Feeling a bit uneasy oO-minor rant(not QQ)

FloraFang - Harshlands

So i've been jumping from alt to alt( lol who doesn't these days?)because of the aps craze I feel a bit uneasy, it seems like all caster classes save for psys and maybe mystics are on the bottom of the later. Add to that how many ppl have r9 it's alittle depressing xD. I remeber when u could go pking and get a red name w/o a sin suddenly poping up and butchering you from behind(oh the good 'ol days).
But what i'm trying to get to is where do venos stand? o.OIt could just be me, pvp seems a bit harder?(for a lack of a better word) You kill someone they come bck w/ a sin alt and murder you xD.
I dnt mean to make this sound like Q_Q but do i rlly need a sin to compete with others? I understand fully it's personal preference and play2 have fun, but it's really hard when you the benefits of your class seems to be um..declining?and u have to find alterior ways of being equal w/ other people. I've spent years just to get to lvl79(mostly due to computer problems) which isnt a good thing but it counts for something right?
Is it me(because i'm undergeared?0 when i see another class w/ their cool gear i suddenly want to make one? but when I actually play them it's not...exciting(this mostly applies to meele classes).
Another factor i consider in my hailstorm of uncertainty is my crappy computer xD a magic classes who lags too much=dead. So i thought okay I have to play a meele class atleast that way i'm still auto attacking while I lag I think? but it's such a pain to play meele.
Anyway /rant I just needed somewhere to vent a little and maybe see if others are having some of the same troubles. remember this is not a Q_Q, it's not a troll, it's just a vent that's what forums are for right? xD

King_Solomon - Heavens Tear

Yes, you need good gear regardless of the class.

Venomancers aren't balanced to be raw damage dealers. They are unique as a defensive class with attack support skills. Even though Venomancers have poor HP pool they're built to survive as many hits as a Barbarian, with 3 skills that may be used for healing (Metabolic Boost, Leech, Soul Transfusion), 2 skills to help with taking even more hits (Bramble Hood, Feral Concentration) and unmatched physical defense gain by Fox Form. Pets alone are powerful enough to tank most bosses of the game.

Eoria - Harshlands

Expel works wonders for dealing with sins and BMs. Also works for stupid archers that just auto-attack you.

But as the person above me said, venos don't really need to kill people in PVP. You're support. And yeah, you'll need gear if you want to do any sort of PVPing on any class.

Don't invest in a class you don't like playing. Just go with whatever class you enjoy.

Sheshka - Raging Tide

Venos are not just a support class. Yes they have a lot of support skills and comparatively their spells may not hit as hard as a psy or a wizard but venos can be built for nuke.

FloraFang - Harshlands

I thin a qyestion i want to ask is do u act on instinct?
I've done some pretty stupid things on instinct like wipe all chracters get 2mil blow it on a new charcater then realize I want my old chracters bck oO
Like right now my veno needs serious monies cause i've quit her multiple times >.> right now i'm looking into playing a seeker. I'm trying to take advice from my friends and plan stuff out but it's so hard when u dnt have the same resources as other ppl or u feel like you might not reach your goal.
I'm a slow player I kind of liek to enjoy the game so i set my sights on full niravana gear for all my characters whether its expensiver than r8/9 or not is even in my head I want niravana and thats bottom line xD.
But i think the lesson here is think before u leap >.< anyone else second this notion? xD

Aijou - Harshlands

Sheshka - Raging Tide wrote: »

Venos are not just a support class. Yes they have a lot of support skills and comparatively their spells may not hit as hard as a psy or a wizard but venos can be built for nuke.

if you want to be ****.

thumbs

King_Solomon - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Yes, you need good gear regardless of the class.

Application dependent

Venomancers aren't balanced to be raw damage dealers.

My veno way out damages my other mage toons.

They are unique as a defensive class with attack support skills.

Mystic's have better defense, and many classes have attack support skills often rivaling veno's.

FloraFang - Harshlands

Thanks to Eoria I've decided to look more into my mystic but i've also shown intrest in archers and seekers
what are your opinons about the three? oO

Sheshka - Raging Tide

Aijou - Harshlands wrote: »

if you want to be ****.

I disagree. I'm built full magic and I do just fine.

tfi3f

Sheshka, you are a lvl64 nobody on a PvE server. Even if your forum icon is "glitched" and you're really lvl 105, the fact that you think a veno is not best played as a support class endgame tells me that you have no idea what your class is about

Sheshka - Raging Tide

tfi3f wrote: »

Sheshka, you are a lvl64 nobody on a PvE server. Even if your forum icon is "glitched" and you're really lvl 105, the fact that you think a veno is not best played as a support class endgame tells me that you have no idea what your class is about

I thought the idea of a game was to enjoy it? Excuse me if you don't like my build and all but I don't think the class is or needs to be limited to only being around to act as support. I do PVE and this build works for me. Obviously that is not going to be the case for PVP or for everyone but calling me a ****** because I'm built arcane wasn't called for.

tfi3f

I called you fail because you seem to think a veno is a DD -- not because you're arcane >.>

Sheshka - Raging Tide

tfi3f wrote: »

I called you fail because you seem to think a veno is a DD -- not because you're arcane >.>

As a matter of fact I never once said the class can't be played support. Most people play it support. I just happens that the class can be played either support or DD and still be effective. It's not like I just pulled the idea out of a hat. I asked players who had been in the game longer then me. Opinions do differ on what is best but I didn't say the class couldn't be support. I said it didn't have to only be played support. It can be played either way, support is just the favored especially for TW and PVP.

Linchen - Sanctuary

tfi3f wrote: »

I called you fail because you seem to think a veno is a DD -- not because you're arcane >.>

u got the point.
i never used a simple attack skill , i only use pet heal and send sparks to my enemy after a while they usually r so full of sparks that they cant attack me anylonger.


ok back to topic.
venos were overpowered in the good old 90s, just a nix attack killed most of the squishies and HA-build was nice to take out bms and archers.

nowadays u have to go back to the roots.
be a supporter and assist on ur squadmembers, maybe u wont get the kill, but ur purge-amp-stun will make ur low refined extremely neebish squad able to kill the OP enemy.
enjoy the game on whatever char u want as long as u r not a r9 psy with high refine u need to check ur enemies before u can kill them.
u only r8 with low refine? avoid r9s with high refines but maybe u start enjoying ur support skills and team pvp.

dosris

tfi3f wrote: »

I called you fail because you seem to think a veno is a DD -- not because you're arcane >.>

Yea because only specially designated "DD" classes can cause damage right? Because Veno's cant actually use any skills that cause damage right? They dont have pets or anything, or attack skills or spells, I mean RIGHT?! /sarcasm

See those little red numbers above a targets head when you use a skill or something? Called damage. Every class can do it. ANY class can DD if you really want to get technical about this.

Aside from the fact that Veno's are perhaps the most versatile class there is in terms of what they can do, the class, any class really, only does as much as you want it to. You make it how you want it to perform. And if you listen to close-minded ding-dongs like this guy your probably never gonna realize your full potential.

Vitenka - Dreamweaver

Have to say - yes, our main purpose is support.

But there's still time in the debuff rotation to throw damage, and there's no reason for that damage to not be as high as possible.

And for many level ranges, our damage is pretty respectable.

Not up to aps levels, obviously, but still pretty darn good.

FloraFang - Harshlands

Okay okay I figured out the essential question I was trying to ask in that minor rant:
Have u felt urself falling ou tof love w/ ur veno? have you/how did u try to reconnect to keep from alt jumping and mindless insticntive money spending?b:chuckle

_Morigan_ - Harshlands

tfi3f wrote: »

I called you fail because you seem to think a veno is a DD -- not because you're arcane >.>

b:quiet

Phoenix_Eye - Heavens Tear

tfi3f wrote: »

I called you fail because you seem to think a veno is a DD -- not because you're arcane >.>

Are u sure the fail isnt u ??? Support/DD is sth every class can do but veno isnt only for pure support endgame. Just not

Eoria - Harshlands

Phoenix_Eye - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Are u sure the fail isnt u ??? Support/DD is sth every class can do but veno isnt only for pure support endgame. Just not

Veno is only useful for getting off purge/amp/stun/armor break on a target or sending chi to someone at end-game anymore.

tfi3f

Eo, don't bother, it makes no sense -- the PvE servers failed at PWIC for a reason. I don't put as much effort as I used to into trying to argue sense into the venos on this subforum, they just don't listen, and they think that words like "flexibility" and "playstyle" can be used to cover their abject failure.

Veno = support class...roll a mage if you want to DD, end of story. Naturally though, everyone has every right to be a failure, so argue the opposite as strongly as you think you need to in order to make it true.

EDIT: LOL, and IIRC, when I visited Dreamweaver for PWIC I saw a message on their world chat, I believe it was a recruiting message for the top guild on that server. Their recruiting level was 70+. Pro shet.

Susamajii - Lost City

Sheshka - Raging Tide wrote: »

Venos are not just a support class. Yes they have a lot of support skills and comparatively their spells may not hit as hard as a psy or a wizard but venos can be built for nuke.

Venos are a support class period. They are more effective as a support class and should never be trying to 1v1 a target in such things as TW. God sometimes I wonder if anyone knows how to play any class in this game.. seriously.

tfi3f

Lol, what do you expect from the only class subforum where people seem to think that light armour on an arcane class is a viable solution? Assassins and archers complain about LA because in the end it's not as good as HA, but venos on this subforum rush to put on LA and call it "suvivability".

Idk, they like to argue everything by saying all kinds of stupid subjective stuff. "In my experience", and "I've found that", and "Well, I don't know about YOU, but when I'M playing...", and they use that kind of phrasing to open up when they're about to type up a huge crock of absolute sh*t. The biggest emerging favourite way to open up a fail post in here is, "Well, different people have different playstyles", or "not everyone plays their veno the same way, playstyle is important". Good shet.

SiR_PaYoNg_ - Dreamweaver

FloraFang - Harshlands wrote: »

Thanks to Eoria I've decided to look more into my mystic but i've also shown intrest in archers and seekers
what are your opinons about the three? oO

can u give me ur cleric..i love cleric b:pleased

Viper_girl - Heavens Tear

FloraFang - Harshlands wrote: »

Okay okay I figured out the essential question I was trying to ask in that minor rant:
Have u felt urself falling ou tof love w/ ur veno? have you/how did u try to reconnect to keep from alt jumping and mindless insticntive money spending?b:chuckle

I have completely fallen out of "love" for my Veno and now that I'm playing other classes I'm far happier. Despite the fact that I invested in a Herc and Nix. Frankly at higher levels I feel somewhat unwanted and when I see how fail most Venos are I understand why the class gets a reputation for fail players. It makes me want to play my Veno even less except maybe for solo farming.

I can tell you the number of times I'm on my Cleric and have to tell the Veno to bramble the Tank, watch as they fail to Amp, have to emergency heal the Veno when their Pet dies (or even worse when they are too slow to re-target their pet on a mob that has aggroed them) then have to run around kiting the mob after I take aggro... really wants me to *facepalm*.

Right now my Seeker and Cleric are my favorites, although my Mystic is quite fun too.

DryadLaFey - Sanctuary

thumbs wrote: »

Mystic's have better defense, and many classes have attack support skills often rivaling veno's.

Either that or people don't understand how the veno attack support skills work.

DryadLaFey - Sanctuary

Susamajii - Lost City wrote: »

Venos are a support class period. They are more effective as a support class and should never be trying to 1v1 a target in such things as TW. God sometimes I wonder if anyone knows how to play any class in this game.. seriously.

You're right. It's a good thing though that venos are never 1v1 in TW until someone gets lucky and kills the nix.b:chuckle

DryadLaFey - Sanctuary

You know what's great about a well built veno that knows how to play the class? They can give great support and still deal decent damage. As much as wiz or a psy? No. But guess what, our pets' damage doesn't get nerfed in instances. The pet continues to do its full damage while the rest of us are doing half - kinda nice eh. I'm probably never going to see a 500k crit no matter how high I refine my weapon but I will amp damage, throw you a spark, pull that stray mob over there off the cleric, re-bramble the melees in squad, purge that fcc/tt/warsong/vana boss, heal my pet while switching between foxform and human to throw a scarab here and there while the whole time my pet is continuing to do damage.

Viper_girl - Heavens Tear

DryadLaFey - Sanctuary wrote: »

You know what's great about a well built veno that knows how to play the class? They can give great support and still deal decent damage. As much as wiz or a psy? No. But guess what, our pets' damage doesn't get nerfed in instances. The pet continues to do its full damage while the rest of us are doing half - kinda nice eh. I'm probably never going to see a 500k crit no matter how high I refine my weapon but I will amp damage, throw you a spark, pull that stray mob over there off the cleric, re-bramble the melees in squad, purge that fcc/tt/warsong/vana boss, heal my pet while switching between foxform and human to throw a scarab here and there while the whole time my pet is continuing to do damage.

Key phrase in RED b:chuckle

BTW, it doesn't matter that the Pet damage doesn't get nerfed when the other DD classes have way way over 2X more damage than your best DD Pet.

DryadLaFey - Sanctuary

Viper_girl - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Key phrase in RED b:chuckle

BTW, it doesn't matter that the Pet damage doesn't get nerfed when the other DD classes have way way over 2X more damage than your best DD Pet.

Yes, key phrase b:pleased and sadly, when I play my cleric, I've seen quite a few venos that don't really know the veno's true potential. "Oh, I don't use foxform skills, I'm arcane" O.o
ME<<near pure mage veno uses foxform skills all the time.

And true the pet's damage isn't as much as the other dd classes but still, we're doing decent damage while also doing all that other stuff. I don't think it's quite accurate to say we're ONLY support and just stick to our support skills as some on the thread have seemed to say.

Now if they would just let us get our nix into the instances...

AnimaBlanc - Sanctuary

tfi3f wrote: »

Lol, what do you expect from the only class subforum where people seem to think that light armour on an arcane class is a viable solution? Assassins and archers complain about LA because in the end it's not as good as HA, but venos on this subforum rush to put on LA and call it "suvivability".

Idk, they like to argue everything by saying all kinds of stupid subjective stuff. "In my experience", and "I've found that", and "Well, I don't know about YOU, but when I'M playing...", and they use that kind of phrasing to open up when they're about to type up a huge crock of absolute sh*t. The biggest emerging favourite way to open up a fail post in here is, "Well, different people have different playstyles", or "not everyone plays their veno the same way, playstyle is important". Good shet.

In my expierence i have found that people like you are so fed up with yourself you completely surpass the point you were trying to make and contradict yourself.
because well, i dont know about YOIU but when i'm playing i never hear anyone complain when i DD after debuffing rather than stand around looking pretty waiting for my debuffs to cool down.
and you know people are different and actually have different playstyles *gasp* whaddya know. and indeed not everyone plays their veno the same way or would you like to say that even HA veno's should stop what their doing and revert back to AA -just- because you believe their not meant for it? ( next to that, look up ANY thread/post about armor for a veno and you'll see that the majority of the veno's advocate AA with decent shards and refines and where LA comes into play they are ALL saying it comes with a drawback of either losing HP/def OR M.attack. given the person interested does not invest in the right adorns/refinement/sharding to compensate the pisspoor stats of LA)

DD = a playstyle.
Support = a playstyle.

Or do you suggest that every veno should stop investing in a herc to tank your ***** and only debuff, nothing else beside that and take up space because you believe the ONLY thing a veno is good for.... is support ?

if you wanna make it THAT black and white, barbs should not wear claws and revert back to tank because... you know, YOUR that black and white and thats what the class was intended for.
Archers shouldn't use fists because you know... their an archer.
clercis dont -need- to rez your *** because their only there to KEEP you alive, and because you died.. whats there to heal...amirite?
BM's are NOT alowed to HF anymore cause you know... your DD and HF is a debuff, keep pressing autoattack brah.

TL;DR: Your an idiot cause your on a pvp server.blah... fool