Wield Thunder as a DD skill?

DeathBanana - Heavens Tear

Why does no one do this? Whenever I go on BHs, I never see anyone DDing with Wield Thunder, it's always just Cyclone and Plumeshot

(important bits are in red)

Numbers:

m.atk = 5000
wep m.atk = 1000
mastery = 10
-chan = 0

Cyclone

Mastery ( Base M.atk + 100% Weapon Attack + 1372.6 )
----------------------------------------------------
Channel ( 100% - -chan% ) + Cast

1.2 ( 5000 + 1.00 ( 1000 ) + 1372.6 )
-------------------------------------
1 ( 1.00 - 0 ) + 1

1.2 ( 5000 + 1.00 ( 955 ) + 1372.6 )
------------------------------------
1 - 0 + 1

6000 + 1200 + 1647.12
---------------------
2

[SIZE="3"][B][COLOR="Red"]4423.56[/COLOR][/B][/SIZE]

Plume Shot

Base M.atk + 100% Weapon Attack + 1379.6
----------------------------------------
Channel ( 100% - -chan% ) + Cast

5000 + 1.00 ( 1000 ) + 1379.6
-----------------------------
1.5 ( 1.00 - 0 ) + 1

5000 + 1.00 ( 1000 ) + 1379.6
-----------------------------
1.5 - 0 + 1

5000 + 1000 + 1379.6
--------------------
2.5

[SIZE="3"][B][COLOR="Red"]2951.84[/COLOR][/B][/SIZE]

Wield Thunder

Mastery ( Base M.atk + 200% Weapon Attack + 4583.3 )
----------------------------------------------------
Channel ( 100% - -chan% ) + Cast

1.2 ( 5000 + 2.00 ( 1000 ) + 4583.3 )
-------------------------------------
2.5 ( 1.00 - 0 ) + 1.2

1.2 ( 5000 + 2.00 ( 1000 ) + 4583.3 )
-------------------------------------
2.5 - 0 + 1.2

6000 + 2400 + 5499.96
---------------------
3.7

[SIZE="3"][B][COLOR="Red"]3756.74594...[/COLOR][/B][/SIZE]

Important part:

Wield Thunder on cooldown

Cyclone + Wield Thunder + Cyclone + Plumeshot
---------------------------------------------
Time

2 ( 6000 + 1200 + 1647.12 ) + 5000 + 1000 + 1379.6 + 6000 + 2400 + 5499.96
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
2 + 3.7 + 2 + 2.5

[SIZE="3"][B][COLOR="Red"]3820.96078...[/COLOR][/B][/SIZE]

Cyclone and Plumeshot

Cyclone + Plumeshot + Cyclone + Plumeshot
-----------------------------------------
Time

2 ( 6000 + 1200 + 1647.12 + 5000 + 1000 + 1379.6 )
--------------------------------------------------
2 ( 2 + 2.5 )

[SIZE="3"][B][COLOR="Red"]3605.93777...[/COLOR][/B][/SIZE]

So, if spamming Wield Thunder on cooldown has a higher DPS than spamming Cyclone and Plumeshot, why does no one do this?

XxLady_XelxX - Dreamweaver

Your calculations are assuming maxed Wield Thunder (I assume). Many Clerics level simply level other skills first, so between lessened damage and range, Cyclone/Plume Shot spam is simply more efficient.

_Pale - Sanctuary

people do this...
but if macro stops, then starting it means the macro may stop again if you get to weild thunder during it's cooldown from the previous sequence. so you throw in a few more cyclone plume shot sequences.

Most people put wield thunder first in the macro... so it often stalls right at the start. I see you didn't, butit will mean you will be channeling wield thunder while the mobs are running for you.

stunning is a real pain for macro's with these kind of skills,
but I still use it.

DeathBanana - Heavens Tear

Should say, I'm at the level where people have plenty of SP

_Pale - Sanctuary

did you also check the mana use for the damage it does?

Thelas_Carr - Sanctuary

I use it all the time... but at L46, I barely used it at all... it's a very expensive skill to level up and I didn't get it maxed until well into my 80s (at which point I started using it all the time in rotation with Plumeshot, Cyclone, and Elemental Seal).

FatherTed - Dreamweaver

Like Thelas, I use it all the time - but I didn't start leveling/using it till my 70s, as I had what I considered to be more important skills to level.

For now, I don't use it as much because both my cyclone and plume are lvl 11 while WT is level 10 - and the other two do roughly the same damage for now. My main usage is on increased phsy res mobs, where they get a cyclone, WT, cyclone combo and go bye bye.

DeathBanana - Heavens Tear

Maybe people on HT are just weird
:S

Lylfo - Dreamweaver

To me, WT to cyclone is like SoR to IH. Even if you can heal better with SoR, my opinion is that you can most likely do without it. Same goes for WT, you are spending a lot more for a little improvement in damage.

I would like to add that the wield thunder combo generates more chi than the cyclone,plume shot combo.

Paramedic - Dreamweaver

u have answer in ur calc

200 more dmg for 10lvl mastery and 10 lvl WT (3m total to max)

and when ur healing it s better to just use as many cyclones as u can since cycolne has best DPS (which u proved)



other important thing u forgot to mention is that those combos DPS wont be same for different mag attack value


for example, for 10k m.att it will be:

6075.86 for 2xGC + WT + PS

6050.38 for GC + PS


vs 5k m.att:

3820 and 3605


gotta mention that clerics with maxed WT are >80lvl and they have bit more that 5k m.att, so difference is even smaller..

TrueHarmony - Archosaur

EHehe i would totally use weild thunder more if i had spirit to get it past 3 lol. Im at a point now where im full of money, but no spirit, so i havent even finished with my heals to worry about WT T.T. CURSE YOU LVL 68 CURSE YOU

Inias - Heavens Tear

if the clerics u run with don't use their wield thunder and debuffs etc ...
→YOUR GOING WITH THE WRONG CLERICS (~edit~→ or they're too poor cuz clerics are kinda poor if they're lower then like lvl 80-85 if they don't cash shop that is )



i rest my case

WtfPownage - Heavens Tear

1. Because at your level, Plume shots and Cyclone are way more mana efficientcy then WT. Look at mana vs damage output ratio.
2. WT are way more expensive to level ... max WT costs over 10times more to get then Plume/Cyclone in both coins/sp.
3. At lvl 50, there are more beneficial spells to upgrade then WT. Hmm i can upgrade 1level of WT or 1more level of Plume n Cylone n IH, guess wat ?? WT can wait.
4. You dont need the extra damage yet till later levels.
These reasons are enough to not bother to level WT till 70+.
At lvl 80+, WT begins to shine more since the mobs have a much higher hp pool.

Magicgabe - Lost City

Wield thunder = 2.5second channeling, 1.2 casting
plume+cyclone = 2.5 second channeling, 2 second of casting

wield thunder = 1x mag attack, 2x weapon damage, 4.5k damage
plumeshot = 2x mag attack, 2x weapon damge, 2.6k damage

if you have a mag attack of 8k, and weapon damge = 1k then

weild thunder = 3.9k dps
plume+cyclone = 4.5dps

assuming wield thunder gets 10% more damge from metal mastery compared to plume+cyclone, then

wield = 4.3dps
plume+cyclone =4.6 dps

wield mana cost = 480mana/cycle=130mana/second
plume+ mana cost=244mana/cycle= 54mana/second

therefore, plume+cyclone does more damage/second and its cheaper on the pots.

Maragon - Dreamweaver

only time i really use weild is either on an increased def mob or on a boss after the bm used HF and veno amps and i 2 spark and etc for the lols of big numbers. hit the culler in fb69 yesterday for over 52k without a crit like thatb:chuckle

StreamElf - Sanctuary

I love using it and if i squad with other clerics i notice them using it too.
But i know why some people won't use it. The mana cost is pretty high and the channeling is a little bit slow =/ But that won't keep me from using it b:victory

Clandore - Lost City

Magicgabe - Lost City wrote: »

Wield thunder = 2.5second channeling, 1.2 casting
plume+cyclone = 2.5 second channeling, 2 second of casting

wield thunder = 1x mag attack, 2x weapon damage, 4.5k damage
plumeshot = 2x mag attack, 2x weapon damge, 2.6k damage

if you have a mag attack of 8k, and weapon damge = 1k then

weild thunder = 3.9k dps
plume+cyclone = 4.5dps

assuming wield thunder gets 10% more damge from metal mastery compared to plume+cyclone, then

wield = 4.3dps
plume+cyclone =4.6 dps

wield mana cost = 480mana/cycle=130mana/second
plume+ mana cost=244mana/cycle= 54mana/second

therefore, plume+cyclone does more damage/second and its cheaper on the pots.

+1

but WT does look a lot cooler

Ingway - Sanctuary

Magicgabe - Lost City wrote: »

Wield thunder = 2.5second channeling, 1.2 casting
plume+cyclone = 2.5 second channeling, 2 second of casting

wield thunder = 1x mag attack, 2x weapon damage, 4.5k damage
plumeshot = 2x mag attack, 2x weapon damge, 2.6k damage

if you have a mag attack of 8k, and weapon damge = 1k then

weild thunder = 3.9k dps
plume+cyclone = 4.5dps

assuming wield thunder gets 10% more damge from metal mastery compared to plume+cyclone, then

wield = 4.3dps
plume+cyclone =4.6 dps

wield mana cost = 480mana/cycle=130mana/second
plume+ mana cost=244mana/cycle= 54mana/second

therefore, plume+cyclone does more damage/second and its cheaper on the pots.

Agreed. It's about cost effectiveness.

I use Wield Thunder only when I'm in the mood for wasting MP Pots or dueling. Otherwise, I'd rather save my mana for more things.

TheBishSlap - Lost City

most clerics wont use wield thunder very much till the 9xs although its stupid
you have higher dps using cyclone wield thunder cyclone debuff in a macro than anything else pre 89 assuming you have maxed skills because of mastery
+ its smarter to use the mdef debuff than the pdef debuff in most situations considering you have like 3k pdef but 8k mdef
at 89+ if your sage, cyclone plume shot cyclone has roughly more dps till your 99 with lvl 11 wield thunder because of the added damage on plume shot but at 99 wield thunder still has higher dps because of the metal mastery + high dmg
at 89+ if your demon, pre 99, cyclone wield thunder cyclone debuff is still best dps because of cyclone having very close dmg to wield thunder from the bonus dmg demon gives you
at 99+ as demon best DD is spirits gift wield thunder cyclone plume shot cyclone plumeshot repeat because with the metal debuff on wield thunder cyclone will hit again almost as hard as wield thunder

but if your Dding on a cleric your not a dd class so on bosses depending on whos DDing debuff for phys and mdef then use whatever macro is most efficient
boosting your squads dps is way more important than getting 1 more atk in your macro
btw sorry if its confusing i fail at grammar

Paramedic - Dreamweaver

yea, interesting i spose, tho u forgot bout base magic attack

Aya__ - Heavens Tear

my basic attack macro goes: loop, wt, cylone, plume, cyclone, plume
usually more than enough to kill mob
i-dont-have-to-heal-tank macro also has it
do i count b:cute

but its true that i started using wt only after it was lvl 6 or 7... at lower levels channeling time and mana cost vs damage dealt wast just so bad...

Crescentia - Harshlands

It was plume shot and weild of thunder for me until level like 50.
I didnt use cyclone. LOL
But use, weild is my favourity skill. WAY stronger then cyclone or plume..

unless you're pking.. plume shot come shot comes in handy