Assassins...not as squishy as I thought.

Hisuna - Sanctuary
Hisuna - Sanctuary Posts: 1,071 Arc User
edited December 2009 in Assassin
After getting the mass of new skills after level 29, I notice that my assassin is becoming increasingly adept at avoiding damage.

In particular, this combination has allowed me to barely take any damage at all when fighting mobs:

Start in stealth, use rib strike, puncture wound, deep sting.

run back a bit, use knife throw, shadow jump and slipstream strike to finish it. This is the combination I usually use to deal with inc def and inc life mobs. I also used it when I fought faarng, although it did not kill him (of course) so I had to kite him.


What have your experiences been like? Do you find your assassin getting less squishy as you level? Or do you use as much charm/pots as you always have?
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
The family is a haven in a heartless world.
Once a Guardian, Always a Guardian. Element: Fire.
Post edited by Hisuna - Sanctuary on
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Comments

  • Sralyn - Dreamweaver
    Sralyn - Dreamweaver Posts: 164 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    Yeah, Asses definitely get less "squishy" later on when they get their more important skills, and start leveling up their important buffs.

    Rib strike reducing the times they get hit
    Tackling Slash completely freezing the enemy (which can be combined with knife throw, puncture wound, or some other skills that have a range on them) to keep you from getting hit from pure phys mobs at all
    Increased "evasion" from Focused Mind
    Deaden Nerves so you don't actually die when you die
    Shadow Escape for if things get particularly nasty and you don't think you can keep up with it
    Blood Paint helping you basically reduce the damage you take by slowly healing yourself with each hit
    etc.
    etc.
    etc.

    All that on top of our high crit rate as we level, helping us take out mobs much faster than we normally would.

    Quite honestly, I'm getting addicted to my Assassin. b:surrender
    We are not your slaves,
    We are not your babysitters,
    We are not your personal med-pack,
    We are Clerics, god dammit,
    And if your death means the survival of the squad as a whole,
    Well...I'll see you in hell...
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • emoretrospective
    emoretrospective Posts: 1 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    After getting the mass of new skills after level 29, I notice that my assassin is becoming increasingly adept at avoiding damage.

    In particular, this combination has allowed me to barely take any damage at all when fighting mobs:

    Start in stealth, use rib strike, puncture wound, deep sting.

    run back a bit, use knife throw, shadow jump and slipstream strike to finish it. This is the combination I usually use to deal with inc def and inc life mobs. I also used it when I fought faarng, although it did not kill him (of course) so I had to kite him.


    What have your experiences been like? Do you find your assassin getting less squishy as you level? Or do you use as much charm/pots as you always have?
    yea i have noticed that except in order to get maximum effect out of all these skills u have to buy a crapload of mp pots. i suggest life powders too since bloodpaint only gives back 2%
  • Hisuna - Sanctuary
    Hisuna - Sanctuary Posts: 1,071 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    yea i have noticed that except in order to get maximum effect out of all these skills u have to buy a crapload of mp pots. i suggest life powders too since bloodpaint only gives back 2%

    I think charms may actually be less expensive for an assassin though. Honestly the only skills that takes a ton of mp are the stealth ones, and the assassin doesn't have a super huge amount of mp, so the ticks are pretty light. I haven't even gone through 50k of a charm in 20 levels. Sure charms are expensive, but if I calculated all the mp potions I would buy in place of one over the life of the entire charm, I think the pots would be more. Of course I am only talking about mp charms, not hp.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    The family is a haven in a heartless world.
    Once a Guardian, Always a Guardian. Element: Fire.
  • Shade - Raging Tide
    Shade - Raging Tide Posts: 61 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    I don't know how it will be with other people's play styles, but once you hit 50 or 60 and get a nice weapon (stash 50 or tt 60), you'll more than likely be burning mp far more than hp. Yesterday before I went on a questing spree in Swamp of the Wraiths I had around 500 or 600k mp charm and about 600k hp charm left, and after about 3 hours of questing and tons of quests done, I used all but 13k of my mp charm, but only about 250k hp charm, and that is with no powders, and only an occasional hp pot. So while you are likely to be very hp charm dependent early on, you'll be burning the mp later, at least in my experience (I use chill of the deep on trash mobs since they don't last long enough to spark on each one and reg attack) Keep in mind I do have the level 69 molded dagger, and it's +6 and has two flawless garnets, so results may vary.
  • Hisuna - Sanctuary
    Hisuna - Sanctuary Posts: 1,071 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    I don't know how it will be with other people's play styles, but once you hit 50 or 60 and get a nice weapon (stash 50 or tt 60), you'll more than likely be burning mp far more than hp. Yesterday before I went on a questing spree in Swamp of the Wraiths I had around 500 or 600k mp charm and about 600k hp charm left, and after about 3 hours of questing and tons of quests done, I used all but 13k of my mp charm, but only about 250k hp charm, and that is with no powders, and only an occasional hp pot. So while you are likely to be very hp charm dependent early on, you'll be burning the mp later, at least in my experience (I use chill of the deep on trash mobs since they don't last long enough to spark on each one and reg attack) Keep in mind I do have the level 69 molded dagger, and it's +6 and has two flawless garnets, so results may vary.

    I can't say too much about this given my limited knowledge of the assassin...but it is a bit hard for me to believe I would burn 500K+ of an mp charm in 3 hours..or even 250k+ of an hp charm for that matter.

    Also, in case anyone gets the notion to say something like, "well you're a veno, of course you don't use much charm"....This is not my only character, and I haven't played a class yet that I used up charms at that rate.

    I could see maybe a barb during Rebirth or a barb or bm on an aoe grind with no cleric maybe...I have never played a barb...

    If assassins seriously use that much mp at later levels, it could really kill the experience for me...I just don't see that happening.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    The family is a haven in a heartless world.
    Once a Guardian, Always a Guardian. Element: Fire.
  • Shade - Raging Tide
    Shade - Raging Tide Posts: 61 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    I can't say too much about this given my limited knowledge of the assassin...but it is a bit hard for me to believe I would burn 500K+ of an mp charm in 3 hours..or even 250k+ of an hp charm for that matter.

    Also, in case anyone gets the notion to say something like, "well you're a veno, of course you don't use much charm"....This is not my only character, and I haven't played a class yet that I used up charms at that rate.

    I could see maybe a barb during Rebirth or a barb or bm on an aoe grind with no cleric maybe...I have never played a barb...

    If assassins seriously use that much mp at later levels, it could really kill the experience for me...I just don't see that happening.

    Well it could very well just be my play style, and I may have underestimated the time I spent out there, there was a very interesting vent convo at the time so the time and quests flew by XD But seriously, when you get your two spark skills, and can figure out a good rotation to use them every 30 secs, you'll be burning the mp, not to mention if you go chill of the deep skill spamming on all the mobs. I also have been known to use excessive force, and also to attack multiple mobs at once so meh. Not to mention those pesky areas of the swamp where you do half damage cause of the water. Also keep in mind while I did this I burned through a good 10-15 quests, so yeah...

    Also this is nothing compared to a good BM aoe grind, I was burning full gold hp charms on my bm every couple hours on NS solo, though I made twice the coin in drops alone that the charms cost XD
  • Twsted - Raging Tide
    Twsted - Raging Tide Posts: 135 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    I can't say too much about this given my limited knowledge of the assassin...but it is a bit hard for me to believe I would burn 500K+ of an mp charm in 3 hours..or even 250k+ of an hp charm for that matter.

    Also, in case anyone gets the notion to say something like, "well you're a veno, of course you don't use much charm"....This is not my only character, and I haven't played a class yet that I used up charms at that rate.

    I could see maybe a barb during Rebirth or a barb or bm on an aoe grind with no cleric maybe...I have never played a barb...

    If assassins seriously use that much mp at later levels, it could really kill the experience for me...I just don't see that happening.
    id aagree with her here. i have both mp and hp charms and after a week my hp charm has 30k left on it while my mp charm isnt even halfway used even though i spam skills on every mob
    is it jus me or does every thread turn into a flame thread at some point? wheres the love?? b:cry
    WTF is a gank? -_- its called pvp
  • threepointone
    threepointone Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    Yeah, Asses definitely get less "squishy" later on b:surrender

    b:chuckle b:cute
  • Kristoph - Lost City
    Kristoph - Lost City Posts: 2,016 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    Skill spamming while grinding/questing is pointless on most things anyway... get some interval gear. And you can spark like twice every three mobs, which does a lot more for melee damage output than it does for skill spamming. I rather spend no mp and take 1 second longer. Depending on how you chain your skills it might even be slower than meleeing because of the difference in range causing delay.
    Wondering how much longer these **** packs are going to be around.
  • rikako
    rikako Posts: 340 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    ^ correct
    with interval gear my sin still kills way faster with normal hits than with skills.. (note skills are all on their highest level!)
  • Ballistixz - Heavens Tear
    Ballistixz - Heavens Tear Posts: 690 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    Skill spamming while grinding/questing is pointless on most things anyway... get some interval gear. And you can spark like twice every three mobs, which does a lot more for melee damage output than it does for skill spamming. I rather spend no mp and take 1 second longer. Depending on how you chain your skills it might even be slower than meleeing because of the difference in range causing delay.

    u forgeting alot of our skills gain chi when they atk. with just tackling slash alone i can get a spark ever mob with skill spamming. dont even need to mention rising dragon strike. so if its sparks ur looking for skill spamming wont be at all when u want to get some chi/sparks. it might even work out better then melee that way. and alot of our main atk skills dont use chi anyway.
  • Periculosul - Raging Tide
    Periculosul - Raging Tide Posts: 16 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    I dont have any problems with my assassin . He hits fast and lots critical every time .I just activate my critical buff and hit normal ..and mobs go down prety fast
  • Kristoph - Lost City
    Kristoph - Lost City Posts: 2,016 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    u forgeting alot of our skills gain chi when they atk. with just tackling slash alone i can get a spark ever mob with skill spamming. dont even need to mention rising dragon strike. so if its sparks ur looking for skill spamming wont be at all when u want to get some chi/sparks. it might even work out better then melee that way. and alot of our main atk skills dont use chi anyway.
    Can you read? If you spark, melee > skill spamming.
    Wondering how much longer these **** packs are going to be around.
  • Arron - Dreamweaver
    Arron - Dreamweaver Posts: 237 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    yea i have noticed that except in order to get maximum effect out of all these skills u have to buy a crapload of mp pots. i suggest life powders too since bloodpaint only gives back 2%

    lol for late quote.

    Life Powder is okay, but Bloodpaint gets good in the 40's with a good dagger. atm i absorb about 20 a hit and 50-60 with skills. Its a nice skill.
    "Closing this for excess letter Q's" - hawk
  • Phoenix - Dreamweaver
    Phoenix - Dreamweaver Posts: 237 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    Once you hit 59 and get Advanced Spark (which you can use on 4/5 mobs you fight, easily), Bloodpaint starts absorbing 30+ health with each hit, and monsters die before they get off more than 3 attacks.

    I'm not very fond of stealthing before attacking a mob. It tends to regen the damage I dealt to it before I hit it again.
  • Shade - Raging Tide
    Shade - Raging Tide Posts: 61 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    Skill spamming while grinding/questing is pointless on most things anyway... get some interval gear. And you can spark like twice every three mobs, which does a lot more for melee damage output than it does for skill spamming. I rather spend no mp and take 1 second longer. Depending on how you chain your skills it might even be slower than meleeing because of the difference in range causing delay.

    And yet if you get yourself maxed chill of the deep and use it, that is an additional 30% damage (because of the +30 attack level from it) done to mobs (at the cost of attack speed), and when you start doing 5k damage on skills then that's a fair amount of extra damage, not to mention when you crit. Now obviously if you stack copious amounts of -interval gear then yeah, it's all gravy, but until you get at least -.2 it isn't worth it for trash mobs you can kill in 3-4 hits anyway without a spark. Of course if you're DDing something that might live for awhile, then yes speed DD is better than skill DD.
  • rikako
    rikako Posts: 340 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    i do 5k~8k normal hit crit so dont need any useless attack level, the delay between skill attacks is just way too high in assassin to make it usefull in pve

    assassin has really trashy skills, beside earth rift, all other attacks are simple 100% + some high number which doesnt really matter, assassin needs attacks that give high weapon attack as in 200% + some number or 300% + some number to outdo normal skillless hitting.
  • shadowvzs87
    shadowvzs87 Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    rikako wrote: »
    i do 5k~8k normal hit crit so dont need any useless attack level, the delay between skill attacks is just way too high in assassin to make it usefull in pve

    assassin has really trashy skills, beside earth rift, all other attacks are simple 100% + some high number which doesnt really matter, assassin needs attacks that give high weapon attack as in 200% + some number or 300% + some number to outdo normal skillless hitting.

    u jokeing? archer dont have 200% exclude lv59 ulti what have 3sec intreval and charged blast what dont have addon only 300%eq and **** long chargeing time, then u want 200/300%eq dmg skills? With 30%dmg u are already do similiar dmg than spear...
  • Shade - Raging Tide
    Shade - Raging Tide Posts: 61 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    rikako wrote: »
    i do 5k~8k normal hit crit so dont need any useless attack level, the delay between skill attacks is just way too high in assassin to make it usefull in pve

    assassin has really trashy skills, beside earth rift, all other attacks are simple 100% + some high number which doesnt really matter, assassin needs attacks that give high weapon attack as in 200% + some number or 300% + some number to outdo normal skillless hitting.

    Good story man, to get those kinds of reg attacks, sparked or not, you'd have to be ridiculously high level, and/or have a +8 or better dagger, cause even with double spark with a +6 level 69 dagger, I wasn't pulling much more than 3.5k reg hits double sparked, and I don't think I was even getting that high. As for skills, have you actually leveled them up and used them? I doubt it because if you did you would be singing a different tune. Also, how is attack level useless? At max, chill of the deep adds 30% more damage to anything you do, so with skills you do some good damage, and that **** aoe earthen rift almost becomes usable. It's not all about the +XXX% weapon damage, the added number damage does more than that more often than not, at least until you get higher refines.
  • rikako
    rikako Posts: 340 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    yea totally unbelieveable that you do 3.5k regular in spark and i 5k in crit lol l2r

    yea sure headhunt on 6 deals ridiculous 16~20k crit on mobs and cost me 2 spark on a high refined dagger, while a cleric same lvl hits about 40k+ with ultimate lmao

    Guess why bm and other melee suck compared to mage? correct no high % weapon attack. S > 400% + 10k ****? Guess why archer sucks end game? lol.

    30 attack level or not, good attack interval plus spark > any skill they have, you obivously havent played or just oracled all the way.

    btw rib strike dealing 12k crit and my reg hits deal same if not higher dmg in the time frame (-attack level since thats slowing down attack speed.) is totally unbelieveable..

    only hope left for sin is that their demon skills add higher % weapon attack or the 30 attack level skill wont take any attack speed, if that wont happen, sin are as useful as a dead cow.
  • shadowvzs87
    shadowvzs87 Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    rikako wrote: »
    yea totally unbelieveable that you do 3.5k regular in spark and i 5k in crit lol l2r

    yea sure headhunt on 6 deals ridiculous 16~20k crit on mobs and cost me 2 spark on a high refined dagger, while a cleric same lvl hits about 40k+ with ultimate lmao

    Guess why bm and other melee suck compared to mage? correct no high % weapon attack. S > 400% + 10k ****? Guess why archer sucks end game? lol.

    30 attack level or not, good attack interval plus spark > any skill they have, you obivously havent played or just oracled all the way.

    btw rib strike dealing 12k crit and my reg hits deal same if not higher dmg in the time frame (-attack level since thats slowing down attack speed.) is totally unbelieveable..

    only hope left for sin is that their demon skills add higher % weapon attack or the 30 attack level skill wont take any attack speed, if that wont happen, sin are as useful as a dead cow.

    attack lv is for skill spam in pk not for normal attack. Skill spam with 3rd spark with att lv and crit buff will be hard dmg.

    idk why u talk ****..
    Archer suck? Seriously? I never noticed that,maybe because i am not 3month =lv99 archer who know how can lv up fast but at high lv he dont know how to use his class. Uber bs what u said ;)
  • rikako
    rikako Posts: 340 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    demon spark wont work unless you gangbang as you are probably some ganger anyways since people will just fly away and laugh you out (sell > anti debuff skills)

    assassins lack any usefull ranged attack so their inferior compared to bm and barb, addionally the attack cooldown between their skills is to big to kill any decent geared person, hard to get facts right?
  • Phoenix - Dreamweaver
    Phoenix - Dreamweaver Posts: 237 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    addionally the attack cooldown between their skills is to big to kill any decent geared person, hard to get facts right?

    Hahaha, yeah, I remember when people used to say that about Fist BMs.

    And now we use them to solo Cata Barbs.
  • rikako
    rikako Posts: 340 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    and i said skills and not hits :)

    also i said with attack interval you will do way better
  • Deceptistar - Sanctuary
    Deceptistar - Sanctuary Posts: 10,454 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    Good story man, to get those kinds of reg attacks, sparked or not, you'd have to be ridiculously high level, and/or have a +8 or better dagger, cause even with double spark with a +6 level 69 dagger, I wasn't pulling much more than 3.5k reg hits double sparked, and I don't think I was even getting that high. As for skills, have you actually leveled them up and used them? I doubt it because if you did you would be singing a different tune. Also, how is attack level useless? At max, chill of the deep adds 30% more damage to anything you do, so with skills you do some good damage, and that **** aoe earthen rift almost becomes usable. It's not all about the +XXX% weapon damage, the added number damage does more than that more often than not, at least until you get higher refines.
    i think hes just over exaggerating, hoping another sin would agree with him. I personally too dont think its that high at least from looking at my sin with pure dex and average gear +3ed. Damage over a period of time is a diff. story tho.
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  • Shade - Raging Tide
    Shade - Raging Tide Posts: 61 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    rikako wrote: »
    yea totally unbelieveable that you do 3.5k regular in spark and i 5k in crit lol l2r

    I actually misread your original post, thought you said you were pulling 5k reg hits not crits, I can believe 5k crits just fine.

    In the end though, unless you stack a decent amount of interval gear, I honestly think CotD is better than reg attacking, at least on trash mobs (anything that doesn't live at least as long as you stay sparked) Obviously on bosses and such in pve speed DD is generally better, interval gear or not.

    As for your comment on triple sparking, you are aware that you can spark while stealthed and still be stealthed right? That way, at least in the case of pvp (since you really don't need to stealth in pve), you can effectively use any spark and not worry about the enemy running because of it, unless they are high enough level to see you in stealth anyway. Also don't forget tackling slash immobilizes.

    Slightly off topic now, speaking of tackling slash, does anyone know if a wiz can distance shrink while immobilized? I know sins can shadow jump while immobilized which is why I ask.
  • threepointone
    threepointone Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    And now we use them to solo Cata Barbs.

    I can has SS pl0x :D
  • Lusca - Sanctuary
    Lusca - Sanctuary Posts: 754 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    I actually misread your original post, thought you said you were pulling 5k reg hits not crits, I can believe 5k crits just fine.

    In the end though, unless you stack a decent amount of interval gear, I honestly think CotD is better than reg attacking, at least on trash mobs (anything that doesn't live at least as long as you stay sparked) Obviously on bosses and such in pve speed DD is generally better, interval gear or not.

    As for your comment on triple sparking, you are aware that you can spark while stealthed and still be stealthed right? That way, at least in the case of pvp (since you really don't need to stealth in pve), you can effectively use any spark and not worry about the enemy running because of it, unless they are high enough level to see you in stealth anyway. Also don't forget tackling slash immobilizes.

    Slightly off topic now, speaking of tackling slash, does anyone know if a wiz can distance shrink while immobilized? I know sins can shadow jump while immobilized which is why I ask.


    um when i use to play my wizzie i could shrink while immobilized but i couldn't turn before shrinking, but that was awhile and i too lazy to go check =x
  • Shade - Raging Tide
    Shade - Raging Tide Posts: 61 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    um when i use to play my wizzie i could shrink while immobilized but i couldn't turn before shrinking, but that was awhile and i too lazy to go check =x

    K good info to know...
  • threepointone
    threepointone Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    um when i use to play my wizzie i could shrink while immobilized but i couldn't turn before shrinking, but that was awhile and i too lazy to go check =x

    I have used Distance Shrink while I was immobilised.