The Questions Everyon wants to know about the Cash Shop.

Kinohki - Lost City

Alright, since a lot of the posts the Kin has read has the mods complaining about not asking questions, the Kin has decided to make this thread. So Mods, PWI, whoever is out there lurking, if they even lurk, The Kin is asking you this. Note the Big Sized Bolded question that follows!

Are there any plans to change cash shop prices across the board by atleast 30-50%

OR

Are there any plans to change the conversion rate of the Dollar > Zen ratio from 1$ = 1 Zen?

There, the direct question has been asked. Now The Kin DEMANDS an answer!

[Disclaimer: The Kin was quite tired and irritable when making this post and the cash shop prices slowly dropping by stupid amounts over a period of time as new ones are released, on top of the insanely expensive items that are still 50$ USD and more provoked this response.]

Now let's wait and see if we get an answer guys. The Kin is also screen shotting this thread so proof of it's existence cannot be denied, incase shady tactics are utlized. =P
-Kinohki

Tomiko - Heavens Tear

The thread with 78 Pages of non-stop bickering didn't work so GL to this Bold LARGE fonts

vigor

Sorry but GMs don't visit this section. They made this section for cash shop just so they wouldn't have to see cash shop related questions and complaints in general forum and avoid them

dvorak

vigor wrote: »

Sorry but GMs don't visit this section. They made this section for cash shop just so they wouldn't have to see cash shop related questions and complaints in general forum and avoid them

nothing could be farther from the truth my friend.

this has been covered several times but i'll reiterate again - pricing concerns and issues are of paramount importance to the company (and obviously the users) and therefore such discussions are fully deserving of having their own dedicated forum.

Secondly, there are many staffers of PWE across all levels that need to be in tune with user feedback regarding pricing decisions and adjustments. Having a dedicated board that consolidates all related discussion in one centralized discussion makes it much easier for them to listen to what users have to say.

Wishfox - Lost City

I have a feeling that realistically, this is not something that they will change overnight. They just now finished up a month of operation in open beta with the cash shop open, around this week they're probably in-house, going over the financial results for september's launch and their labor costs vs their cash shop intake. After they go over the financials, they will then have to do some accounting to analyze the effect of a cash shop price drop. Calculating how many sales they need at whatever cost to maintain operational status, as well as estimating the increase in sales of certain items when they decrease in cost. I have a feeling with all of this feedback that we will see changes in the pricing, but probably not until December, or possibly after Q3 2008 fiscal analysis. You know how companies are. :P

Ciryas - Sanctuary

I know money through the cash shop is PWI's main income, but wouldn't lowering the prices or increasing the exchange rate actually give them MORE money, since more people might be willing to pay? People see 1 USD = 100 Zen and groan. But even if they made it 1 USD = 200 Zen, more people might actually buy things. If 1 person buys an item at $50 bucks, that's only $50. But if 3 people buy the same item at $25, that's $75 made. Less is more, isn't it?

zpirit

That logic only works if 3 people actually buys it, if only 2 buys it then it's only even and if 1 then they'll lose money.

There is of course a middle point which will optimize the profit and I'm sure that is what they're trying to find out.

On another note, the reason you see all complain posts on the forums is because the ones that are willing to pay and has paid, aren't complaining for obvious reason. The ones that can't afford or doesn't want to pay the price are the ones that are the loudest.

Ash - Heavens Tear

Ciryas - Sanctuary wrote: »

I know money through the cash shop is PWI's main income, but wouldn't lowering the prices or increasing the exchange rate actually give them MORE money, since more people might be willing to pay? People see 1 USD = 100 Zen and groan. But even if they made it 1 USD = 200 Zen, more people might actually buy things. If 1 person buys an item at $50 bucks, that's only $50. But if 3 people buy the same item at $25, that's $75 made. Less is more, isn't it?

I have to agree. Also, prices this inflated start to make you wonder if the company isn't only about taking advantage of its players. Charging so much for necessary things like inventory and charms makes you wonder if the whole design of the game wasn't set up to be crooked from the start. This set-up allows them to advertise as f2p when in actuality players need to spend big $$$$ to even be able to enjoy the game....

There should be enough inventory from the start, you shouldn't have to rely on cash shop charms at high levels, etc etc.... These things really make me wonder... It makes PW seem crooked. It might seem clever if the cash shop prices were affordable and reasonable, but THEY ARE NOT!

Oh, and if they're going to do something and lower the prices, I'd advise them to do it soon. They risk losing a lot of players and potential players from now until Dec..

They're in the process of launching the game here and exposing it to US players, are they not?? Word of mouth goes a long way and if people hear about how ridiculously expensive the cash shop items are and how the set-up seems crooked, potential new players will probably stick with games like WOW. The basic game design of this game in most respects is genius and way better than any other MMORPG online right now, so PWI could steal millions of players from WOW and other games like it eventually if they're SMART and go about things right. But not if you need to spend $100 a month just to store all your virtual herbs and regenerate your virtual mana.....................................

It's just DUMB to not lower the prices and not lower them SOON, imho.

Ash - Heavens Tear

zpirit wrote: »

On another note, the reason you see all complain posts on the forums is because the ones that are willing to pay and has paid, aren't complaining for obvious reason. The ones that can't afford or doesn't want to pay the price are the ones that are the loudest.

I've been willing to pay and have paid. But that stops at a certain point.... I don't intend to spend $100 a month on one little game when I could spend that money much better on 5-10 other games or REAL PHYSICAL clothes or much better other things! I don't mind at all paying the developers and designers what they deserve and helping them out. But there is a cut off point! $100 a month per person for a game is not reasonable for anyone with any semblance of sanity, imho. Even if you're filthy rich or your parents are filthy rich, it's still not a wise investment. You aren't getting your money's worth, just throwing it away... vaporizing it into thin air. It's a blatant rip-off. Whether you have the money or not. Or do you enjoy feeling like a sucker?

I'm perfectly willing to pay the price.... up to a point. But it stops somewhere.

Lypiphera - Heavens Tear

To avoid ripping off consumers who have already paid, the decrease would have to be on the cost of in game items, which it appears they're testing the effects of various item price drops in-game on a semi-weekly basis. Though it's tedious for those of us wanting things and having the patience to wait for the costs of things to drop to a level we consider reasonable, it's understandable to me the pace of their testing of the waters. They wouldn't be able to judge the effects of a change in just a few hours or a day or two as the weekly market is variable with the peak play obviously being on the weekends.

That being said, I have already spent a decent amount of money on zen in anticipation of those in-game items I want being released and hope that their release will be at a reasonable price, though not so reasonable a price that when playing I see everybody and their mother wearing the items I view as being worth spending money on. It's my feeling that aerogear and fashion wear should contain all the variety available on other servers and more, and that the pricesof those currently available should be cut in half, or at least a 40% reduction to encourage players to buy and utilize a greater variety.

Oh, and open the wardrobe and material storage already.

Kingpiccolo - Heavens Tear

Lowering the prices for Zen won't be ripping previous customers off. That's not how it works. Let's say you buy a banana, the next day the prices of bananas fall, you were NOT ripped off for your banana, you bought it at the market value at the time.

Obviously there are enough people who are willing to buy the Zen at the current prices that the admins do not see a problem keeping them at this level. There really isn't too much unreasonable things about the prices as they are, feel that it's too expensive? Don't buy it! There is absolutely nothing in the Cash shop that is absolutely vital that you need to spend real cash on. You could get Charms with in game gold, and at the levels that would actually require you to use charms they would be very affordable compared to the in game potions of the same level.

All other things are luxuries, if you can't afford them then don't buy them.

Lypiphera - Heavens Tear

I'd say zen:dollar dropping is a big difference. That'd be like me playing the international currency exchange, buying british pounds at current exchange of 1:$1.76 and then having the pound worth only 88 cents the next day. Changing in game prices is a more reasonable thing as it's only affecting the internal game market. Changing the zen per dollar amount is a different idea and would in fact rip off those customers who purchased zen in anticipation of items they wanted being released as they may not have spent the currency they purchased for use on the internal market.

I'm sure I'm not the only one anticipating future item price adjustments within game who has purchased zen in excess of their current demand for usage and if say zen price were cut in half, I would certainly want my unused zen doubled. I didn't buy the banana, I purchased the artificial currency to buy the banana with.

Zress - Lost City

Dvorak wrote: »

nothing could be farther from the truth my friend.

this has been covered several times but i'll reiterate again - pricing concerns and issues are of paramount importance to the company (and obviously the users) and therefore such discussions are fully deserving of having their own dedicated forum.

Secondly, there are many staffers of PWE across all levels that need to be in tune with user feedback regarding pricing decisions and adjustments. Having a dedicated board that consolidates all related discussion in one centralized discussion makes it much easier for them to listen to what users have to say.

I was fixing to say, these were created by the mod's to help them track and report it better, least that is what was told. And thank you all for doing a tough job too. It isnt easy, been there done that. And here I am being cranky on some posts... b:chuckle oh well, bad day dears.

Kingpiccolo - Heavens Tear

Lypiphera - Heavens Tear wrote: »

I'd say zen:dollar dropping is a big difference. That'd be like me playing the international currency exchange, buying british pounds at current exchange of 1:$1.76 and then having the pound worth only 88 cents the next day. Changing in game prices is a more reasonable thing as it's only affecting the internal game market. Changing the zen per dollar amount is a different idea and would in fact rip off those customers who purchased zen in anticipation of items they wanted being released as they may not have spent the currency they purchased for use on the internal market.

I'm sure I'm not the only one anticipating future item price adjustments within game who has purchased zen in excess of their current demand for usage and if say zen price were cut in half, I would certainly want my unused zen doubled. I didn't buy the banana, I purchased the artificial currency to buy the banana with.

So it's completely unreasonable for what you have to be worth half of what it is but it's totally reasonble for it's value to suddenly double? If you bought something and it dropped in value then it's perfectly within reason. Retailers have no responsibility over making sure their goods stay at the same value and as a monopoly of this good they are free to set their prices as they see fitting.

Lypiphera - Heavens Tear

My point wasn't so much that it was unreasonable to drop cost of zen, it was that such a move would be less fair to those players who have already invested money into unspent zen than it would be to drop prices of in game items as those can be viewed as luxury goods. Luxury good price would be expected to drop as better items become available or as more variety is introduced effectively creating internal competition in a way, old items struggling to sell as well as new items priced on the same pricing scale. And so I'm forseeing the game developers making the decision that as more new items are introduced, they'll be introduced at the current cost of similar items that are of a lower quality or expected to be of a lesser demand as they've become commonplace and thus less desirable. Hence to encourage purchasing of those items the prices of the items that have been available longer will be reduced to encourage continued purchasing of those items.

On a similar spectrum I'd expect in game prices of limited edition items such as the boa to increase as time progresses since maybe 30 players (by my guess based around how many I've seen being ridden in Heaven's Tear) on each server actually chose to purchase one. The availablity of said item(s) will never increase and will likely decrease as those players who purchased limited edition items eventually move on to other games (nobody plays a game forever) and as they won't be playing the game they will likely not care about selling their items for in game coin and the item will effectivey dissappear from the environment. (this whole paragraph is irrelevant to the point I'm really making)

If the developers expect their previously released items prices in game to decrease, there would be no reason for them to decrease the cost of the zen gold as well as it would create a double decline in their profit margin and effectively be a self-defeating business move.

vigor

Dvorak wrote: »

nothing could be farther from the truth my friend.

this has been covered several times but i'll reiterate again - pricing concerns and issues are of paramount importance to the company (and obviously the users) and therefore such discussions are fully deserving of having their own dedicated forum.

Secondly, there are many staffers of PWE across all levels that need to be in tune with user feedback regarding pricing decisions and adjustments. Having a dedicated board that consolidates all related discussion in one centralized discussion makes it much easier for them to listen to what users have to say.

Guess I was wrong

Kinohki - Lost City

Dvorak wrote: »

nothing could be farther from the truth my friend.

this has been covered several times but i'll reiterate again - pricing concerns and issues are of paramount importance to the company (and obviously the users) and therefore such discussions are fully deserving of having their own dedicated forum.

Secondly, there are many staffers of PWE across all levels that need to be in tune with user feedback regarding pricing decisions and adjustments. Having a dedicated board that consolidates all related discussion in one centralized discussion makes it much easier for them to listen to what users have to say.

Sorry my friend, but the Kin believes that listening is only half of the battle. To be better appreciated, you must atleast keep in touch with us, that "us" being the community. Even bits and pieces of information are welcome. If you know for a fact that prices could change, then all you have to do is say so, keep some sort of hope for us. There are ways of wording things to keep the community atleast somewhat informed, yet without revealing information that may be misleading. That would be more welcome than just stayin silent. Codemasters done that, and well, when they promised us a patch on RF, we got no word for over six, yes 6 months then suddenly out of the blue, they announce the game is shutting down. That hurt the Kin very badly.

In any case, The Kin realizes that the wheels are constantly turning on your end and that things change. However, if you know something can, will or may change, do not hesitate to share it with us. Giving vague statements, albeit as long as they are not repetitive, is much more welcoming as well as comforting than just staying silent and keeping us guesses. As for now, these sales are a step in the right direction, and the fact that you are lowering prices as the cash shop releases more items has the Kin guessing that once the game releases into full release, the items "migh" be more affordable.

However, allow the Kin to say this. The Kin for one, absolutely REFUSES to spend large amounts of money in game. For example, the mounts and such. Although the boa is limited and all shiny, the fact that it is 60$ USD is simply a joke. C'mon, seriously. Who has sixty dollars to just throw away? And yes, need before greed, is how The Kin and a lot of people nowadays think. That is also how the PWE should think, however it seems that is not the case. The Kin does like this game, however he has not logged on in a while due to simply waiting for the prices to fall. Although the cash shop is not required, the prices are still a joke to The Kin.

Lypiphera - Heavens Tear

For example, the mounts and such. Although the boa is limited and all shiny, the fact that it is 60$ USD is simply a joke.

Ok, I'm seriously missing something, was it $60 on lost city and $50 on heaven's tear? But yeah, comparatively like I said (I think in this thread) $50 was just a $5 uphike from 2 equivalent level 60 pets+their upgrade, and since the boa in my opinion is more attractive than the raptor or the kirin, it's worth it costing more. Yes, stuff needs a price scaling. At current prices, people will buy stuff for themselves, but not likely for their good game friends who can't afford stuff. charge $5 forthe panther and problem fixed, more people buying it, cheap enough to buy for a friend to speed them up in game so you don't have to wait around for them to run across the map. But yeah, you want a L40 panther, people are constantly selling them in arch, it's the 20s that are harder to come across and expensive. So yes, kirin and raptor price drop 3 weeks ago was excellent move, and imo those two only need another $5 drop, though every other ride pet needs a $5 drop as well. Yes, that's percent scaling from 18.88...% to 50% and may not make a bit of sense to some of you. So, I say this: gasoline prices...

Tenderloin - Sanctuary

Well they could always do a promo sale like buy $50 worth of ZEN and get 30-50% more ZEN for free.. that way people would be encouraged to charge more $50 bucks to take advantage of the free zen.

smoo

I'll put in my 2 cents:

I used the quest makeover scroll. Mainly to free up a slot.

Then, (typical for me) after a while, I realized that i wanted to go back and tweak just a couple things.

I'm not gonna do that for 2 bucks. Less than a buck, like 25 silver, sure. But do I REALLY look at my chars face enough to justify losing 2 bucks? No.


Also: hp/mp charms. For the current prices, I might get ONE hp charm on my archer. Then I avoid using it whenever possible. My 100k charm lasted from the 10k noob one running out till lvl 40+. No mana charm ever.

Now, if they were cheaper, I'd consider buying an MP charm and using it to spamkill, then buy another after that runs out, etc. I would also wince less when my HP charm just barely activates due to poison that wouldn't have killed me before the potion worked.

So yeah. I would probably make worse decisions money-wise if stuff was cheaper. Heck, I'd have bought a mount by now if the prices were more reasonable. But as it stands... I spent my money preordering Dead Space.