Player Greed?
Comments
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Tojop - Dreamweaver wrote: »I would just like to say, the value of an item is the price it is sold for. If I sell something for 5m, and you tell me that the item is not worth 5m....
Well, obviously, IT IS.
True. I'd like to see someone who sells molds and TT mats to other players at NPC prices lol
There is no ''Real value'', it's in constant fluctuation depending on the amount of coins in circulation and the rarity of each item.
As long as someone somewhere is willing to pay the price...0 -
Wrong. Not the price people "have to" pay to get it. It's the price people "DO" pay to get it. You have missed my point entirely.
The fact that something is bought and sold for 5m SETS THE PRICE at 5m. If it happens often enough, that price becomes stable. If you don't think an all class pet is worth 5m, don't pay 5m for it. I would agree with you, I think they're dumb. They're still worth 5m.
And Zoe, I thought you knew better. You use "greedy" with an awfully negative connotation. Why?0 -
Hunter_PT - Heavens Tear wrote: »doesnt mean that its worth it, just means thats the price people have to pay to get it.
If someone is willing to pay lots of coins for something, well obviously it was worth it for them, otherwise they would not buy it. If YOU think it's not worth it, just don't buy it. I don't see a problem here...0 -
k this is my first post. My view is that the economy in PW is becoming stagnant. however we have to move past the greed and look for a purer economic system.
for starters lets ignore catshops and ****** merchants capitalism says if noone buys or sells to them theyll give up. 2 i propose we set up a kind of brand that ppl can use to sell with like a badge of best price. at the center is a council that takes reports and kicks and accepts members based on reputation for selling and buying fairly, a thought anyone want to fine tune this?0 -
Lericah - Lost City wrote: »k this is my first post. My view is that the economy in PW is becoming stagnant. however we have to move past the greed and look for a purer economic system.
for starters lets ignore catshops and ****** merchants capitalism says if noone buys or sells to them theyll give up. 2 i propose we set up a kind of brand that ppl can use to sell with like a badge of best price. at the center is a council that takes reports and kicks and accepts members based on reputation for selling and buying fairly, a thought anyone want to fine tune this?
You do realise that even if you manage to gather trust worthy members, with everyday low low prices... Some people will still complain about something. I know lots of people who hate Wallmart in real life... lol
Nonetheless, I think it'S a good idea. Some catshops have already done that however, in sanctuary anyway. Same catshops, everyday, always full of what they are selling, almost online 24/7. If they manage to get enough regular costumers, they can afford to lower the prices a lot.0 -
My cat-shop (well, my alt character's shop, actually) almost always has the very lowest price on whatever I'm selling. I have no qualms about under-bidding the competition.Lericah - Lost City wrote: »for starters lets ignore catshops and ****** merchants capitalism says if noone buys or sells to them theyll give up. 2 i propose we set up a kind of brand that ppl can use to sell with like a badge of best price. at the center is a council that takes reports and kicks and accepts members based on reputation for selling and buying fairly, a thought anyone want to fine tune this?
Not only that, but you know what I do when I offer to buy? Yup, that's right, I offer to pay more than anybody else. Why? Because my selling prices are the lowest, meaning I sell more, meaning I need more inventory, meaning I'm willing to pay the most to get it.
The result is that your carefully selected group of do-gooders wouldn't be able to beat my prices. You'd have people complaining that your group of "fair-trade approved" merchants were offering rip-off prices compared to mine.
And what motivates me to give producers the highest pay for their work, and to offer buyers the lowest prices on their purchases? Why, greed, of course, because I make the most money that way.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
PWI Merchanting Guides: warrenwolfy.wordpress.com0 -
Fail thread.... beeching about the prices is fail... deal wiv it yob:victoryATTENTION ALL: I would just like you to know....I has fleas.0
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Yeh, Lericah has good intentions, but is grasping at straws. Problem with economy is not "player greed," that's actually what drives it.
First problem is chest of coins, which sets the minimum price in gold of a perfect iron hammer as benchmark for gold prices in game. 1 hammer = 1m coins. 5g hammer = 200k coins, with room for upward growth (obviously).
In order to lower gold prices, GMs (or whoever) would have to RAISE price of perfect hammer. 10g hammer = 100k gold prices.
Second "problem" is the packs. This topic has been argued about to death. You all know where you stand.
Before chest of coins, economy was 99% player driven, with sales/new boutique stuff/etc giving the occasional spike in gold prices. But even with sales, if there was no demand for the item, gold price was unaffected.
Enter hammer, which set a minimum, and packs, which......you know.
Discuss b:bye0 -
You have the power to not buy low, but you buy the lowest price you can find anyway. Proof of greed.Zoe - Heavens Tear wrote: »You have the power to not sell high, but you sell high anyway. Proof of greed.
So you, being an arcane veno, probably wouldn't be willing to buy a lunar bow for more than a few thousand. That means that if you happened to get one, you it would be wrong for you to sell it for more than a few thousand?You sell things at a much higher price than you are willing to buy them at. Proof of greed.
An item's value is how much someone is willing to buy it for, not how much the seller is willing to pay for it. An economy with prices based on what the seller is willing to pay would be stagnant and non-functional (basically nobody would be willing to sell anything because there would be no benefit to doing so). I've given this example 3 times in response to your posts but it doesn't seem to be getting through so here it is again:
Consider an economy consisting of a chicken farmer and a dairy farmer. The chicken farmer has so many eggs he can't eat them all and has to throw many away. The dairy farmer has so much milk he can't drink it all and much of it spoils. One day the two of them talk to each other about their respective problem. They agree to trade a dozen eggs for a gallon of milk every week.
To the chicken farmer, the gallon of milk (which he has none of) is worth more than the dozen eggs (which he has lots of). So he benefits from the trade. To the dairy farmer, the dozen eggs (which he has none of) is more valuable than the gallon of milk (which he has lots of). So he benefits from the trade. Both are selling their goods for more than it's worth to them, and both are happy with the exchange. Both of their standards of living have gone up. The chicken farmer's family now gets to drink milk instead of just water. The dairy farmer's family now gets to eat eggs instead of just bread.
This is a fundamental aspect of economics you keep missing - that an economic exchange results in increased value and wealth even when the amount of stuff before and after the trade is exactly the same.
That's exactly what I do too. Most folks don't seem to realize that when you sell for a lower price, your profit per item goes down; but your sales volume goes up by more than enough to compensate for it. So the way to make the most money as a merchant is to buy at a higher price than anyone else, while selling at a lower price than anyone else (as long as the sell price is higher than the buy price). You don't make much money per sale, but your sales volume goes through the roof. The past month I averaged between 100-300 million in sales volume a week.WarrenWolfy - Sanctuary wrote: »My cat-shop (well, my alt character's shop, actually) almost always has the very lowest price on whatever I'm selling. I have no qualms about under-bidding the competition.
Not only that, but you know what I do when I offer to buy? Yup, that's right, I offer to pay more than anybody else. Why? Because my selling prices are the lowest, meaning I sell more, meaning I need more inventory, meaning I'm willing to pay the most to get it.
The result is that your carefully selected group of do-gooders wouldn't be able to beat my prices. You'd have people complaining that your group of "fair-trade approved" merchants were offering rip-off prices compared to mine.
And what motivates me to give producers the highest pay for their work, and to offer buyers the lowest prices on their purchases? Why, greed, of course, because I make the most money that way.
The shop where I don't do this is the one where I sell TT mats for my guild. That one I try to set the prices so the stuff sells out about as quickly as we can restock. If some mats don't sell, I lower their price. If some mats sell quickly, I raise their price next time we restock. Since we restock rather slowly (one or two TT runs a day), that's resulted in surprisingly high prices. I even had someone leave a message that the prices were very greedy. But I'm not the one setting the prices - the buyers are. I'm just matching what they're willing to pay.0 -
Solandri gets it. Why no one else?0
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I'de rather buy the chicken and the cow and then sell the eggs and milk back to the farmers.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Thank you Forsakenx for the picture. b:thanks0 -
I don't understand why are you crying when baby pets getting cheaper? Before it costed 2m+ for baby kitty and in guild we have made some as bday gifts for guildies. Now i see them around in catshops for 500k smth and same with all other baby pets, they just getting cheaper, rare ones are still a bit expensive, but 2m isn't expensive. Some people have spent 4m+ for baby snow cub before.0
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DeathPlan - Dreamweaver wrote: »HOW DOES A TURTLE have value?At all..It's just like a stupid fowl no one is'QQING' It's stating a fact.. It's not just the turtle some people forget that it's a GAME NOTHING has a valued price..at all All I am saying is people sometimes SET THINGS to Ridicoulos prices this thread is for people to MAYBE TRY and get what I'm saying and prices will drop some I'm a cashop player as well EVEN I don't set stupid prices..
Another case of wanna-be-internet-martyr. People are going to buy the things at the price they wanna buy them at and your silly post won't change that. There's been numerous posts full of logical retorts to your strange assertions that the market should cater to you specifically. This nonsense about the price being ridiculous is merely your opinion. I believe some things are ridiculously priced but they are still priced that way because that's their value, and their value is what it's supposed to be, not what you want it to be. If your fun is defined in you determining what market prices are, rather than the market itself, then you're simply clueless and too head-in-the-clouds.DeathPlan - Dreamweaver wrote: »Actually no from the start I said SO EVERYONE CAN HAVE FUN not just cashop players read carefully.
Ain't just him, I've seen several. Hey guys, this car is overpriced, give it to me for 1K or I QQ about cars being too expensive. After all, the market determines they are $10K+, but I want it for less. Damn greedy bastids willing to spend more than me!Tojop - Dreamweaver wrote: »Solandri gets it. Why no one else?0 -
Once again that idea was looking for reform not a ruthless attack. is constructive criticism to much to ask. All i want is for a kind of price check system. a standard that people can look at so they can decide if they want to jack the price up or lower it for competition0
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Lericah - Lost City wrote: »Once again that idea was looking for reform not a ruthless attack. is constructive criticism to much to ask. All i want is for a kind of price check system. a standard that people can look at so they can decide if they want to jack the price up or lower it for competition
We have that system, it is called shop around arch and check the AH. I am sure you will get a decent idea of how much items sell for.
Also, every item has a value for how much you can sell it to the npc printed on the item itself, so you know the lowest possible someone would sell you that item....Too often we loose sight of life's simple pleasures. Remember, when someone annoys you, it takes 42 muscles in your face to frown, BUT, it only takes 4 muscles to extend your arm and slap that mother#$@%#^! upside the head.0 -
yeah i would hate to see the value of everything go up in this game. turtle? never heard of it but i think one of those stupid pets that do nothing but follow you around should cost no more than 200k0
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Uh, some items are rarer than others. People want rare items. Therefore, that item is worth more since there is a limited supply and a high demand. Therefore, the price is high. Some items have a high supply and low demand. Those items are not very expensive. We already set the prices. If you want prices to go down stop buying that item. Its value will go down eventually. No point QQing about it. You don't have to go and buy a goldmane. A lobster will do. Or roll a barb. 7.3 m/s in TF is good enough for me. You just QQ because you want rare items. It's because you WANT them that the price is so high. People want an all class turtle. There is a limited supply. Therefore, price is high. Though it is slowly lowering because demand is becoming less and supply is becoming more. Get it?[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Thank you Forsakenx for the picture. b:thanks0 -
i don't understand why some people get angry that people set their own prices.
those people eventually wind up losing out on alot of sales. the only irritating thing to me is specific items that rot because of greed, like say a rare skill scroll rotting on someone's vendor for an insane amount, that is irritating, not someone who is trying to sell a token for 50k when the shop next to them has them for 20k.0 -
Lygerr - Dreamweaver wrote: »i don't understand why some people get angry that people set their own prices.
those people eventually wind up losing out on alot of sales. the only irritating thing to me is specific items that rot because of greed, like say a rare skill scroll rotting on someone's vendor for an insane amount, that is irritating, not someone who is trying to sell a token for 50k when the shop next to them has them for 20k.
if the scroll is rotting at a common price and no one buys it, eventually the seller will lower the price to meet the market demand... or someone will come across it whose demand matches the sellers price. lol this thread is funny... If it is their item.. let them sell if for however much??0 -
i think this is funny the op says "its just a stupid turtle its not worth 2 mil it should be the same price of the other pets" i think this is hilarious. if you didnt care about it then why care about the price of it? it has nothing to do with you obviously.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
ty Nowitsawn
Everything has its beginnings, but it doesn't start at one. It starts long before that... The world is born From zero. The moment zero becomes one is the moment the world springs to life. One becomes 2. 2 becomes 10. 10 becomes 100. taking it all back to one solves nothing. so long as zero remains... One.. Will eventually grow to 100 again.0 -
Oh you think you have it bad? HT yesterday I questioned a Noob on trying to sell, get this, A Wooden Sword for 5.2M. I said "Really?" Are you crazy or something, it's worth $10. His reply was "No U"! Yes I agree ppl. r frikin dumb w/ their prices. Another example. I saw a shop selling cotton thread for $4,995. ok you can go either way w/ that. However, as I'm standing there a cat shop drops right behind me, so I check it out. Guess what not 5 feet from the first cat shop cotton thread $7,995. Hmm wouldn't you look around for Comparable pricing before you drop your shop?0
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Worship - Harshlands wrote: »if the scroll is rotting at a common price and no one buys it, eventually the seller will lower the price to meet the market demand... or someone will come across it whose demand matches the sellers price. lol this thread is funny... If it is their item.. let them sell if for however much??
you underestimate people.
in previous MMOs i would see people sit on items for months, yes i'm saying 3-4 months on a skill scroll that is rare. in those games you may only see one on the server in that period of time and people knew it, but it still didn't make that item worth 40 times what it really should be worth. i'm not exaggerating the value either, that is why they sat on their sales broker for that long of time, because i nor anyone else wanted to touch it for that price.
as a comparison it would be like if rough furs stopped dropping, but you need one to make a magic sword and someone had it on their catshop listed for 10 million coins, the only one left on the server. no one in their right mind is going to pay that cost, but they think they have some uber loot because it is so rare, except the item you get is so minor no one would value it that high and pay it.
you did reiterate what i did say though, i do try to ignore people with the exceptions like i mentioned, because it is just stupid greed that drives people to think they have something so special when it is really just a "polished ****".0 -
"polished ****" = WINb:chuckle0
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