, Q_Q

TJTLegend - Archosaur

The 2 spark cost wouldnt be a problem for sage wizys or if u have cloud eruption or chi pots.

John_Smith - Harshlands

Cytte - Harshlands wrote: »

at the cost of 2 sparks, Q_Q

I use 2 sparks constantly as is. For PvE at least I've gotten to the point with my genie where I can triplespark every 30 seconds and that'll go faster once I hit 100 and steal my clerics genie.

Plus, I think it's worth it for a 12 metre AoE to **** with people. b:chuckle

AsimM - Raging Tide

John_Smith - Harshlands wrote: »

**** dat. I want my sin popping targetless AoE more than I want autoblink.

^ This. Sure, Arcane Defense is cool, and I'd go for it first if it wasn't for the reset position/HP skills, and if Ice Prison needed a target. But that's not the case.

Mizuoni - Dreamweaver

TJTLegend - Archosaur wrote: »

The 2 spark cost wouldnt be a problem for sage wizys or if u have cloud eruption or chi pots.

Smack. Yourself. Now.

Why would you waste genie energy or chi pots in the middle of PK?????????????

AsimM - Raging Tide wrote: »

^ This. Sure, Arcane Defense is cool, and I'd go for it first if it wasn't for the reset position/HP skills, and if Ice Prison needed a target. But that's not the case.

I'm in shroud and I have both my reset position/HP skill. Threw my mystic into luminance and got my skills. Arcane would add a lot more to survivability than ice world ever would. I don't know what is with new wizzies and they're craziness over damaging skills. Back in my day, we made sure we could live before we attempted boosting damage to any extreme amount. There's no reason why you shouldn't want arcane defense as a wiz. none.

Leviath_Imp - Lost City

Mizuoni - Dreamweaver wrote: »

I don't know what is with new wizzies and they're craziness over damaging skills. [/COLOR]

well... itz not just damage dealing part, itz becuz wizzies can finally be like a bm-> blink into the middle of a battle scene, wiz-style hf and stun (at teh same time ftw?) and then charge emberstorm for the aoe 1shot all around u (recorded on fraps, ofc)

Mizuoni - Dreamweaver wrote: »

There's no reason why you shouldn't want arcane defense as a wiz. none. [/COLOR]

b:chuckle being a bit more serious here, i dunno if anyone doesnt want arcane defense, just some ppl prioritize it lower... and tbh itz not gonna help u at all against caster-sins like rico that rolled all sorts of wizzies before the expansion came out

that being sed, im also in shroud goin for arcane defense, got my hp/position reset skills from sin, then switched him outta luminance into shroud too

John_Smith - Harshlands

Mizuoni - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Smack. Yourself. Now.

Why would you waste genie energy or chi pots in the middle of PK?????????????


I'm in shroud and I have both my reset position/HP skill. Threw my mystic into luminance and got my skills. Arcane would add a lot more to survivability than ice world ever would. I don't know what is with new wizzies and they're craziness over damaging skills. Back in my day, we made sure we could live before we attempted boosting damage to any extreme amount. There's no reason why you shouldn't want arcane defense as a wiz. none.

From the description it doesn't really do much damage, only "Frozen targets suffer 130% damage". It's more for the targetless AoE that will annoy the **** out of anyone encountering it than the damage.

Arcane defence can only proc every 25 seconds as well (From description) which while still useful means you can still get autoatkd - autblinked - shadow teleported and rolled with auto attacks so long as they drop you within 25 seconds (Not hard).

Dealing with a 2 second 67% freeze/stun that stacks with occult (And therefore won't be cancelled by it) is considerably more difficult, especially since it has 3 attempts to break through a sins Tidal to interrupt them long enough for you to lay down FoW and a combo. Oh, and did I mention it appears to be targetless? The worst thing is the lack of being able to chase a sin when they escape, with a proc like that they need to cover 12 metres from casting Escape and getting hit, which gives them about 3 seconds before they get popped. Considering theres a relatively long cast (Seriously, you can't move for more time than you'd think after using escape) you're liable to get walloped straight back out.

~You can probably come up with an argument of better quality for Arcane, but it's really irrelevent since in the long run we will want to obtain all of our skills. (I mean, I'm not gonna be saying no to a 5% anticrit, that makes anyones life harder when they try killing us).

Scorched_Sky - Sanctuary

Wtf u all talkin bout.
Arcane defense should be first priority, hands down.
Nuff said.

If u dont know why........
Nothing comes to mind. There shouldn't be a reason why you wouldn't realize this.

Mizuoni - Dreamweaver

Leviath_Imp - Lost City wrote: »

well... itz not just damage dealing part, itz becuz wizzies can finally be like a bm-> blink into the middle of a battle scene, wiz-style hf and stun (at teh same time ftw?) and then charge emberstorm for the aoe 1shot all around u (recorded on fraps, ofc)



b:chuckle being a bit more serious here, i dunno if anyone doesnt want arcane defense, just some ppl prioritize it lower... and tbh itz not gonna help u at all against caster-sins like rico that rolled all sorts of wizzies before the expansion came out

that being sed, im also in shroud goin for arcane defense, got my hp/position reset skills from sin, then switched him outta luminance into shroud too

Ignores joke.

Ice World is just, ew...

John_Smith - Harshlands wrote: »

From the description it doesn't really do much damage, only "Frozen targets suffer 130% damage". It's more for the targetless AoE that will annoy the **** out of anyone encountering it than the damage.

Arcane defence can only proc every 25 seconds as well (From description) which while still useful means you can still get autoatkd - autblinked - shadow teleported and rolled with auto attacks so long as they drop you within 25 seconds (Not hard).

Dealing with a 2 second 67% freeze/stun that stacks with occult (And therefore won't be cancelled by it) is considerably more difficult, especially since it has 3 attempts to break through a sins Tidal to interrupt them long enough for you to lay down FoW and a combo. Oh, and did I mention it appears to be targetless? The worst thing is the lack of being able to chase a sin when they escape, with a proc like that they need to cover 12 metres from casting Escape and getting hit, which gives them about 3 seconds before they get popped. Considering theres a relatively long cast (Seriously, you can't move for more time than you'd think after using escape) you're liable to get walloped straight back out.

~You can probably come up with an argument of better quality for Arcane, but it's really irrelevent since in the long run we will want to obtain all of our skills. (I mean, I'm not gonna be saying no to a 5% anticrit, that makes anyones life harder when they try killing us).

Well, I could come up with a better argument, or I could use your own argument to defeat your own argument. If a 25 second cd doesn't help you, how would a 3 min cooldown? That costs 2 sparks at that. Yes, we will all get Ice World eventually, but it's nowhere near top of the priority list (ok, it's above the 5% anticrit...)

Mystic-Night - Heavens Tear

Arcane defense is the one that purifies/leaps you away right? If so, then yea I'm not getting that one on my wizard.

It's a great skill, granted, but for me I think I'm better off without it. I might be a bit biased towards it since I don't PK actively anymore and I'm only here for TW. I don't want to be casting an ulti in a huge group then have a random bm/sin hit me for 200 damage, then get leaped back. Oops..there goes me helping on that push.

I do just fine by using distance shrink/badge/fortify etc and I don't think I need a skill that can potentially **** me over at the most horrid of times.

Now, on a PK stand point: Must have.

My thoughts anyway.

John_Smith - Harshlands

Mizuoni - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Ignores joke.

Ice World is just, ew...



Well, I could come up with a better argument, or I could use your own argument to defeat your own argument. If a 25 second cd doesn't help you, how would a 3 min cooldown? That costs 2 sparks at that. Yes, we will all get Ice World eventually, but it's nowhere near top of the priority list (ok, it's above the 5% anticrit...)

By the time those 3 minutes are up that sin you just rolled will have barely cooled all his skills. In fact, Deaden Nerves, sin Fave outside of Tidal, is exactly a 3 minute cooldown.

Anyway who cares, I have time to laze around and take fun skills in priority, my gear isn't really up to par just yet (140k rep ) so I can play with w/e I like. I'll have all the available skills before I get to the point where going out to a hotspot won't be 15 seconds of hell followed by going to town.

Mizuoni - Dreamweaver

John_Smith - Harshlands wrote: »

By the time those 3 minutes are up that sin you just rolled will have barely cooled all his skills. In fact, Deaden Nerves, sin Fave outside of Tidal, is exactly a 3 minute cooldown.

Anyway who cares, I have time to laze around and take fun skills in priority, my gear isn't really up to par just yet (140k rep ) so I can play with w/e I like. I'll have all the available skills before I get to the point where going out to a hotspot won't be 15 seconds of hell followed by going to town.

Ah makes sense. You haven't reached the point where a simple purify or an extra blink could have saved you or genie energy for a win. b:surrender

John_Smith - Harshlands

Mizuoni - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Ah makes sense. You haven't reached the point where a simple purify or an extra blink could have saved you or genie energy for a win. b:surrender

*Removal of one effect. You're liable to have several applied at once.

As for shrink, I love it, I really do, when it's in my control. I can't count the times where I've cast it and it has done a big **** all however. And on top of that you have to be hit by an auto-attack. Not terrifically hard to spike down a Wizard without using autoattacks unless you suck or you're severely outgeared.

Again, not gonna skip it, I'm not stupid. I just have different priorities since 2 seconds is all I need to start ruining someones attempt on me.

AsimM - Raging Tide

Yes, Arcane Defense is good. Yes, it can save your live in getting twitched to death by a sin or BM. But any good non-aps sin or zerk-axe BM will still own you. And seekers? Since when do seeker auto attack? Metal immobalize > Gemini Slash. You just got charm bypass killed without any auto-blink. I'm not saying it's not a good skill, I'm just saying I'd enjoy using Ice Prison a bit more. And it'd be a bit more useful.

Mizuoni - Dreamweaver

AsimM - Raging Tide wrote: »

Yes, Arcane Defense is good. Yes, it can save your live in getting twitched to death by a sin or BM. But any good non-aps sin or zerk-axe BM will still own you. And seekers? Since when do seeker auto attack? Metal immobalize > Gemini Slash. You just got charm bypass killed without any auto-blink. I'm not saying it's not a good skill, I'm just saying I'd enjoy using Ice Prison a bit more. And it'd be a bit more useful every 3 minutes.

fixedb:pleased

AsimM - Raging Tide

Mizuoni - Dreamweaver wrote: »

fixedb:pleased

Touche. b:laugh

Leviath_Imp - Lost City

my critical hit evasion buff pwns ur ice or arcane thingy cuz guess wat...

it doesnt have an effect cooldown!!!!!

b:bye

John_Smith - Harshlands

Leviath_Imp - Lost City wrote: »

my critical hit evasion buff pwns ur ice or arcane thingy cuz guess wat...

it doesnt have an effect cooldown!!!!!

b:bye

This is a damn good point for that skill, and one I had overlooked b:laugh

Sint - Harshlands

Provided you know what you're doing, autoblink is more important, simply because of the chance to bail you out of headhunt. the only ailments sins can cast are the ones they want to use to keep you still/in range/sealed, + bleed, slow, hp debuff and subsea.removing one negative effect is likely to bail you out, unless the sin really wants to waste his time casting useless ailments to reduce the chance of you purging the stun.

Normal sins are not casters. If you force them to use skills only, you gimp their dps.

The argument is the same as archers going shroud for stealth. Stealth is awesome, very sexy skill. But it can't compete with leaps, period.

SovereignVis - Sanctuary

I'm in Luminance just to get "Ice Prison" I don't care about any of the other skills. Most of the other skills suck. b:sweat

Mizuoni - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Join shroud, get your auto blink
Put an alt in luminance, get your two skills

If you want ice world, get it after auto blink.

GG.

And wizards don't "blink". The "Blink" (teleportion technique) is a witchcraft technique. And it works very different from the way a wizard's teleport skills work. The teleportion skills wizards use in this game are really more like warp jumps. So it's really an Auto-Warp. b:chuckle

Cytte - Harshlands

Sint - Harshlands wrote: »

Provided you know what you're doing, autoblink is more important, simply because of the chance to bail you out of headhunt. the only ailments sins can cast are the ones they want to use to keep you still/in range/sealed, + bleed, slow, hp debuff and subsea.removing one negative effect is likely to bail you out, unless the sin really wants to waste his time casting useless ailments to reduce the chance of you purging the stun.

Ignorant sins are not casters. If you force them to use skills only, you gimp their dps. they'll ragequit

The argument is the same as archers going shroud for stealth. Stealth is awesome, very sexy skill. But it can't compete with leaps, period.

Fixed for you,
go full Nv, get +attack lvl daggers, use chill, skill spam and fxck **** up all the same. Sins are a broken class auto-blink wont affect a smart sin.

and its no way the same as an archer going shroud for stealth, honestly archer stealth is by far the most useless new skill out there, yea sure hide and have a 0.1m/s speed, hell I'd just agro a nearby mob and aoe since they'd probably still be in range

SovereignVis - Sanctuary wrote: »

And wizards don't "blink". The "Blink" (teleportion technique) is a witchcraft technique. And it works very different from the way a wizard's teleport skills work. The teleportion skills wizards use in this game are really more like warp jumps. So it's really an Auto-Warp. b:chuckle

you move from point "A" to a reasonable distance away almost instantaneously, its a blink, the animation may be different, but its still a blink.
Warp implies a much longer range and usually a longer amount of time to cast/activate, sometimes even full squads or enemies.

The trade-able wiz skills are warps as they take time to activate, distance shrink and arcane light are blinks since like blinking are instant or close too.

And you're nit-picking between witchcraft and wizards... and not even doing it right, 1) It should be witchcraft and wizardry 2) Witchcraft is a supposed supernatural means of malevolent or harmful magic. while a wizard is someone who practices any form magic, which one do you think would practice a skill to avoid being attacked?

Don't nitpick if you don't know what you're talking about.

Leviath_Imp - Lost City

Cytte - Harshlands wrote: »

Fixed for you,
go full Nv, get +attack lvl daggers, use chill, skill spam and fxck **** up all the same. Sins are a broken class auto-blink wont affect a smart sin.

ur doin it wrong

the reason this autoblink/purify is useful is cuz when those awesome caster sins start rolling ur wiz, you can pull out ur own 105 stealthed sin on a separate client and...

just use ur sin to auto atk u from stealth with no weapon and voila, u got a blink purify! no genie needed ftw and u save ur wiz.

next step: force stealth ur sin and just let it wait around a bit while u go back to ur wiz. if the caster sin ur fighting doesnt use aoes for some weird reason, u could even put ur sin on follow wiz and just switch client windows and press f1 for another purify blink in ~25 sec or however long the CD was. ofc, ur force stealth will be on CD then... b:surrender

Arenaceous - Lost City

You won't need to worry anyway, all the broken lvl 105 caster sins are in your faction, so the skill will help you far more than me for example. :P

SovereignVis - Sanctuary

Cytte - Harshlands wrote: »

you move from point "A" to a reasonable distance away almost instantaneously, its a blink, the animation may be different, but its still a blink.
Warp implies a much longer range and usually a longer amount of time to cast/activate, sometimes even full squads or enemies.

The trade-able wiz skills are warps as they take time to activate, distance shrink and arcane light are blinks since like blinking are instant or close too.

And you're nit-picking between witchcraft and wizards... and not even doing it right, 1) It should be witchcraft and wizardry 2) Witchcraft is a supposed supernatural means of malevolent or harmful magic. while a wizard is someone who practices any form magic, which one do you think would practice a skill to avoid being attacked?

Don't nitpick if you don't know what you're talking about.

I do know what I'm talking about. The "Blink" was invented by witches/warlocks. The way it works and is used is very different from the way wizards teleport. When using a "Blink" you first need to picture the place you want to go in your mind. Like if you wanted to go to the bank, mall, school, work or whatever. You could just picture in your mind the front of the building as if you were standing there looking at it. Then you close your eyes just for a split sec and when you open them, the place you saw in your mind you now see it for real, because you are now there. In that very short amount of time when you blinked. You did not go flying through the air at a super fast speed. You did not freeze time and then had to walk or run to where you wanted to go. You did not turn into dust or something and just flowed away to reassemble somewhere else. In that very short amount of time when you blinked you did not exist. When you open your eyes again you now exist in a different spot. a.k.a (the place you wanted to go to) The Blink can not be seen or traced with any kind of high speed camera or equipment. So you have no way to see which way the user went. It all happens in the blink of an eye. (hints the name of the skill "Blink".) b:chuckle Yeah not existing for about 1/100 of a sec must feel weird. O.o But that is kind of what it is like.
The "Blink" is said to be the fastest teleportion technique there is. Yeah even faster than a wizard's teleportion skills.
There is only a few bad things about the "Blink". First of all you can not use the "Blink" if you are blind. So if you wanted to stop a person from blinking you just need to find a way to blind them. And just be sure when you are using the "Blink" don't picture a sky view of your destination, because that will not end well for you. b:laugh A good example of what a "Blink" would look like can be seen in the TV show "Charmed", yeah it's about witches. If you blink you might miss seeing what it looks like. LOL

There are 2 main ways a wizard teleports. The first is by opening a dimensional portal, gate, door, rift, or however you want to call it. Into and out of a dimensional void. Sometimes these portals are confined with in a doorway of a building somewhere and come out somewhere else, like a place 100s of miles away. You can see a simular teleporting like effect to this in moives like "The Matrix Reloaded" and "Howl's Moving Castle." Walking through a door and coming out somewhere totally different. They may not all look the same, but they all work about the same. Higher level or more skilled wizards learn to easily open and close these dimensional portals almost anywhere at anytime. Because this dimensional void has no really effect on this world. The distance of the portals that go in and back out doesn't matter. You could open a portal in front of you and have the exit portal right next to or in front of the that portal. While in this world the entrance portal in front of you and the exit portal can be 100s of miles away. So you walk into the entrance portal into the dimensional void only about 1 step and back out into this world far away from your original location. Also this way of using a dimensional portal to teleport can be used in an oppsite way to add distance or delay something. By putting a portal opening right in front of a wizard and then making the exit portal in the dimensional void a long distance away. A wizard can shoot a fireball into the portal, have it fly through the dimensional void for some distance before coming out the exit to hit a nearby enemy a few moments later when they are not expecting it. That always sounds like fun. Even if you have mastered this kind of skill opening and closeing portals at will. If is still not as fast as the "Blink" and there is always the problem of other things or objects getting pulled into the portal with you if you don't close it behind you fast enough. Like that fly that always manages to slip in just before you close the door behind you. You can see an example of what this problem would be like in the movie "Jumper". If you are not careful it's not a very clean way to teleport. But it most cases it works well enough.

The other way a wizard could teleport is by warping or bending the space they want to travel through. The way this works is a lot like you would see in sci-fi movies like "Star Wars" or "Star Trek". Where the space ships all have some kind of warp drive or hyper drive device. Or the take some kind of shortcut through space like a wormhole. They don't just have some super fast powerful engines in their ships to make them fly through space passed light speed. The way the warp drives work is by warping or bending the very fabric of space itself to make a very long distance a lot shorter. This is how they are able to go light speed and faster. They are not really going faster, it is more like they are cheating.
Lets say you had 2 small tables and you wanted to be able to get from on top of 1 table (Table "A") to stand on top of the other table. (Table "B".) Both tables are on top on a carpet that is lets say 25-30 meters long. Well you can't jump from table "A" to table "B" because it's too far to jump. Unless you are superman or something. And you could just hop off table "A" walk over to table "B" and climb on to table "B". But this would not be a very fast way to go from "A" to "B" And you can't move the tables by just picking them up and moving them because they are glued to the carpet. So you cheat by pulling the middle of the carpet making it fold over its self many times until it's only a short gap between table "A" and table "B". You can just hop from "A" to "B" now with no problem. Yeah it's kind of cheating but this is kind of how warp drives or worm holes work.
Wizards that learn how to control time and space by warping it, can use this method to transport them self a much longer distance, in a short amount of time, with less effort. In the movies the warp drives normally have to power up before they can be used. And warping can be done on any distance and on any scale. You think blackholes have to be super big like only something big like a spaceship can be warped. Look at this link ---> Man-made Blackhole People have made blackholes but they are way to small to do any damage. Warp does not imply a super long distance. Distance is only relevent to the size of something. The distance of 3 meters may be a long distance for an ant, but to a human it's not any distance at all. So you can take the 25-30 meters in front of you and warp, or bend, or fold, or shrink, it to a much shorter distance. This is why in the case of this game "PWI" the skill is called "Distance Shrink" and not "Distance Blink". b:laugh To the wizard using it, it only feels like they jumped forward like 1 foot or less but because they warped the 25-30 meters in front of them it seems like they jumped that far. Nope we just cheated.

Yeah I have been very bored and have been doing a ton of research on stuff like this.

There is some major differences between wizards and witches/warlocks. Witches/warlocks study in the same form but in totally different areas. A Witch or "wicca" in the Old English term, practices witchcraft. To them witchcraft not just magic but a religion and a way of life, where they believe in worshipping mother nature and that all creations are sacred. They also believe that the world, and everything in it, was created by both a male and a female deity, a God and Goddess. Witchcraft is neither black nor white. But in most cases witches/warlocks or people that practice witchcraft are viewed as evil mostly. And their are people who would use it's magic to create a spell to harm, manipulate, dominate or control another person's body and mind in some way, shape, or form. a.k.a. "Curses". Basiclly using it in evil ways, and many people do. O.O The Wican Rede or "rule" is the one thing that everyone involved must respect and follow in order to have a good order in this religion. But the "Warlocks" a.k.a "Oath Breakers" (the meaning of the word) Don't follow these rules and use their powers for evil, to help them self and not others. But in many other places you hear of a witch being refered to as a female and a warlock as a male wican. Always some confusion here. I have always heard it this way.

A wizard dose not become a wizard by studying wizardry. That is really a word someone just made up cause they were not sure what to call all of it. The word wizard means "wise one". And wizards don't just practices any form of magic. Wizards study in the form of arcane magic. Arcane magic has many fields or areas in it. To wizards magic is not religion or a way of life like it is for a wican/witch/warlock, but it is more of an art and a science. In the areas of witchcraft they study magic that can help the body or mind in some way, "Charms" and hurt the body or mind "Curses" As well as many other magic spells and effects. Most of the time when using a spell a witch will say some kind of weird words or some kind of chant. These words/chants are not just magic words that make things happen, but more like words to ask or command "if you are evil," the spirits or supernatural forces to do something for you or to someone. For those that are good asking for help, those that are bad asking them to hurt or curse someone. Wizards on the other hand, the spells they learn is much more along the lines of not controling someones body or mind, but the world around them. Controling the environment and the forces of nature. This is why wizards have so many elemental type spells like fire, lightning, ice, etc. etc. etc. etc. etc... But wizards don't just say magic words. Wizards don't need to say anything at all to use magic. The way a wizard uses magic is not just by making a fireball appear, but first knowing and understanding what fire is and how it works. It's about knowing the science behind it all. Once you know this then you only need to apply a little magic in the right area and the right way to make a small change happen to get the results you want. Wizards don't always follow or worship a deity but many do. But their religion and magic do not in any way effect each other. Wizards are mostly always viewed as good and friendly. In many stories the hero is always helped out in some way by a wise old wizard. Magic + Science = the way wizards use magic. You don't become a wizards by being born one. Magic is not something that is just in your blood and those that don't have it can't use it. It just takes many, many, many, years of studying magic and science.

So those of you that are fans of Harry Potter, he is really not a wizard. Wizards don't use curses, and don't need to say anything to use spells. He is really a wican/witch/warlock depending on your religion and/or what part of the world you are coming from. I mean come on, how are the flying broomsticks not a dead give away. LOL

I'm not nitpicking, I'm just telling it how it is... or was... or whatever... b:pleased