TW a joke ?

Thinkalot - Dreamweaver

Well, what's up with all the TW's lately ?

You see a message appearing : "xxx faction blahblah blah against yyy Faction...etc", the war starts and not even 2 minutes later it's over !

I've talked to some people doing TW's and they all say the same : "the opposing faction came in, rushed the attackers, bam, war over before we knew what was going on..."

On Dreamweaver it's really not funny anymore. You have low lvl factions (meaning with low lvl players) attacking the dominating faction(s) and they all get wiped out in a matter of (less then) 5 minutes. I think that is kinda normal oc, but considering the dominating factions throw everything they've got at the attacker it's also kind of overkill.

I wonder if it's really "fun" for those poor people going into a TW anymore. Seems all it's about is to gain cash and more cash for the Land owning factions.

I started to look at some of those "dominators" gear, and behold : Uber gear refined to an insane hight fully sharded with gems. I'm amazed they haven't all gotten warsoul weapons...

I was looking forward to doing TW's since it's the only fun pk you have outside of duels imo, but i'm not sure anymore. What's the point if all you can do is go up against Uber cashshoppers who forget it's all about the FUN ?

The developers messed up with the new Tideborns, they messed up with the BH system, some instances are increased in expense and difficulty, they messed up with the stupid packs, ...and now this.

By the time i'm really high enough to go to TW (with my other toon) it won't be worth it anymore, pay over 500K without counting towers just to last less then 5 minutes ?
Who the hell is stupid enough to pay a couple of mill for 5 minutes of fun ?

MANray_ - Sanctuary

I'm against the current TW status quo but don't understand your position. Do you expect dominant factions to "toy" with lowbies for a full hour? It's PvP, people holding back would mean more in the way of contempt and disrespect that people finishing a fight fast and efficiently.

Balthier - Dreamweaver

Its not all about ze cash

Its about being in a dedicated faction, with people dedicated to excel at TW, to learn and improve their strategies, to learn and improve teamwork, to get better with each loss. A couple of mill is not much divided on 80 people.

You can't expect to start a new faction and have one hour TWs. For many many weeks on Dreamweaver Calamity defeated Equinox in a matter of 10 mins, but they didn't give up. They learned and improved to the point where now Calamity and Equinox is having three hour TWs, where noone is certain on winning.

Sure, having good gear is important too, but in which game is it not important? Have patience and work on your toon and your gear. You will eventually reach a point where you can be a great part of the team without spending tons of real life cash. Sure, you might never be one of those people running around with +12 gear, but you know what, those people are only a few in an 80 people TW, and they cannot win alone.

So, you can either spend you time crying on the forums about not being all powerful, or you can concentrate on improving yourself, making friends, becoming part of a faction with the same goals as you and improve together as a team.

And anyway. Do you want us to "go easy" on a faction who is attacking us? When we have to defend our lands, we will do just that. We have worked long and hard to be as good as we are, I see no reason to be nice and cosy to someone attacking us, just because they are weaker. Victory have to be earned, not given. So go earn it

Thinkalot - Dreamweaver

My point of TW is this :

Attackers go in with lets say 20/30 people, half of which are BELOW lvl 80.
Defenders however go in with 30/40, MOST of which are above lvl 90 !

Not only are they overpowered, they're also outnumbered. As if the dominating faction dreads the thought of losing one (1) piece of land for a week.....pathetic. Instead of assessing the opposion, they go in FULL force, oblitirating the enemy and then say "good fight", yeah right.... If it werent for a couple of strong factions, the whole map would be dominated by one faction. As if they're not rich enough already.

So, when you KNOW you have such opposition, why go to TW at all since you'll be oblitirated just for the sake of cash ? Because that's the only thing the dominating faction(s) care about. And this is not only on dreamweaver.

A game battle can only be FUN if the 2 enemies are about equally strong and the fun lasts a bit longer then the 2 minutes it does now.

Btw, fyi : Calamity and Equinox = 2 hand on one belly. Several people on this server know for a fact they have been "co-working". Just ask some former members of Calamity.

MANray_ - Sanctuary

Using your logic this is actually the weaker faction's fault for placing a bid in the first place...

This is an MMO, if you want a "fair" fight get a console or try games that aren't based on character progression.

Jennalicious - Sanctuary

Come to Sanctuary, where all but three pieces of land are owned by Nefarious. Some factions do TW for the hell of it, while others are "hired" by the "dominant" faction to fake bid and intentionally lose.

RoidAbuse - Sanctuary

Jennalicious - Sanctuary wrote: »

Come to Sanctuary, where all but three pieces of land are owned by Nefarious. Some factions do TW for the hell of it, while others are "hired" by the "dominant" faction to fake bid and intentionally lose.

Assumptions assumptions.

@ OP, what do you suppose the dominant faction should do? Go in with 5 players instead of 30?

MANray_ - Sanctuary

RoidAbuse - Sanctuary wrote: »

Assumptions assumptions.

@ OP, what do you suppose the dominant faction should do? Go in with 5 players instead of 30?

Lol, aren't you guy that defends oracling?

I do agree on your comment to the OP. He obviously has no understanding of military strategy which is what TW is suposed to simulate... An irl general which did as he suggests would find himself relieved of command and facing treason charges in a martial court. And rightly so.

Balthier - Dreamweaver

Thinkalot - Dreamweaver wrote: »

My point of TW is this :

Attackers go in with lets say 20/30 people, half of which are BELOW lvl 80.
Defenders however go in with 30/40, MOST of which are above lvl 90 !

Not only are they overpowered, they're also outnumbered. As if the dominating faction dreads the thought of losing one (1) piece of land for a week.....pathetic. Instead of assessing the opposion, they go in FULL force, oblitirating the enemy and then say "good fight", yeah right.... If it werent for a couple of strong factions, the whole map would be dominated by one faction. As if they're not rich enough already.

So, when you KNOW you have such opposition, why go to TW at all since you'll be oblitirated just for the sake of cash ? Because that's the only thing the dominating faction(s) care about. And this is not only on dreamweaver.

A game battle can only be FUN if the 2 enemies are about equally strong and the fun lasts a bit longer then the 2 minutes it does now.

Btw, fyi : Calamity and Equinox = 2 hand on one belly. Several people on this server know for a fact they have been "co-working". Just ask some former members of Calamity.

Wow, I'm sorry to be blunt here, but this is just sad to read. So you think a dominant faction should just give away a land they have fought hard for? They weren't given the land you know, they actually won it, by fighting for it. I think you need to consider the history here, not just make a toon one day and after playing for a month or two think, why the hell do they own so much land, they should give me one too. (Yes, you probably have a high lvl alt, and have been playing for ages, which in that case would make it even more sad).

And your fyi is just hilarious Anyone with a slight bit of knowledge knows that this is most certainly not true. I've been in Calamity for around 11 months, I should think I know whats what. (Insert: Yes, but one time you agreed to not attack eachother, you are clearly teammates). And if you want to go there, be my guest love. Anyways, I fail to see what this statement has to do with anything other than an attempt to throw some dirt around. Are you saying Calamity is being "nice" to Equinox now, and that Equinox never got better in their TWs? Since that was what I was trying to point out to you, that they never gave up, and learned each week how to become better and stronger together

Asheera - Raging Tide

Balthier - Dreamweaver wrote: »

So, you can either spend you time crying on the forums about not being all powerful, or you can concentrate on improving yourself, making friends, becoming part of a faction with the same goals as you and improve together as a team.

That's what some people actually do, and they join the most powerful faction since nobody good and skilled wants to be in a losing faction. This is also why this most powerful faction, who started with same chances as the others, is now so dominating that pwns everything else. Well in some cases is more than 1 but only a few max.

I'm not talking about PWI only btw, I also played another game before where one guild was also so overpowered that nobody else stood chance against it even though this guild was actually even low in number of people compared to others.

The main problem is that in these type of games there is just too much power given out to people every day. So someone 'new' just can't stand a chance to compete. And what I find funny is that devs in these type of games, after seeing and realizing how on every server they got there is a faction that just pwns everything in its path, they still add patches and content to improve those even more while the others can't take advantage of it.

In that other game they were releasing more and more difficult content with better and uber drops, where only a few uber people could even set foot in (needed uber gear for that, yes PvE was hard in that game not like here :P). This of course made those uber ones even more uber while others weren't even ready to finish upgrading their equipment with an old instance's gear... that the uber ones were able to duo as fast as a full 'normal' party.


Well... if you just make the rich more rich, and the strong more powerful... with no chance for others to catch up at all... how you expect to have entertaining fights with the people who started playing much earlier than others? (or in case of f2p game, also people who spend tons of cash on it). I mean unless those people quit or take a break the gap between you and them will just become bigger and bigger every day.


I dunno if even those strong ones realize but this is a major problem. For the weak ones, it's no fun losing. For the strong ones, it's just boring. I mean where's the fun pwning everything? Just think of it: once you get all the map for yourself, you'll have no more TW at all. Is that fun? b:surrender

Fangxing - Heavens Tear

RoidAbuse - Sanctuary wrote: »

Assumptions assumptions.

@ OP, what do you suppose the dominant faction should do? Go in with 5 players instead of 30?

It is understandable that the purpose of the defending faction is to keep their territory since they worked hard for it. Therefore, it would not be fair if defense is crippled to make it "fair". Oh, oh, maybe make it a bit harder to for factions to just go in TW's so it won't be as emotionally detrimental to lower factions.

b:shutup

TigerLily - Lost City

People in a dominant faction normally has been playing the server for over a year, they worked hard for where they/and their faction are today. And not just by cash shopping, also by farming gear and money, team work, building up a strong faction and making strategys for TWs and lvling to 100+.

Than you get these lazy people, they start the game and play for a few months and than they want everything served without putting in any effort. They assume they should be able to TW since its an in game feature. But they haven't invested time in the game or in a faction, haven't invested in good gear and their chars sucks period, so of course they get zerged in 5 minutes. Than they complain and thinks GM should hand out free land and reset map b:sleep

People in lowbie guilds that looses in 5 minutes gets just what they deserve - thats getting totally **** on. You wont win TWs or getting to enjoy fun TWs either for that matter, unless your faction actually worked for it <.<

Does anyone think its fun for a dominating faction to go TW against some useless on-organized lowbies where half of them dont even have hp charms, carry pvp-pots and cant even fill the instance? Its not.

You really just wanna get it over with so you can go do something else thats actually challenging and fun. Being nice and letting the lowbies run around to get 1 shoot and spawn camped for 30 minutes inst really fun. Belive me ive been to enough of those non-factor wars where you decide to be nice so they get to see the inside of a TW and you give them 15-20 minutes to play around before you smash the crystal. It gets really really boring after a while.

Im all for changing the entire TW-system tho. It does get kinda boring when only 1-2 guilds own the map.

Ranfa - Dreamweaver

At least those factions are taking initiative to attack Calamity. I've never seen so many more factions jumping into the wagon in this server. Smaller factions divide and conquer (a.k.a. gank) but hey, some TW's are happening and I like it. Let's be optimistic.

Jennalicious - Sanctuary

RoidAbuse - Sanctuary wrote: »

Assumptions assumptions.

@ OP, what do you suppose the dominant faction should do? Go in with 5 players instead of 30?

LOL, you must be from Nef. Plus, it's not assumptions. The "dominant" faction on Sanctuary makes it quite obvious.

RoidAbuse - Sanctuary

Jennalicious - Sanctuary wrote: »

LOL, you must be from Nef. Plus, it's not assumptions. The "dominant" faction on Sanctuary makes it quite obvious.

I'm from RedRaidrs thank you very much. How did they make it obvious? Is it that they're getting ganked by three powerful factions week after week? If they're "hiring" to stop the ganking, it didn't work now did it? Or are you talking about Nef hiring no name factions to bid on Nef? What for? Wasting coins for fun and possibly risking ban?

Balthier - Dreamweaver

Many good points here, and Id hope the thread starter have gotten some reasons to rethink his complaints

To Asheera: I agree, some possibilities for newer players to get to a competitive level (not just talking exp here) would not be too bad. PWI however have alot of implements for this. With the easiness of gaining exp now, getting to level 90 is not such a hard task. A bigger problem is getting enough money to get gear that is competitive too, but since this is a f2p game, they kind of relay on getting income from the cash-shop, so spending real life cash is about the only way of accumulating alot of coins fast. You can always merchant, or run a few TTs each time you log on, and still get a pretty nice cashflow going.

To TigerLily: I wouldn't mind a few changes to the TW system myself, as of now I'm not sure which changes that should be though.

Knownase - Heavens Tear

TW is just competition.....

Yea, its totally unfair to the lowbies trying out TW. Most land owning factions tend to finish off the minor fights in 5 - 10 mins.


TW is personally just a feature, its up to you to use it. Its not like you are completely need TW acting like you will die if you participate in it.


Its all fun and games, and like sports, its fun and competitive. Yea, you will have the QQers and such saying otherwise.


The way I see it, its going to stagnate in the next few months.


Edit: This thread is gonna be locked for TW Drama! >:/

Airyll - Dreamweaver

All I see from the OP is... "QQQQ LEAVE THE LITTLE FACTIONS ALOOOOOONE!!! QQQQ!"

Seriously now.

You're telling us that a little faction bids on a higher, bigger, better faction's territory [fully aware of just how powerful they are] and get streamrolled in less than five minutes...

... and this somehow isn't fair?

You have a very, very twisted way of thinking, don't you? Somebody does something, probably very aware that they're not going to win, and it's not fair? Seriously, OP, sort yourself out and straighten out this awful logic you carry. If you want longer TWs, go do what Equinox did:

Go form a faction, full of people willing to lose the first five hundred tries, so that by the time TW five hundred and one comes along, the TW time has gone from a two minute steamroll into a three hour stalemate.

Oh wait, I'm sorry, that initially starts off with small TWs that get steamrolled, too. Guess you're never going to be happy.

Whatever happened to common sense?

Knownase - Heavens Tear

Airyll - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Whatever happened to common sense?

It died a very long time ago.
b:cry

DeathBanana - Heavens Tear

This thread made me lol. GJ.

Alliptica - Raging Tide

tw is not fun unless your on the winning team. its depresssing going in there, get rolled by 5 people, then its over in 5 minutes. i even been in a tw once that lasted 3 hours. that wasnt fing fun bcuz it was 1am and i was fing tired!

Pressa - Heavens Tear

Alliptica - Raging Tide wrote: »

tw is not fun unless your on the winning team. its depresssing going in there, get rolled by 5 people, then its over in 5 minutes. i even been in a tw once that lasted 3 hours. that wasnt fing fun bcuz it was 1am and i was fing tired!

just because you lose doesn't mean its not fun. Small fights are pests the logic behind them bidding on bigger factions is flimsy at best. The only reason I have found to continue to bid is to gather members to help the faction.Its no fun to be rolled in 5 mins? You have two choices make it fun or don't do it.Thats all there is to it

Duke_Atticus - Sanctuary

I have never participated in TW, but am looking to join it in the future. Still, I don't think they should reset map just for new people.

But it'd be nice if they had a level range based instance for mass PvP where outcome isn't a piece of land or some such but just for fun. I don't know how game programming and all that work, but if it's possible to make level based instances for Rebirth, then maybe the same can be said for mass PvP?

Escorian - Dreamweaver

ok here is the deal you small factions bid on Calamity knowing the Strength of the Faction knowing full well that there was a huge chance they would dominate you, you also bid on Calamity knowing that Dynasty has land and none were bid on besides the one by Calamity.

if you were that concerned about winning a tw why did you not try for the weakest of top 1/3 factions instead of attacking the top faction on the server?

GalenNn - Lost City

All i can say to this since i personally dont know much about TW why challenge such a big faction its like a 30-40 faction challenging Conquerer (100+) What is the point you know you will lose but is it for the fun of being steamrolled and used to mop the land that the faction keeps? or is it just fun? i have no clue on the subject really but its just my opinion here

Jennalicious - Sanctuary

RoidAbuse - Sanctuary wrote: »

I'm from RedRaidrs thank you very much. How did they make it obvious? Is it that they're getting ganked by three powerful factions week after week? If they're "hiring" to stop the ganking, it didn't work now did it? Or are you talking about Nef hiring no name factions to bid on Nef? What for? Wasting coins for fun and possibly risking ban?

Oh, sorry, my mistake. I'm not saying anything against Nef as that would be naming and shaming. What I am saying is that the most dominant TW faction on our server does hire no name factions to bid on their territory so they can get an easy win and focus more on the real competition. Most of the server knows that they do this. The ones who say they don't are either with them, do it themselves, are part of the no name factions, or are very naive as to what is going on around them. They won't get banned for it because it is hard to prove, but that doesn't mean that it doesn't happen.

Now, speaking of Nef. They don't get ganked by 3 powerful factions week after week. The only faction that is remotely on their level is Regicide. The only way any other faction can take land from them is if Nef is involved in multiple TW's at the time, they send a small part of their faction to fight the weaker faction and the weaker faction gets lucky.

RoidAbuse - Sanctuary

Jennalicious - Sanctuary wrote: »

Oh, sorry, my mistake. I'm not saying anything against Nef as that would be naming and shaming. What I am saying is that the most dominant TW faction on our server does hire no name factions to bid on their territory so they can get an easy win and focus more on the real competition. Most of the server knows that they do this. The ones who say they don't are either with them, do it themselves, are part of the no name factions, or are very naive as to what is going on around them. They won't get banned for it because it is hard to prove, but that doesn't mean that it doesn't happen.

Now, speaking of Nef. They don't get ganked by 3 powerful factions week after week. The only faction that is remotely on their level is Regicide. The only way any other faction can take land from them is if Nef is involved in multiple TW's at the time, they send a small part of their faction to fight the weaker faction and the weaker faction gets lucky.

Why would they need to "hire" no name factions when they are able to defend their land from 3 way attacks from the current three factions with the most power? And they've been defending their land from 3 way attacks from current top factions for a while now. No faction can stand against them in a 1 vs 1, there's no need for them to waste coins to "hire" factions to attack them. That tactic is only used by faction trying to **** up time slots and that hasn't been happening.

All factions are easy win for them in a 1 vs 1. No need to "hire" factions for an easy win when legitimate factions are already easy wins.

I really hate assumptions. In fact, RedRaidrs and Enel were accused of being hired by Nef to bid on them at one time but it's obviously false as you can see. So, get your facts straight before you accuse another faction.

Jennalicious - Sanctuary

RoidAbuse - Sanctuary wrote: »

Why would they need to "hire" no name factions when they are able to defend their land from 3 way attacks from the current three factions with the most power? And they've been defending their land from 3 way attacks from current top factions for a while now. No faction can stand against them in a 1 vs 1, there's no need for them to waste coins to "hire" factions to attack them. That tactic is only used by faction trying to **** up time slots and that hasn't been happening.

All factions are easy win for them in a 1 vs 1. No need to "hire" factions for an easy win when legitimate factions are already easy wins.

I really hate assumptions. In fact, RedRaidrs and Enel were accused of being hired by Nef to bid on them at one time but it's obviously false as you can see. So, get your facts straight before you accuse another faction.

They're not assumptions, they're facts, and my facts are straight. You're obviously one of the naive ones who just can't see what actually goes on around you. There's really no point in continuing this. You're only seeing things your way, when you can't even see obvious events going on around you that a toddler could detect. Next time, remove your head from your sphincter before you type something, and make sure is also has some relevance to it.

Shiga - Sanctuary

Jennalicious - Sanctuary wrote: »

They're not assumptions, they're facts, and my facts are straight. You're obviously one of the naive ones who just can't see what actually goes on around you. There's really no point in continuing this. You're only seeing things your way, when you can't even see obvious events going on around you that a toddler could detect. Next time, remove your head from your sphincter before you type something, and make sure is also has some relevance to it.

Fact =/ Opinion and unless you have some sort of proof that this is happening (other than everyone knows it), I would suggest you either put up evidence or admit that in your OPINION they are cheating.

Shoshoni - Sanctuary

Jennalicious - Sanctuary wrote: »

They're not assumptions, they're facts, and my facts are straight. You're obviously one of the naive ones who just can't see what actually goes on around you. There's really no point in continuing this. You're only seeing things your way, when you can't even see obvious events going on around you that a toddler could detect. Next time, remove your head from your sphincter before you type something, and make sure is also has some relevance to it.

Back when Saitada was in Nef, this wasn't the case although they did get accused of it when Soviet attacked them even though Soviet was a level 3 faction in their own right, that was also a land holder at the time. They got accused of it because the Former leader of Soviet left and joined Nef. (or had been, it has been a bit since then, I don't remember the particulars exactly, as I really didn't care either way.)

With the new leader of Nef, who knows, but I know the core group of player/members of Nef wouldn't have stood for it.

RoidAbuse - Sanctuary

Shoshoni - Sanctuary wrote: »

Back when Saitada was in Nef, this wasn't the case although they did get accused of it when Soviet attacked them even though Soviet was a level 3 faction in their own right, that was also a land holder at the time. They got accused of it because the Former leader of Soviet left and joined Nef. (or had been, it has been a bit since then, I don't remember the particulars exactly, as I really didn't care either way.)

With the new leader of Nef, who knows, but I know the core group of player/members of Nef wouldn't have stood for it.

I remember that. An ex-leader of Nef was banned for fake bidding a long time ago but I don't see any point of them doing that now as they've been quite successful in fending off attackers.