A little rant, and advice to all classes.
Xerow - Dreamweaver
Posts: 16 Arc User
I don't know where I should put this, but the issues I'm about to rant about come from doing FBs, so I'm putting this here.
This rant will most likely be pointless, as the people I'm ranting about probably don't come here, which would be why I'm ranting about them in the first place.
Then again, aren't rants supposed to be pointless? So let me start...
LEARN HOW TO PLAY YOUR CLASSES PEOPLE.
If you're a wizard or archer, this rant is not for you, because I don't seem to have problems with any of them. I think this is because their objective is simple - kill stuff.
Let me start off with my biggest problem - Barbarians. As a cleric, I love barbs. The ones who know what the hell they're doing. The ones who go kitty mode and pull all the aggro like they're supposed to. I HATE barbarians who exclusively use humanoid form and expect to be the main tank. The majority of these people are useless. Some may know how to maintain aggro while in humanoid form. I haven't played a barb much or seen barbs actually be able to do this to know, but the main point is... tiger form is much more effective at maintaining aggro. Don't expect the smarter players to support you while you're attacking if you're too stupid to realize that your role is not to do damage, but to hold aggro. Clerics can't heal if they know they're going to pull aggro because you're only attacking 1 of the 5 mobs you rushed into, and wizards and archers wont attack knowing they're going to do a hell of a lot more damage than you are, therefore pulling aggro.
So please. Do me a favor. If you expect to be a main tank, learn to use tiger form. If not, by all means, focus on humanoid form. I'm not going to tell you how to play. But know your role in a squad.
Next off. Blademasters. WHAT THE HELL GUYS. This is similar to my barbarian problem. Let me start off by saying this - you're not barbarians. Is it just me or does every BM I see needlessly rush into all 10 monsters around them all the damn time? Not even waiting for the rest of the party to catch up? You're not supposed to use your sprint to get away from your party... you're supposed to use it to catch up or run away from enemies. Sure, you have AOE attacks, but that doesn't mean you should try and go on suicide runs all the time. Just... try to be careful. You can't hold aggro as well as tiger barbs.
Venomancers. Small issue. Learn how to not pull aggro from your pet. I can't save you all the time if I'm focusing on the people know actually know how to maintain aggro. That is all.
Clerics. It's rare that I have a problem with other clerics. But I do have something to say. Heal. You have a ton of healing spells for a reason. We're healers. On the flipside - attack. We also have attacks for a reason. I hate seeing clerics who only either heal or attack. Even if you're a FA cleric, you should still have ironheart. Try to keep your eye on everyone's health and protect them accordingly. And if you're a support cleric, if everyone's fine in terms of health, you can attack. Don't be afraid to. Unless you have barbs and BMs who don't know what they're doing.
It seems to me I've started to have these issues with people ever since summer started... a flood of noobs perhaps.
Well I guess there's something else to say, but it's not really a rant. Here's some advice to archers and wizards. I don't have anything to rant about because like I said, they have the clearest role in a squad, to attack. But be careful about how you do it. Because you do so much damage, you risk pulling aggro, even if the barb knows what he's doing. Let the barb hold aggro for a while if you're not sure you can get rid of the mobs/bosses quick enough.
That is all.
/rant
This rant will most likely be pointless, as the people I'm ranting about probably don't come here, which would be why I'm ranting about them in the first place.
Then again, aren't rants supposed to be pointless? So let me start...
LEARN HOW TO PLAY YOUR CLASSES PEOPLE.
If you're a wizard or archer, this rant is not for you, because I don't seem to have problems with any of them. I think this is because their objective is simple - kill stuff.
Let me start off with my biggest problem - Barbarians. As a cleric, I love barbs. The ones who know what the hell they're doing. The ones who go kitty mode and pull all the aggro like they're supposed to. I HATE barbarians who exclusively use humanoid form and expect to be the main tank. The majority of these people are useless. Some may know how to maintain aggro while in humanoid form. I haven't played a barb much or seen barbs actually be able to do this to know, but the main point is... tiger form is much more effective at maintaining aggro. Don't expect the smarter players to support you while you're attacking if you're too stupid to realize that your role is not to do damage, but to hold aggro. Clerics can't heal if they know they're going to pull aggro because you're only attacking 1 of the 5 mobs you rushed into, and wizards and archers wont attack knowing they're going to do a hell of a lot more damage than you are, therefore pulling aggro.
So please. Do me a favor. If you expect to be a main tank, learn to use tiger form. If not, by all means, focus on humanoid form. I'm not going to tell you how to play. But know your role in a squad.
Next off. Blademasters. WHAT THE HELL GUYS. This is similar to my barbarian problem. Let me start off by saying this - you're not barbarians. Is it just me or does every BM I see needlessly rush into all 10 monsters around them all the damn time? Not even waiting for the rest of the party to catch up? You're not supposed to use your sprint to get away from your party... you're supposed to use it to catch up or run away from enemies. Sure, you have AOE attacks, but that doesn't mean you should try and go on suicide runs all the time. Just... try to be careful. You can't hold aggro as well as tiger barbs.
Venomancers. Small issue. Learn how to not pull aggro from your pet. I can't save you all the time if I'm focusing on the people know actually know how to maintain aggro. That is all.
Clerics. It's rare that I have a problem with other clerics. But I do have something to say. Heal. You have a ton of healing spells for a reason. We're healers. On the flipside - attack. We also have attacks for a reason. I hate seeing clerics who only either heal or attack. Even if you're a FA cleric, you should still have ironheart. Try to keep your eye on everyone's health and protect them accordingly. And if you're a support cleric, if everyone's fine in terms of health, you can attack. Don't be afraid to. Unless you have barbs and BMs who don't know what they're doing.
It seems to me I've started to have these issues with people ever since summer started... a flood of noobs perhaps.
Well I guess there's something else to say, but it's not really a rant. Here's some advice to archers and wizards. I don't have anything to rant about because like I said, they have the clearest role in a squad, to attack. But be careful about how you do it. Because you do so much damage, you risk pulling aggro, even if the barb knows what he's doing. Let the barb hold aggro for a while if you're not sure you can get rid of the mobs/bosses quick enough.
That is all.
/rant
Post edited by Xerow - Dreamweaver on
0
Comments
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I've met some annoying Barbs, who can't even be classed as tanks tbh0
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Wow, way to hate on barbs >.>
I've found of my fellow Barbs doing odd stuff like that, but as long as I'm in the fb, TT, or whatever... I can tank. I know my class very well. Human form is only needed as a DD, while tiger is tank. I use my aggro skillz to perfection, and rarely loose aggro. I understand your frustration, as I've seen useless Barbs as well. However I myself, am a useful Barb.0 -
Another problem I've seen with barbs.
"My charm went off, you suck as a cleric!" *drops party in the middle of the boss*
If you don't want the charm used, why did you equip it?Main characters
Celestial Sage Venomancer Zoe - 100
Sage Barbarian Malego - 910 -
I've seen all these problems Q_Q
Before people come in here and say "ooh I am variant hear me roar," you can anything as long as you know you role in the squad and squad knows your role as well.
But don't be offended if you're a heavy cleric, don't tell your squad so, and then get kicked before the first boss when you go, "oh by the way..."[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
It's always amusing for me at the point of Blademasters. Their suicide-runs are funny. Running like you said into a group of monsters with their speed skill. I'm running 4,8m/s as cleric, so without Holy Path it's impossible for me to catch these suicide-BM's up. And what the.. Most times i got told that it's my fault if they die at these runs.
Even thought it's amusing if the tank's saying : "I won't attack until you started spamming Ironheart." Lol? Tank's who're reading this : Cleric's are getting the aggro by using Ironheart at the people who are going to be attacked, if they don't aggro the boss first with their skill/s.
Means, as long as you don't want the full squad dead : Use an aggro-skill before the Cleric heals. For these situation's the higher Clerics got a better heal than Ironheart (Stream of Rejuvenation i mean).0 -
When a Barbarian says to spam Ironheart on them, they probably meant to stack a couple on them first before they run and start attacking. When I was on my cleric, I never had any problems with this. I don't heal them again until I know they caught aggro.0
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Um, when tanks say spam ironheart. You put 3-4 on them, let them run up, throw in a flesh ream, then you start healing again.I was early taught to work as well as play,
My life has been one long, happy holiday;
Full of work and full of play-
I dropped the worry on the way-
And God was good to me everyday.0 -
Please look at what I've written.
Quoting myself:
Even thought it's amusing if the tank's saying : "I won't attack until you started spamming Ironheart."
I know that I won't get the aggro when I use Ironheart of them before they're already heading up to the mob/boss.
The enhancement should be the "spamming".
You know how it works for Clerics Loyd, but there are much Barbs/BM's who think that they got to run into the mobs directly when they see that the Cleric's usin' Ironheart.0 -
Tremblewith - Heavens Tear wrote: »Wow, way to hate on barbs >.>
I've found of my fellow Barbs doing odd stuff like that, but as long as I'm in the fb, TT, or whatever... I can tank. I know my class very well. Human form is only needed as a DD, while tiger is tank. I use my aggro skillz to perfection, and rarely loose aggro. I understand your frustration, as I've seen useless Barbs as well. However I myself, am a useful Barb.
Haha. I hate when people try to get stupid with me is all. Like I said, I love barbs who know what they're doing, like you.Zoe - Heavens Tear wrote: »Another problem I've seen with barbs.
"My charm went off, you suck as a cleric!" *drops party in the middle of the boss*
If you don't want the charm used, why did you equip it?
Lawl. I can understand what they mean though. If a cleric can keep up with the healing, barbs don't have to worry about their charm ticking. But it IS there for the purpose of keeping them safe just in case a cleric can't catch up fast enough or something. The charm shouldn't have to be the primary healer, the cleric is. But getting mad over one tick is stupid. If it happens multiple times, then the cleric is either doing something wrong, or the barb is running off too fast for the cleric to heal him.0 -
Lolz, you must have met all kinds of noobs on your gaming time
And.. fyi BMs do mob control and honestly, i can tell you i saved cleric/veno asses a lot times on fbs and HHs cause i actually knew that barb might not be able to get aggro fast enough, and stun mobs by getting there first. So don't start telling people what they need to know. Actually if a lvl 70+ char doesn't know what to do, then you honestly fail and better reroll other char.
Besides... I'm an axe bm, i have loads of aoes. There's like a pack of 5 mobs, veno fails to lure, barb fails to get aggro. BM is the one taking all the remaining mobs so everyone else can live... Especially the damn squishy cleric asses. A little bit more respect would be nice sir. I never told a cleric they don't know how to do their job, and i died countless times in HHs cause cleric was healing a veno while i was tanking 5 mobs... EPIC 0 -
Dakaruch - Lost City wrote: »Lolz, you must have met all kinds of noobs on your gaming time
And.. fyi BMs do mob control and honestly, i can tell you i saved cleric/veno asses a lot times on fbs and HHs cause i actually knew that barb might not be able to get aggro fast enough, and stun mobs by getting there first. So don't start telling people what they need to know. Actually if a lvl 70+ char doesn't know what to do, then you honestly fail and better reroll other char.
Besides... I'm an axe bm, i have loads of aoes. There's like a pack of 5 mobs, veno fails to lure, barb fails to get aggro. BM is the one taking all the remaining mobs so everyone else can live... Especially the damn squishy cleric asses. A little bit more respect would be nice sir. I never told a cleric they don't know how to do their job, and i died countless times in HHs cause cleric was healing a veno while i was tanking 5 mobs... EPIC
Did I say you didn't know what you were doing? No.
The first line of your post sums up who I'm talking about. Not you.0 -
Clerics. It's rare that I have a problem with other clerics. But I do have something to say. Heal. You have a ton of healing spells for a reason. We're healers. On the flipside - attack. We also have attacks for a reason. I hate seeing clerics who only either heal or attack. Even if you're a FA cleric, you should still have ironheart. Try to keep your eye on everyone's health and protect them accordingly. And if you're a support cleric, if everyone's fine in terms of health, you can attack. Don't be afraid to. Unless you have barbs and BMs who don't know what they're doing.
That's the main annoyance I have with some clerics. Be aware of who's getting hit and don't just blindly throw Ironhearts. I can't tell you how many times my pet is tanking and the cleric just sits there healing the tank. If my pet's tanking, healing the Barb wastes your mana and everyone's time. Be aware enough to know when to attack and when to heal. Also, if the **** hits the fan, don't automatically BB. That is not always the right thing to do.0 -
Xerow - Dreamweaver wrote: »
If you're a wizard or archer, this rant is not for you, because I don't seem to have problems with any of them. I think this is because their objective is simple - kill stuff.
Give it time - wizards and archers who don't know how to control their attacks will be one of your biggest pains eventually.Let me start off with my biggest problem - Barbarians. As a cleric, I love barbs. The ones who know what the hell they're doing. The ones who go kitty mode and pull all the aggro like they're supposed to. I HATE barbarians who exclusively use humanoid form and expect to be the main tank. The majority of these people are useless. Some may know how to maintain aggro while in humanoid form. I haven't played a barb much or seen barbs actually be able to do this to know, but the main point is... tiger form is much more effective at maintaining aggro. Don't expect the smarter players to support you while you're attacking if you're too stupid to realize that your role is not to do damage, but to hold aggro. Clerics can't heal if they know they're going to pull aggro because you're only attacking 1 of the 5 mobs you rushed into, and wizards and archers wont attack knowing they're going to do a hell of a lot more damage than you are, therefore pulling aggro.
So please. Do me a favor. If you expect to be a main tank, learn to use tiger form. If not, by all means, focus on humanoid form. I'm not going to tell you how to play. But know your role in a squad.
Good barbs are my heroes. I have the luxury and honor of accompanying a damn good barb on almost all of my runs, so I rarely have to deal with those problems. The few times I meet a bad barb in a dungeon run - once we are finished it's the last time they see meNext off. Blademasters. WHAT THE HELL GUYS. This is similar to my barbarian problem. Let me start off by saying this - you're not barbarians. Is it just me or does every BM I see needlessly rush into all 10 monsters around them all the damn time? Not even waiting for the rest of the party to catch up? You're not supposed to use your sprint to get away from your party... you're supposed to use it to catch up or run away from enemies. Sure, you have AOE attacks, but that doesn't mean you should try and go on suicide runs all the time. Just... try to be careful. You can't hold aggro as well as tiger barbs.
I disagree with a lot of this. The only issue I see is if a BM gets ahead and then blames the cleric if something goes wrong.
If the BM knows what he is doing and the cleric does as well - there's almost never a problem in my experience.
I'll take a strong BM with no fear of death on any dungeon run though. More often than not it's that BM saving my ****, or the **** of whichever squishie DD draws agro while the barb is busy.Venomancers. Small issue. Learn how to not pull aggro from your pet. I can't save you all the time if I'm focusing on the people know actually know how to maintain aggro. That is all.
The times my venos draw agro, they take one hit and the pet has it again - learn your veno's habits and you'll see more often than not them drawing agro isn't a huge issue. Just keep half an eye on them while you keep healing the tank.Clerics. It's rare that I have a problem with other clerics. But I do have something to say. Heal. You have a ton of healing spells for a reason. We're healers. On the flipside - attack. We also have attacks for a reason. I hate seeing clerics who only either heal or attack. Even if you're a FA cleric, you should still have ironheart. Try to keep your eye on everyone's health and protect them accordingly. And if you're a support cleric, if everyone's fine in terms of health, you can attack. Don't be afraid to. Unless you have barbs and BMs who don't know what they're doing.
You must party with better clerics than I do - as more often then not my problems in parties are the other clerics. Between the sorry dependence on BB in totally unneeded situations, pure insistence on DDing even when the tank's charm is ticking like a stopwatch, etc . . . It's enough to drive me nuts sometimes. Learn the right situations to use skills and how to balance out those skills for the right situation. . .[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Thanks for the sig Ophida
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Next off. Blademasters. WHAT THE HELL GUYS. This is similar to my barbarian problem. Let me start off by saying this - you're not barbarians. Is it just me or does every BM I see needlessly rush into all 10 monsters around them all the damn time? Not even waiting for the rest of the party to catch up? You're not supposed to use your sprint to get away from your party... you're supposed to use it to catch up or run away from enemies. Sure, you have AOE attacks, but that doesn't mean you should try and go on suicide runs all the time. Just... try to be careful. You can't hold aggro as well as tiger barbs.
just a point though, BMs can well tank a few physical mobs with no problem. the true sign that a BM doesnt know his stuff is when he runs headon into a bunch of magical attack mobs. that i would agree with u, the BM is being pure stupid.
But as fellow axe BMs, i would say that we are aoe freaks, and with >3 aoe skills under our belt, we would be inclined to utilise it to its full potential and save the squad some valuable time, (not at the expense of dieing and getting the full squad killed though).
The point about us cloud sprinting, if (and i stress on the word if again) the BM knows what he is running into, it would be to the best of the squad as he is actually winding up the mobs for you. (provided that the BM can survive on his own).
It all boils down to the BM himself. Running headlessly into a bunch of mobs with cloudsprint may seem noob, but there is more to it if the BM is an experienced one0 -
yeah.. there's kinda the thing where the majority of people are just plain dumb or ignorant. there's some that know what they're doing from all classes, but unless someone actually knows you, ur skill is stereotyped and skeptecized by all the idiots / ignorants.
like we were doing a fb 29 and there was a 9x BM with heiro, i happened to be on my lv53 herc veno, and figured i'd save his heiro alotta ticks by tanking the boss myself (which i can do quite cheaply, especially considering i dont have heiros on). The bm was alright with this, but guess what... as SOON as i sent my herc into qingzi, this dumb lv50 wizard starts up with his attacks, no later than my herc had hit it only once or twice, so the 9xBM had to get the agro to save the dumb wizard, and we ended up with a bm that ticked his heiro to tank the boss (didnt have cleric which was why i was gona tank). he didnt mind either way, but had it not been for the dum wiz (not all are dumb lol) his heiro wouldnt've needed to tick once.
but, gota love dummies eh? lol
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oh.. and on my cleric, my first character i played up into the 40's (i've actually got all 6 classes)... i was having a problem with heal agro and thought it was something i was doing wrong. i even waited as long as i possibly could before starting to heal whoever was tanking, but would still get mobs come after me as soon as i iornhearted.
now that i've played for a while, probably more-so from having played veno thn anything else, i know that whoever the person happened to be that was trying to tank things, just wasnt doing their job n getn all the mob agro'd like they should have been.
so... as was said before: kno ur build, kno ur role, kno what you can and cant do, and dont try to do something you dont know how to do, or are incapable of doing lol.i'm pro all classes, and against none in particular..
but the age old QQ about venos is just that. OLD.
QQ'd about a nix lately? check out this thread n tell me who's "OP" lol..
(copy and paste this to address bar):
pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=1021720 -
Well yeah. See, if everyone knows what they're doing, I don't have a problem. Here's an example of what pisses me off.
I was doing a 51 last night with a barb, and a bm. It went pretty well, except multiple times, the barb (who used tiger form... but still didn't keep all the aggro -_-) and the bm would be targeting the same thing, while a ranged mob would be attacking one of them. So I had to sit and wait, and not heal them, knowing I would pull that mob's aggro. This happened so many times I just said **** it, healed them, let the mob come to me, and started healing myself (because I can't take on those mobs by myself yet). It was only then that they realized they didn't have all the aggro and had to come attack the monster while I waited and spammed ironheart on myself. Yet they kept letting it happen. This is the kind of **** that grinds my gears. At one point I just stopped healing and attacked whatever they were attacking so that it would die faster, and I didn't have to worry about healing them, so they could move onto the next one.
I understand BMs run into multiple mobs because they're aoe freaks. But they still have to pay attention to those that they missed, and not blame the cleric if they're too stupid to realize that they either can't take on all of those mobs, or they failed to draw all the aggro they intended.0 -
Thumbs up. smart BMs would wait for others to lure the mobs that they cant get aggro (either because the mob is too far away or it is a magical mob) before running into the group of mobs to AOE. We have a diamond sultra(recovers 20% hp) for a reason, and an experienced BM would bring along some instant heal potions or manufactured some orbs to ensure survival.
And yea i agree, in a FB the BM and Barb should never be together unless there are only 1 mob aggroed
because a BM can be said to be the 2nd substitute tank of the squad.
however, there are still exceptions, when the BM aoe-ed and thought that he has gotten all aggro, he might have missed(attack missed on) a mob and didnt realise. But in ur case it certainly wasnt the case, what could i say, tough luck on ur FB run... b:shocked
Great quote! Love how u put it all in just one sentence... as was said before: kno ur build, kno ur role, kno what you can and cant do, and dont try to do something you dont know how to do, or are incapable of doing...0 -
FatherTed - Dreamweaver wrote: »Give it time - wizards and archers who don't know how to control their attacks will be one of your biggest pains eventually.
And maybe archers and wizards can help you when they do control their attacks?
Personally, I always try and AoE when I see a cleric having to spam heal when monsters have not been aggro'd. Ideally, a better tank will pull them off of me, if I pull aggro. Or, maybe I run for an exit, giving my party time to get itself situated better. Or maybe I can get some healing and I can stay and tank. Or maybe the situation was hopeless and the cleric dies despite my efforts. Or, maybe I die...?
I am no blademaster, but sometimes, in a pinch, archers can substitute for one.0 -
I just hate barbs that say "Veno tank I dont want to waste a charm" >.> so my charm isn't as important? Then my pet dies because I have to tank some impossible boss with out Red bubble like Wulord and end up loosing 500 loyalty points on my herc... True story happens alllll the time with me =( I end up just bitching out the lazy barbs now lol.0
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Tehfishy - Heavens Tear wrote: »I just hate barbs that say "Veno tank I dont want to waste a charm" >.> so my charm isn't as important? Then my pet dies because I have to tank some impossible boss with out Red bubble like Wulord and end up loosing 500 loyalty points on my herc... True story happens alllll the time with me =( I end up just bitching out the lazy barbs now lol.
Do you have a cleric with you when the barb says that? Because a good cleric means a barb doesn't have to worry about that. I make it a point to make sure barb's charms don't tick - and they love me for it.0 -
What does aggro mean?0
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Next off. Blademasters. WHAT THE HELL GUYS. This is similar to my barbarian problem. Let me start off by saying this - you're not barbarians. Is it just me or does every BM I see needlessly rush into all 10 monsters around them all the damn time? Not even waiting for the rest of the party to catch up? You're not supposed to use your sprint to get away from your party... you're supposed to use it to catch up or run away from enemies. Sure, you have AOE attacks, but that doesn't mean you should try and go on suicide runs all the time. Just... try to be careful. You can't hold aggro as well as tiger barbs.
Actually u r supposed to run into 10 mobs, u can tank em, and u can hold aggro on them.Nullum crimen sine lege.0 -
Hippie - Harshlands wrote: »Actually u r supposed to run into 10 mobs, u can tank em, and u can hold aggro on them.
Not in most cases I've seen. And even if they can survive it, my problem is when they don't hold all aggro and fail to realize that one of the monsters they missed is coming towards me because I'm trying to keep them alive. Like I said... this isn't how ALL bms are. I'm just frustrated with the ones who do this.johnnycarson wrote: »What does aggro mean?
It basically means who the monster is attacking. If someone has/pulls aggro, it means the monster is attacking them.0
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