Sage Sandstorm

Evanera - Heavens Tear

Holy ****. I actually thought you, prof, had decent information to post for people. You just ruined your *reputation* in this thread. Snare hits just as hard as BIDS? Oh dear..

+7 refines are the most Lost City has? Are you kidding me? I haven't ever PKed on LC, but I have run around a few times just to take a peak, and +7 refines was average among people in top contending PvP factions.

Please, if I was to post a screenshot of all my 40k+ damage hits in TW just from a BIDS, maybe you would see how effective sage BIDS is..or maybe not. Oh also, how is BT better than BIDS? Technically, both skills are just as effective because of the variety you get from each one, however the BIDS crit proc makes it more versatile in many, many situations.

Demon and sage wizards both have their advantages, and disadvantages. To say that sage BIDS sucks, is completely ignorant.

Using the weapon switch after getting a crit proc in PvP, then using sutra isn't stupid. However, it is very situational and against someone who is highly skilled, there is very slight chance you get to kill them. It just isn't really practical. Going for the big hit on a tough target is the most practical thing. If you've seen how Adroit times his BIDS in 1v1 PK, you could see how *not terrible* the skill is.

Arenaceous - Lost City

WTF lol, I do not even feel like commenting on that post. Nontheless, here are some short remarks...

1.) Bypassing someones charm is not weak, it's smart. It's, like Adroit says, the concept of a dph class. It's the same that for example a barb does when he uses arma. I dun see by what criteria you decide what's the "normal" way lol... I could as well say "It's weak to tick someone and kill him through dps, because it shows you are unable to bypass his charm." Same (non) logic.... If it kills your enemy, it works and is teh right thing.

2.) lvl 11 GS: "Water damage equal to base magic damage plus 300% of weapon damage plus 6171.0"

lvl 11 BIDS: "water damage equal to base magic damage plus 500% of weapon damage plus 13955.0."

Ya you are right, looks like the same.. Maybe it's because you have so uber pro weapons on your server.. Oh wait, the difference gets bigger the better the weapon is... Or is your BIDS like lvl 2 or something? That would explain it. Dude, I know it's expensive, but you got to lvl it to compare it to snare.

3.) Where exactly does higher refines (except for ornaments) result in better mdef? And having better geared people walk around does not only affect the damage of sage wizards ijs...

4.) Yea, crit glitching is a GREAT idea. ~4 seconds to glitch bids and another 4 to cast BT... Works 50% of the time... Do you have a private cleric with you all the time to sleep the target to your convenience?

5.) Most people walk around with higher pdef than mdef because of all the physical classes out there, or because they need the HH99 ornaments for aps... So no, in general BT is not better than bids, even when you compare lvl 10 versions.

prof

i'll post a reply when a nonbiased holy mage with a brain replies.

magic defense makes everything you see on a skill null. the only thing that matters is the weapon modifier and they're all pretty close together on high end skills.

bypassing a hiero is not the concept of this class. if you rely on critically passed someone's hiero, you'll never be able to kill a well refined enemy. again, rethink your strategy.

evanera, your server has the lowest mdef chars out of the original 3 servers(jesus, even sanctuary is better. ew). i'm surprised you only hit 40k with all of the amps it requires you to kill anything.

i'd say you'll all learn, but as pwi has been out for over 2 years and still hasn't grasped these things, i'm quite sure you never will. i'll post again some other day, every time androit gets involved his asstickling fanboys get involved, disgusting.


fyi, androit lost to anybody who didn't have decent refines. calvin and his +7~10 set tanks him pretty easily.

Evanera - Heavens Tear

How exactly would you know how much it takes me to kill anything? How do you know how many damage amplifiers I had on those 40k hits?

Have you taken the time to look at my sig? And that's with a +10 weapon from like 7 months ago.

You have zero knowledge of what you are talking about.

Arenaceous - Lost City

My God, I was seriously thinking about going demon and I see both as kinda similar in effectiveness, I am neither brainless nor biased nor Adroits fanboy. All I see is that YOU fail to give any decent arguments. BIDS and GS is as clsoe together as GS and gush weapon modifier wise.. would you say your gush hits the same as your GS? Again who are you to decide what's the concept of this class? Where did I say bids crits is the only way to kill someone? You dun even bother to argue. You just say "It's like that" and everyone who does not agree with you is just stupid. That is no basis for any argument, that's just stupid bs.

Adroit - Lost City

prof wrote: »

i'll post a reply when a nonbiased holy mage with a brain replies.

magic defense makes everything you see on a skill null. the only thing that matters is the weapon modifier and they're all pretty close together on high end skills.

bypassing a hiero is not the concept of this class. if you rely on critically passed someone's hiero, you'll never be able to kill a well refined enemy. again, rethink your strategy.

evanera, your server has the lowest mdef chars out of the original 3 servers(jesus, even sanctuary is better. ew). i'm surprised you only hit 40k with all of the amps it requires you to kill anything.

i'd say you'll all learn, but as pwi has been out for over 2 years and still hasn't grasped these things, i'm quite sure you never will. i'll post again some other day, every time androit gets involved his asstickling fanboys get involved, disgusting.


fyi, androit lost to anybody who didn't have decent refines. calvin and his +7~10 set tanks him pretty easily.

"nonbiased" - irony?

magic defense does not nullify everyone on a skill, immune would nullify everything on a skill. Magic defense merely reduces everything equally. 300% compared to 500% is a pretty big difference BTW

You can kill a highly refined enemy with a bypass.. as I've done hundreds or thousands of times. Just because you haven't figured out how to use sleep -> ulti when somebody is just above 50% doesn't mean everybody needs to suck like you. You severely limit yourself by never learning how to do this.

Grasp your bs? I've seen it and discarded it. As has nearly everyone else reading apparently. It looks to me more like Evanera and Arenaceous are more disagreeing with you than agreeing with me.. which is your doing. Perhaps if you didn't try to bs your way out of a corner you wouldn't be getting laughed at.

FYI, you still haven't figured out how to spell my name. Calvin has much better gear than I do, but I still kill him fairly often. The last time we 1v1'd (I still have the footage) we killed each other 3 times each.. which I'm comfortable with.

Mumintroll - Heavens Tear

Adroit - Lost City wrote: »

BIDS does the same damage as glacial snare? Interesting. I always assumed a higher weapon multiplier and much higher static damage meant that BIDS does more damage. Maybe I should blindly listen to the all knowing prof that is digging a hole he can't get himself out of.

Not everybody has the time to farm 24/7 like you. I enjoy my 4.0 GPA and doing things that don't require me to be starring at the monitor. Lazy and having real life priorities are very different.

Just because you can't figure out how to play a sage mage doesn't mean demon is better. You obviously don't understand the advantages of a DPH class, and the more you post the more I'm convinced you should not be playing a mage. You'd be far better off as a psychic or archer.. as they are actually made to "kill people normally".

I know how to crit "glitch".. but it is horribly ineffective in pvp. I can't believe anyone would actually recommend doing this.. you must really be scraping the bottom of the barrel to say something. Sage BIDS is way better than BT, you're lying to yourself if you say otherwise. Lol there is so much BS in your post.. I'm actually getting bored responding. There was actually a short time I thought you had something to offer, but its obvious you are as narrow-minded as ever.

I told on this forum 1000x that prof is a moron which has no idea how game works. Hopefully now you believe it yourself. He totally discredited himself and I didn't even have to help him. ;-)

prof

mumin, go fall off a cliff. seriously. you don't even measure up to the other rejects in this thread.

i call you 'androit' as a spin off of an old cartoon i use to watch. google it.

i've been arguing with biased sage ****'s for 2 years(hell, i even point out positives for sage..), i've given up 'arguing'. take what i say up front or don't take it at all, simple right? you're trying to argue with someone who isn't here to argue, merely to say 'shut the **** up, you're wrong'. i've done this for months now, but only when i question the only ****ing skill any of you went sage for, lolnerdrage.

there's more to sage than just one skill. maybe, just maybe you know that - but it doesn't show. all i see is 'i crit a lot with sage bids hurr'. i crit a lot with my passives, i hit faster, and i can bypass hiero's with normal skill spamming. no fury wasted.

???

really, go play a real server. pwi is a disgrace to pw history.

b:shutupdone posting here, wasted too much time on this forum. i hope to god nobody in this server starts to refine their gear higher, this whole section will go under.

b:byeb:byeb:bye

Evanera - Heavens Tear

You've said you're done posting here twice already, so how come you're still here?

It's ok to tell someone they're wrong, but when you do, you need to provide evidence of how they are wrong. That is something you have not done here.

You need to realize that as a wizard, there are many ways to kill someone. Whether it be with an ulti at half HP bypassing their charm, using essential sutra to commit fast DPS etc etc. We aren't saying that bypassing someone's charm is the only way to kill, and you fail to realize that. Being demon and using fast DPS is not the only way to kill. If it kills them, then it works. If it kills many people on a consistent basis, then how is it fail? It's only fail in your eyes because you're too ignorant

You're almost as bad as tweakz on the veno forums, and that's a terrible thing to be compared to :P

Btw, that last post of yours was pure nerdrage. b:cuteb:bye

Adroit - Lost City

prof wrote: »

mumin, go fall off a cliff. seriously. you don't even measure up to the other rejects in this thread.

i call you 'androit' as a spin off of an old cartoon i use to watch. google it.

i've been arguing with biased sage ****'s for 2 years(hell, i even point out positives for sage..), i've given up 'arguing'. take what i say up front or don't take it at all, simple right? you're trying to argue with someone who isn't here to argue, merely to say 'shut the **** up, you're wrong'. i've done this for months now, but only when i question the only ****ing skill any of you went sage for, lolnerdrage.

there's more to sage than just one skill. maybe, just maybe you know that - but it doesn't show. all i see is 'i crit a lot with sage bids hurr'. i crit a lot with my passives, i hit faster, and i can bypass hiero's with normal skill spamming. no fury wasted.

???

really, go play a real server. pwi is a disgrace to pw history.

b:shutupdone posting here, wasted too much time on this forum. i hope to god nobody in this server starts to refine their gear higher, this whole section will go under.

You don't point out positives for sage.. you do quite the opposite. You generally do try to argue and prove a point, but we get back into the cultivation subject and there really isn't anything you can say to defend your position. You can pretend all you want that you have some higher level of understanding (that you won't share) than the rest of us, but you really aren't fooling anybody.

Let's take a quick look back. You first mention that you cannot hiero bypass people that "know what mdef is" or are not lazy and actually refine their gear. Now you say that it is so easy to bypass hieros that you don't even need to use "fury".. normal skill spamming is sufficient. This kinda thing sure doesn't help your case.

Don't let the door hit you in the *** on your way out! b:cute

_Hysteria_ - Dreamweaver

Evanera - Heavens Tear wrote: »

You've said you're done posting here twice already, so how come you're still here?

It's ok to tell someone they're wrong, but when you do, you need to provide evidence of how they are wrong. That is something you have not done here.

You need to realize that as a wizard, there are many ways to kill someone. Whether it be with an ulti at half HP bypassing their charm, using essential sutra to commit fast DPS etc etc. We aren't saying that bypassing someone's charm is the only way to kill, and you fail to realize that. Being demon and using fast DPS is not the only way to kill. If it kills them, then it works. If it kills many people on a consistent basis, then how is it fail? It's only fail in your eyes because you're too ignorant

You're almost as bad as tweakz on the veno forums, and that's a terrible thing to be compared to :P

Btw, that last post of yours was pure nerdrage. b:cuteb:bye

the tweakz reference made me lol b:chuckle

Mumintroll - Heavens Tear

Prof FYI: I made demon mage also. I was really like it. Channeling with demon spark is awesome. Also some nice controlling skills. BUT the damage comparing to sage suck. I had 2 absolutely same mages. One demon and one sage. With +12 end game weapon is difference in damage HUGE!!!
Yes. I'm slower than demon wizard but I need to bypass hierogram and with demon I could do it much less times than with sage.

_Hysteria_ - Dreamweaver

im not really sure how the argument came up in the 1st place to be honest, theres not really a right or wrong choice, either path is viable depending on your playstyle, personally im going sage for offensive capabilites, but demon stone barrier is pretty damn great in its ownright, sure sage sandstorm isnt amazing but so what both side have skills thats arent great with the add ons, doesnt mean one is better than the other, at the end of the day, like alot of things on the game, its going to come down to personal preference. just my two cents.

Ruxal - Harshlands

Mumintroll - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Prof FYI: I made demon mage also. I was really like it. Channeling with demon spark is awesome. Also some nice controlling skills. BUT the damage comparing to sage suck. I had 2 absolutely same mages. One demon and one sage. With +12 end game weapon is difference in damage HUGE!!!
Yes. I'm slower than demon wizard but I need to bypass hierogram and with demon I could do it much less times than with sage.

Considering that the numerical difference between some demon and sage skills is minimal in some instances and equal in others I am wondering how HUGE is this difference (numbers please) that you are recording. Using capital letters and a red font makes your claim no more valid.

Certainly I have interacted with and watched both sage and demon wizards in action and both have their particular advantage. Your argument that you tick charms less often in demon than in sage sound like an overblown claim considering that I am neither sage nor demon yet and have easily ticked the charms of 9x players. Wait though I smell some retaliatory post about lessons in PvP coming on.

Mumintroll - Heavens Tear

Ruxal - Harshlands wrote: »

Considering that the numerical difference between some demon and sage skills is minimal in some instances and equal in others I am wondering how HUGE is this difference (numbers please) that you are recording. Using capital letters and a red font makes your claim no more valid.

Certainly I have interacted with and watched both sage and demon wizards in action and both have their particular advantage. Your argument that you tick charms less often in demon than in sage sound like an overblown claim considering that I am neither sage nor demon yet and have easily ticked the charms of 9x players. Wait though I smell some retaliatory post about lessons in PvP coming on.

First. I don't telling about tick hiero. I'm telling about bypass hiero. That's significant difference. Bypass hiero means opponent is death.
Second. Sage damage thanks to +5% from mastieries is always bigger than demon mage. This is more significant with more powerful weapon + more powerful refines. I did calculation looong time ago when rank 8 was just dream. With rank 8 weapon and with +12 refines is difference(If I remember correctly) more than +2K in output damage. Especially with ultimates is difference even higher. With rank 9 or warsoul weapon it will be even more bigger.

Ruxal - Harshlands

Points taken.

Ursa - Dreamweaver

uhm, prof, you know something?
Link your char in core connect.
Let us see how many kills you have and what's your kill/death ratio.
Come back and school the "nubs" after, ok?
Thanks.

MageFizban - Lost City

I see sage wizzies outnumber demon on forums still. How about in game now?

Ursa - Dreamweaver

same ****

Hi Fizz, how's goin on LC?

MageFizban - Lost City

Much more fun than DW.