Sage or Demon?

2

Comments

  • Mizuoni - Dreamweaver
    Mizuoni - Dreamweaver Posts: 3,533 Arc User
    edited October 2010
    Sage for one reason
    My wiz been doing TW since level 38 and i wanted to improve in my TW abilities

    Now thats TW dead, Im going demon b:surrender
    Sins are Scissors. Psychics are Rocks.
    Archers, Venos, Barbs, Wizards, BMs, Mystics, Seekers are Paper.
    ...and Clerics are Mushrooms.
    Paper beats Rock. Scissors beats Paper. Scissors also happens to beat Rock...until Rock gets 50k+ soulforce at which point Rock becomes an unstoppable killing machine that beats Paper... and would beat Scissors but it can't find Scissors, because Scissors are invisible.
    So Scissors beat Paper and avoids Rock, and that is called BALANCE. -cheze
  • GenericBrand - Archosaur
    GenericBrand - Archosaur Posts: 280 Arc User
    edited October 2010
    Demon cleric. The reduced chi requirement for key skills was the deciding factor for me.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Joshcja - Sanctuary
    Joshcja - Sanctuary Posts: 3,502 Arc User
    edited October 2010
    demon bm

    wanted to go to the 1st ring of hell to punch plato and play sportts with the unbabtised infants (their already dead and you would to)

    oh and spark stuns +sexy burger geni
    Gifs are hard to make work here
  • Zoe - Heavens Tear
    Zoe - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,814 Arc User
    edited October 2010
    Sage Venomancer

    Just reached the Celestial Sage cultivation for my level 3 fairy. :D

    I chose sage because I am not going to rely on possible damage from crits and such, I want to know my damage will always be there. Also, I don't run away from things I go foxform and get in their faces so the extra defense from sage fox is most useful.
    Main characters
    Celestial Sage Venomancer Zoe - 100
    Sage Barbarian Malego - 91
  • Aisubeki - Sanctuary
    Aisubeki - Sanctuary Posts: 313 Arc User
    edited October 2010
    crit always is there, and can be calculated and accounted for as a modifier in a formula.

    after the m.atk x (1.25) for sage mastery, add in 1.xx for your crit %.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    remember our fallen heroes
  • Zoe - Heavens Tear
    Zoe - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,814 Arc User
    edited October 2010
    Aisubeki - Sanctuary wrote: »
    crit always is there, and can be calculated and accounted for as a modifier in a formula.

    after the m.atk x (1.25) for sage mastery, add in 1.xx for your crit %.

    I mean demon skills give + crit while sage skills get + damage. Wood mastery for example. I'd rather KNOW my damage is there rather than hope a crit happens.
    Main characters
    Celestial Sage Venomancer Zoe - 100
    Sage Barbarian Malego - 91
  • Aisubeki - Sanctuary
    Aisubeki - Sanctuary Posts: 313 Arc User
    edited October 2010
    im aware, but for every % of crit you have stacked up, it equates to roughly an extra 1% dps. of course it is one of exponential decay as it reaches extreme %s like it does with power dash, it still makes a significant difference in a long term scale.

    LA venos make great use of this in pvp and pve situations.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    remember our fallen heroes
  • Okeano - Harshlands
    Okeano - Harshlands Posts: 4,943 Arc User
    edited October 2010
    I like drowning puppies.

    I also like BM's 7.5 seconds stun on Drake Bash, 9 seconds amp on HF ("dg" for HL people), never fail on Roar as well as shorter c/d for spamming in TW, 50% chance for 100% crit for 5 seconds for Glacial Spike and Magic Marrow + Bell = epic for 15 seconds. Did someone say demon spark? *Puts on auto spark macro and eats a sandwich while watching boss's hp drops. Lulz, sage got that 50 chi thingy.

    Sin's extra stun time on tele stun and Headhunt, spike damage from 40% rage buff from Wolf Emblem.
  • Quilue - Sanctuary
    Quilue - Sanctuary Posts: 5,787 Arc User
    edited October 2010
    So what's the difference between Demon and Sage HF other than duration? Sage does an AOE fire DoT or something?
    Elena Costel: I wash my hands of this affair.
    Legerity: *drags you back* *stains your hands with said affair*
    Elena Costel: Noooo... I don't want to have a dirty affair with Lady Legerity...
    Qui: b:dirty
  • Alphae - Lost City
    Alphae - Lost City Posts: 1,512 Arc User
    edited October 2010
    Demon veno here.

    Went for venomous debuff, ironwood armor break, noxious cooldown, nova amp, metabolic/nature's grace cooldowns, bramble, and yes, demon fox speed (it's so useful). Of those skills I have about 1/2 (bramble, venemous, ironwood, fox) and I haven't ever regretted my choice.
    Zoe - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Sage Venomancer

    Just reached the Celestial Sage cultivation for my level 3 fairy. :D

    I chose sage because I am not going to rely on possible damage from crits and such, I want to know my damage will always be there. Also, I don't run away from things I go foxform and get in their faces so the extra defense from sage fox is most useful.

    You know that you can use fox form speed for running forward, too, right?
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Aisubeki - Sanctuary
    Aisubeki - Sanctuary Posts: 313 Arc User
    edited October 2010
    Quilue - Sanctuary wrote: »
    So what's the difference between Demon and Sage HF other than duration? Sage does an AOE fire DoT or something?
    sage has an extremely crappy DOT that doesnt do much damage, demon's is a prolonged duration. demon's is way better >_>;
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    remember our fallen heroes
  • WarrenWolfy - Sanctuary
    WarrenWolfy - Sanctuary Posts: 1,686 Arc User
    edited October 2010
    Sage, because it matches my usual playing-style of putting Defense + Speed first.

    If I didn't have a personal rule about not dying, I'd have gone Demon, but I prefer to try to stick to old-school RPG rules as much as possible, where death = death.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    PWI Merchanting Guides: warrenwolfy.wordpress.com
  • Zoe - Heavens Tear
    Zoe - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,814 Arc User
    edited October 2010
    Alphae - Lost City wrote: »

    You know that you can use fox form speed for running forward, too, right?

    I have apoth pots and holy path for that. Every demon veno I've seen, only went demon so they could run away fast when their pet dies. I saw it in TW every single weekend and I still see it in dungeons. We liked to make fun of venos that did that, the every other faction veno felt the same way, bad players those runners. I'm not saying you do that, its just my experience. Don't take this as an insult that's not what it is.b:thanks

    When my pet dies I go foxform for the defense, stand my ground and bring out another pet, that or melee the thing until it dies.
    Main characters
    Celestial Sage Venomancer Zoe - 100
    Sage Barbarian Malego - 91
  • Graviora - Dreamweaver
    Graviora - Dreamweaver Posts: 1,073 Arc User
    edited October 2010
    I'm a demon cleric.

    I had a difficult time choosing... At first I wanted to be different than a lot of the clerics I see and choose sage. I love my end decision to go demon. The res makes TW so much easier, and my husband loves the IH. Questing with my demon husband in Hell is always fun, since we both get a reward in the end. Also ;D Our fairies are sexy.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • KageYingZi - Heavens Tear
    KageYingZi - Heavens Tear Posts: 823 Arc User
    edited October 2010
    Well,some classes have a more biased Sage to Demon/Demon to Sage ratio because of certain coughinfluentialcough people.

    Demon for archer because I'll get called noob if I'll go Sage at 89.

    /inb4certainarcherwhoactspro
  • Alphae - Lost City
    Alphae - Lost City Posts: 1,512 Arc User
    edited October 2010
    Zoe - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    I have apoth pots and holy path for that. Every demon veno I've seen, only went demon so they could run away fast when their pet dies. I saw it in TW every single weekend and I still see it in dungeons. We liked to make fun of venos that did that, the every other faction veno felt the same way, bad players those runners. I'm not saying you do that, its just my experience. Don't take this as an insult that's not what it is.b:thanks

    When my pet dies I go foxform for the defense, stand my ground and bring out another pet, that or melee the thing until it dies.

    I am a demon veno because I saw no reason in sacrificing a bunch of really useful skills (IMO) for a little bit more defense in fox form, as I plan remain arcane for the duration of my PWI tenure. I would have had a much more difficult choice had I planned to possibly restat to heavy or heavy/arcane.

    I use fox speed for all sorts of things:
    -catching up to kiting mobs to freeze them with stunning blow
    -to sneak in between a boss's aoe, amp and myriad, then run out again before being hit
    -racing to help out someone who's accidentally drawn a mob in a dungeon and is stuck back a ways fighting by himself
    -yes, to escape dangerous situations (though holy path is faster than fox form speed and IMO is more appropriate in these cases)
    -for a permanent 10.0mps running speed, allowing me to devote genie energy and stamina to other skills (unless HP is truly needed)
    -when HP is on cooldown
    -a whole lot of convenience

    Mostly I use it for convenience purposes, and to free up genie energy to fire skills. No reason to fire HP most times if you can run 10.0 mps permanently for 150 mana a switch. And I firmly believe that aside from sage soul degeneration, demon's skill bonuses are far more useful to a veno. The most debatable skill would be amp, which has proved itself to be about equal between the two from numerous math threads in the veno subforum.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Lanyiara - Harshlands
    Lanyiara - Harshlands Posts: 271 Arc User
    edited October 2010
    Voted Sage cos thats what my plans are generally.

    I like the chi gain and spark defence.

    That said my Ceric and upcoming Wizard is /will be Demon, for the added effects varying from the Channel on spark to Demon Wizards extended cast range on Mountain Press and stun on Emberstorm.
  • Longknife - Harshlands
    Longknife - Harshlands Posts: 4,843 Arc User
    edited October 2010
    KageYingZi - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Well,some classes have a more biased Sage to Demon/Demon to Sage ratio because of certain coughinfluentialcough people.

    Demon for archer because I'll get called noob if I'll go Sage at 89.

    /inb4certainarcherwhoactspro

    I think the most common Sages are Barbs and Psys.

    Most common Demons, hell I dunno because look how many of them there are. :P
    I <3 AGOREY
  • DeadSound - Lost City
    DeadSound - Lost City Posts: 176 Arc User
    edited October 2010
    Demon BM: it was a tough call but in the end a few things won me over.
    Tri-Spark, Cyclone Heel, AGB, Glacial Spike, Roar and Diamond Sutra since i already had a very decent crit rate.

    Demon WF: Demon Fox Form, Ironwood, envenomous and Nova.
    I only managed to get venomous scarab on my wf.
  • Ellantria - Heavens Tear
    Ellantria - Heavens Tear Posts: 129 Arc User
    edited October 2010
    Going Sage because...

    50% chance of a free Vector.
    10 seconds of immunity with Psy Will.
    10 seconds of watching an enemy squirm with Soulburn.
    No mana cost on Soul of Vengeance.
    A free 15% HP restored every 30 seconds.
    AoE Purify.
    Longer lasting Silence.
    Easier to use Soul of Stunning (Less soulforce needed for the win.)
    Longer -chan on Tide Spirit.
    More damage from masteries.
    Chi skill.
    Smexi Sage Spark.
    4 second faster cool on charms.
    4 second longer cool on enemy charms.
    25 attack levels on black voodoo.
    71 defense levels in white voodoo.
    Really long immobilize with Glacial Shards.
    More damage on my DoTs.
    Spirit Blast randomly giving chi.
    Adorable little fairy~
    ┐('～`；)┌
  • Lenore - Harshlands
    Lenore - Harshlands Posts: 1,201 Arc User
    edited October 2010
    Longknife - Harshlands wrote: »
    I think the most common Sages are Barbs and Psys.

    Most common Demons, hell I dunno because look how many of them there are. :P

    I know a fair number of wizards who went sage also.

    And we can all assume that APS classes TEND to lean towards demon...
  • Kupuntu - Sanctuary
    Kupuntu - Sanctuary Posts: 3,008 Arc User
    edited October 2010
    Longknife - Harshlands wrote: »
    I think the most common Sages are Barbs and Psys.

    Most common Demons, hell I dunno because look how many of them there are. :P

    From what I've seen on Sanct:

    BM: Sage
    Wizard: Pretty even, more sages though
    Barb: Sage
    Veno: Sage
    Archer: Demon
    Cleric: Sage
    Sin: Demon
    Psy: Sage
    100% F2P player. Started PW: March 2007, Quit PW: March 2011.
    pwcalc.com/e7016929e7b204ae "Pure axe" 8k HP multipath BM, last one of my kind.
  • Euphy - Dreamweaver
    Euphy - Dreamweaver Posts: 495 Arc User
    edited October 2010
    Kupuntu - Sanctuary wrote: »
    From what I've seen on Sanct:

    BM: Sage
    Wizard: Pretty even, more sages though
    Barb: Sage
    Veno: Sage
    Archer: Demon
    Cleric: Sage
    Sin: Demon
    Psy: Sage
    Wow Dreamweaver is really different... I think the trends tend to go like this:
    Blademaster: Demon
    Wizard: Sage
    Barbarian: Demon
    Venomancer: Sage
    Archer: Demon
    Cleric: Even Split
    Assassin: Demon
    Psychic: Sage
    To be fair, there's lots of each. I think the magic classes tend to have a good mix fo the two cultivations. However, Sage Barbarians and Blademasters are a dyeing breed. There were hardly any sage archers and assassins to begin with.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Kupuntu - Sanctuary
    Kupuntu - Sanctuary Posts: 3,008 Arc User
    edited October 2010
    Euphy - Dreamweaver wrote: »
    Wow Dreamweaver is really different... I think the trends tend to go like this:
    Blademaster: Demon
    Wizard: Sage
    Barbarian: Demon
    Venomancer: Sage
    Archer: Demon
    Cleric: Even Split
    Assassin: Demon
    Psychic: Sage
    To be fair, there's lots of each. I think the magic classes tend to have a good mix fo the two cultivations. However, Sage Barbarians and Blademasters are a dyeing breed. There were hardly any sage archers and assassins to begin with.

    Sanctuary is the promised land of sage BMs. Most of our barbs are still sage but some old timers are going demon now. There are also some sage sins, not as many as demons but still I see those every day.
    100% F2P player. Started PW: March 2007, Quit PW: March 2011.
    pwcalc.com/e7016929e7b204ae "Pure axe" 8k HP multipath BM, last one of my kind.
  • Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973
    Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973 Posts: 7,881 Arc User
    edited October 2010
    Kupuntu - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Sanctuary is the promised land of sage BMs. Most of our barbs are still sage but some old timers are going demon now. There are also some sage sins, not as many as demons but still I see those every day.

    Huh? Every sage BM I know on sanc either regretted it or switched to demon. Nasrath, TheDan, NeoCru.. I don't know any that went the other way. Barb is a pretty similar trend to BM with the only sage barbs left being TW cat pullers. Euphy's trend list is what we have on sanc.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Refining Simulator - aster.ohmydays.net/pw/refiningsimulator.html (don't use IE)
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  • Kupuntu - Sanctuary
    Kupuntu - Sanctuary Posts: 3,008 Arc User
    edited October 2010
    Asterelle - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Huh? Every sage BM I know on sanc either regretted it or switched to demon. Nasrath, TheDan, NeoCru.. I don't know any that went the other way. Barb is a pretty similar trend to BM with the only sage barbs left being TW cat pullers. Euphy's trend list is what we have on sanc.

    I could list some 'proud' sage BMs. riosl, BladeThirst, Domi, Kyran, Zan, Damni etc. There are more new 89+ BM people that are sage than demon on Sanct.
    100% F2P player. Started PW: March 2007, Quit PW: March 2011.
    pwcalc.com/e7016929e7b204ae "Pure axe" 8k HP multipath BM, last one of my kind.
  • Spirit_Age - Raging Tide
    Spirit_Age - Raging Tide Posts: 267 Arc User
    edited October 2010
    I could not vote in your poll. I am an undecided Archer. Sorry
    I quit. Nothing ever changes @ PWE or PW CN . Expansion was over hyped. Guild bases (that looked cool) can be destroyed, so why waste the time if your a in a small faction like me.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Thanks Dorset. I quit. Nothing ever changes @ PWE or PW CN
    -ZeroDefects-"trollin trollin trollin. keep those flames a rollin. keep that post count growing. flamebait!" -Vitenka- "You are modifying the game files. That's not allowed. The freaking end."
  • Silest - Sanctuary
    Silest - Sanctuary Posts: 816 Arc User
    edited October 2010
    Sage, and I'm a venomancer. Mostly going sage because of Sage Ironwood Scarab and Sage amplify.

    The longer the better.
  • Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973
    Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973 Posts: 7,881 Arc User
    edited October 2010
    Kupuntu - Sanctuary wrote: »
    I could list some 'proud' sage BMs. riosl, BladeThirst, Domi, Kyran, Zan, Damni etc. There are more new 89+ BM people that are sage than demon on Sanct.

    We must be in different circles heh. Most of the 100+ BMs of the bigger TW guilds I know would advise against sage for both PVP and PVE reasons.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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  • Kupuntu - Sanctuary
    Kupuntu - Sanctuary Posts: 3,008 Arc User
    edited October 2010
    Asterelle - Sanctuary wrote: »
    We must be in different circles heh. Most of the 100+ BMs of the bigger TW guilds I know would advise against sage for both PVP and PVE reasons.

    Yeah. Being a 8x player is fun, you get to meet special kind of people.

    If only you could kill them... The people I listed aren't exactly my best friends in PK or otherwise.
    100% F2P player. Started PW: March 2007, Quit PW: March 2011.
    pwcalc.com/e7016929e7b204ae "Pure axe" 8k HP multipath BM, last one of my kind.

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