[ask] veno human mode

bubble7th
bubble7th Posts: 10 Arc User
edited December 2010 in Venomancer
can anyone pls describe to me the best human mode build for veno??

i have demon veno lv 101

i'm plan to reset status to light, so have high critical

and also get some phy def from the eq

any suggetions????
Post edited by bubble7th on

Comments

  • Waterfal - Sanctuary
    Waterfal - Sanctuary Posts: 2,723 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    it all depends on playstyle ofc, but I like the full magic build.

    With demon you'll get more critrate anyway, and you can always get +crit gear. imo going la for the crit aint worth it, others say it is.

    You can always get more phys defense by using defense ornaments and adding garnet shards in your gear.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Thanks Silvychar for the awesome sig :3

    Characters:
    waterfal - lvl 90 demon ferrari veno
    Hazumi_chan - lvl 9x sage seeker
  • Eoria - Harshlands
    Eoria - Harshlands Posts: 6,118 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    bubble7th wrote: »
    can anyone pls describe to me the best human mode build for veno??

    i have demon veno lv 101

    i'm plan to reset status to light, so have high critical

    and also get some phy def from the eq

    any suggetions????

    I'm going to say this right now...if you are primarily a caster veno and only go into fox form to amp/purge/sage soul degen, do not go light/heavy armor. You're not taking full advantage of light/heavy by just staying in human form.

    Besides, you can still get high crit with accessories and wep with arcane. No, your crit will not be as high as a light/heavy veno's with the same, but it's still pretty damn high. Can also get pretty high pdef with arcane as well.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    "subtraction has the butt of an angel" - Paulrogers
    I <3 Subtraction.
    /blatant sig copy is blatant

    105/105/105 obtained! b:cute
  • SeaStorm - Heavens Tear
    SeaStorm - Heavens Tear Posts: 315 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    I agree with Eoria on the high pdef when you're a robe veno. That's what I run and I posted some of my info (granted I'm sage) but it's on this recent post: http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=945742
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Alphae - Lost City
    Alphae - Lost City Posts: 1,512 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    Here is an example of an easily doable build (minus the weapon, I got lucky on that one ><).

    http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=e6ed3a000dd200f6 << unbuffed
    http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=578464b1e5fc9996 << self-buffed with demon fox and melee mastery
    http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=bfda564ba73a977d << fully buffed w/ demon fox/melee mastery and L10 everything else.

    As you can see my gear, refines and shards are all embarrassingly bad, and I can still manage to get nearly 9k pdef in fox form. Out of fox form, it's nearly 6k--that's with demon fox, with no extra pdef mods. As you can see this is a heavy vitality build. It all comes down to personal playstyle. Some would say not to add this much vit, others will tell you it's great--it's all up to you. But heavy especially is a build for those with money and the time and will to learn to utilize it to its fullest potential.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • tweakz
    tweakz Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    Eoria - Harshlands wrote: »
    You're not taking full advantage of light/heavy by just staying in human form. .

    What advantage does LA give?
    Be kind: Help the GMs to depopulate the servers.
  • Vitenka - Dreamweaver
    Vitenka - Dreamweaver Posts: 4,125 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    Higher crit, higher pdef. You know that.

    (Lower, quite significantly lower, magic attack is of course the downside.)
  • tweakz
    tweakz Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    Vitenka - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Higher crit, higher pdef. You know that.

    (Lower, quite significantly lower, magic attack is of course the downside.)

    Higher crit (rate) is arguably a disadvantage when it comes at the cost of higher dps. -(I asked for an advantage: you'd have to demonstrate how higher crit (rate) at such a cost can benefit anyone). Higher pdef isn't an advantage when it's at the cost of higher dps and higher mdef, and I think it's already been shown how after Lv.90 that AA tends to have better survivability?

    Some may not realize this, but Archers and Sins get their patk from dex like barbs and venos get atk from str or mag. This indicates that the dex necessary for LA is wasted on a veno, wiz, etc.
    Be kind: Help the GMs to depopulate the servers.
  • JanusZeal - Heavens Tear
    JanusZeal - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,852 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    I just did a LA build that borrows from sin/archer gear of mine, using the Beamhoof Slicer or the TT99 IHRS magic sword, and can interchangeably use channeling for casting. You lose ~ 2000 magic attack, gain ~ 3000 phys attack, a lot more crit, and can switch over to -chan gear when needing to cast. However, this also requires playing in fox as well to utilize the most (comes with 2.22 APS), as well as being sage for the passives + phys def + accuracy + spark dmg phys atk. If you're just gonna be a caster and only use fox when you have to like on, say, Mountain's Finger, then just stick to arcane and either follow a standard pure magic or vit AA build, statting into vit only what you find necessary. The higher the budget, the less into vit you'll need.
  • Myrrmidonna - Dreamweaver
    Myrrmidonna - Dreamweaver Posts: 204 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    LA veno (like me) is not a dps character, but a great, dependable support for the party, able to survive narrow sqeaks without bothering the cleric.

    I can't solo things as soon as AA do, due to lower m-atk and thus lower pet heal, but I think I'm more convinient for a party to have, due to survivability and focus on support.
    Also, I usually don't have problems with pet keeping the aggro, unless my pets get left behind in levels, or my crit ticks on my initial ironwood :P and even then mobs can't really hurt me much, and usually I kill them before they can get to me anyway (or I simply lure them back onto my slowpoke golem)

    Yes, higher crit is an arguable advantage, but, really, unless it ticks on your initial ironwood it's not a problem at all, rather a nice bonus bringing your damage output and gameplay dynamics towards those of AA, even though it's more unpredictable. Well... for me it means more fun :P
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    DREAMWEAVER:
    Myrrmidonna, 8x Trickster b:sin
    Eskarinne, 5x Summoner b:cute

    It is not the destination that makes the journey worthwhile...
  • tweakz
    tweakz Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    Myrrmidonna - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    LA veno (like me) is not a dps character, but a great, dependable support for the party, able to survive narrow sqeaks without bothering the cleric.

    Horribly wrong. I'm no fan of vit builds, but this person demonstrates how crappy LA is for classes that don't get +atk from dex:

    http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showpost.php?p=9051332&postcount=5

    You're not great support if your dps is so low, and your survivability is inferior to AA. Also, range tanking rarely benefits from evasion.

    Still waiting on a real advantage to be given for LA.
    Be kind: Help the GMs to depopulate the servers.
  • AnimaBlanc - Sanctuary
    AnimaBlanc - Sanctuary Posts: 555 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    tweakz wrote: »
    Still waiting on a real advantage to be given for LA.

    It looks prettier.
    All you need is something to believe in. -Solar_one. <-- <3 mah snoockums, mah hubby, mah eberyfing. :3

    Lag; You think yours is bad ? It took Jesus 3 days to Respawn !
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    "Current games aren't -games- anymore, just light shows operated by win buttons, lol."
    "ah sh*t, were gonna die!.... but it's still cool!" -INTMDATOR
  • Mauntille - Heavens Tear
    Mauntille - Heavens Tear Posts: 694 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    AnimaBlanc - Sanctuary wrote: »
    It looks prettier.

    Aww, but the Sacred Tortoise and Amethyst sets are pretty! Acrobatic set is fun too.
  • Meyki - Sanctuary
    Meyki - Sanctuary Posts: 222 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    tweakz wrote: »
    Still waiting on a real advantage to be given for LA.
    Better pdef than AA
    Better mdef than HA

    For others: tweakz is just a troll, if you are searching for info, this one is not good source.
  • tweakz
    tweakz Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    Meyki - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Better pdef than AA
    Better mdef than HA

    For others: tweakz is just a troll, if you are searching for info, this one is not good source.

    Failed to demonstrate an advantage and you call me the troll? I could have just stated that you are fail, but let you show that instead.
    Be kind: Help the GMs to depopulate the servers.
  • Meyki - Sanctuary
    Meyki - Sanctuary Posts: 222 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    tweakz wrote: »
    Failed to demonstrate an advantage and you call me the troll? I could have just stated that you are fail, but let you show that instead.
    For troll: Yeah, that is your opinion. But who cares, you're just a troll.

    For others: The advantage of using LA is exactly what I said. If I am wrong and LA does not have better mdef than HA and better pdef than AA, correct me.
  • Cheski - Sanctuary
    Cheski - Sanctuary Posts: 17 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    I'm no expert on this. Have just asked a similar question myself. So I'm probably wrong but here is my two cents: Tweakz's example is for clerics who don't exactly have a melee form unlike venos. I honestly can't see a use for the dex (I personally hate crits as they make the monster mad at me! Although I'm guessing higher PDef would help until my pet could regain aggro, and there's always kiting.) but surely the extra strength would help with the melee skills one uses in fox form?

    Obviously if you don't use your melee fox skills the extra strength would be useless and you're better off robe.

    Going off that theory though heavy/robe would be better. More strength less dex.
  • Meyki - Sanctuary
    Meyki - Sanctuary Posts: 222 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    Dex boosts your accuracy if you want to use the melee fox. On the other hand, I dont have much trouble in HA as fox, barely miss actually.

    There is not always kiting, really. Not always. And sometimes more mdef helps you until pet regains aggro. I know those were just examples, but they don't reflect the reality well.
  • Kenichiiii - Sanctuary
    Kenichiiii - Sanctuary Posts: 65 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    Meyki - Sanctuary wrote: »
    For troll: Yeah, that is your opinion. But who cares, you're just a troll.

    For others: The advantage of using LA is exactly what I said. If I am wrong and LA does not have better mdef than HA and better pdef than AA, correct me.

    As tweakz posted, that's not an advantage.

    As far as trolling goes, all of tweakz posts & links in this thread would be informative to a veno, whereas your post would be less than helpful.
  • Mauntille - Heavens Tear
    Mauntille - Heavens Tear Posts: 694 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    Meyki - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Dex boosts your accuracy if you want to use the melee fox. On the other hand, I dont have much trouble in HA as fox, barely miss actually.

    There is not always kiting, really. Not always. And sometimes more mdef helps you until pet regains aggro. I know those were just examples, but they don't reflect the reality well.

    Accuracy really shouldn't be an issue for a veno; there are ways to get around it.

    The dex build really doesn't make sense for a veno. The "extra defenses" argument has been proved wrong many places.

    Full arcane gear works well because of the additional magic attack and/or vit you can get out of it (depending on if you're pure or vit-arcane). My original veno was LA; this veno is AA. At the same level with approximately the same monetary value of gear, my AA veno had more HP, p.def, and m.attack than my LA veno did.

    If you really think that p.def is that hard to get for an arcane user, I'll happily introduce you to a pure magic veno who's tanked Pole and Fragrance. A build that can do that isn't going to be a liability for survival.

    HA/AA works well because while your m.attack is lower than a pure magic build, your strength is much higher, giving you benefits in fox.

    Arcane - gimps fox
    Heavy - gimps mage
    Light - gimps both

    As for crits, in my experience, they never come when you really need them (even on Dex based classes). It's far more important to have a solid foundation to rely upon than spike damage. Adding dex for the sake of crits is a waste considering how many points it takes to raise your crit rate by 1% compared to how many points will raise your attack/defense/hp.
  • tweakz
    tweakz Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2010
    Mauntille - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Accuracy really shouldn't be an issue for a veno; there are ways to get around it.

    Just to expand on this: Using Ironwood or any pdef debuff I believe causes 100% acc even when buff wears off. S.Fox Form gives +250% acc. Fox skills do phys dmg and don't miss.
    Be kind: Help the GMs to depopulate the servers.

Categories