Sharding End-Game Bow

Ubique - Raging Tide

To start with a bit of background,

I am pure dex (as much as possible with gear requirements) demon archer. Shorty i will be getting what will be my End Game bow with a bit of luck. I am interested in my fellow Archers opinions on my sharding choices for said bow. Here are what i consider to be my options.

1. + crit stones, I like this idea as i see my crit rate as crucial to both my DPH and DPS and and any increase in Crit rate is beneficial.

2. Garnet Gems (+75 phys Att), This is really (for me at least within my budget) the only alternative to 1, and the benefits versus 1 is simply that the + modifier applies to every shot instead of relying on crit for damage.

So in short i guess its consistancy versus spike damage, I would really appreciate your input to help me decide.

Lubs, Ubi

NiightmareXz - Harshlands

I would go with 2.
Crit stones are kind of a waste of money for archers, especially if you are pure dex. It's also a waste of sockets. I would suggest getting + Crit rate ornaments and armor if you really want + Crit. Anyway, you must have around 30% crit rate, right? I'm 10 levels under and have about 26% with the added dex from gears. (Well before I trashed this archer).
Also, you can make up for crit rate by getting Demon Bow Mastery. I don't know if you have it or not, but it does give a 1% crit rate. It also saves you a socket on your wep.
But I would suggest consistancy over chance, but then again, I never leave anything to chance. b:surrender
It's a matter of personal preferance really... just don't go doing what I did when I was painkillers and shard your wep with +Accuracy WHILE having a misty forest ring.

Boogiepanda - Raging Tide

Primevals gives such a pretty trail

Garnet anyway. 40%-42% crit rate isn't that much different in my opinion.

Ubique - Raging Tide

yer i have demon bow mastery, depending on the ornaments i use i can get my current crit rate upto 40%, i guess i should explain further. The bow im talking about is rank9 which has only +2% crit on it compared to the +4 on rank8 also the rank9 ring is +2% i think compared to +3% on rank 8. So in going to rank9 im losing +3% crit rate on my gears. i can gain 1% back statting dex wen i get 101 and i figured to gain the other 2% back using +crit stones on the wep so i can maintain my +40% crit rate overall.

hopw this explains the issue better

Ubi

(im a bit hungover so i havent checked the exact +crit numbers on the rings, my memory sucks lol but the the loss of -3% overall is correct)

Sereneai - Dreamweaver

garnets 100%


there is also a gem that gives +100patk, drakeflame i think it is called (or something like that)

reason why:

lets say you do 5k/hit damage with that bow equipped. over lets say 10 hits, 4/10 of them do double damage at 40%, so your damage is 1.4x5x10=70k/10 hits

at 37% crit, with now 5150/hit(2 garnets=150patk), we have 1.38x5150x10=70.05687k/10 hits...which is actually HIGHER DPS than the 40%crit build, since you do more damage for that 63% of the time you are not critting(not to mention your crits are bigger), and the 3% crit rate is not a huge loss tbh. if you use the drake +100s, it ends up even higher!

Allynna_ - Dreamweaver

Garnet Gems don;t give a base 75 extra damage, they give 75 more WEAPON damage. Which means it gets multiplied by skills, spark, and your Dex + Masteries. IE with 350 dex, and Demon Mastery, each Garnet Gem would give 306 extra damage. Plus, triple spark would add an extra 375 damage. Thats not even including Blazing arrow

[Damage is equal to Weapon damage * (1 + (dex/150) + Masteries as Decimal) Garnets add to Weapn damage, hence get muliplied more]

Sereneai - Dreamweaver

i know, i was using auto attack as my example, and an average hit number b:surrender, sorry bout that. Obviously with weapon-damage based skills, spark, etc, it would also boost your damage greatly, yes.

Sarrafeline - Sanctuary

Go for Drakeflames.

Just don't be FAIL and put a Flawless garnet and a Drakeflame in... That would cause a kitten to cry somewhere in the world every time you fired your bow.

Ubique - Raging Tide

b:thanks

thank you all for your advice

lubs. Ubi

Valirah - Sanctuary

Ubique - Raging Tide wrote: »

b:thanks

thank you all for your advice

lubs. Ubi

Yes, garnets 100%, only fools who lack math skills or the wisdom to ask for advice shard +Crit or +Att lvl in weapons. I believe that it has been worked out that the average damage output increase would less than that of a flawless garnet.

Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973

With garnet gem vs primevals, even at R9 +12 you end up trading like 5% of your base damage for 2% more crit. While crit rate is useful, there is plenty of time where the opponent has just a sliver of life remaining and you wish that shot did just a bit more damage.

Also crit is easier to increase with runecrafting / faction base aura / equipments / demon skills than base damage.

KedgeSniper - Lost City

you getting rank9.. but putting garnet gem.

Tbh go for the highest garnet you can get, which is combined by 3.. forgot name.

Rank9 bow with simple garnet gem that every archer has in a cv bow/rank8. Make it look cheap IMO. Mite as well go shabby

Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973

KedgeSniper - Lost City wrote: »

you getting rank9.. but putting garnet gem.

Tbh go for the highest garnet you can get, which is combined by 3.. forgot name.

Rank9 bow with simple garnet gem that every archer has in a cv bow/rank8. Make it look cheap IMO. Mite as well go shabby

On my server an R9 bow can be as cheap as like 360m (after you have the ring) while each drakeflame is around 120m (240m for 2). That's a heavy premium over garnet gem for just 25 more phys attack <_<

I'd rather put that money towards more important things like a g16 cube neck first...

Vicarcher - Heavens Tear

pls b:thanks dont ever go for 40% crit u be stealing agg like a mad **** and get kilts b:surrender

Fleuri - Sanctuary

Vicarcher - Heavens Tear wrote: »

pls b:thanks dont ever go for 40% crit u be stealing agg like a mad **** and get kilts b:surrender

In my experiences, even vit build archers with low refines and low crit chances steal aggro sometimes.

Furthermore, with 5aps, I no longer consider damage dealing to be my job. I do deal damage, but from my point of view my primary job is making my squad perform well.

I try to use my debuffs when they seem useful, I try to make sure aggro stays off the cleric, when I am pulling aggro I soak damages, and I try and keep my costs down and my squad mates alive through intelligent use of stun and chi skills. And, when things go to hell, I tend to barrage or kite.

For now, I just have flawless garnets in my bow -- they are throwaways until I can afford something good.

Ubique - Raging Tide

Vicarcher - Heavens Tear wrote: »

pls b:thanks dont ever go for 40% crit u be stealing agg like a mad **** and get kilts b:surrender

The trick my friend is knowing what u can tank and what u cant. High aps farming squads in my experience are all about speed, the clerics i work with know what they are doing and switch heals between squad members w/o much difficulty to allow squad members to go all out DD which is beneficial to everyone in the squad, 5aps build with gorenoxs i reach 38% crit rate and will be tanking normally at least some of the time even versus other high aps toons as a lot of our archer bretheren do. b:nosebleed

P.s. I dont die often PvE either lol.

Ubique - Raging Tide

KedgeSniper - Lost City wrote: »

you getting rank9.. but putting garnet gem.

Tbh go for the highest garnet you can get, which is combined by 3.. forgot name.

Rank9 bow with simple garnet gem that every archer has in a cv bow/rank8. Make it look cheap IMO. Mite as well go shabby

I checked the prices and tbh the Dragonflame stone +100 att requires 6 garnet gems to Combine. At c20mill each thats 120mill per Dragonflame, 240 mill to shard both sockets, a nice thought but out of my price range i think unless as was suggested in a previous post i put in some throw away shards while i work at getting the required garnets together over the next 12 months lol.

Boogiepanda - Raging Tide

For 240m, I'd rather +12 a bow

KedgeSniper - Lost City

b:shutup

360mill plus what you already spent to get it...

Its an endgame bow anyways.

Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973

KedgeSniper - Lost City wrote: »

b:shutup

360mill plus what you already spent to get it...

Its an endgame bow anyways.

Just because you get R9 doesn't mean you have infinite money. With limited resources you want to put your money where it gives you the most benefit. This is actually a type of constrained optimization problem.

Boogiepanda - Raging Tide

360m to get it.

Most people don't want to spend 66% of that on sharding.

For that 240m you can get the rest of R9 with it, and some refining.

KedgeSniper - Lost City

Its not only "360m" since.. you have to get insignia.. etc.

Hey Im not saying anyone can afford it. Is it worth having the best gem in the most expensive bow? I had say Yes.

If you already afford the bow, im pretty sure you will have enough money to +12-10 with drakeflame. If not then to bad for you..

Like i said If you already spend that much "real coins"/"real time farming" .. Mite as well have the best out damage.

b:bye Shabbys would do the trick too

Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973

KedgeSniper - Lost City wrote: »

If you already afford the bow, im pretty sure you will have enough money to +12-10 with drakeflame. If not then to bad for you..

Noone is saying drakeflames aren't the best there is. However, the added benefit per added cost (marginal benefit) in drakeflames over garnet gems is pretty low. Even if people can afford it, it doesn't mean it should be a high priority to have. Case in point you think someone would get a +10 R9 bow with Drakeflames. That would be pretty dumb considering that for much less cost someone could get a +11 bow with garnet gems and still do like 8% more damage than a +10 with Drakeflames. Drakeflame should really be lower priority than having a +12 weapon and fully sharded +10 armor / +10 ornaments.

From what I've seen on my server, R9 weapons are like 60% +10, 15% +11, 25% +12.

Teppeii - Dreamweaver

I could never justify to myself getting drakeflames. I'd always be thinking about how the money could have been better spent on refines here or there or put towards a piece of gear down the road. Nah. Garnet gems are sufficient. Drakeflames are superfluous.

The 'if you have a, then you can get b' argument most certainly does not apply here. Just because someone has a certain weapon doesn't mean they have money to spare. Some people have to work for the weapons they get. I'd find it pretty ridiculous to grind nirvy and merch for three months for a G15 bow, then spend the next two months of profit on just the stones.

Fleuri - Sanctuary

Asterelle - Sanctuary wrote: »

Drakeflame should really be lower priority than having a +12 weapon and fully sharded +10 armor / +10 ornaments.

Also, you can get garnet gems, then purge them later for drakeflames for a 17% cost increase along with a longer span of time with your garnet gem damage increase. Depending on your priorities, the time you spend with garnet gems might be enough to recoup that 17% cost difference.

(Personally, I am not there yet, and may never be, but if I can find good enough deals maybe I will ...)

Sint - Harshlands

shard jades of steady defense.