Bare Bones Cleric Guide

SATII - Lost City

I don't see the point in leveling up str to be able to use the lv99 weapon at lv49. I'm pretty no one would be stupid enough to "forget" to add into strength as they level up

Scoleo - Sanctuary

SATII - Lost City wrote: »

I don't see the point in leveling up str to be able to use the lv99 weapon at lv49. I'm pretty no one would be stupid enough to "forget" to add into strength as they level up

Really? No one in the 50s + will forget something like that. But someone who just started and is level 20? I have read countless posts on here of someone around 20 who has 20vit and 20dex by that point and hasnt built mag nearly enough. All willfire is saying is that if you follow his guide as a low level, you will not mess up your characters stat points. You can follow it until you have learned enough to make up your own decisions.

Azerandus - Sanctuary

I'd have to agree with the majority of the posters here that being able to use lvl 99 items as lvl 49 is a little... pointless.

Personally, before I figured out what I wanted to do, I added 6 mag and 1 str every 2 levels and just banked the rest. I'd recommend doing that if you're unsure about what build you want to have.

I understand what you're saying with the guide. I also think that since this guide is designed so that newbs don't feel they've wasted their stat points, the fact that they'll have so much str may make them feel that they've wasted their stat points.

Also keep in mind that not everyone is going to play long enough to get to the point where they need those stats.

_WillFire_ - Sanctuary

Azerandus - Sanctuary wrote: »

I'd have to agree with the majority of the posters here that being able to use lvl 99 items as lvl 49 is a little... pointless.

Personally, before I figured out what I wanted to do, I added 6 mag and 1 str every 2 levels and just banked the rest. I'd recommend doing that if you're unsure about what build you want to have.

I understand what you're saying with the guide. I also think that since this guide is designed so that newbs don't feel they've wasted their stat points, the fact that they'll have so much str may make them feel that they've wasted their stat points.

Also keep in mind that not everyone is going to play long enough to get to the point where they need those stats.

Good point Azerandus. I've been waiting for someone to say something about this. As others have noted, however, this guide was made to make life simpler for those who don't know which way to jump or why.

The guide stickied at the very top of this forum suggests this sort of strategy as well ( 6 Mag, 1 Str every two levels ) but doesn't really go into the why of it or give suggestions on what skills are basics for all builds.

You could modify this guide by simply taking out adding the extra Str for the future but then that brings in complication ( when and where should I put the points ) which a new player doesn't need. This game is confusing enough as testified too by the huge amount of posts here asking for help.

As for people not playing all the way too 99th...that seems to be a weak arguement if you'll forgive me saying so. No small amount of stat allotment is going to effect how long someone plays this game.

Nelae - Heavens Tear

Just explain to me, who will wait to lv 49 to see which way to go.

Let me say what "newbies" will do.
Go LA or full vit build. Why? Cause of the psy mobs, then comes a long period 60-80 where full int or slight vit build would be more useful.

Laying such a guide where things are left unsaid, gimping your character is NOT something for new players.

If you want to write a guide, write a full guide not "gimp your character" guide.

Isaphet - Heavens Tear

_WillFire_ - Sanctuary wrote: »

Good point Azerandus. I've been waiting for someone to say something about this. As others have noted, however, this guide was made to make life simpler for those who don't know which way to jump or why.

I did in fact say something about this, something you clearly didn't realise. Though judging by your "semantics" comment at the end your grasp of the English language is somewhat lacking, so that makes sense.

Let me put it in simpler language for you, I'll even add some constructive criticism. Here goes nothing...

This guide is complete bollocks, a nice way to improve it would be to delete it and post an apology for your stupidity.

Better for you?

Exexexe - Sanctuary

seemingly, he only listens to people from sanctuary. again, i say seemingly. upon study, i've yet to see him agree with anybody from another server, but those who are from sanctuary, he praises the ground they walk on. don't let it bother you.

Isaphet - Heavens Tear

_WillFire_ - Sanctuary wrote: »

1) The difference those points make between a "pure" build and my guide are very very small.

2) If you want to criticize something then take the time to do it constructively and offer proof...not empty opinion and posturing.

How can you prove what everyone else thought was just mere common sense, and yet somehow think it proves what you said? Thats absolutely barmy! I'll take back what I said about flames being unnecassary, you sir are one of that rare breed that actually needs flame after flame. Hopefully somehow, through some stroke of luck, you decide to quit making everyone elses eyes hurt with your idiocy and move on to something more fitting you, chewing on a dead goats **** for example.

What you posted up as proof of insignificance in actual fact shows that the difference at level 70 of your gimped up "idiot cleric" and a proper streamlined "normal cleric" is about the same as using no shards in your weapon, or two flawless shards.

.... no shards or two flawless shards.

Do you want me to say it again?

The reason noone was "offering proof to constructively criticise" your guide is because, well, it's mind blowingly obvious!! You have less magic, because you wasted your points in str. What the hell kind of proof are you looking for?

Some more constructive criticism:
The main problem with this guide is, well, that it exists. Your best bet to remedy this problem is to delete it and post up a strong begging apology to all those people who had to suffer its drivel. You should post up a link to a picture of yourself letting a camel defecate on your head, its a classic way of remedying this kind of problem, just do it, you'll see!


goodnight.

_WillFire_ - Sanctuary

Isaphet - Heavens Tear wrote: »

I did in fact say something about this, something you clearly didn't realise. Though judging by your "semantics" comment at the end your grasp of the English language is somewhat lacking, so that makes sense.

Let me put it in simpler language for you, I'll even add some constructive criticism. Here goes nothing...

This guide is complete bollocks, a nice way to improve it would be to delete it and post an apology for your stupidity.

Better for you?

Well...you are correct on the "nothing" part.

_WillFire_ - Sanctuary

Exexexe - Sanctuary wrote: »

seemingly, he only listens to people from sanctuary. again, i say seemingly. upon study, i've yet to see him agree with anybody from another server, but those who are from sanctuary, he praises the ground they walk on. don't let it bother you.

No...I listen to everyone who has something to actually say. Those who insist on being @sshats...I have no patience with.

_WillFire_ - Sanctuary

Isaphet - Heavens Tear wrote: »

How can you prove what everyone else thought was just mere common sense, and yet somehow think it proves what you said? Thats absolutely barmy! I'll take back what I said about flames being unnecassary, you sir are one of that rare breed that actually needs flame after flame. Hopefully somehow, through some stroke of luck, you decide to quit making everyone elses eyes hurt with your idiocy and move on to something more fitting you, chewing on a dead goats **** for example.

Amusing

What you posted up as proof of insignificance in actual fact shows that the difference at level 70 of your gimped up "idiot cleric" and a proper streamlined "normal cleric" is about the same as using no shards in your weapon, or two flawless shards.

.... no shards or two flawless shards.

So it's your belief, then, that those who play a Vit build or an LA build are "gimped". Got it.

Need I show you how much damage they loose by going those routes? No?

The difference is minimal between the pure Mag build and my build.

Do you want me to say it again?

Only if you want to demonstrate your lack of comprehension again. By all means feel free if so.

The reason noone was "offering proof to constructively criticise" your guide is because, well, it's mind blowingly obvious!! You have less magic, because you wasted your points in str. What the hell kind of proof are you looking for?

The comment was made that the build I suggested somehow "gimped" the character. Therefore I proved that view as incorrect.

Some more constructive criticism:
The main problem with this guide is, well, that it exists. Your best bet to remedy this problem is to delete it and post up a strong begging apology to all those people who had to suffer its drivel. You should post up a link to a picture of yourself letting a camel defecate on your head, its a classic way of remedying this kind of problem, just do it, you'll see!


goodnight.

/even more amused

Good day.

Forp - Heavens Tear

yours?

junk wrote: »

+ Barebones build. Minimum necessary stats for robes/weapon (not a build per se but you can do this to conserve your stats if you haven't made up your mind yet).
- 6 MAG
- 1 STR
- 3 free points

you took it from the stickied guide(or from his original guide) and added "oh lol, add enough str for level 99 gears at 49, pro move".

_WillFire_ - Sanctuary

Forp - Heavens Tear wrote: »

yours?

you took it from the stickied guide(or from his original guide) and added "oh lol, add enough str for level 99 gears at 49, pro move".

Are you speaking to me?

Forp - Heavens Tear

no, of course not. how could you think such a thing?

_WillFire_ - Sanctuary

Forp - Heavens Tear wrote: »

no, of course not. how could you think such a thing?

Of course. How silly of me.

Do you think perhaps that I didn't read the stickied guides?

How is my build different from that one chuckles?

1) I added Str into the equation.
2) I outlined the skills basic to all the different types of builds
3) I explained why.

Now my challenge to you is to create your own guide based on the stats of this game. But be careful...some @sshat might come in here and accuse you of plagerizing a different guide based simply on the fact that they share something in common.

Forp - Heavens Tear

you mean you got the name "barebones" by complete and total coincidence? doing the exact same type of build? added some color and more str into the equasion? wow. that's weird.

_WillFire_ - Sanctuary

Forp - Heavens Tear wrote: »

you mean you got the name "barebones" by complete and total coincidence? doing the exact same type of build? added some color and more str into the equasion? wow. that's weird.

Isn't it though?

So are you up to my challenge? Perhaps you might come up with something useful.

Forp - Heavens Tear

write a cleric guide? ok. though there's a very good one already stickied.

Trebor_sov - Sanctuary

Forp - Heavens Tear wrote: »

write a cleric guide? ok. though there's a very good one already stickied.

Interesting. While i've read the "stickied" guide and found it useful, for a LA build it wasn't quite what I was after. Being new to the game, and trying to come up with a viable build strat to make things fun for myself, and my 9yr old, it just wasn't what I was looking for.
This one on the other hand actually makes sense for a LA build ( of course i'm in my 40's, and own a calculator), it allows for flexibility if you need to tweak something down the road.
Your 1st 20 lvls, your taking primarily phys dam anyway. With your def spells and a higher mag attribute, your taking less dam from phys attacks than from the other build. Since most players are younger anyway, they're usually getting frustrated from dying a lot ( 9yr old again, it's good to be the dad). Just to prove this, I ran 2 clerics for a LA build thru to lvl 19. The higher mag attribute definetly helped "soak" the physical damage being dealt by the baddies (love plume shell, great spell).
In addition, I didn't have to use as many mana pots as I did for the 1st build, or healing for that matter. Something which I personally found interesting. So by all means, you folks continually bash this gentleman. But I really recommend you at least run a test or two before you trash it, it's only fair. I on the other hand, will PM him, this build has excellent potential for a LA build, and possibly some nice nasty surprises for mid-rng pk's.
So, kudos Sir (tips hat), nice job. I'll pm you when time permits to run a few scenarios past you for this build.

Isaphet - Heavens Tear

Its as I said earlier. This "build" is only viable and not going to hurt you in the long run if you choose to go light armour, if you choose arcane then its going to suck for you. On top of that its a pretty poor way of going light armour, the preferred method is about as simple as, well, going for light armour.

Light armour up till level 50 is going to be nice with all the physical mobs. Its going to suck up till the much later levels past that though with lower magical defence and lower attack power. Later levels, well I'm not there yet but some people say its good, some people say its terrible, I really wouldnt say either way.

LA is a viable option, this guide on the other hand, really is not.

Forp - Heavens Tear

Light armor before 60? Nonsense. The massive amount of damage loss before then will make you level unbelievably slow. Get your arbor at 60, then restat. Light armor generally last until 89, then you move onto your hh90 armors. There is no need for the big loss in damage at that time, and if you want the crit, there's a nice selection of rings for it down the road.

Shano - Lost City

another one-shot guide b:dirty

Highestelf - Heavens Tear

I want to shed some light on the value of this guide.

One key argument made, early on, was that this guide was lacking pertinent details. While I understood the challengers argument, He demonstrated a clear misunderstanding of the point. The Author on the other hand, neglected to stress this point as he, understandably, was compelled to address the onslaught of abuse.

The point I alluded to was that this guide "did not" go into details for a reason. It was intended as a road map only, not a tour guide as so many other "guides" attempt to be.

Frankly, the other guides tend to be overwhelming to a new player, so much new terminology and acronyms to learn and interpret. I'm speaking from personal experience here.

At LVL 43 Cleric, I am still struggling to learn beneficial options and techniques to overcome mistakes made in my stat point allocation in first 20 lvl's - and improve on what I do have.

Frankly, I'm getting pretty frustrated at the rate of death I experience in the game. In an effort to overcome incorrect point allocation I have been dumping all stat points into MAG for 15 LVL's and then a few points here and there to VIT. I still have far too much in DEX which I would love to have in VIT.

It is not unusual for me to die 3 - 4 times on challenges against mobs my own LVL. I shudder at the thought that I lost the equivalent of about 2 or 3 LVL's worth of EXP from dying so often.

The stat point distribution is not much deviation from other guides I read, but I personally would be distributing the "saved" points between MAG and VIT. This is due to my own experience and hindsight.

I would actually like to see a couple, separate guides covering separate issues. Each guide done similar to this one. Keep this guide, then compliment it with a separate guide on the best ways to enhance equipment and weapons based on the role one has chosen, such as preference for HP or PHYS enhancements. And another guide focusing on Manufacturing or purchasing.

Guides that try to cover all of these tend to be overwhelming to newcomers. It is too much information to take in. I don't want to spend countless hours reading, I want to learn a bit, apply it, get comfortable and go back for more as I need it!

So, to sum up.... This is a great guide for the intent behind it.

And one final note, the debate and conflict of opinions made the discussion even more valuable as it hashed out some interesting perspectives for all to consider. So, although 2 individuals did not see eye to eye, the Guide and this thread have proved themselves beneficial to the community.