Demon or Sage (PvE)

andracil

Friend of mine is about to hit 89, and was wondering whether to go Sage or Demon. She wishes to focus on PvE. I ran a search to see what I could find, but no threads really gave an in-depth explanation which would be better, and most of them were focused on PvP anyway.
So, what's your opinion? ^_^

Angel - Harshlands

for pve, both are fine really, but if she does a lot of HH and fbs, that sage sharpened tooth is lovely.
Also getting the skillbooks past the three basic 89 books are difficult, so if she plans to not reach 99, then the choice shouldn't really matter.

Ajani - Harshlands

Only 2 words needed:

HELL SPARK

Saveless - Harshlands

andracil wrote: »

Friend of mine is about to hit 89, and was wondering whether to go Sage or Demon. She wishes to focus on PvE. I ran a search to see what I could find, but no threads really gave an in-depth explanation which would be better, and most of them were focused on PvP anyway.
So, what's your opinion? ^_^

Never imagined a mod making a thread asking for advice. b:shocked

DarkSniper - Lost City

I know demon is much better for PvP but I if the focus is PvE then I'm not sure although like someone said sage sharpened tooth arrow is good for HH

Alyyy - Sanctuary

Saveless - Harshlands wrote: »

Never imagined a mod making a thread asking for advice. b:shocked

this....



Archers are GODS in pvp so i woudl say demon all the way ._. ......


>.< Discharge three Spark to recover 20% of your maximum HP,
add 500% weapon damage and increase attack speed
by 25% for 15 seconds. Grants invincibility for 3 seconds
after the discharge.....b:shockedok i anounce archers as secondary nixes....(....phy dmg)

+ the winged shell is good o.o....and barage >_>.....omg....too much dmg >.<

DarkSniper - Lost City

lrn2read.


She said PVE

Mosz - Heavens Tear

DarkSniper - Lost City wrote: »

lrn2read.


She said PVE

in pve dealing massive damage doesnt matter? this carebear would like to argue otherwiseb:chuckle

Alyyy - Sanctuary

DarkSniper - Lost City wrote: »

lrn2read.


She said PVE

>_>.......

Mosz - Heavens Tear wrote: »

in pve dealing massive damage doesnt matter? this carebear would like to argue otherwiseb:chuckle

this.....

andracil

I'm not asking advice, my friend is <
But she doesn't like forums or something. In any case, she didn't want to ask here. xD

Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973

I don't think it matters much with genies.
If you are a sage and want a rapid fire spark just use relentless courage during your spark.

If you want chi gain as demon use cloud eruption (or get to 100 and use Awaken b:chuckle).

If you are really missing something from the other side it's not hard to find a genie substitute.

Yulk - Heavens Tear

I have no idea, but one thing i know, i got an archer, and he'd be sage b:pleased Also please sticky a certain guide please b:sad redsrose's genie guide deserves sticky

Werebeasts - Sanctuary

andracil wrote: »

Friend of mine is about to hit 89, and was wondering whether to go Sage or Demon. She wishes to focus on PvE. I ran a search to see what I could find, but no threads really gave an in-depth explanation which would be better, and most of them were focused on PvP anyway.
So, what's your opinion? ^_^

a gm asking us a question? thats a bit suprising lol

Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973

Werebeasts - Sanctuary wrote: »

a gm asking us a question? thats a bit suprising lol

Someone not knowing the difference between a GM and a mod? Not very surprising I guess. Mods are volunteer players who help maintain civility on the forums.

Werebeasts - Sanctuary

Asterelle - Sanctuary wrote: »

Someone not knowing the difference between a GM and a mod? Not very surprising I guess. Mods are volunteer players who help maintain civility on the forums.

oh they are? lol ok that makes since

Saveless - Harshlands

http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=263481

b:victory

Cal - Harshlands

Saveless - Harshlands wrote: »

http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=263481

b:victory

That is not a guide .... its just a rant.

For pve, its more based on the how ur friend play. If he/she wanna do some tanking or play a diff style heaven is as gud.

Archer = deal max dmg, is only gud for pvp.
Squad cry at times coz i deal too much dmg and take aggro too fast. So in a pve sense, too much dmg is a boon as well as a bane.
(usual shots "rings off; use another bow; u start dd after hp reach 20%, give herc 5 mins then dd .... )

Ajani - Harshlands

Cal - Harshlands wrote: »

That is not a guide .... its just a rant.

For pve, its more based on the how ur friend play. If he/she wanna do some tanking or play a diff style heaven is as gud.

Archer = deal max dmg, is only gud for pvp.
Squad cry at times coz i deal too much dmg and take aggro too fast. So in a pve sense, too much dmg is a boon as well as a bane.
(usual shots "rings off; use another bow; u start dd after hp reach 20%, give herc 5 mins then dd .... )

Thats an awesome guide -.-

Only good thing about Sage for pve is sharp. U need 99 and loads of luck to get it. Go demon and enjoy ur hell sparky thingyb:kiss

Suiryujin - Sanctuary

i would suggest demon just for the extra dps on bosses because of the attack speed boost.
archer on high lvl with a decently refined wpn (+5 or higher) can handle most pve mobs with just frost/knockback/stun demon/sage doesnt really make a difference.
only thing i see that might be useful when grinding is the free chi from sage for when you are trying to grind using winged shell and frost arrow and need more chi.

>.> of course if u really want max dps get a fist archer using -.1 interval bracer and rank 4 la top, with demon spark you will outdmg everything over time except maybe nixes on 75% reduction bosses. once u start sparking on a single target, u can keep sparking every 30 seconds or so. u can use blazing arrow with a bow 1st then switch to fist, the blazing arrow stays. its amusing when u use fist on fire immune boss, you dont see the resist symbol but everyone else sees it XD flood their screen with resists with the 2.5atk/sec under spark.

Faildom - Harshlands

Demon obviouslyb:chuckle

Absoluth - Heavens Tear

Hey ami ^^

Well, our friend decided to go sage. She asked another friend, a lv 101 sage archer and he told her the 15% extra weap mastery and 10% extra blaze is really helpful PvE-wise, not to mention 4% less hp from bosses.
Personally i think its a waste. In terms of rebirth, i rather kill faster and maybe pull apot dmg reduction pots on hard times. On skull bosses, i dont see how 15% weap dmg is gonna do more good than a constant 12% more crits (2% from passives, 10% from alternating stun/sharp tooth every 10 secs). Even in pve, i rather go demon considering all skills.

PvP-wise, the demon crits+speed are just awesome.

Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973

Absoluth - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Hey ami ^^

Well, our friend decided to go sage. She asked another friend, a lv 101 sage archer and he told her the 15% extra weap mastery and 10% extra blaze is really helpful PvE-wise, not to mention 4% less hp from bosses.
Personally i think its a waste. In terms of rebirth, i rather kill faster and maybe pull apot dmg reduction pots on hard times. On skull bosses, i dont see how 15% weap dmg is gonna do more good than a constant 12% more crits (2% from passives, 10% from alternating stun/sharp tooth every 10 secs). Even in pve, i rather go demon considering all skills.

PvP-wise, the demon crits+speed are just awesome.

The added 15 % weapon attack and 10% extra blazing translate into about 5% more damage from sage than demon for a lvl 100 full dex archer. This percentage is just from how much dex you have and not how highly refined your weapon is.

Demon barrage makes rebirth delta fairly easy. Mobs die very quickly and the squishy wiz rarely holds much aggro.

Absoluth - Heavens Tear

Asterelle - Sanctuary wrote: »

The added 15 % weapon attack and 10% extra blazing translate into about 5% more damage from sage than demon for a lvl 100 full dex archer. This percentage is just from how much dex you have and not how highly refined your weapon is.

Demon barrage makes rebirth delta fairly easy. Mobs die very quickly and the squishy wiz rarely holds much aggro.

I see. I thought the skills applied to weapon damage, not the dexterity. So those % wouldnt give that much advantage to a sage when talking about, lets say for the sake of argument, a +12 ultimate xbow? I mean, a 15% extra from that weapon would be considerable.

Devoted - Lost City

15% weapon damage is very small compared to 12+ crit even with a +12 grade 13 bow. www.pwcalc.ru/pwi if you wanna look at the actual numbers

Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973

I've been posting this alot but you have to really look at the damage formula to get what weapon attack means

Base damage = (1 + 2/3 (Dex/100) + Mastery +[any other added weapon attack %])*(weapon attack)

This is the damage shown in your sheet when you hit c and that is the damage you do to mobs with 0 physical resist. If you are a full dex archer at level 100 you have lets say like 450 dex.

The left hand side becomes

(1 + 2/3 (450/100) + ... )* weapon attack.
(1+3+mastery) * weapon attack.

For demon bow mastery with demon 50% blazing you have
(1+3+0.75+0.5) * weapon attack
(5.25) * weapon attack

For sage the multiplier on the left becomes
(1+3+0.9+0.6) * weapon attack
(5.5) * weapon attack

So sage's 5.5 attack multiplier is 4.7% higher than demon's 5.25 multiplier. The more dex you have the less the relative difference.

When a skill like take aim adds 400% weapon attack... you add 4 to the multiplier... so demon take aim is
5.25 + 4 = 9.25... 9.25 is 76% higher than the base multiplier of 5.25

So a demon take aim skill is 76% more powerful than a normal shot.

If you want to calculate the numbers in your sheet exactly the weapon attack is

attack on weapon + garnet shards + rings + your level

A perfect garnet shard that adds 40 damage gets multiplied by 5.25 to add 210 damage to every shot. This makes it better than a grade 12 elemental shard which only adds a flat 200 damage (which is why elemental shards suck).

Bearleeable - Lost City

Absoluth - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Hey ami ^^

Well, our friend decided to go sage. She asked another friend, a lv 101 sage archer and he told her the 15% extra weap mastery and 10% extra blaze is really helpful PvE-wise, not to mention 4% less hp from bosses.
Personally i think its a waste. In terms of rebirth, i rather kill faster and maybe pull apot dmg reduction pots on hard times. On skull bosses, i dont see how 15% weap dmg is gonna do more good than a constant 12% more crits (2% from passives, 10% from alternating stun/sharp tooth every 10 secs). Even in pve, i rather go demon considering all skills.

PvP-wise, the demon crits+speed are just awesome.

repeated ST? WTH, my understanding is reusing it after 30 secs resets max hp?

Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973

Bearleeable - Lost City wrote: »

repeated ST? WTH, my understanding is reusing it after 30 secs resets max hp?

After the first shot the decreased max HP effect is fairly meaningless. Demon tooth though has a badass 15s 10% crit buff that is fun to have on.

GunShoT - Dreamweaver

demon of course...
D.SPARK + DEADLY SHOT = INSTANT KILLb:pleased