The Food Chain

Niteshadows - Harshlands

now it's simple, the first one to make the actual food chain for pk/pvp wins.

*name of the class only~anything add like "r9 barb" or "5 aps sin" doesn't count. have funb:bye

HardToThink - Lost City

sin>psychic>wiz>archer>bm>barb>veno>seeker>cleric>mystic

XXZeonXx - Harshlands

HardToThink - Lost City wrote: »

sin>psychic>wiz>archer>bm>barb>veno>seeker>cleric>mystic

LC must have some pretty crappy Seekers if you think we're below Venos and Barbs, lmao.

X\_Tegus_/X - Harshlands

XXZeonXx - Harshlands wrote: »

LC must have some pretty crappy Seekers if you think we're below Venos and Barbs, lmao.

i seen a seeker try to vortex her in a 1 vs 1 in one of her videos

_Perses_ - Lost City

Assuming top of the line gear (and I mean everything maxed):

Psychic > Sin > Wizard > Barb > BM > Archer > Veno > Cleric > Mystic > Seeker

XXZeonXx - Harshlands

X\_Tegus_/X - Harshlands wrote: »

i seen a seeker try to vortex her in a 1 vs 1 in one of her videos

Lmfao.

_Perses_ - Lost City wrote: »

Assuming top of the line gear (and I mean everything maxed):

Psychic > Sin > Wizard > Barb > BM > Archer > Veno > Cleric > Mystic > Seeker

Yeah, LC must have some terrible Seekers. WTB server transfer stone. HL is getting pretty boring anyway.

ZackMystic - Harshlands

XXZeonXx - Harshlands wrote: »

Lmfao.



Yeah, LC must have some terrible Seekers. WTB server transfer stone. HL is getting pretty boring anyway.

They totally need one of those stones.. But Zeon dont leave HL we rock!!! b:embarrass

XXZeonXx - Harshlands

But we need an influx of new players. :<

_Perses_ - Lost City

XXZeonXx - Harshlands wrote: »

Lmfao.



Yeah, LC must have some terrible Seekers. WTB server transfer stone. HL is getting pretty boring anyway.

About the only good seekers I know of are..

TwoHandedAOE (Who switched from a veno to a seeker when expansion hit) and RaveOr_Die.


Other than those two...i've never seen any other good seekers.

Ajiuo - Harshlands

So THIS is the thread you were talking about earlier....

X\_Tegus_/X - Harshlands

im interested to see wut niteshadows thinks the actual food chain is since theres a correct answer apparently.

but anyway while we're on topic, lemme talk about seekers for a sec. I didnt wanna waste a whole new thread about his but there's a few noteworthy things i must mention from observation and self experience having a seeker myself, and i come to conclusion that seekers are underrated as hell. Courtesy of all the amazingly fail seekers that ive seen or fought.

When my bm was 89 i was aoe grinding near burning heart because double drops was on and i gathered the wolves then suddenly a red name seeker that i didnt notice in the area decides to attack me in the middle of my pull .. So wut does he do ? He opens with
voidstep ....*palmface* I didnt see wut happend but suddenly im stunned so i thought it was a sin attack then next thing u know i see this seeker inside me... no homo... So then he tries a vortex..... i leaped back.... i was out of range... he wasted 2 sparks.... like a nugget..

im sorry but any seeker that can fit themself into the following descriptions is just fail :

- if ur a seeker and u occult ice on ur genie so u can occult ice DERP VORTEX... u fail...

- if ur a seeker and u went demon because of demon spark ... u fail

- if ur a seeker and ur idea of working with stances is auto attacking till ur target is marked .. u fail..

- if ur a seeker and ur trying to justify the usefullness of having more APS on a seeker ... u fail..

- if ur a seeker and u dont kite melees .. u fail..

This final point is wut bothers me the most. when i see r9 seekers die to a non r9 sin because they sat there trying to tank spark when they werent even stunned, or tank aps in general. Some seekers i guess dont understand the ridiculous advantage they could have when fighting a melee class. Jesus Christ son u have a long range immobilize that last 8 seconds , which is enough time to cast off more of ur other ranged skills . Do u think that heart seeker is 25-28 m range ( 33 if demon ) so that u can run up to their face and use it? So that theyre immobilized but can still reach u cause ur practically hugging them? This is one of the advantages which makes sins easier to deal with as opposed to say a bm or barb that has to be in its range to kill it , meaning he can be hit himself also. **** the str genies and go vit magic with some defensive skills like expel , absolute domain, fortify and other skills u could have. extreme poison should be enough for a dmg boost .


But as i was saying , u see me mentioning sins specifically like theyre the only class that exists but let me tell u something, if u can beat sins u just beat like 75% of the frickin game. My seeker is 91 , not even full TT 90 , has a **** barely refined Fireblowtis blade of the faggen and yet i have beat photocopy geared sins ( r8/tt99 boots , wrists/ nirv daggers ).

Just a few days ago i fought one at hidden orchid, beat him twice, then another sin ( his friend ) who is the wife of ANOTHER sin -_- challenged me . So we started, and she stealthed.. So i was moving around not staying still, till she finally came out with a tackling slash from stealth then demon sparked . I transferred back her imobilize then kited, got in a few hits then she re-stealthed.... comes out again later blah blah blah, she triple sparks again, i kite. If she catches me with with shadow teleport i still have expel ready to use , but the minute i turn the fight around and get some offense in she would stealth. Then shes b!tching at me talking about ''youre a runner!'' ''i dont fight runners'' and when i say im not gonna sit there and tank demon spark she hits me with '' ur charmed and ur a runner, u deserve to be ganked!'' I'm sorry but sins with every control skill in the book plus occult ice on their genie, complaining about ''runners''??? When they themself stealth???
They have nothing to complain about with all their control skills , shadow jump , shadow teleport , Tidal protection for themself because u know, they have to protect themselves from the many variety of insanely OP control skills and status effects that the original classes have. Then when u die u have the nerve to drop vacs ... **** Pleeassee

X\_Tegus_/X - Harshlands

X\_Tegus_/X - Harshlands wrote: »

im interested to see wut niteshadows thinks the actual food chain is since theres a correct answer apparently.

but anyway while we're on topic, lemme talk about seekers for a sec. I didnt wanna waste a whole new thread about his but there's a few noteworthy things i must mention from observation and self experience having a seeker myself, and i come to conclusion that seekers are underrated as hell. Courtesy of all the amazingly fail seekers that ive seen or fought.

When my bm was 89 i was aoe grinding near burning heart because double drops was on and i gathered the wolves then suddenly a red name seeker that i didnt notice in the area decides to attack me in the middle of my pull .. So wut does he do ? He opens with
voidstep ....*palmface* I didnt see wut happend but suddenly im stunned so i thought it was a sin attack then next thing u know i see this seeker inside me... no homo... So then he tries a vortex..... i leaped back.... i was out of range... he wasted 2 sparks.... like a nugget..

im sorry but any seeker that can fit themself into the following descriptions is just fail :

- if ur a seeker and u occult ice on ur genie so u can occult ice DERP VORTEX... u fail...

- if ur a seeker and u went demon because of demon spark ... u fail

- if ur a seeker and ur idea of working with stances is auto attacking till ur target is marked .. u fail..

- if ur a seeker and ur trying to justify the usefullness of having more APS on a seeker ... u fail..

- if ur a seeker and u dont kite melees .. u fail..

This final point is wut bothers me the most. when i see r9 seekers die to a non r9 sin because they sat there trying to tank spark when they werent even stunned, or tank aps in general. Some seekers i guess dont understand the ridiculous advantage they could have when fighting a melee class. Jesus Christ son u have a long range immobilize that last 8 seconds , which is enough time to cast off more of ur other ranged skills . Do u think that heart seeker is 25-28 m range ( 33 if demon ) so that u can run up to their face and use it? So that theyre immobilized but can still reach u cause ur practically hugging them? This is one of the advantages which makes sins easier to deal with as opposed to say a bm or barb that has to be in its range to kill it , meaning he can be hit himself also. **** the str genies and go vit magic with some defensive skills like expel , absolute domain, fortify and other skills u could have. extreme poison should be enough for a dmg boost .


But as i was saying , u see me mentioning sins specifically like theyre the only class that exists but let me tell u something, if u can beat sins u just beat like 75% of the frickin game. My seeker is 91 , not even full TT 90 , has a **** barely refined Fireblowtis blade of the faggen and yet i have beat photocopy geared sins ( r8/tt99 boots , wrists/ nirv daggers ).

Just a few days ago i fought one at hidden orchid, beat him twice, then another sin ( his friend ) who is the wife of ANOTHER sin -_- challenged me . So we started, and she stealthed.. So i was moving around not staying still, till she finally came out with a tackling slash from stealth then demon sparked . I transferred back her imobilize then kited, got in a few hits then she re-stealthed.... comes out again later blah blah blah, she triple sparks again, i kite. If she catches me with with shadow teleport i still have expel ready to use , but the minute i turn the fight around and get some offense in she would stealth. Then shes b!tching at me talking about ''youre a runner!'' ''i dont fight runners'' and when i say im not gonna sit there and tank demon spark she hits me with '' ur charmed and ur a runner, u deserve to be ganked!'' I'm sorry but sins with every control skill in the book plus occult ice on their genie, complaining about ''runners''??? When they themself stealth???
They have nothing to complain about with all their control skills , shadow jump , shadow teleport , Tidal protection for themself because u know, they have to protect themselves from the many variety of insanely OP control skills and status effects that the original classes have. Then when u die u have the nerve to drop vacs ... **** Pleeassee

Cool story bro...

XXZeonXx - Harshlands

X\_Tegus_/X - Harshlands wrote: »

im interested to see wut niteshadows thinks the actual food chain is since theres a correct answer apparently.

but anyway while we're on topic, lemme talk about seekers for a sec. I didnt wanna waste a whole new thread about his but there's a few noteworthy things i must mention from observation and self experience having a seeker myself, and i come to conclusion that seekers are underrated as hell. Courtesy of all the amazingly fail seekers that ive seen or fought.

When my bm was 89 i was aoe grinding near burning heart because double drops was on and i gathered the wolves then suddenly a red name seeker that i didnt notice in the area decides to attack me in the middle of my pull .. So wut does he do ? He opens with
voidstep ....*palmface* I didnt see wut happend but suddenly im stunned so i thought it was a sin attack then next thing u know i see this seeker inside me... no homo... So then he tries a vortex..... i leaped back.... i was out of range... he wasted 2 sparks.... like a nugget..

im sorry but any seeker that can fit themself into the following descriptions is just fail :

- if ur a seeker and u occult ice on ur genie so u can occult ice DERP VORTEX... u fail...

- if ur a seeker and u went demon because of demon spark ... u fail

- if ur a seeker and ur idea of working with stances is auto attacking till ur target is marked .. u fail..

- if ur a seeker and ur trying to justify the usefullness of having more APS on a seeker ... u fail..

- if ur a seeker and u dont kite melees .. u fail..

This final point is wut bothers me the most. when i see r9 seekers die to a non r9 sin because they sat there trying to tank spark when they werent even stunned, or tank aps in general. Some seekers i guess dont understand the ridiculous advantage they could have when fighting a melee class. Jesus Christ son u have a long range immobilize that last 8 seconds , which is enough time to cast off more of ur other ranged skills . Do u think that heart seeker is 25-28 m range ( 33 if demon ) so that u can run up to their face and use it? So that theyre immobilized but can still reach u cause ur practically hugging them? This is one of the advantages which makes sins easier to deal with as opposed to say a bm or barb that has to be in its range to kill it , meaning he can be hit himself also. **** the str genies and go vit magic with some defensive skills like expel , absolute domain, fortify and other skills u could have. extreme poison should be enough for a dmg boost .


But as i was saying , u see me mentioning sins specifically like theyre the only class that exists but let me tell u something, if u can beat sins u just beat like 75% of the frickin game. My seeker is 91 , not even full TT 90 , has a **** barely refined Fireblowtis blade of the faggen and yet i have beat photocopy geared sins ( r8/tt99 boots , wrists/ nirv daggers ).

Just a few days ago i fought one at hidden orchid, beat him twice, then another sin ( his friend ) who is the wife of ANOTHER sin -_- challenged me . So we started, and she stealthed.. So i was moving around not staying still, till she finally came out with a tackling slash from stealth then demon sparked . I transferred back her imobilize then kited, got in a few hits then she re-stealthed.... comes out again later blah blah blah, she triple sparks again, i kite. If she catches me with with shadow teleport i still have expel ready to use , but the minute i turn the fight around and get some offense in she would stealth. Then shes b!tching at me talking about ''youre a runner!'' ''i dont fight runners'' and when i say im not gonna sit there and tank demon spark she hits me with '' ur charmed and ur a runner, u deserve to be ganked!'' I'm sorry but sins with every control skill in the book plus occult ice on their genie, complaining about ''runners''??? When they themself stealth???
They have nothing to complain about with all their control skills , shadow jump , shadow teleport , Tidal protection for themself because u know, they have to protect themselves from the many variety of insanely OP control skills and status effects that the original classes have. Then when u die u have the nerve to drop vacs ... **** Pleeassee

Most of the fail Seekers from the servers will probably not bother to read this, will never see it, or will see it and not comprehend. For this reason, and because I actually like the fact that most people don't know how to play Seekers and that it requires a bit of thought to play efficiently in a lot of situations, I haven't attempted convincing the ones who are terrible at the class (most) on how to play. That'd be like a Sin trying to teach a Sin how to play.
But let me add to it.

When it comes to casters like Wizzies, Clerics, Psys, Seekers, etc. the optimal strategies don't require nearly as much thought as fighting melees, especially Sins and BMs. Telling the difference between an excellent Seeker and a crappy one won't be as obvious when watching a fight between the Seeker and a caster as it will be when they fight an APS/dangerous melee.

When it comes to fighting melees, specifically APS melees, knowing how to kite and to play Seeker efficiently will make the difference between having 9x mold gear and..mediocre refines/shards on R9. Yes, this means that for Sins/BMs, this inferior geared Seeker would be harder than, or just as hard to kill, as a clueless/mediocre R9 Seeker.

The difference that being skilled vs unskilled makes is apparent in every class, but out of all of my experience of watching and participating in fights in PWI, I have yet to see a class that is more skill-influenced than Seeker.

Get a good genie and learn your class (AND LEARN HOW TO KITE, PLEEEAASSEE) before you CS R9 or give your Seeker your alt's gear. If you plan to PvP. If not, then have fun spinning circles in PvE.

And lol, Tegus, I love how I'd know exactly who you were talking about without even having to be told. XD

CRIMSONJR FTW! <

Niteshadows - Harshlands

if i were to compile all of the videos i've seen, the threads i've read and the pvp i've witnessed on my server and sometimes the lost city server<west gate then this would be my order.

psy>barb>sin>wiz>bm>seeker>archer>mystic>veno>cleric

my reasons:

psy in first place because i've seen first hand what hey r capable of when they receive their r9 and the added bonus in their dmg they get from their op soulforce. qq lol

i place barbs ahead of sins because in most cases a sin has to spark to dispatch a barb where as a barb will only need to tank the sins hits until he/she sees an opportunity to use arma or whatever to end the fight.

wizzies r a force to be reckoned with in tw as they pretty much can one shot anyone.

bm's can be versatile in their own right, but again they r not the hardest hitting class among the melee users though they do have an array of control skills, but imo a sin stuns a hell of alot better. lol

seekers r perhaps the most underrated pvp class there is. my reason for placing them before bms is because they lack aps. but don't let that fool u. they r the "hardest hitting melee class u know" and in the right hands can deal some massive damage to a squad of players.

don't be discouraged for where archers r placed, personally i love archers. but the downside for using archers is the class is designed for refines. if u have **** refines then u will have a hell of a time at pvp and will be easy pickings for any wizard looking for a one shot kill.

mystics can be tricky. they have plants that can be a pain to deal with, and added they have summons that can quickly turn the tide of the battle at any time. but their major weakness is their massive mana consumption.

now the last two. nothing against clerics but i believe they r the most handicapped out of any class. i've read there is a way for them to one shot other classes but im to lazy to find where i've seen it at. clerics were made for the support role, so placing veno's ahead of them i think is fair since they do have the advantage of having a nix that dishes out massive bleeding dmg. more so u will need to have decent refines for the bleed not to be a factor when u do face one. and for the veno's dmg, lol let's not go there. >>

well those r my placements. whether u agree or disagree is something im more intrigued to see.b:victory

Nniotora - Lost City

_Perses_ - Lost City wrote: »

About the only good seekers I know of are..

TwoHandedAOE (Who switched from a veno to a seeker when expansion hit) and RaveOr_Die.


Other than those two...i've never seen any other good seekers.

... never seen any good ones huh but yea lost city has nearly no end game seekers who can match the other classes cept Dangler and me. Lost City seekers are a joke not hating jsut truth

_Perses_ - Lost City

Nniotora - Lost City wrote: »

... never seen any good ones huh but yea lost city has nearly no end game seekers who can match the other classes cept Dangler and me. Lost City seekers are a joke not hating jsut truth

I've never seen you outside of catshop before <.<

But I have watched those before. TwoHanded in both PvE and PvP, and RaveOr_Die in PvE with a small bit of PvP.


You need to let me know when you gonna PK, i'll come watch xD

ZackMystic - Harshlands

Niteshadows - Harshlands wrote: »

if i were to compile all of the videos i've seen, the threads i've read and the pvp i've witnessed on my server and sometimes the lost city server<west gate then this would be my order.

psy>barb>sin>wiz>bm>seeker>archer>mystic>veno>cleric

my reasons:

psy in first place because i've seen first hand what hey r capable of when they receive their r9 and the added bonus in their dmg they get from their op soulforce. qq lol

i place barbs ahead of sins because in most cases a sin has to spark to dispatch a barb where as a barb will only need to tank the sins hits until he/she sees an opportunity to use arma or whatever to end the fight.

wizzies r a force to be reckoned with in tw as they pretty much can one shot anyone.

bm's can be versatile in their own right, but again they r not the hardest hitting class among the melee users though they do have an array of control skills, but imo a sin stuns a hell of alot better. lol

seekers r perhaps the most underrated pvp class there is. my reason for placing them before bms is because they lack aps. but don't let that fool u. they r the "hardest hitting melee class u know" and in the right hands can deal some massive damage to a squad of players.

don't be discouraged for where archers r placed, personally i love archers. but the downside for using archers is the class is designed for refines. if u have **** refines then u will have a hell of a time at pvp and will be easy pickings for any wizard looking for a one shot kill.

mystics can be tricky. they have plants that can be a pain to deal with, and added they have summons that can quickly turn the tide of the battle at any time. but their major weakness is their massive mana consumption.

now the last two. nothing against clerics but i believe they r the most handicapped out of any class. i've read there is a way for them to one shot other classes but im to lazy to find where i've seen it at. clerics were made for the support role, so placing veno's ahead of them i think is fair since they do have the advantage of having a nix that dishes out massive bleeding dmg. more so u will need to have decent refines for the bleed not to be a factor when u do face one. and for the veno's dmg, lol let's not go there. >>

well those r my placements. whether u agree or disagree is something im more intrigued to see.b:victory

Like you said archers without good refines arent very fast killers. so id place mystics in front of them since a mystic can get away with less refine imo

Cody_tylor - Sanctuary

Niteshadows - Harshlands wrote: »

now it's simple, the first one to make the actual food chain for pk/pvp wins.

*name of the class only~anything add like "r9 barb" or "5 aps sin" doesn't count. have funb:bye

Fail BM

Cash shopper > Veno > Mystic > Everybody Else > Noobs.

duygutr

HardToThink - Lost City wrote: »

sin>psychic>wiz>archer>bm>barb>veno>seeker>cleric>mystic

b:laughb:laughb:laugh u mention about Pwi or another game?

dfdfdfdfdfds

hiiiii

Niteshadows - Harshlands

Cody_tylor - Sanctuary wrote: »

Fail BM

Cash shopper > Veno > Mystic > Everybody Else > Noobs.

im the fail? look at who's not posting on their main.b:shutupb:bye

BloodTyrant - Raging Tide

barbs=seeker > sin > psy > wiz > archer > bm > cleric > veno > mystic.

barb / seeker fight can last too long if equally rates. i've saw one of 15min +b:tired

Xaner - Dreamweaver

Mystic=Psy>barb>sin=bm>veno>archer>seeker>wizard>cleric

Leviath_Imp - Lost City

the wiz is moving down the chain as more ppl post b:surrender

blbldsfwsr

dfdfdfdfdfds wrote: »

psy > seeker > sin > barb > wiz > bm > veno > mystic > archer > cleric

Considering all are r9+12 for the purpose of max soulfource, without high soulforce psy's are nothing.

Seeker with with gear/ornas equal to a sins weapon will **** it all day long. Sins **** the rest, BM who go aps are wannabe sins and fail. Archers who go aps are a joke and id put them at bottom of list if it wasnt for full r9 archers.

You can't discuss a classes potential pvp skill without discussing their endgame gear and choices, whether it's soulforce, aps, dph, sage, demon. Going 5 aps is a players own choice same as going full r9 so when it comes to endgame aps chars with huge dps they should be compared to a char with max survivability ie. full r9+12 josd seekers.

HAH.....puhlezzz.....full r9 +12 dot sin will destroy a full r9 +12 josd seeker ANYDAY.

Cody_tylor - Sanctuary

Niteshadows - Harshlands wrote: »

im the fail? look at who's not posting on their main.b:shutupb:bye

OFC you are fail, while you post on your main while you think you are a big shot and looking like some idiot in public... I just killed a fail demon sin in DT with my 70 veno without my pet... and I don't even PK. I wasn't supposed to kill anyone...

Niteshadows - Harshlands

Cody_tylor - Sanctuary wrote: »

OFC you are fail, while you post on your main while you think you are a big shot and looking like some idiot in public... I just killed a fail demon sin in DT with my 70 veno without my pet... and I don't even PK. I wasn't supposed to kill anyone...

nah, im not a fail. reasons being 1. i don't have to hide behind an alt to get a point across. 2. i see trolling is ur profession so u have me beat by a long shot in that category. AND 3. from what i see, u couldn't even hurt a fly. so scoot along jr. and stop killing those helpless afk sins.b:quiet

Clairvoyantt - Dreamweaver

I thought we already went through this once

Sins are Scissors.

Psychics are Rocks.

Archers, Venos, Barbs, Wizards, BMs, Mystics, Seekers are Paper.

...and Clerics are Mushrooms.

Paper beats Rock.

Scissors beats Paper.

Scissors also happens to beat Rock...

...until Rock gets 50k+ soulforce at which point Rock becomes an unstoppable killing machine that beats Paper... and would beat Scissors but it can't find Scissors, because Scissors are invisible.

So Scissors beat Paper and avoids Rock, and that is called BALANCE.

Credit to cheze and http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NXX8URSUWm0

b:thanks

Cody_tylor - Sanctuary

Niteshadows - Harshlands wrote: »

nah, im not a fail. reasons being 1. i don't have to hide behind an alt to get a point across. 2. i see trolling is ur profession so u have me beat by a long shot in that category. AND 3. from what i see, u couldn't even hurt a fly. so scoot along jr. and stop killing those helpless afk sins.b:quiet

Yeah, QQ on your main... Really smart b:laugh At least we know who fails hard... ROFL LOL

ZackMystic - Harshlands

Leviath_Imp - Lost City wrote: »

the wiz is moving down the chain as more ppl post b:surrender

There really should be more specific on like what lvl the classes are... cause im definetely sure wizzies at my lvl are not complete down, i say they are one step above archer at ths lvl

Leviath_Imp - Lost City

hmm well lotsa ppl say that wiz sux until 100+ or somewhere around there...
problem with wiz is b/c it is very genie dependent to survive and in some cases, hit hard, many ppl count this as a big weakness, which is probably true b:cry