The TRUTH about archers
So....I know there is no truth only opinion. What i have seen throughout the forums is everyone complains about their class....Why do I hear people saying archer sucks? I have been leveling easy (35) I love the ranged attack and I don't feel as fragile as a mage...
Post edited by bkloes on
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So....I know there is no truth only opinion. What i have seen throughout the forums is everyone complains about their class....Why do I hear people saying archer sucks? I have been leveling easy (35) I love the ranged attack and I don't feel as fragile as a mage...
because you be only level 35 and apparently it's going to go downhill in pvp.
X_x
still good for pve.
b:thanks
o and leveling is easy for all classes....
with teh triple bh, daily quests, etc etc
it be so easy that going afk on me catshop makes me gain exp.
Dx
well me wish it worked that way
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lol......I just mean grinding is easy....I can kill more things per min then I can with my BM cause I don't have to chase them down (Run here RUN there....Run run run...I hate running)
As to PvP I am very inexperienced but why are mages so good? They are super squishy....yes they can hit hard in PvE but does that translate to PvP? I also dabbled with a mage and someone challenged me. I figured that I would nuke the person, but my normal 2000K points of damage was reduced to 300....
O I know I am a noob but I am a noob with access to the forum so who knows what will become of me......Become a confused noob most likely:D0 -
lol......I just mean grinding is easy....I can kill more things per min then I can with my BM cause I don't have to chase them down (Run here RUN there....Run run run...I hate running)
As to PvP I am very inexperienced but why are mages so good? They are super squishy....yes they can hit hard in PvE but does that translate to PvP? I also dabbled with a mage and someone challenged me. I figured that I would nuke the person, but my normal 2000K points of damage was reduced to 300....
O I know I am a noob but I am a noob with access to the forum so who knows what will become of me......Become a confused noob most likely:D
In PvP, all damage is reduced BY 75% meaning you will only do one quarter of your listed damage on your character sheet. This damage then goes through the opponents defenses.
And why people say Mage is better than an Archer? Once they hit 95 onwards, they will hit very hard (and have very high crits... not as high as an Archer but event gear gave them the option to literally go from single digit % crits to double digit % crits) because they have access to lunar weapons, lunar rings and capes and will have decent base physical defense. We still hurt them with a decent weapon until we realise they can cast this skill called Stone Barrier. This then leaves them with extremely high physical defense as they have sharded a mixture of garnets which get amplified by the buff and high magical defense due to arcane armor specialising in magical resistances naturally.
PvE wise, I prefer an Archer but everything does rather well in PvE. Mage (or Wizards as they are called here) are not squishy later on in the game. You will notice if you PvP things will become easier for you now until later 70s. At around early to mid 8x we lose the familiar PvP domination. The game pace changes at 90 and even more so at 95.0 -
I'll tell you the truth. People think about PVP all the time. I hate PVP. 99% of the game is PVE anyways... and Archers rock in PVE grinding, especially after mid lvls! Forget about PVP, it's lame.
Why I love my Archer in PVE:
- Extreme range.
- High damage and lots of crits.
- Get +MP recovery armor and you will never need mana potions because we mainly fight with normal attacks or low mana skills (frost arrow, lvl1 knockback).
- Almost never need HP potions because most mobs can't even reach us. If they do, use winged shell, second wind (genie heal), and melee skills.
- 1v1 grind faster than other classes (kill everything in matter of seconds). We even grind faster than AoE BMs because they need time to collect mobs and they eat lots of potions. We just stand in the middle and reach everything thanks to our range... and mobs can't even reach us. =P
- Cheap and good moneymaker (low repair fee, doesn't have to buy lots of skills. I'm richer than most of my friends at my lvl and I very rarely buy gold. I have millions of spirit too).
- Get all essential skills at lower lvls, so the skills are cheap! (frost, blazing, knockback, bow mastery, etc.)
- Can grind effectively with decent gear / weapon (only PVP requires THE BEST gear. I grind like crazy with cheap 3-star armor and a +3 legendary bow and never die).
- Always fun to play.
- Archers are sexy.
- Bow = best looking weapon in any MMO, including PWI. Hands down.
I could write more, but I'm going back to play. ^^ GO ARCHERS! It might be challenging at lower lvls, but don't give up! Archers become really good after mid lvls!◄ Alt for posting. | PVE Sage Archer and happy with it.0 -
You don't need to run as a BM just use your stun and you do have sprint to chase them down.lol......I just mean grinding is easy....I can kill more things per min then I can with my BM cause I don't have to chase them down (Run here RUN there....Run run run...I hate running)Looking for a decent casual understanding Faction.0 -
Yes the running away is bothersome but what I am talking about is when the mobs are spaced way apart between other ones.....you spend alot of time going from mob to mob. Archer stands in a field and kills everything within 25.................oh just leveled 26m:D0
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Done right, an archer and BM spend the same amount of time running - just the BM is running toward the mobs and the archer is running away (to get max range). The real difference is that the mob dies to the archer without landing a hit and without any real mana cost. So, unlike a low BM you aren't meditating every couple mobs.
And, for anybody who thinks an archer would dominate PvP up to 70 (at this stage of any active server), where is it that you find only similar-level PvP? I've never found the place where a lowbie archer isn't just a meal waiting to be eaten by a bigger fish. People leveling up at this point are not in for the same rude awakening that lies behind a lot of the archer self-hate because they will always have had much bigger fish in their pond."?" IS my avatar.0 -
FitHitDShan - Sanctuary wrote: »Done right, an archer and BM spend the same amount of time running - just the BM is running toward the mobs and the archer is running away (to get max range). The real difference is that the mob dies to the archer without landing a hit and without any real mana cost. So, unlike a low BM you aren't meditating every couple mobs.
From my grinding experience (even as a low level and in places like Tusk Town or in the sky/water), I often have to run to mobs instead of running away from them to get in attacking distance - but that distance is alot less than what a bm requires in order to be in attacking distance. Endgame wise for archers, it's not often necessary to kill normal mobs at max range to avoid any damage at all. When you reach lvl 89 (assuming you choose demon path), the archer can triple spark and kill at least 4-5 spread out mobs in 2-3 shots each 30+m away during spark duration without ever having to move much.
About the mp cost, that's not how I remembered it. Whether we are a low level archer or high, I'm sure alot of archers would agree that mp is something we can never get enough of even if we don't spam skills. Usually, we use at least one/two skills (i.e frost arrow, knockback, stun, or demon quick shot for eg archers) to kill a mob/keep them at bay, and we kill faster than our mp can fully regenerate .
On another note, PVE - as a DD we are very easy to be replaced by other DD classes or other higher level Archers. We do range damage, but so can all the other classes except a barb (by this I mean barbs don't do damage effectively with a bow like a bm/sin can). We are needed in squads for certain instances mainly for our 2 skills: STA and BoA, which are no longer that special because they can be replaced by other classes with similar skill effects or results. So, for something like FCC, BHs, and even Rebirth now - archers aren't really a requirement. And since we have difficulties tanking our own bosses we need for our quests (mainly at low level bosses/eg bosses), it can be very difficult to find a squad sometimes. Heck, a rude barb once kicked a lower level archer from a BH squad for a sin because he prefers a sin's buff. TBH, I don't find PVE as an eg archer that enjoyable as other classes now. Barb/Bm-they can tank well and are accepted into squads as tanks without skepticism, clerics-easy to find squads for anything, venos-can solo bosses/instances/solo grind just as good/better, for all the other DD classes-well they have it better in PVP too without much reliance on top eg gears as an archer would need.0 -
lol i quit playing this game cuz my archer is too squishy =x0
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o0.
BM's can tank.. depending on the squad - but so could an assassin or archer tank in most BH runs. Hell I've had to tank qingzi because the Barbs and BM's couldnt hold aggro off of me.
The statement that venos can tank/solo bosses is somewhat fallable though - that all depends on if they pour piles of money into getting a hercules pet. And even then.. depends on the squad. A herc can't hold aggro off of an archer, sin, mage, and sometimes even its own master - given they are all in same level range. Granted Barbs can get aggro ripped from them as well, but they get it back with FR. Most herc veno's I know say that roar is fail on Herc. But without roar, theres no resetting aggro back to the herc. I always prefer to have either a Barb or a higher level tank my runs, elsewise I'm tanking it if I know I will live.
But meh.. its fun to go pew pew.0 -
archer is a very difficult class. if the mob comes up close to you, cant really do anything but run away and hit it and u run into other mobs. like the defence is so low that if 2 mobs attack you, your a goner. and in squads oh you aggro things so easily. i used to die all the time in bh bcuz one hit of the mob and it comes after you.
and in pvp i got beat by a psychic 12 or more lvls below me wtf is that. maybe the tideborn is still overpowered.
it is pretty cool though like at PQ u can just stand up on the rock and hit the mobs and dont have to get in their and risk your life.0 -
EronKillstar - Dreamweaver wrote: »o0.
BM's can tank.. depending on the squad - but so could an assassin or archer tank in most BH runs. Hell I've had to tank qingzi because the Barbs and BM's couldnt hold aggro off of me.
uhum..... it aint very skillfull for an archer to pull aggro it mostly happens when you spam skill just STA and thundershock is enough rest just normal shot.otherwise every squad will hate you for it.
if you still pull aggro you should get a set of fists and use thoseb:victory0 -
Alliptica - Lost City wrote: »
and in pvp i got beat by a psychic 12 or more lvls below me wtf is that. maybe the tideborn is still overpowered.
try the difference in pvp against psy and duel you just need to find out how to duel them because they have a skill that reflects run away for the first coulpe of seconds use winged shell and stun them.0 -
Relakss - Harshlands wrote: »uhum..... it aint very skillfull for an archer to pull aggro it mostly happens when you spam skill just STA and thundershock is enough rest just normal shot.otherwise every squad will hate you for it.
if you still pull aggro you should get a set of fists and use thoseb:victory
I hope that post wasn't serious considering an archer attains their highest DPS (and aggro stealing potential) with... y'know... normal attacks. So skill spam would kinda lower your damage output and reduce how easily you gain aggro.0 -
I hope that post wasn't serious considering an archer attains their highest DPS (and aggro stealing potential) with... y'know... normal attacks. So skill spam would kinda lower your damage output and reduce how easily you gain aggro.
you will only shoot slower using skills but hit harder but you have a point best is just to use fists when having such a problemsb:laugh0 -
well.. coming from an 81 Barb I've never really found it hard to hold aggro unless the DD is much higher than me or (in the case of archers) stacks minus interval gear. I've had aggro ripped off me in TT runs by ColorPaper going demon spark fist-cher on me.
As my own archer, I'm pure dex and I stack +dex gears, and I'm using a sinister shooter refined +1. But thats really nothing entirely epic compared to what my own Barb has held aggro over. I even take my bless box off and shoot bosses without blazing arrow on, I STA up front and wait a bit before shooting, but still take aggro if the Barb doesnt FR enough. But.. I go in knowing it may happen, and my winged blessing is level 8 so I put it up and stop attacking as soon as I see the barb loose aggro. In the case of AoE bosses, I purposely position myself so that if I do jerk aggro hes not moving close to the squad placing them in AoE range (though on some bosses there is not staying outside aoe range, such as drums). I can take direct hits from farren and other bosses with winged shell up, then I just second wind.
Maybe its just me, but I don't find the archer class to be as squishy as most people seem to put it out to be. I actually feel safer taking hits as an archer than I did as a veno. And again, maybe its just me, but I was able to kill Virridis when I had him as a quest (at quest level) with just a cleric healing me.
edit: next goal for my archer is Bracers of Blood Moon, then Wind and the Clouds
*drools*0 -
Relakss - Harshlands wrote: »you will only shoot slower using skills but hit harder but you have a point best is just to use fists when having such a problemsb:laugh
Go learn ur class!!!
Its well known fact that archers best dps comes from normal attacks0 -
and quickshot procs
>.>
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Legerity: *drags you back* *stains your hands with said affair*
Elena Costel: Noooo... I don't want to have a dirty affair with Lady Legerity...
Qui: b:dirty0 -
On another note, PVE - as a DD we are very easy to be replaced by other DD classes or other higher level Archers. We do range damage, but so can all the other classes except a barb (by this I mean barbs don't do damage effectively with a bow like a bm/sin can). We are needed in squads for certain instances mainly for our 2 skills: STA and BoA, which are no longer that special because they can be replaced by other classes with similar skill effects or results. So, for something like FCC, BHs, and even Rebirth now - archers aren't really a requirement. And since we have difficulties tanking our own bosses we need for our quests (mainly at low level bosses/eg bosses), it can be very difficult to find a squad sometimes. Heck, a rude barb once kicked a lower level archer from a BH squad for a sin because he prefers a sin's buff. TBH, I don't find PVE as an eg archer that enjoyable as other classes now. Barb/Bm-they can tank well and are accepted into squads as tanks without skepticism, clerics-easy to find squads for anything, venos-can solo bosses/instances/solo grind just as good/better, for all the other DD classes-well they have it better in PVP too without much reliance on top eg gears as an archer would need.
Hm... I duno why but never had the issue of getting into squads...
While playing on my other chars I do have a pref for archers more rather than compared to wiz (let's say for bhs or rbs) if I got the option. They are kinda pain in the **** cause they steal agro more ._. but at the same time... I duno it just seems runs get done much faster with archers (not just cause of st)
Don't care of pvp.
I already steal more agro with fists than with my normal weap... & I only have the chest with -0.05int... Most of my bhs I just end up tanking myself (-69 twins, somehow didn't feel like trying)if you still pull aggro you should get a set of fists and use those[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
Quilue - Sanctuary wrote: »and quickshot procs
>.>
<.<
I doubt he thought about demon qs proc when he said that....0 -
Archers dont suck in pve at all if played right. Use common sense. I can tank up to fb89(exclude 69) with a mere 4592 hp. Yes I'm pure dex with low refined armor(+3/2) and 3 base vit. And i use a +5 soulsmasher. The key is timing and your genie. My genie is built perfectly for me imo. By 95 it'll be complete with all the skills i want. atm i have 2nd wind for hp holy path for speed wind dance for crit cloud eruption for chi and wind sheild for when im **** around. The latter will be replaced with absolute domain and wind dance will be replaced with ep. I'm not sure where the presumptions from people are coming from really. I suppose its harder to be a good archer then a regular archer. My advice? Make yourself stand out from other archers and others will prefer you for instances. I'm always asked for fcc or the like because i know how to play my class well. I hate dying so i made sure to utilize my skills the best i can and communicate with my squad. Often times if something bad happens im the one still left standing. Granted i do have a charm but most bosses can kill you quickly with one still. So like i previoulsy stated learn and utilize your class to its fullest potential. Don't accept death because youre an archer. Wings of grace/sheild/single sparks can be used it times of danger. Learn to time those. Learn to find common signs of a disaster that may come and respond appropiatly. Most people dont like being told what to do but it's for the greater good of the party to get the task done. And I by no means intend to incinuate that im a "pro" archer or the sort. Just that archers arent as gimped as people make them out to be.
On the pvp note i only prefer duels but once again it comes down to knowing your opponent's skills. Like common knowledge basically. maxed bm roar is 6sec stun sleep is 33 i believe cleric's plume sheild doesnt block lightning skills venos tend to purge when you pop sheild(then you can use spark or wings of grace) most classes dont think about alacrity barbs stuns have 4 sec cd sins try to stun and hold you in place psys try the stun selfbuff and most clerics/bms try to sleep/stun as their first move and so on. Of course i watch alot of pvp. But predicting and responding appropiatly is a key ingredient to success imo.
Happy gaming ^^[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero~0 -
Lu$t - Sanctuary wrote: »most classes dont think about alacrity barbs stuns have 4 sec cd /QUOTE]
I'll admit that pre 79 that whenever I dueled on my barb I would generally start off in true form and run up with alacrity, especially on clerics. Post 79 - I violent triumph especially against classes that are well known to stun off gate (BM, Archer, Cleric - and sometimes psychic). Indeed knowing your opponent and their skills/strategy well is key to success.0 -
EronKillstar - Dreamweaver wrote: »As my own archer, I'm pure dex and I stack +dex gears, and I'm using a sinister shooter refined +1. But thats really nothing entirely epic compared to what my own Barb has held aggro over.
*drools*
with a slingshot you prob will not aggro try a refined bow or crossbow i use a broadland atm +4 with perfect garnet shard i even pull aggro from lvl89 barbs that why i use fists after using STA and thunder. slingshot has low n fast attack is the best wep for not pulling aggro.0 -
Relakss - Harshlands wrote: »with a slingshot you prob will not aggro try a refined bow or crossbow i use a broadland atm +4 with perfect garnet shard i even pull aggro from lvl89 barbs that why i use fists after using STA and thunder. slingshot has low n fast attack is the best wep for not pulling aggro.
Yeah.... no.
Remember how archer DPS comes from normal attacks? Well, slingshots being fast allows for a higher DPS since you'll get more of those attacks in. Especially when -interval comes into play. So a good slingshot (Like, say, wind and the clouds) will pull aggro more easily than the other weapons around its level.
Why do you think fists are so insane for aggro? Sure they deal the lowest damage per hit out of all the BM weapon types, but they more than make up for it with the speed at which they hit.0 -
Lol, archers still suck /Thread0
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Lu$t - Sanctuary wrote: »Archers dont suck in pve at all if played right. Use common sense. I can tank up to fb89(exclude 69) with a mere 4592 hp. Yes I'm pure dex with low refined armor(+3/2) and 3 base vit. And i use a +5 soulsmasher. The key is timing and your genie. My genie is built perfectly for me imo. By 95 it'll be complete with all the skills i want. atm i have 2nd wind for hp holy path for speed wind dance for crit cloud eruption for chi and wind sheild for when im **** around. The latter will be replaced with absolute domain and wind dance will be replaced with ep. I'm not sure where the presumptions from people are coming from really. I suppose its harder to be a good archer then a regular archer. My advice? Make yourself stand out from other archers and others will prefer you for instances. I'm always asked for fcc or the like because i know how to play my class well. I hate dying so i made sure to utilize my skills the best i can and communicate with my squad. Often times if something bad happens im the one still left standing. Granted i do have a charm but most bosses can kill you quickly with one still. So like i previoulsy stated learn and utilize your class to its fullest potential. Don't accept death because youre an archer. Wings of grace/sheild/single sparks can be used it times of danger. Learn to time those. Learn to find common signs of a disaster that may come and respond appropiatly. Most people dont like being told what to do but it's for the greater good of the party to get the task done. And I by no means intend to incinuate that im a "pro" archer or the sort. Just that archers arent as gimped as people make them out to be.
On the pvp note i only prefer duels but once again it comes down to knowing your opponent's skills. Like common knowledge basically. maxed bm roar is 6sec stun sleep is 33 i believe cleric's plume sheild doesnt block lightning skills venos tend to purge when you pop sheild(then you can use spark or wings of grace) most classes dont think about alacrity barbs stuns have 4 sec cd sins try to stun and hold you in place psys try the stun selfbuff and most clerics/bms try to sleep/stun as their first move and so on. Of course i watch alot of pvp. But predicting and responding appropiatly is a key ingredient to success imo.
Happy gaming ^^
LOL dude... no one is saying that archers suck in pve, they are maybe the coolest class for pve, its the pvp we suck in.0
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