Pvp gets worse at 8x?

Fleuri - Sanctuary

Sylvae - Sanctuary wrote: »

How can people keep messing up a simple thing? + crit % is exactly equal to the + avg dmg. So a 4% crit increase is 4% more avg dmg.

If you start from no critical chance, this would make sense. But archers already have some critical chance.

So, for example, if your critical chance was 20% and if criticals double your damage and if you gain a 4% critical chance, your damage increase from that 4% critical chance would be 3.333%.

(But if criticals add your weapon's max damage (do they? I do not really know how criticals work) then how much damage you get from criticals would depend on your weapon's max damage instead of your weapon's average damage, and would totally favor crossbows.)

Elahim - Lost City wrote: »

Crits do double damage.

Total DPS = %Hit*(DPS + 2*DPS*CritChance)
Total DPS = %Hit*(DPS (1 + 2*CritChance))

Your equations say criticals do triple damage, on average. But I have never gotten anywhere close to triple my maximum damage.

Sylvae - Sanctuary

20% crit chance means out of every hundred, 80 normal attacks and 20 double damage.

80 + 20*2 = 120. 120 divided by the normal damage of 100 equals 120% dmg compared to normal 100%

An extra 4% means you have 24%. Out of every hundred, 76 normal attacks and 24 double damage.

76 + 24*2 = 124. 124 divided by the normal damage of 100 equals 124% dmg compared to normal 100%

It almost looks like you did some version based off of some of the crits from the 4% being counted under the 20%. So 80% normal attacks times 4% would be 3.2% extra. But you only do that when they are two seperate calculations that get run. PWI adds them. So 4% is added on to 20% to make 24%.

Fleuri - Sanctuary

Sylvae - Sanctuary wrote: »

80 + 20*2 = 120. 120 divided by the normal damage of 100 equals 120% dmg compared to normal 100%

An extra 4% means you have 24%. Out of every hundred, 76 normal attacks and 24 double damage.

76 + 24*2 = 124. 124 divided by the normal damage of 100 equals 124% dmg compared to normal 100%

It almost looks like you did some version based off of some of the crits from the 4% being counted under the 20%.

If you do 120 damage and you increase your damage to 124, your damage increase will be: 124/120 = 1.03333 -- in other words, you increased your damage by 3.33%

Sylvae - Sanctuary

2 different measurements that sound similar, but aren't. Extra averag damage is 4 in the example, and let's you know how much extra there is. The 3.3% one is for comparative purposes, and isn't how much extra damage is gained, but damage increase compared to current output.

Another way, when someone gets 25 phys attack boost on their weapon, they say 25 extra dmg or avg dmg. Not 25 divided by what they currently do. Because they will be doing 25 extra dmg each time they hit. Just like in the 100 hits example. In 100 hits, they will crit 4 extra times. Which comes out to 4 extra attacks worth of damage hitting.

Ratio will always be used for comparative purposes. If someone wants to know what they have gained, that's going to be simple addition and subtraction. Both are true. But people usually want how much they have gained. Because then they can use the numbers for other comparisons much easier.

Knowing 3.3% and then taking 98% of that to multiply by damage is too much effort. Just toss on the 4, 98% of that, and you get what you need. Using 4 is just a more ease of use than the other route.

Fleuri - Sanctuary

Sylvae - Sanctuary wrote: »

2 different measurements that sound similar, but aren't.

You are right, of course!

And when I want to compare your benefit from two different alternatives you must put them on an even footing. And, personally, if I am comparing some alternatives (added dexterity? added physical damage? added critical chance?), I like using "damage gained" because otherwise how can I account for my combined benefits with benefits I already have?

But I mostly ignore target defenses, because I mostly have no control over them. (But if I have some kind of choice which might let me reduce my target's defenses or which might give me advantages against only certain kinds of targets, I would have to try and see... because I am just too ignorant for any other approach.)

white7

sillyfoo wrote: »

When u fight bm try to make it an air battle if its on the ground u will lose most the time since they have cloudsprint, also use aim low not the three second stun cuzz to be honest three seconds isnt long enough for u to tick his heiro and do enough damage b4 he gets out of stun and stuns u. Barb is not worth trying because hp is too much to overcome one on one unless its a pure pvp barb with no vit which is hard to find. Max ur metal skills. when fighting bm do aim low, aoe metal move, hiero ticks then use ur other two metal moves and he should be dead if not repeat u will get a lucky crit eventually. If ur low on chi regular hit and keep flying around. If he gets close kite!!! Drop, fly around gain altitude. If he has faster flying mount this will be harder to do. Mage pk vs archer its whoever hits first light armor wont make much of a dif just imagine ur fighting another archer with a lot less dodge and light armor offers more magic def then physical so ur better off regular hitting with fury either way its a toss up against mage since their seal move can negate ur fury.

if is BM trying to kill you and you notice it sooner before he stun you(and kill),just aim low him and run away between your mates, as far as you can. 8 seconds are enough. Try to kill BM only on high lvl(80+ and i doubt you will succeed) or with some support, like another 1-2 DDs with you.

white7

Uhm, u said that slingshots arent good for pvp. i disagree with that.
As a balanced dex/vit archer, slingshots arent good. But when u r pure dex, and your crit rate is 20%+, combine it with shooting speed of, for example, wind and cloud, the enemy will get at least 1 critical hit for 6 seconds. And aim low freeze them for 8 seconds + use before/after aim low stunning arrow, and you got 11 seconds of free shooting. I usually use combo stunning,1 normal shot,aim low, normal shots/lightning (it depends on class) and it works pretty nice.

sillyfoo

white7 wrote: »

if is BM trying to kill you and you notice it sooner before he stun you(and kill),just aim low him and run away between your mates, as far as you can. 8 seconds are enough. Try to kill BM only on high lvl(80+ and i doubt you will succeed) or with some support, like another 1-2 DDs with you.

aim low only stops them from moving not from using skills so if hes in range he will stun u and hit u. I have beaten BM higher lvl then me 1 vs 1. I think its just cause i didnt explain it well in that paragraph but b4 he comes close or within range of stunning you should of droped already unless you have antistun pots. I was just giving him some techniques not the only way to do it. Archers can take bm even higher lvl bms in air battles. Range gives us the couple hits we need to win even though we have less hp. Im not saying you will win 100% of the time but it should give you a great chance.

edit: in that paragraph i was wrong about mages with light armor having less pdef since their stone barrier makes their pdef higher.

Chaotiic - Lost City

white7 wrote: »

Uhm, u said that slingshots arent good for pvp. i disagree with that.
As a balanced dex/vit archer, slingshots arent good. But when u r pure dex, and your crit rate is 20%+, combine it with shooting speed of, for example, wind and cloud, the enemy will get at least 1 critical hit for 6 seconds. And aim low freeze them for 8 seconds + use before/after aim low stunning arrow, and you got 11 seconds of free shooting. I usually use combo stunning,1 normal shot,aim low, normal shots/lightning (it depends on class) and it works pretty nice.

Sling is good for light/robes but bad for heavy classes, normal attack speed doesnt help against heavy who u have to use skills on. Xbow packs a bigger punch and yes sling does shoot faster and can **** light/robes but it they have high pdef such as a light mage or another archer with pdef gear ur screwed as u wont hit for much at all.

The combo u mentioned wont work as freeze is only useful on melee in which case u would be spamming lightning so attack speed doesnt help. For ranged classes if u can hit them they can hit u so freeze wold do nothing but be a waste of vigor.

Misty rings are bad