Full Mag Cleric Vs Hybrid Cleric

Sakubatou - Sanctuary

Going to add two things to this.

1. Its said over and over again: Power leveling is ruining the game. If people were spending a month on each level they'd probably refine their gear a bit more, have more hp and pdef. Level 100's with 3k hp and 2k pdef? (also noticing alot of high -channeling clerics but thats a whole different can of worms)... Anyways, a few mirages is well worth the coin to increase your hp and pdef, as well as finding physical ornaments and current gear. With a little care you can have both decent hp, and still be pure magic making adding to vit pointless.


2. Run with people you trust. Randoms kill. And bad randoms should either be kicked or build reputations so that they either NEED to learn to play the game or are never able to find a squad again. Every instance should be doable at a reason level with base vitality as long as its ran well with decent players, and the cleric should be most protected of all.

LongWushi - Heavens Tear

Sakubatou - Sanctuary wrote: »

2. Run with people you trust. Randoms kill. And bad randoms should either be kicked or build reputations so that they either NEED to learn to play the game or are never able to find a squad again. Every instance should be doable at a reason level with base vitality as long as its ran well with decent players, and the cleric should be most protected of all.

Yes and no, but sometimes random squads are very, very good. It is a rare occurance to get a good squad of randoms though. I really wish it were true. I find it so funny that if I'm doing fine tanking something on my own my squad will rush to save me, but when I really need the help (and ask for it) I get ignored. Maybe it's just the difference of servers of noobness of the players, but sometimes the quality of playing just gets shot to hell with a baaaaad squad.

Quinarella - Sanctuary

The Pure Mag Build Has to Shard with Citrine for HP but you don't get any Phys Def from the shards. You would have to use ornaments to get your Phys Def and then you can't have Channeling gear. But the Pure Mag Cleric obviously hits a little harder and heals stronger but not so much to make a Huge differance. In order to get a decent amount of HP on a Pure Mag build you have to have all 4 socket gear and high Lv shards. With the Vit Hybrid 1 str, 2 vit and 7 mag avary 1 Lv's you can have a decent ammount of HP and shard with Garnet for Phys def. Your choice would also depend on if you are PvP or PvE. Using the PWI Calculator you can see that the Vit hybrid has More HP and Phys def than the Pure mag build. Both Clerics have the came Exact hear and ornaments I only changed the build and shards.

Pure Mag With Citrines
http://pwcalc.com/d736975e5e634f15

Vit Hybrid With Garnets
http://pwcalc.com/cce8e83bc7030153

If you don't really care for the Channeling gear you can get more Hp and Phys Def from some ornaments. The point here is that if you have the same Exact gear and Sockets the Vit Hybrid Sharded with Garnets will Always have More HP and Phys Def than the Pure Mag.

Zvyn - Heavens Tear

Quinarella - Sanctuary wrote: »

Pure Mag With Citrines
http://pwcalc.com/d736975e5e634f15

Vit Hybrid With Garnets
http://pwcalc.com/cce8e83bc7030153

Ha ha! b:laugh Wow, that's awful. My cleric, wearing my veno's TT90 hand-me-down set, which does contain a few garnet shards, but that's just ridiculous, I would have preferred more citrines. Sharding with garnets is a joke unless you're putting them in your weapon.

Why did you put so much VIT in? The only clerics I know who have over 100 VIT generally have 120+ in VIT for TW/TT. Your "vit hybrid" cleric is pretty lame since the rank gear is unreasonable if they can't afford and because the amount of vit put in is really up to the player. Some people are fine with about half of what you put in, some people have maybe fifty points more than what you put in, and most of the good (and smart) players carry more than one set of ornaments to boost one thing or another, including channeling.

Besides, I would certainly hope that some of their gear would be better than what you put up there. The cape and the hat don't seem very good when you can find others out there that are better.

Quinarella - Sanctuary

Zvyn - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Ha ha! b:laugh Wow, that's awful. My cleric, wearing my veno's TT90 hand-me-down set, which does contain a few garnet shards, but that's just ridiculous, I would have preferred more citrines. Sharding with garnets is a joke unless you're putting them in your weapon.

Why did you put so much VIT in? The only clerics I know who have over 100 VIT generally have 120+ in VIT for TW/TT. Your "vit hybrid" cleric is pretty lame since the rank gear is unreasonable if they can't afford and because the amount of vit put in is really up to the player. Some people are fine with about half of what you put in, some people have maybe fifty points more than what you put in, and most of the good (and smart) players carry more than one set of ornaments to boost one thing or another, including channeling.

Besides, I would certainly hope that some of their gear would be better than what you put up there. The cape and the hat don't seem very good when you can find others out there that are better.

You obviously did not read the Whole Post and Just Decided to Bash my gear. I Don't care what "Dream Gear" and Ornaments you have or don't have. If you use the Vit Hybrid Build: 1 str, 2 vit and 7 mag every 2 Lv's and shard with Garnet you will have MORE HP AND PHY DEF. I did Not make up this build, it is on every Cleric guide there is. Use the PWI Calculator to build a Cleric Any Lv and With Any Gear that you want and use Pure Mag Build sharded with Citrines. Then Copy it Exactly and Change ONLY the Build to Vit Hybrid and the Shards to Garnet and you will see for yourself. Better yet use the Calculator and post your Cleric with your "Great Gear' so we can see it and I will change the build and shards. This Topic has been on this Forum about 200 times and every time it is proven that the vit hybrid has more HP and Phys Def than the Pure mag.

ColdSnow - Dreamweaver

Quinarella - Sanctuary wrote: »

You obviously did not read the Whole Post and Just Decided to Bash my gear. I Don't care what "Dream Gear" and Ornaments you have or don't have. If you use the Vit Hybrid Build: 1 str, 2 vit and 7 mag every 2 Lv's and shard with Garnet you will have MORE HP AND PHY DEF. I did Not make up this build, it is on every Cleric guide there is. Use the PWI Calculator to build a Cleric Any Lv and With Any Gear that you want and use Pure Mag Build sharded with Citrines. Then Copy it Exactly and Change ONLY the Build to Vit Hybrid and the Shards to Garnet and you will see for yourself. Better yet use the Calculator and post your Cleric with your "Great Gear' so we can see it and I will change the build and shards. This Topic has been on this Forum about 200 times and every time it is proven that the vit hybrid has more HP and Phys Def than the Pure mag.

but you have 2k less magic attack..and thats the point. most pure builds dont use immaculate shards. most clerics restat to pure cause they intend to get primal shards.

And talking about "realistic" build....4 sockets on gear...really? Instead of saving money for another Socket, any pure build (actually every AA build) would use this money for refinement on gear to get more HP.

Elemental Belt lvl65? if you get at lvl95 one with with physical defense from quest?

A pure build cleric would NEVER EVER use elemntal ornaments on his gear, thats why your example is...useless.

Here is a pure build Cleric according to your build. Ornaments exchanged with physical one (from quest even so for FREE), REALISTIC sockets and refines at least till 5 on gear (costs even less than your 4th socket).

That is a pure build with primeval.
http://pwcalc.com/e284ac5e7a1c2f5a

That is pure build with immaculates.
http://pwcalc.com/a63ec645cba15f08

Still more HP than you and better defense. You better save money on refining than 4th socket.

Edit: ohh and btw..talking about guides. You prolly missed the point as well that its written by ONE person. So its his build. Almost every hybrid Cleric stops at 40-50vit base and that for a reason.

Quinarella - Sanctuary

ColdSnow - Dreamweaver wrote: »

That is pure build with immaculate.
http://pwcalc.com/a63ec645cba15f08

Still more HP than you and better defense. You better save money on refining than 4th socket.

You compared Immaculate's with Primeval?

Here's youe example with Garnets and Vit Hybrid Build

http://pwcalc.com/a63ec645cba15f08

More HP and More Phys Def.

I never said that you wouldn't loose Mag attack.

ColdSnow - Dreamweaver wrote: »

A pure build cleric would NEVER EVER use elemntal ornaments on his gear, thats why your example is...useless.

I know that. so lets remove all the Ornaments and just look at the Gear and Build

Pure with Citrines
http://pwcalc.com/a63ec645cba15f08

Hybrid with Garnets
http://pwcalc.com/a63ec645cba15f08

Again Hybrid has More HP and Phys Def

Now go ahead and put gear on both as you put the SAME EXACT gear on Both

Eoria - Harshlands

Why would anyone use vit stones on a cleric again? Lol. Cit gems give more HP for 2/3rds of the price.

Also, LOL @ seriously using mdef ornas on a cleric.

ColdSnow - Dreamweaver

Quinarella - Sanctuary wrote: »

You compared Immaculate's with Primeval?

Here's youe example with Garnets and Vit Hybrid Build

http://pwcalc.com/a63ec645cba15f08

More HP and More Phys Def.

I never said that you wouldn't loose Mag attack.




I know that. so lets remove all the Ornaments and just look at the Gear and Build

Pure with Citrines
http://pwcalc.com/a63ec645cba15f08

Hybrid with Garnets
http://pwcalc.com/a63ec645cba15f08

Again Hybrid has More HP and Phys Def

Now go ahead and put the same Exact gear on both

Its same link.

And a hybrid shouldnt use vit shards btw. He has more than enough HP due his points. A Hybrid should use DEF...especially you since you have over 100 base.

And i didnt compare prim. with immaculates. i just showed you an example that a pure build can have better stats with same gear and SHARDS and physical ornaments than you have (and less expensive cause you showed 4 sockets build). Thats why i took immaculates as second example. a pure would use prim. shards. And 2k magic attack more for 1k HP...is more than worth a try.

Quinarella - Sanctuary

OK

Your Build with Citrines
http://pwcalc.com/a63ec645cba15f08

Same Gear and Orniments Hybrid with Garnets
http://pwcalc.com/1f06835c734cbec6

Armor and weapon Only: Pure with Citrines
http://pwcalc.com/0210dc70ebf0f256

Armor and Weapon only Hybrid with Garnets
http://pwcalc.com/fe785a76f407a791

The Whole Point of my post was to show that a Vit Hybrid With Garnets has MORE HP and PHYS DEF than a Pure Mag with the SAME EXACT GEAR ON
Your argument that a Pure would never wear this and a hybrid would never wear that is irrevelent.

ColdSnow - Dreamweaver

Quinarella - Sanctuary wrote: »

The Whole Point of my post was to show that a Vit Hybrid With Garnets has MORE HP and PHYS DEF than a Pure Mag with the SAME EXACT GEAR ON
Your argument that a Pure would never wear this and a hybrid would never wear that is irrevelent.

Thats exactly is wrong. Cause it depends on your build what kind of shards you chose. You basicly concentrated on Channel. A Pure build would never do it. You chose elemental ornaments. A pure build would never do that. You chose Immaculates. A Pure one would go for Prim. You took yourself as as example of a hybrid build. I took equal gear in lvl. I didnt take any ornaments that are not affordable either. If you use lvl65 channel ornaments and paste here your hybrid build then dont expect wonders if people paste actually EQUAL one for pure (without channel).


And now as for your links.
Your Hybrid build is still worse in my eyes. You have 1,5k more pdef but pure wins with 2k magic attack. I rather pew pew that QQ. i have 50 base myself and i think thats to much.

Again..a pure wouldnt be satisfied with immaculates. And a smart hybrid would never use HP shards even.

Quinarella - Sanctuary

I'm done with this Thread.

Saving_Grace - Raging Tide

Pretty much everything has been written here so far. But I like the fact that discussion went on despite the fact that OP dude is almost 100 by now b:chuckle
Anyway, I was pure up until lev72. My gear was always chosen by following that good old tip "have the HP and P.def numbers match each other and as high as possible". Since 72 I've been pumping Vit. No point explaining why I did it and what changed and how I played my game before or after..
Among the common pros and cons "HP vs M.atk. there are few other differences that one should (not) consider and those can be measured and compared in almighty Coin b:dirty..

Vit build - Yes extra HP and (slightly) p.def. Burns more MP. Need higher refines in weapon and better shards in it to compensate (not really important, you can always burn more MP), lower m.resists, could go for channeling ornaments which is not an option for Mage build, and finally you WILL buy reset Note (thrust me) as soon as you see how you suck at lv100 when it feels like even fashion gives you hp. b:cute

Mage build - HP sux until The End, High power and heals, need better shards and refines in armor, will burn more HP pots (tho in my experience, this will not help at all, ever b:laugh ), charms will be a MUST if you want to live as longs as Vit build dude in your squad, you always have time to DD between heals, and do a good job while at it. (fills your friend list faster).. .. ...

I got bored so I'll sum up from here.. Until you hit 100. both builds will cost you the exact same amount of coin. If you're smart 'nuff, you will ware the appropriate gear for you build and from there the game will be slightly different. It don't matter if you can deal noticeable between heals and purifies 'cuz there are 5 APS fellas that can do that and most of bosses you'll do my favorite BB+TV combo. b:pleased On the other side, it doesn't matter that you're last man standing long 'nuff to revive barb or BM after sqd.wipe, cuz high power heals prolly wouldn't get you in that mess at first place.
So I guess it all comes down to the fact how good clery YOU are, not your gears or build. You!

Zvyn - Heavens Tear

Quinarella - Sanctuary wrote: »

I'm done with this Thread.

b:chuckle It was fun picking on you because I really did think your builds and armor and shards looked ridiculous. I read pretty well before replying.

Quinarella - Sanctuary

Zvyn - Heavens Tear wrote: »

b:chuckle It was fun picking on you because I really did think your builds and armor and shards looked ridiculous. I read pretty well before replying.

Really!!! Post your Gear and Build

Eoria - Harshlands

Quinarella - Sanctuary wrote: »

Really!!! Post your Gear and Build

This wasn't directed at me, but I'll do it anyway.

http://pwcalc.com/a1cc8e45891a2f0f Self-buffed.

That's my current gear while working on my end-game gear. Note that I also have a 3 star level 98 mag ring +3 with +225 HP overall and +31 matk in reserve for TW purposes.