Sage = TW and Demon = PK

2

Comments

  • I_Snipe - Lost City
    I_Snipe - Lost City Posts: 451 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    CinnaStix - Harshlands wrote: »
    An archer receiving 33% less dmg that cannot be slept or stunned > the few seconds or so you get with Demon Barage...

    Wait what? So you're saying Sage Barrage of Arrows is better than Demon Barrage of Arrows? I think you are truly misinformed my fellow player.
    1. In order to do WoG and BoA, you'd need 3 sparks which is difficult to get in TW unless you have 2 Spark Chi pots and a Genie with Chi skills. [Or attacked and survived long enough to get that much Chi]
    2. I think most Archers [or all] would prefer faster intervals of BoA over 33% damage reduction [which is pretty nulled with the amount of +30 Atk Lvl Blessings running around, and the fact that it can be replaced with temporary immunity pots/genie skills]
    CinnaStix - Harshlands wrote: »
    If you don't understand, I may be able to help... I believe that was before Genie's were around.

    1. I am sure RedsRose was here long before you were.
    2. Stating how "old" you are =/= you being a know it all.
    3. http://www.pwdatabase.com/pwi/mob/10027 explain to me how Barrage [which is a physical attack] can do "so much damage" as you claim to something with 10k Physical Defence? If Barrage did so much damage, what's the point of a Catapult again? If I recall, it is the main and only way to damage Towers and Crystals [attacks from classes do very little damage]
  • truekossy
    truekossy Posts: 7,021 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    Another thing to add,
    CinnaStix - Harshlands wrote: »
    Idk how many times ive stated "ASSUMING THEY DO NOT USE STUN/SEAL/SLEEP"... Honestly... a smart person is going to put up... potion to NOT ALLOW STUN/ SLEEP... Obviously you dont' realize the effect of that... An archer in barage that won't be stun/slept... Ofcourse you might not relate... once again i said an Experienced person would do this. But anyway. An archer receiving 33% less dmg that cannot be slept or stunned > the few seconds or so you get with Demon Barage... There you go... I honestly wonder if you have much experience... and yes I have been in TW.. and in TW i run into experienced archers who want to not allow me to break them from barage as long as possible... It is still easy to kill a normal archer in barage even if they were demon and use pot... SO as a result... using the pot and getting an extra dmg reduction time... would be best... Also.. it can be stacked with wings of grace... Wings of grace... Barage... 15 seconds without stun/sleep... then an extra 12 seconds due to pots... after this... Unless ur sealed by a wiz... which is less odds due to the smaller amount of them and chances that they might be busy... fighting or getting killed... 27 seconds with a 33% reduction of dmg and immune to stun/sleep is better... b:victory Obviously a sage would be able to hold it alot longer considering as soon as they put up barage they will get mobbed by people trying to kill them.

    This is flawed on so many levels. Say you don't get slept/sealed/stunned. You're still going to have several people suddenly jump you and that defense reduction? Yeah it's not gonna help much against 5 people attacking you at once. Then you mention an extra 12 seconds of barrage due to pots after grace wears out. Do you even know how this game works? Assuming you had the sparks to grace + barrage and didn't waste apoths to do it (oh and since Demon can do the same, they'd also have grace's damage reduction for the first fifteen seconds if your opponents were stupid enough to let you live with zhen up for that long if you weren't using an invul pot wheras sage would nullify that once they open barrage), how the hell are you gonna use another anti-movement debuff pot while... ya know... in barrage? Cause apoths kinda sorta maybe CAN'T BE USED WHILE YOU'RE CHANNELING/CASTING SKILLS, which means once grace runs out in this hypothetical situation, sage is just as screwed as demon is.

    So again, I have to question if you have any real TW experience. Because all your replies and theorizing in this thread have been pointing to the opposite as being true.
  • Yulk - Heavens Tear
    Yulk - Heavens Tear Posts: 1,951 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    RWARGH BLARGH you have no idea what your talking about. That wizzie must of use distance shrink wrong.

    Oh, and demon emberstorm > demon Armageddon b:bye
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    Thanks for Flauschkatze for siggy b:cool

    VIT > STR > DEX > MAG... GG
    HA > LA > AR... GG

    HA + VIT = win b:bye
  • Rawrgh - Raging Tide
    Rawrgh - Raging Tide Posts: 6,790 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    Yulk - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    RWARGH BLARGH you have no idea what your talking about. That wizzie must of use distance shrink wrong.

    Oh, and demon emberstorm > demon Armageddon b:bye
    You have to be a troll, you just have to be, no way you can seriously be that stupid.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    "My understanding of women only goes as far as the pleasure. When it comes to the pain, I'm like any other bloke - I don't want to know."
  • Desiree - Harshlands
    Desiree - Harshlands Posts: 635 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    I started on the second week of LC, TW'd on LC, HL and RT (not real "TW" but meh). But just because I'm one of the old-schoolers who miji'd at butterflies and fishes doesn't automatically make my arguments valid. But I digress.

    Archers don't barrage crystals to take them down; they do it because its just a stationary target to AoE on.

    A few other misconceptions but no point wasting time arguing.

    Understanding of TWs comes from experiencing. If you are not in the position to experience TW, watch more TW videos from top factions.

    ~Desiree
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Qingzi - Harshlands
    Qingzi - Harshlands Posts: 232 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    Rawrgh - Raging Tide wrote: »
    You have to be a troll, you just have to be, no way you can seriously be that stupid.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l8BRbM52gpc
  • I_Snipe - Lost City
    I_Snipe - Lost City Posts: 451 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    truekossy wrote: »
    Another thing to add,Cause apoths kinda sorta maybe CAN'T BE USED WHILE YOU'RE CHANNELING/CASTING SKILLS

    LOL i forgot about that too. it's happened many times when i put up barrage and forget to activate Dew of Star Protection beforehand, and all I can do is /facepalm
  • Asperitas - Lost City
    Asperitas - Lost City Posts: 907 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    Yulk - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Oh, and demon emberstorm > demon Armageddon b:bye

    Oh lord...
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • SashaGray - Heavens Tear
    SashaGray - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,765 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    Yulk - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    RWARGH BLARGH you have no idea what your talking about. That wizzie must of use distance shrink wrong.

    Oh, and demon emberstorm > demon Armageddon b:bye
    Rawrgh - Raging Tide wrote: »
    You have to be a troll, you just have to be, no way you can seriously be that stupid.

    dude, its yulk

    the impressiveness of his post count is only matched by the impressiveness of the wisdom he has imparted in each and every one of those posts.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • lmaonade1xp
    lmaonade1xp Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited July 2010
    I think this guy has a fetish for periods b:shockedb:shockedb:shocked
  • CinnaStix - Harshlands
    CinnaStix - Harshlands Posts: 37 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    I_Snipe - Lost City wrote: »
    Wait what? So you're saying Sage Barrage of Arrows is better than Demon Barrage of Arrows? I think you are truly misinformed my fellow player.
    1. In order to do WoG and BoA, you'd need 3 sparks which is difficult to get in TW unless you have 2 Spark Chi pots and a Genie with Chi skills. [Or attacked and survived long enough to get that much Chi]
    2. I think most Archers [or all] would prefer faster intervals of BoA over 33% damage reduction [which is pretty nulled with the amount of +30 Atk Lvl Blessings running around, and the fact that it can be replaced with temporary immunity pots/genie skills]



    1. I am sure RedsRose was here long before you were.
    2. Stating how "old" you are =/= you being a know it all.
    3. http://www.pwdatabase.com/pwi/mob/10027 explain to me how Barrage [which is a physical attack] can do "so much damage" as you claim to something with 10k Physical Defence? If Barrage did so much damage, what's the point of a Catapult again? If I recall, it is the main and only way to damage Towers and Crystals [attacks from classes do very little damage]

    Never stated how old i am... just said when i was playing... that has nothing to do with TW experience... Neither does the use of Pots during casting time... So idk how u question TW experience with that... BUT... If you read any of the posts above this... i clearly showed videos of people doing damage to the crystal.... WITHOUT catapult... That is where my argument comes from... and i didn't say barage does so much dmg... plz read before you try and contribute. And im glad ur sure RedsRose has been here long before i have. GJ
  • RedsRose - Lost City
    RedsRose - Lost City Posts: 12,354 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Rawrgh - Raging Tide wrote: »
    You have to be a troll, you just have to be, no way you can seriously be that stupid.

    <3 b:chuckle
    CinnaStix - Harshlands wrote: »
    Never stated how old i am... just said when i was playing... that has nothing to do with TW experience... Neither does the use of Pots during casting time... So idk how u question TW experience with that... BUT... If you read any of the posts above this... i clearly showed videos of people doing damage to the crystal.... WITHOUT catapult... That is where my argument comes from... and i didn't say barage does so much dmg... plz read before you try and contribute. And im glad ur sure RedsRose has been here long before i have. GJ

    Ok....I will say this.

    If you hit the crystal, YES there will be damage. However, if your normal attack is 100, you will hit the crystal for about 5 <-- if that.

    Therefore = no point. And Desiree's response = why archers open zhen and +1!!
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    RoidAbuse is awesome, only he would sell his sperm for gear!!

    "Toughest monster? ..... RedsRose b:surrender" - Kantorek
    Where is my 1 v 1 Kan? b:mischievous
  • Moranine - Lost City
    Moranine - Lost City Posts: 319 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Demon > Everything.

    Only class that is worth going Sage for is Mage and Cleric, everything else should be demon. If your an Archer and your Sage in TW you should prob uninstall.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973
    Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973 Posts: 7,881 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    You zhen the HQ to provide covering fire for your forces attacking the HQ.

    It forces the other faction to run around the barrage and attack from the side when their first instinct is to run straight for the cats. It does make you a target but now they have to first take down the barrage, then kill the clerics, then kill cats. All the while the HQ is getting killed.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Refining Simulator - aster.ohmydays.net/pw/refiningsimulator.html (don't use IE)
    Genie Calculator - aster.ohmydays.net/pw/geniecalculator.html - (don't use IE)
    Socket Calculator - aster.ohmydays.net/pw/socketcalculator.html
  • Quizenbort - Dreamweaver
    Quizenbort - Dreamweaver Posts: 71 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Demon Glass Cannon = Win
  • Noob - Raging Tide
    Noob - Raging Tide Posts: 771 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    i only went sage cuz i never planned on hitting 100 so i just wanted the 90% wep dmg and +2 range then you can barrage right inside enemy spawn :D
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Yulk - Heavens Tear
    Yulk - Heavens Tear Posts: 1,951 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Moranine - Lost City wrote: »
    Demon > Everything.

    Only class that is worth going Sage for is Mage and Cleric, everything else should be demon. If your an Archer and your Sage in TW you should prob uninstall.

    agreed, now give me free sage books :D.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    Thanks for Flauschkatze for siggy b:cool

    VIT > STR > DEX > MAG... GG
    HA > LA > AR... GG

    HA + VIT = win b:bye
  • Rawrgh - Raging Tide
    Rawrgh - Raging Tide Posts: 6,790 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Ok....I will say this.

    If you hit the crystal, YES there will be damage. However, if your normal attack is 100, you will hit the crystal for about 5 <-- if that.

    Therefore = no point. And Desiree's response = why archers open zhen and +1!!

    Not to mention that in the time you manage to do 10k damage to the crystal it will have recovered 100k
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    "My understanding of women only goes as far as the pleasure. When it comes to the pain, I'm like any other bloke - I don't want to know."
  • HarmOwnie - Dreamweaver
    HarmOwnie - Dreamweaver Posts: 574 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    for wizard = true

    sage
    = better chi generation
    less chi consumption for ultis
    dmg improvment
    higher elemental res

    demon

    = higher dmg on core skills gush ss
    channeling improvement
    crit rate increase
    additional control skills
    higher phys res

    so you clearly see demon = pk = 1v1 sage = pve = tw
  • Ignation - Lost City
    Ignation - Lost City Posts: 176 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Sage Sandstorm > Demon Sandstorm.

    On the condition that you have earth mastery and a good refined weapon.
    Same goes for gush.
    "It is not the critic who counts, not the man who points out how the strong man stumbled, or where the doer of deeds could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who strives valiantly, who errs and comes short again and again, who knows the great enthusiasms, the great devotions, and spends himself in a worthy cause, who at best knows achievement and who at the worst if he fails at least fails while daring greatly so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who know neither victory nor defeat."
  • ArchSaber - Sanctuary
    ArchSaber - Sanctuary Posts: 1,440 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    im here to say that sage bm skills are a bit underpowered. demon mag marrow can even out both your def to 10k each at endgame. hell bell may last for only 15 secs, but realize it only has 3 second cooldown, so spam it yo, mp food is cheap. Demon HF is pretty much 5 times better then sage. Bm's usually have cat jobs, which is just to use roar as many times you get. Demon Roar always succeds when they target is not immune to stun, and the cooldown is reduced.

    in conclusion, what im trying to say is that either sage or demon, if they both have equal gear and maxed skills, they are pretty much the same.
    AP classes are a real butt pounding...
  • TheDan - Sanctuary
    TheDan - Sanctuary Posts: 3,495 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    LOL WTF? Sage better for TW? Please tell me you're trolling. I went Demon because Sage sucked at multi PvP. I was sage BM for 2 years and it was the quickest way to get 1 shot by +12 Archers with mage marrow on. I always Demon Bell for the sole purpose of tanking multiple people at once when I immune stun rush Roar + HF + Bolt + Fissure.

    I personally didn't see the point of being a sage BM post anniversary packs. It even fails in PvE TT / FCC / AoE Grinding cause HF only lasts 6 seconds, and can't reach 5.0 APS without heel.

    Less chi cost does not equate to casting more often if you have white tea / chi genie / fists. I'd rather be casting 9 second demon HFs than 6 second Sage HFs every 30 seconds. Meaning only waiting 21 seconds before the curse effect can be re-casted on your enemy instead of 24. In fact, demon should let you cast MORE because cool down minus duration of effect = is the interval of time when the skill is not in effect, which makes demon better for stunning/HFing which is a necessity in TW. Roar cool down lowered, Heaven's Flame duration increased. Less time when the skills are not in effect.
    BM PvP Guide: pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=1320761

    YouTube channels: youtube.com/TheDan912 and youtube.com/TheDanPWI
  • _Ghostz_ - Archosaur
    _Ghostz_ - Archosaur Posts: 230 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Well lets look at the Classes and their Culti choices

    Sage BM= Garbage compared to Demon BM

    Demon Assassin= Decent but worse than Sage Assassin

    Sage Archer= COMPLETE AND UTTER GARBAGE PERIOD i mean really wth? And Demon is better

    Sage Wizard= Better than Demon Wizard just because of their ultimate (BIDs omg) and other skills

    Sage Cleric= On par with Demon Cleric, both are good choices

    Demon Barb= Better PVP, less HP but Sage is High HP and PVE so they are equal in their own right

    Demon Veno= Better than Sage Veno unless Sage is HA/Arcane then there is a problemb:shocked

    Demon Psychic= Better than Sage....period
    Just don't. This is your final warning.
  • XKi - Lost City
    XKi - Lost City Posts: 103 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Sage psychic < Demon psychic? Then how come the demon psychics I've been killing have all died? Discuss.
  • Boogiepanda - Raging Tide
    Boogiepanda - Raging Tide Posts: 4,682 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Because killing = in the process of being killed? If they weren't dead by the end of it the process wouldn't be called killing.
  • Zoe - Heavens Tear
    Zoe - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,814 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    XKi - Lost City wrote: »
    Sage psychic < Demon psychic? Then how come the demon psychics I've been killing have all died? Discuss.

    The simple fact is, both demon and sage are great for everything on every class. It's all about knowing how to properly utilize your class.
    Main characters
    Celestial Sage Venomancer Zoe - 100
    Sage Barbarian Malego - 91
  • Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973
    Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973 Posts: 7,881 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    XKi - Lost City wrote: »
    Sage psychic < Demon psychic? Then how come the demon psychics I've been killing have all died? Discuss.

    Even if that were the case and even if it could be attributed to your culti (and not skill or gear), there are 7 other classes out there each with 2 cultivations. Your point means very little about the pvp and pve viability of sage psychics.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Refining Simulator - aster.ohmydays.net/pw/refiningsimulator.html (don't use IE)
    Genie Calculator - aster.ohmydays.net/pw/geniecalculator.html - (don't use IE)
    Socket Calculator - aster.ohmydays.net/pw/socketcalculator.html
  • XKi - Lost City
    XKi - Lost City Posts: 103 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    @Boogie: *loses IQ reading this* (and yes it is now 0)

    @Zoe: True, although there seems to be a lack of that on this server....psychic-wise that is...it seems to me that there are only an EXTREMELY small handful of RPK'ing/PvP'ing psychics on this server that are almost or are end-game.

    @Asterelle: Well of course I'm talking about PvP...IJS I haven't seen any good demon psychic opponent/rival on this server....if there are any on other servers, then make the GM's allow people to move their characters to other servers. I'm ready to be proven incorrect. Oh and by the way, my gear isn't anything to be worshiped...just putting that out there if anyone is going to use that remark.
  • Fist_Mama - Harshlands
    Fist_Mama - Harshlands Posts: 237 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    the thread starter has never TWed before and btw sage isnt TW oreinated cause im pretty sure sage wizards and clerics r pvp people
  • Michael_Dark - Lost City
    Michael_Dark - Lost City Posts: 9,091 Arc User
    edited August 2010
    Rawrgh - Raging Tide wrote: »
    When you get a character to the level where you can at least learn to use armageddon or any other ult, then someone might care what you say.

    I lol'd irl. Nobody is ever going to listen to what Yulk has to say. Ever.
    I post in forums. This one and others. That's why I post.

Categories