Does Dawnlight Halls require keys to enter?

keihan007#7641

Is it spammable or do you need some sort of keys to enter? Sneak peak spoke of none so I would expect it to be spammable but I rather not get my hopes up for nothing.

kalystconquerer#0876

You receive a batch of little "feathers" (or keys I guess we can just call them) when you get the requirements. It's not spamable to my knowledge and they might have made it that way so people don't suddenly get level 10 Glyphs in a short amount of time. You can still get Glyph packs from turning in badges at the Royal Knight Hector NPC in Neverfall, so you won't be restricted to just farming Dawnlight Halls for Glyphs.

sin20

This is really disappointing , same as up/dup , because of lack of 'keys' to enter a lot of people are struggling to make decent squads most of the times simply cause there's this stupid 1key per day limitation.
If we get that on new instance aswell thats gonna suck again for a lot of ppl and kill their desire to do the instance and farm the mats and they will struggle to keep up and slowly semiquit / quit.

perrion

I expected as much. Another wasted opportunity to actually add life to this decaying corpse of a game.

With the low server populations that we have, these once a day instances really are a hindrance. People struggle to find enough players to build squads, especially later in the day.

I miss the days of Nirvana and TT spam. There was always something profitable to do and the economy was robust. People with time would farm, people with money would buy, everyone was happy.

These artificial restraints on running the latest instances are hurting the game. I've run UP maybe 1/2 a dozen times, and never even bothered to try UPD. With drops being so extremely limited, there is just no point in wasting time on them. What was it, 17 years, the expected amount of time needed to run UP daily to get enough mats to make a G17-5 weapon?

darkfalconknight

im expecting alot more players quit after this monstrocity since it takes too long to farm/do much of anything without it taking months or even a couple yrs to complete and ive already given up on anything solid coming from the pwcn numbskulls. all ive done is just gone to soloing bhs for my alts and anything pve related on whats left. I think you guys need to start drawing the line to where the buck stops here and either quit donating funds to a game that no longer puts your best interest but rather satisfies the kids who want everything handed to them on a silver platter INSTANTLY, or find another game where it does alot of things you want out of a game. Such as the following: nothing op/power creep, earn coin in game without it being nerfed, class balance ( if there can be such a thing), bugs, glitches, etc get fixed within days instead of weekly. And anything else that may come to mind.

sin20

I see ppl almost daily looking for more either dd's , or seeker/bm/sb for debuffs for around 30mins minimum to 1h easy to make a squad for regular up.
A lot of ppl gave up on doing squads for up because it takes so long 30-60mins to just make a squad cause they cant find dds since most ppl got either daily squads or arent just interested in doing it anymore.
And its killing their desire to farm cause with all this dailies and what not who's got 1h to make a squad for up rofl?
This could be fixed easy , enable us to enter UP and new instance more then once a day , either completely remove that limitation or give us like 3 keys per day...

ballenato

kalystconquerer#0876 wrote: »

You receive a batch of little "feathers" (or keys I guess we can just call them) when you get the requirements. It's not spamable to my knowledge and they might have made it that way so people don't suddenly get level 10 Glyphs in a short amount of time. You can still get Glyph packs from turning in badges at the Royal Knight Hector NPC in Neverfall, so you won't be restricted to just farming Dawnlight Halls for Glyphs.

Great... Another way to kill this game... Making farming this instance to become an endless thing... U guys dont learn anything do you??

Look at the G17 weapon. It's been officially a year since it was released. How many ppl got g17 weapon on high stages? there are several S3... maybe a hand of s4?... Not even 1 s5...
And U guys are about to release same thing, with the ring, cape, helmet... Another year that we wont see any of the higher stages of those gears...

And now, it's the same novela with skills??? Put this comment on favs till Abril 2018. NOBODY will have a skill with lvl 10 rune. I bet on it!

keihan007#7641

ballenato wrote: »

And now, it's the same novela with skills??? Put this comment on favs till Abril 2018. NOBODY will have a skill with lvl 10 rune. I bet on it!

Nobody would have one even if the instance was spammable. The amounts of glyphs high levels require are just insane.

angellicdeity

I said it before, these recent expansions have been doomed to fail. The "keys-to-enter" concept was tried and failed back when Nirvana was still a thing and that was 2009/2010. PWI needs to stop doing this. The only successful end-game instances have been FSD and FSJ. While you can only collect rewards once a day - you can enter multiple times a day. All these stupid "key-entry" mechanics do is kill this game.

perrion

Actually Nirvana worked pretty well I thought. Keys were a limit, but you gained 3+ a day and you could stockpile them to use as you wished. I think this was quite a good compromise. The instance had limits to control spam abuse but still allowed for bursts of activity when players had time available.

angellicdeity

perrion wrote: »

Actually Nirvana worked pretty well I thought. Keys were a limit, but you gained 3+ a day and you could stockpile them to use as you wished. I think this was quite a good compromise. The instance had limits to control spam abuse but still allowed for bursts of activity when players had time available.

It never worked well. Every key-based entry dungeon in PWI has created cliques and small groups of players that will run exclusively together. Whenever there is a limited entry system people suddenly behave much differently. There is 0 opportunity for having a bad squad. FSD and FSJ were good instances because people were willing to take risks as there was no penalty if the squad failed.

perrion

The "loss" for a blown Nirvana was minimal. Even if the run was somehow unsalvageable, it was very rare to be so low on keys that it would matter. Cliques form because fast reliable runs form bonds among the participants. It was the same way when TT was farmed, there were no keys in sight.

koudelkamorgan

Keys need to go away. I haven't bothered with UP, and won't bother with DH either. Nirvana is dead. What would be the worst outcome of letting players access any content they want at any time? You might actually have players online all day instead of 2 hours after reset and nothing but catshops the rest of the day?

Yeah that sounds terrible, why would you want that?

catgirldesu

I already brought it up in another thread, but yeah, limiting instance entry to keys is terrible. Maybe it works in PWCN, but not here.

At the very least they should increase the daily key to three. Nirvana was a good compromise, as someone else said, because it still left room for failure. Not to mention, with lvl1 Glyphs being trade-able we could have had a great market.

beast21g

Glyphs packs will be on boutique ?

bloodedone87

I am glad that I uninstalled this game now. It has become a waste of space.
But you know what PW? You should make all instances key based. Warsong, Delta, Lunar, Sot, Abba. Even the FB 19-89 ones should be key based. This way you will finally unplug this game from the life support machine that its on.
Oh and I saw that you gonna remove the game from steam. I wonder why?

werewolves#6809

This could be fixed easy , enable us to enter UP and new instance more then once a day , either completely remove that limitation or give us like 3 keys per day...

While this may work, maybe a possible nerf like no rewards or smaller rewards on the next runs.

As I think like as in UP the drops will have to be shared maybe made a npc they need to talk to after each boss which gives random items or a sadness card, so you still have the bonus mats can get in a run, but not have it go crazy.

And that quest at the npc could be once a day, this means that people that have run already can go help guildmates etc, or try out different combos to see if that works.

Personly I plan to see a few people try out this instance first hand, watch a vid for it in english, then try it

zentfamily

Like all content updates, we'll get few of the new items at the begining and the amount obtained will increase after a fe w months. It's was like that with avatars, it was like that with charts. Will definetely be with glyphs.

The only issue with all this complaining is people can't have things maxed as fast as they want. So the whine,

Now, for the entrance limitation, maybe ask PWCN if they could increase the number of "keys" we get. At least to two. I know this is essencially a no from them, but maybe in a future patch.

kalystconquerer#0876

Glyphs have other sources that are not just limited to the one a day in Dawnlight Hall, as I mentioned earlier. For my own curiosity, I checked the Royal Night Hector NPC and it's five Squire Badges for one Glyph Pack Lv 1. You get a decent stack of badges going through the main questline for Neverfall.

There are no Glyph packs in the boutique at this time and I haven't heard any plans from CN currently regarding this.

Don't forget that I always find way to address supply issues if it becomes a big enough issue though contests, changes in TW/xTW rewards, tournaments etc. And outside of things I do here, I can also start talking to them about events in game that will have these as rewards. To try and change any mechanics of dungeons depends on how they set it up and if a key system is just purely for entry or if it's hard coded for explicitly a "1 per day only" rule. So for anything changing in game mechanics, that would have to be a back and forth with CN. I wouldn't be surprised if in a few months they put out other in-game ways to get said Glyphs or as a reward for another PvP type event.

perrion

I'm less concerned about the availability of the glyphs than the playability of the instance as a whole. A hard coded 1 per day instance is just awful. With so few active players to begin with, having a system that removes players from the pool once they do a single run makes filling squads an arduous task. This is supposed to be a game, entertainment, fun. Forcing people to go through hoops just to "play" is a terrible idea. Friends who start playing at slightly different times often can't run together because one may have already used his ticket for the day.

It's a **** system and there is zero need for it. If glyphs were produced at 100x the rate, Level 10 would still take obscenely long to achieve. Longevity will not be severely effected.

sin20

If you can enter 2nd time and get half of even no drops is just as bad as being able to enter just once imo and it wont make ppl do the instance more , maybe like 2-5% of would help and rest would just stay away from instance.
With that being said getting more DH drops from lets say spend promo, login event , or some other events wont help at all with massive demand for them because it will proly be just bound and like 5-10 mats per 6 months when u need 500x that amount to actually get something decent.

So being able to enter DH lets say 2-3 times per day and get full drop would be actually really good , and there will be still only 1 daily q for that instance which gives few mats, otherwise we are stuck with farming it for years.

Also i doubt ppl will have time and will to spam for 1-2h to find enough decent dds to actually do the instance with all stuff they gotta do already on pwi (lets say dailies , fsp , up , dh , bh , if new bh puts u in maze gg waste time there aswell and other stuff i forgot), all that will just drop our already low activity on servers and make more ppl inactive or semiquit.

ballenato

kalystconquerer#0876 wrote: »

Glyphs have other sources that are not just limited to the one a day in Dawnlight Hall, as I mentioned earlier. For my own curiosity, I checked the Royal Night Hector NPC and it's five Squire Badges for one Glyph Pack Lv 1. You get a decent stack of badges going through the main questline for Neverfall.

There are no Glyph packs in the boutique at this time and I haven't heard any plans from CN currently regarding this.

Don't forget that I always find way to address supply issues if it becomes a big enough issue though contests, changes in TW/xTW rewards, tournaments etc. And outside of things I do here, I can also start talking to them about events in game that will have these as rewards. To try and change any mechanics of dungeons depends on how they set it up and if a key system is just purely for entry or if it's hard coded for explicitly a "1 per day only" rule. So for anything changing in game mechanics, that would have to be a back and forth with CN. I wouldn't be surprised if in a few months they put out other in-game ways to get said Glyphs or as a reward for another PvP type event.

Nobody cares about getting some freebies outta the main questline...
Cause the questline only happens once... It's not something U can FARM or do daily to make porfit, or that would benefit your toon

keihan007#7641

ballenato wrote: »

Nobody cares about getting some freebies outta the main questline...
Cause the questline only happens once... It's not something U can FARM or do daily to make porfit, or that would benefit your toon

Unless, of course, if you got alts. Guess I be dusting off my alts I havent logged in months for this =/.

sin20

saxroll wrote: »

ballenato wrote: »

Nobody cares about getting some freebies outta the main questline...
Cause the questline only happens once... It's not something U can FARM or do daily to make porfit, or that would benefit your toon

Unless, of course, if you got alts. Guess I be dusting off my alts I havent logged in months for this =/.

As i heard to be able to enter new instance you need to be TS1+ so for new area it stands to reason that there will also be some req to be able to enter the map and do questline and dailies that will supposedly give mats also, if all that is true lets just hope mats we get wont all be untradeable since its easy for them to make 2 sets of items , one tradeable other untradeable and fk us up like with everything else xD

kalystconquerer#0876

Badges you can get from doing dailies inside Neverfall as well. The ones you get from the main questline definitely gives you a good starting boost- I mentioned these first since that was the first thing I remembered regarding obtaining them. There's also some interesting things I found about the Glyphs such as -

+You can combine Glyphs of unlike type that are the same level as the one you're combining into, but the resulting Glyph will be what you end up with i.e. if you have a Red Glyph in the middle and you combine a Blue and a Green to it, you'll end up with a Red one.

+You can combine Glyphs of varying levels, but it'll hurt the chance rate i.e. if you want to make a 4 you can combine your middle one (Lv 3) and add some Lv 1's, but the chance rate is lower than if you combined all the same level.

I think it's too early to decide one was or another on how Glyph supply will actually go and if the restrictions on Dawnlight Hall will hurt the entire system. That being said, this will be something I'll be keeping an eye on post launch!

sin20

kalystconquerer#0876 wrote: »

Badges you can get from doing dailies inside Neverfall as well. The ones you get from the main questline definitely gives you a good starting boost- I mentioned these first since that was the first thing I remembered regarding obtaining them. There's also some interesting things I found about the Glyphs such as -

+You can combine Glyphs of unlike type that are the same level as the one you're combining into, but the resulting Glyph will be what you end up with i.e. if you have a Red Glyph in the middle and you combine a Blue and a Green to it, you'll end up with a Red one.

+You can combine Glyphs of varying levels, but it'll hurt the chance rate i.e. if you want to make a 4 you can combine your middle one (Lv 3) and add some Lv 1's, but the chance rate is lower than if you combined all the same level.

I think it's too early to decide one was or another on how Glyph supply will actually go and if the restrictions on Dawnlight Hall will hurt the entire system. That being said, this will be something I'll be keeping an eye on post launch!

Tbh its not to early to decide how supply will go since we already see it with UP and g17 wep mats so you can understand why ppl are sceptical.
Can you clarify what are req to enter new map and to have access to new dailies and will mats obtained from said dailies be tradeable?

rieihdius

Honestly I lost interest in this whole new update since months ago, from the moment I saw what was the main purpose of the whole thing. Just to summarize:

- Giant new map to explore (good)

- probably some sort of chain quest to get a new culti level and some items to get new skills (ok I guess)

- new daily quest to farm some glyph to get new skill (ok i guess eventhough some people are tired of that)

- Daily instance catered to overgeared people that always complain about how easy the game is, but are the first to use spark kill squads to finish the thing as fast as posible due being to hard/annoying/boring/etc (bad)

- Skills that are farmed by doing all the above and that most likely require an insane amount of mats and/or billions of coins in order to get something alf decent (Bad)

- New pvp arena (good)

At first glance there are only 2 bad things on that list, only problem is that the skills are most important, the one thing that the whole update revolves around.

Don't get me wrong, I am not ranting or anything, but I feel that since the Elysium Update this game started a road of no return to fail and lose playerbase, at least on our version.

If we take the whole homestead/g17 thing as example:
- You need to build a house that drains coins, and to level it up to get alf of the mats for the weapon, that is a lot of coin.
- You need to do some really annoying instance in order to get the other alf of the mats.
- You need to farm said place for about.... what was it? 17 years to get the mats for the final cast... lel.....

If we add to that, at some point they put lvl 3 atk/def shards turning certain people in some sort of DBZ char instead of a player.
And even worse if we add that the number of overgeared people is actually not low compared to average or low geared people, we have a game that is extremely one sided pvp wise.

I found funny how people on the past always complained about how hard everything was. But the true is that farming TT, Lunar, Vana and Warsong, even on low gear was actually easy compared to this ''new slavery system'' that they put on the last few years.
In order to make one of the cast of one of those g17 weapons, not even the last stage, you need hundreds or even thousands of mats.

Now the whole g17 thing I understand since those weapons are top tier, but making some instance to farm skills like you farm weapons is silly.

Skills should be easy to obtain for everyone, not catered just to a few docens of people runing on 30k+ USD gear.
And please bear in mind that I say this as someone with good gear. I honestly don't think that problems lies on the limitation to enter the instance, the problem is the instance itself and the insane amounts of mats needed to make those skills.

EDIT: When I say skill Im talking about the whole rune/glyph thing, my bad on that

heerohex#3018

Nirvana worked very well. Stack keys use when you can. Just like AEU n EU. Even with no keys groups of people that farm will start.

The problem comes from timed events like NW. Where people can even do these for key parts to make gear.

Time also plays a part. If you have time your fine, No Time you can keep up with money. I never say no to a bit of charging but within your means... Its what keeps the game running after all.

Cuz people can't keep up. People leave. FSP has helped but it's already to late.

catgirldesu

To be fair, there was a time when getting certain Sage/Demon or level 100 skills was a real achievement. People got used to skills being so easy to obtain now.

Most people can manage to get the merged skills and basic level 1 Glyphs for all effects. That will be good enough for a while seeing as people who farm regularly will probably get level 5 Glyphs (tier 2 effects) and then hit a dead end. The more motivated/dedicated will choose to go on and eventually get some level 8 Glyphs (tier 3 effects). Anything more than that I believe is impossible for at least a year.

Though Glyphs give some stats, but not sure how big the difference is between lvl1 and lvl5.

Don't get me wrong though, I don't agree with skills being treated as elite gear. I believe skills should be a sort of achievement, but still something everyone can get with a bit of dedication. I'm skeptical about it, like everyone else, but I also want to enjoy the expansion and worry later.

kalystconquerer#0876

The Attack and Defense Level +3 Shards were available in game through using Flowing Crystals to upgrade them. Granted you needed the +2 in your armors already to do this and not until recently did they start going on sale (Flowing Crystals). +3 Attack Stones though I believe started getting introduced into Charge Rewards right before sales on those Crystal packs were a more frequent thing.

With the badges you get from the main questline, you can actually get a good chunk of your new skills for free right away (however you'll need to hit the new Cultivation to be able to use them) but I didn't go through and screenshot all of the exchanges for the teaser blogs.

There is an important point about looking back and revisiting Homestead related content just to see how that's going. I'm slowly working on the supply issues for the harder materials (TW rewards should have been dispensed already, if not next week). Thursday Night Fights Cross Server, maybe taking a look at the new Arigora Rankings if those can be used as well, contests and even looking into running Tournament circuits are all solutions I've been looking at to fix some of these issues in the meantime. For the lower end materials, some of these items get disbursed into free codes, but if we have had a dry spell recently let me know!

Part of the issues that I've noticed with the newer instances (and even Flowsilver Palace to some extent) is that squads intentionally gate randoms by asking for links on gears/weapons. If we create easier content or scale down, players will still want to smash it as fast as possible. So I think this makes a "between a rock and a hard place" situation, because some people will want the next challenging thing- make it too challenging however, and you frustrate people. I'd love to talk to the devs in the future just to get their thoughts on this!

As always I'll be keeping an eye on things, so we'll see how things shake out!

keihan007#7641

kalystconquerer#0876 wrote: »

Part of the issues that I've noticed with the newer instances (and even Flowsilver Palace to some extent) is that squads intentionally gate randoms by asking for links on gears/weapons. If we create easier content or scale down, players will still want to smash it as fast as possible. So I think this makes a "between a rock and a hard place" situation, because some people will want the next challenging thing- make it too challenging however, and you frustrate people. I'd love to talk to the devs in the future just to get their thoughts on this!

Large reason for that actually is the key restrictions. You dont want to risk using your key for nothing, hence you gate lower geared players or randoms from your squads and run with the ppl you can count on. Which is why removing restrictions would actually be pretty good way of handling the new instances as then losing a run doesnt **** you over too badly as you only lost time.