Which Failed Catagorized Class is More Failed in FB/BH/FC etc?

I_kaine - Archosaur

Like the title, which failed catagorized class is most failed when there is teamwork involved.

(If you've voted for Failed DD, please do say which class and why)

I personally think Barbarian fails are the most failed of the three catagories. I say this mainly because I've only played Cleric and DD. I always take agro in some way, whether it's heal agro or damage agro. The past failed Barbarians I've played with never hold mob agro, or ream enough when I assist attack. (I only have Venomancer and Wizard as my DD classes)

Okay, discuss!!! (Now's your chance to badmouth the other classes b:chuckle)

Nowitsawn - Heavens Tear

Voted barbarian since I'm a cleric myself b:chuckle

Honestly though, it's a tie between clerics and barbs.

XxLady_XelxX - Dreamweaver

Clerics. Tanks and DDs can be interchanged, but Cleric is the only class that squads will seldom enter an instance without. In my experience it's lead to many more cases of primadonnadeekheditis than even Barbs are accused of exhibiting.

Not to mention actual squad functionality. If tank screws up, good squads can often recover. DDs **** up it's easy enough to correct. But if Cleric screws up? Forget it...more often than not it's a party wipe.

Longknife - Harshlands

Maybe I'm an idiot, but I can't even make heads or tails of your question. Fairly certain it has improper grammar.

Are you asking which class has a tendency to fail more often or which class generates the most problems when it can't do it's job properly?

XxLady_XelxX - Dreamweaver

Went with "which class causes the most problems when the player behind it sucks" for 1000. b:laugh

Kupuntu - Sanctuary

Clerics tend to be one of the classes that I usually don't see failing that bad. I'm going to have to say barbs. DDs cause problems too, but it usually only results to a death of that one particular DD. If the barb dies... I'll tank b:victory

Michael_Dark - Lost City

I really can't answer this as if they're a failed class they're fail so I really can't answer this.

There is something definitely strange about your observations that I'll have to give some thought to and come back to post my observation about something definitely strange.

Jiblet - Sanctuary

I_kaine - Archosaur wrote: »

Like the title, which failed catagorized class is most failed when there is teamwork involved.

(If you've voted for Failed DD, please do say which class and why)

I personally think Barbarian fails are the most failed of the three catagories. I say this mainly because I've only played Cleric and DD. I always take agro in some way, whether it's heal agro or damage agro. The past failed Barbarians I've played with never hold mob agro, or ream enough when I assist attack. (I only have Venomancer and Wizard as my DD classes)

Okay, discuss!!! (Now's your chance to badmouth the other classes b:chuckle)

I'd say that the most NOTICED fail class has to be cleric, as when you get a bad one it leads to squadwipe after squadwipe.

OP, if you feel barb's are fail because they can't hold aggro from you, then you're actually the one failing as aggro control is an essential part of being a DD class. Personally I love getting aggro but I always consider it my fault when I do so if I die that's down to me as wellb:laugh

TigerLily - Lost City

Failed barb in Frost is the most fail b:angry

You would think someone thats 90+ would know the purpose of Roar+Invoke and have correct genie skills b:surrender For some reason is pretty common with barbs that have no clue how the most fundamental tiger skills work.

It so much extra fail with a bad barb because many of them refuse to take advice from others, they know "everything". They even get offensive if you tell them how pulling mobs is done. I think its something that comes with the class, knowing everything and assuming you're the alpha male leader. So in the end you might have to kick a fail barb in Frost, than it takes ages to find a new one.

XylolyX - Heavens Tear

TigerLily - Lost City wrote: »

Failed barb in Frost is the most fail b:angry

You would think someone thats 90+ would know the purpose of Roar+Invoke and have correct genie skills b:surrender For some reason is pretty common with barbs that have no clue how the most fundamental tiger skills work.

It so much extra fail with a bad barb because many of them refuse to take advice from others, they know "everything". They even get offensive if you tell them how pulling mobs is done. I think its something that comes with the class, knowing everything and assuming you're the alpha male leader. So in the end you might have to kick a fail barb in Frost, than it takes ages to find a new one.

I do run into this a great deal on my archer. However, most of these barbs have leveled quickly without the aid of having another barb as a mentor.

On my barb I have seen an equal number of fail clerics and barbs.

As far as DD'ers go, it's really hard to fail at being a DD. Though I have seen my share of BMs decide that every mob in the instance needs to be aggroed...NOW! Which more than not leads to some interesting situations.

To me it seems that the learning curve on players and their toons has shifted a great deal to the 90's levels, when it should have remained at the 60's levels. There's a natural progression in quest mobs that takes one step by step in learning how to play their toon. BH's seem to eliminate that all important step of learning how to play against ranged and ranged magic mobs effectively. (lvls 40-70.) It's sad because I see potential in a great number of players- then they go on to fail marvelously in many, many ways.

BarbLord - Raging Tide

Jiblet - Sanctuary wrote: »

I'd say that the most NOTICED fail class has to be cleric, as when you get a bad one it leads to squadwipe after squadwipe.

OP, if you feel barb's are fail because they can't hold aggro from you, then you're actually the one failing as aggro control is an essential part of being a DD class. Personally I love getting aggro but I always consider it my fault when I do so if I die that's down to me as wellb:laugh

at your level gaining agro might be your fault but this what happened when i agreed a diffrent barb would tank wyvern we had 3 clerics and 1 bm, me and another barb
i double sparked and did 1 devour 3 secs later i had agro i was kinda like wtf since my damage isnt that good i have TT60 axes +1 with an average amber shard in it and im am pure tanker builded and i was in tiger form and then that barb was yelling at me
me is tank you no steal agro i was kinda like lol because if i can steal agro the easily what about any decent DD though i was the only one who stole agro because all the bm did who used poles btw was auto atacking and i dunno what the cleric that was suposed to DD was doing either
And the whole squad told me to hold back....? lol
after wyvern i said that i didnt want to hold back and i tanked fushma and rankar and no one got agro for even a second from me and they didnt hold back as much anyway
conclusion some barbs do fail to keep agro even in tiger form

now on topic: i think its a tie between stupid tanks(can be barbs dont have to be) and stupid clerics i survived bhs with crappy clerics as long they understood a bit what heal the tank was but i also heard of bhs failing because of idiot barbs

Michael_Dark - Lost City

XylolyX - Heavens Tear wrote: »

ITo me it seems that the learning curve on players and their toons has shifted a great deal to the 90's levels, when it should have remained at the 60's levels. There's a natural progression in quest mobs that takes one step by step in learning how to play their toon. BH's seem to eliminate that all important step of learning how to play against ranged and ranged magic mobs effectively. (lvls 40-70.) It's sad because I see potential in a great number of players- then they go on to fail marvelously in many, many ways.

I've pointed this out a number of times in a few different threads, and most people don't actually believe it...however, it is the truth. Glad I'm not the only one who sees it lol.

VlLKASS - Sanctuary

OP, if you feel barb's are fail because they can't hold aggro from you, then you're actually the one failing as aggro control is an essential part of being a DD class.

b:embarrass rofl.... it's funny this coming from you ROFL


I say clerics.


Next Rawr pwsome DD fist archers/bms that think they can tank everything & then get 2 shot on a boss they were proclaiming to tank.

TigerLily - Lost City

XylolyX - Heavens Tear wrote: »

I do run into this a great deal on my archer. However, most of these barbs have leveled quickly without the aid of having another barb as a mentor.

On my barb I have seen an equal number of fail clerics and barbs.

As far as DD'ers go, it's really hard to fail at being a DD. Though I have seen my share of BMs decide that every mob in the instance needs to be aggroed...NOW! Which more than not leads to some interesting situations.

.

Yeah thats true. Even if you leveled far to quickly as a DD just spamming oracles, its pretty hard to fail in Frost and similar. You really only have to watch that you dont steal aggro on bosses <.<

As a barb you need to learn a lot more running instances. How aggro, tanking and defense works etc.

There is just as many fail DDs and clerics out there of course, due to everyone speed leveling these days. But you wont really notice them as much since its hard to **** up when you only have to heal macro + open BB or auto attack.

Yukies - Harshlands

I didn't vote cause I think the worst are barbarians AND assassins. Cannot really choose. Barbarians usually are not able to play their class, have a very low armor and can just spam always "heal" instead of take aggro on them and tank.
Most of assassins, instead, usually start aggroing all the mobs, or wanna tank with 4000hp; they probably don't know that even a cleric can tank better then them. They go in stealth, jump some mob groups and go for the boss, without waiting other partecipants and wining if they die; lol.. see, not all can be invisibile like them! In fact I really prefer groups without assassins, they're boring and pedants, most of them think that Assassin class is the best for all, best for tank, best for DD, best... for.. all.. I cannot really tolerate them.
b:laugh

Elviron - Dreamweaver

BarbLord - Raging Tide wrote: »

at your level gaining agro might be your fault but this what happened when i agreed a diffrent barb would tank wyvern we had 3 clerics and 1 bm, me and another barb
i double sparked and did 1 devour 3 secs later i had agro i was kinda like wtf since my damage isnt that good i have TT60 axes +1 with an average amber shard in it and im am pure tanker builded and i was in tiger form and then that barb was yelling at me
me is tank you no steal agro i was kinda like lol because if i can steal agro the easily what about any decent DD though i was the only one who stole agro because all the bm did who used poles btw was auto atacking and i dunno what the cleric that was suposed to DD was doing either
And the whole squad told me to hold back....? lol
after wyvern i said that i didnt want to hold back and i tanked fushma and rankar and no one got agro for even a second from me and they didnt hold back as much anyway
conclusion some barbs do fail to keep agro even in tiger form

now on topic: i think its a tie between stupid tanks(can be barbs dont have to be) and stupid clerics i survived bhs with crappy clerics as long they understood a bit what heal the tank was but i also heard of bhs failing because of idiot barbs

Correct me if I am wrong, but doesn't DEVOUR generate aggro? Which would mean you just generated aggro onto yourself using one of your aggro skills instead of the actual damage. So saying the other barb failed to hold aggro when you generated aggro onto yourself is kinda ...you know....not right.

As for the class which would cause the max damage when the person is failing at it would be cleric.

But the most failed cleric ive seen till now was a high 9x cleric with 8x quest armours sharded with evasion shards b:thanks

Reshanta - Sanctuary

How did fail become an adjective is beyond me..

Jiblet - Sanctuary

VlLKASS - Sanctuary wrote: »

b:embarrass rofl.... it's funny this coming from you ROFL

I wondered when you'd show up and make some comment uglyb:pleased

To be fair, I do know how to control aggro - I just choose not to do itb:laugh

Jiblet - Sanctuary

XylolyX - Heavens Tear wrote: »

To me it seems that the learning curve on players and their toons has shifted a great deal to the 90's levels, when it should have remained at the 60's levels. There's a natural progression in quest mobs that takes one step by step in learning how to play their toon. BH's seem to eliminate that all important step of learning how to play against ranged and ranged magic mobs effectively. (lvls 40-70.) It's sad because I see potential in a great number of players- then they go on to fail marvelously in many, many ways.

Oh, completely agree with this as well. When you get into a mixed (non-fac) delta BH and someone says that they have never been in rebirth before...that's just scaryb:shocked

drjiggle

Jiblet - Sanctuary wrote: »

OP, if you feel barb's are fail because they can't hold aggro from you, then you're actually the one failing as aggro control is an essential part of being a DD class. Personally I love getting aggro but I always consider it my fault when I do so if I die that's down to me as wellb:laugh

This.

How many times have I seen some idiot DD who steals aggro (3 crits in a row! 50k+!!!) and then start yelling, "Heal me! Heal me! I'm tanking!" as he 3 sparks and continues skilling and/or runs away from the tank? If you stole aggro, stop attacking, numnutz, and bring the mob back to the tank or you're gonna die. You aren't the tank. Give the real tank a chance to get it back. Honestly, you probably should have stopped attacking after the 2nd crit, but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt on that one.

Most of the time when the cleric "steals" aggro by healing, it's also the cleric who is failing, not the barbarian. Watch the barbarian. See what he's attacking. Note what skills he's using. You shouldn't be healing until he has aggro on everything. Yes, it's his job to get aggro, but it's also your job to wait until he does.

Playing well in a squad means working together, and that means you as much as it means the other guy. It's not about everyone else doing extra work so you can click your macro and AFK.

RoidAbuse - Sanctuary

BarbLord - Raging Tide wrote: »

me and another barb
i double sparked and did 1 devour 3 secs later i had agro

This confirms it, barb is the most failed class.

Malei - Sanctuary

RoidAbuse - Sanctuary wrote: »

This confirms it, barb is the most failed class.

I did kind of face palm from his post, but I didn't think he was being...yanno...serious.

Futurelord - Dreamweaver

I voted cleric cause lets face it, if the cleric fails you know you, your brother, your sister, your cousins, their cousins, your wife, and your children are all in trouble...oh and the barb.b:laugh

Joshcja - Sanctuary

fail barbs and clerics cause wipes = no squads till they get decent

fail dd's can fail forever and most people wolnt care

a good tank is great

a good cleric is god dam gold

a dd that actually plays right is just priceless

BarbLord - Raging Tide

Elviron - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Correct me if I am wrong, but doesn't DEVOUR generate aggro? Which would mean you just generated aggro onto yourself using one of your aggro skills instead of the actual damage. So saying the other barb failed to hold aggro when you generated aggro onto yourself is kinda ...you know....not right.

while you are right about devour generating agro it doesnt come close to a barb spamming flesh ream unless devour is maxed and spammed and i didnt spam it i used it like once in 15 secs lol in that time a good barb can easily do 4-5 flesh reams
devour is diffrent from most agro skils unlike most skills it doesnt reset agro
oh and the tanking barb combined roar, devour and flesh ream to keep agro
whilst you could ask why the hell are you using devour as well is because ah i dunno its my best direct damage skill and i have it level wise maxed something i doubted from the tank with his buff levels
but back to the point roar is a long casting aoe agro skil that can keep maybe agro from 1 aoe from 1 DD and its weaker then 1 devour and a combination of devour and flesh ream can work though from my opinion flesh ream imedatly when its cooldown is over works best in terms of keeping agro

also i had barbs using devour with me as tank and whatever else and they couldnt steal my agro oh and did i mention this was one of those barbs that doesnt know what heal agro is nearly caused a squad wipe on mobs when i was gone 30 secs errr lol

volst

Reshanta - Sanctuary wrote: »

How did fail become an adjective is beyond me..

Words change/gain meanings all the time. Try to keep up.

KayLinda - Sanctuary

volst wrote: »

Words change/gain meanings all the time. Try to keep up.

Well you better clue in Webster's Dictionary because fail still does not have an entry as an adjective!

Oo_Rinoa_oO - Harshlands

the most failed one is a fail sin with fail personality.

some of them are proud of them and their intervals.
they go full attack, triple spark, whatsoever to steal aggro.
they proudly laugh when they steal aggro while letting clerics have hard job.

i play veno and barb.
when any sin does that, i pm all others in squad.
if veno, i cut my herc's bash off. if barb, i stop using aggro skills.
ive left squad to purge and amp the sin who did it on all bosses in TT though i told not to repeat.

well, about your question.
fail barb -> all others just need to be careful not to steal aggro, takes time but do-able.
fail cleric -> wipe, barb doesnt have infinitely many ways to heal himself. works only with venos.
fail DD -> same as fail sins, stealer. just let them die and stay in peace.

Elviron - Dreamweaver

BarbLord - Raging Tide wrote: »

while you are right about devour generating agro it doesnt come close to a barb spamming flesh ream unless devour is maxed and spammed and i didnt spam it i used it like once in 15 secs lol in that time a good barb can easily do 4-5 flesh reams
devour is diffrent from most agro skils unlike most skills it doesnt reset agro
oh and the tanking barb combined roar, devour and flesh ream to keep agro
whilst you could ask why the hell are you using devour as well is because ah i dunno its my best direct damage skill and i have it level wise maxed something i doubted from the tank with his buff levels
but back to the point roar is a long casting aoe agro skil that can keep maybe agro from 1 aoe from 1 DD and its weaker then 1 devour and a combination of devour and flesh ream can work though from my opinion flesh ream imedatly when its cooldown is over works best in terms of keeping agro

also i had barbs using devour with me as tank and whatever else and they couldnt steal my agro oh and did i mention this was one of those barbs that doesnt know what heal agro is nearly caused a squad wipe on mobs when i was gone 30 secs errr lol

Well umm if he didnt use any of his aggro skills and you did, its obvious youre gonna steal. Also if his aggro skills, equips and hp arent as good as yours, you could simply step up to tank and avoid a failing run.

FoxyGR - Raging Tide

Cleric and Barbarian.

I've played with newbs where the cleric tries to be a tank or a DD and ends up getting killed, thus killing off the rest of the party.

I've also ran threw with two barbarians just last night, and neither one could keep the agro off the Cleric. The cleric is diffrent from the other one, actually trying to help out via heals, but if TWO barbarians can't keep one cleric alive... then there's problems there.

I'll also say some venomancers are a fail too. They rely far too much on their pets. If their pet dies, then they are screwed. I've seen Veno's running away right when their pet dies, screaming 'help me!'. It's like... seriously! Attack the thing your pet's attacking and it wouldn't have died! -And yes, I AM a Veno. But I usually use my pet when in party or getting it's exp maxed to level it up.

Deceptistar - Sanctuary

Fail DDs. I swear some DDs think that going (brainless) all out is their job. If it were some other games i know some that would get DDs kicked from endgame factions if their not skilled enough to learn to control their aggro levels.