DISCUSS: New Mystic Skills

koryn7

Hi guys!

I just got the new ultimate mystic skill and was wondering if anyone else had thoughts on it or the other skills? I like the idea that leeching it gives basically devil and mistress's leeching buffs simultaneously. That could be nice. But I don't really know what kind of merit it has with the 80% absorption of damage or how hard it will hit on explosion. I guess I'll have to wait til NW to play with it. Maybe someone who pk's on the open map has played with it a bit?

Any thoughts on the other skills?

chary

I have not tested the ulti skill yet either. My guess is you'll probably want to leech it instead of letting it explode though.

I'd say the best out of the the three updated skills is going to 100% be the upgrade to Lucky Break. Thicket's usefulness is probably going to sink as more people get defensive wep procs and I'm not 100% sold on going ahead and grabbing the plant upgrade, but I think that's more due to pve reasons...​​

capnk

Got the new Lucky Break already and loving it. I haven't decided if I'm getting the combined plant or not. I like to combo befuddling or spidervine after listless and I'm worried that punishing sting will wake them up.

azizatoinette

I advice you to wait with spellbound sting. A mystic on my server got it and he had to lyse it 3 times..once for each plant. We don't know if it plays a factor that his lysing was the old version (the one with lotus graphic) though.

chary

Asked a mystic in guild that got the combined plants. Yes, you have to lyse one by one and apparently can't choose the order, but the debuffs aren't random like with non-combined plants (i.e. you use the skill, anyone that gets in range of the plants will have all possible debuffs from Befuddling+Spider) and the aoe damage reduction works well (I hit 88 damage on them with aoe vs. one-shotting them with single target damage).

idk yet.​​

capnk

How does the aoe reduction work? Do you have to stand near your plants, or do you get it when you lyse them? Is it a buff? How long does it last?

chary

The aoe reduction is on the plants themselves so they don't die to random aoes and stays for the duration of the plant. It makes it so people actually have to target and use a single target attack to kill the plant. You do not get the reduction yourself.​​

capnk

Ugh this skill just sounds worse and worse. Think I'll skip it.

koryn7

I'm pretty sure I don't want to get the new plant upgrade. The loss of flexibility and the chi cost just doesn't make it worth it to me and also I agree with capnk that it would suck if you debuffed after listless and it woke the target up, which logically would happen with the upgraded plant.

BUT...I did some experimenting with the Voidbringer pet. It says that it only absorbs 80% of the damage directed at you, but I took it to the boss that oneshots near Liu Soo when you are doing the daily and I let the boss hit me. It oneshot the pet instead of me. I didn't take any damage at all. I think more experimenting is in order.

To try: jumping in the lava in FS with the pet out, getting the oneshot debuff on you from toad and seeing if it oneshots the pet instead of the mystic, standing new a yellow plant at succubus, etc.

If anyone else wants to try these or other similar things, it would be good to establish whether the pet absorbs all oneshots and DoT oneshots as well.

koryn7

Also, loving the new lucky break!

capnk

Omg yes upgraded Lucky Break is amazing. Had another mystic complaining that we got lackluster skill updates compared to other classes. I was like dude they took our best skill and made it three times as good.

klys

The new combined plant skill is a downgrade. I'd advise mystics to avoid it.

New crit skill is nice when ur assisting your DDs, cuz who needs to heal their team when enemy is dead #supportclass

Thicket is, meh. Doesn't hurt to upgrade a little, but doesn't change gameplay at all.

Void might be neat. No further comments until i've upgraded to lv 2 and had time to use it more.

azizatoinette

Pwi is going stupid..the description of spellbound is different if you look in your skill menu or at the book at the npc...also you gotta hover the mouse over the text:lvl 1 at the voidbringer skill to find out it lasts 30sec at lvl 2...furthermore the book says the voidbringer do more dmg but the lvl 2 description states the same exploding dmg so unless it's own skills get higher dmg or if it get a higher % of your stats then I can't see what's the benefit beside the 15 extra secs. And thicket..I use it to stop people I wont/cant get close to..not for it's low dmg. if it was x48 or more of our weapon dmg then i might start to see the usefulness but x24..wont do an epic difference..

capnk

Tested Spellbound Sting with another mystic on server that got it. It breaks sleep immediately. It does seem to apply all the debuffs at once, so either very high or 100% chance of that happening.

I advise not getting it if you like to combo other plants with sleep.

jasgar

Thicket before and after vs 42427 wood defense, 64 def levels, 1449 spirit.

Demon Thicket: 590 x 4
Omega Thicket: 1879 x 4

2360 damage vs 7516 damage (each hit also can be affected by its own amp.)

Spellbound Sting: Proc rate of 100% makes it more reliable than previous versions, with no need to detonate. 95% damage reduction from aoes mean the plants will stay up. If someone does decide to single attack them, think of of it as damage mitigation, up to 3 more hits that weren't aimed at you. Chi cost is the same as Spidervine by itself, so this is not technically an increase. 12 second cooldown.

chary

Admittedly I haven't bothered to grab any new skills lately, just collecting the seals, but thicket's able to crit now? Uhhh...wow, that should bring back it back up to being able to insta charm tick people?​​

jasgar

Correction: the thicket damage is affected by its own amp. It does not actually crit.

chary

Well there goes my excitement.​​

capnk

Got level 2 Voidbringer today. Tested before and after on the damage test dummy. Everything is the same with level 2, the only change is that it lasts 30 seconds instead of 15 seconds.

This pet is pretty bad as a pve pet. Normal attack and aoe were hitting test dummy for 22k, strong skill was hitting 33k. Long cooldowns on each. Explosion from getting destroyed was hitting dummy for 169-200k (variance because it's based on your magic attack not pet's). I would expect it to do about 5000 damage on explosion to a rank 9 player.

So I would recommend using this pet solely for its damage-absorption and/or to leech it. Stick with Storm Mistress in PVE.

pwisintoon

I thought void explosion was missing/glitched. I couldn't get it to go off on multiple tests- at least in pk- I haven't tried it in pve.

koryn7

I also got the level 2 Voidbringer. Same results on the test dummy as @capnk , no change in stats or damage with level two pet and I agree with his recommendations. Definitely not worth it in pve unless for some reason you need massive damage absorption or want to leech it for giggles. I used the level 1 version in TW last week. It's really helpful if something happens to the cleric and you need to spend a lot of time just healing your squad. I pulled it out, healed and healed pet until the timer ran out, then before it disappeared, then I leeched it for more defense while I kept healing. Plus it increases magic attack after leech as well which makes your heals stronger. All in all, I feel like this pet is very useful in pk in general and especially in mass pk but not really worth it in pve. I feel like it should do more at level two but I suppose 30 secs is nice
Also, he looks pretty cool

@pwisintoon I haven't had problems with the void explosion. It has always worked for me and hits quite hard, if the Voidbringer actually dies before the timer runs out...It would be awesome if it mass sealed upon death as well at level two but I suppose that would be too much to ask...

capnk

Well I will say that I haven't *noticed* the explosion going off in PVP, but since it's probably not going to kill anyone there's not much to notice. It definitely works on pve test dummy though.

koryn7

Spellbound Sting: Full review and testing information

Hi guys

I decided to take the plunge and get the upgraded plant skill (Spellbound Sting). I then enjoyed testing them on my baby alt T3 cleric and in several instances! If you have additional questions about usage, stats, or "what if" scenarios, let me know please! I'll be glad to test anything out you like. I really enjoyed playing around with this.

A. Some general facts:

1. This skill replaces the three original "offensive" plants (Befuddling Creeper, Spidervine, and Punishing Sting). Once you learn the new upgraded version, you definitely lose the other three.
2. This skill costs 30 chi and has a 12 sec CD.
3. When you cast Spellbound Sting, you summon all three plants at once. Each plant casts it's own particular debuffs or in the case of Punishing Sting, does physical damage.
4. Instead of a chance to evade damage, each plant now has a buff that enables it to resist 95% of aoe damage meaning that they last much longer at aoeing bosses and from players who try to aoe them in PvP.
5. One second after you cast the skill, the plants IMMEDIATELY debuff/attack continuously. There is never a moment when they do not apply debuffs. (The application of debuffs in the past versions of the plants was completely random and unreliable, always changing unless lysed, then they would last about 12 seconds) Now, your target will be fully debuffed for one minute.
6. You may lyse the plants. If you lyse the plants, they lyse in a fixed, consistent order: Punishing Sting, Befuddling Creeper, and finally Spidervine. I tried this a few times and they always lysed in the same order. Once you lyse a plant, it applies its debuffs one final time and disappears. For example, you cast the skill and lyse twice. Only Spidervine will be left and the only debuffs applied will be Spidervine's.


B. Stat/DamageTesting on Cleric alt:

1. Cleric's original stats:

Physical Attack: 2859-3219, Magic Attack: 22380-27175
Physical Defense: 4771, Magic Defense: 23448

2. Cleric's stats debuffed by individual non-upgraded plant skills:

Physical Attack: 2454-2762, Magic Attack: 21835-26513
Physical Defense: 4299, Magic Defense: 21730
Original Punishing Sting's Constant Damage: 851, Lysed Punishing Sting Damage: 3400

3. Cleric's stats debuffed by NEW Spellbound Sting

Physical Attack: 2352-2648, Magic Attack: 21699-26340
Physical Defense: 4063, Magic Defense: 20872
Upgraded Punishing Sting's Constant Damage: 1046, Lysed Punishing Sting Damage: 4100

-You can definitely see improved debuffing and damage as part of the upgrade, even though it's not mentioned in the skill description.
-I'm too tired to do math tonight so I'll do it later.

C. Other Testing

1. You can now debuff wood immune mobs/towers in SoT with Spellbound Sting.
2. You can have BOTH healing and offensive plants at the same time. Used to be only Vital could be used simultaneously with one debuffing plant. If you summon Spellbound Sting, and then summon Healing Herb, Healing herb will replace Spidervine leaving Healing Herb, Befuddling Creeper and Punishing Sting all working at the same time. If you summon Vital Herb next, it will replace Spidervine and Befuddling Creeper but leave Punishing Sting, so that you have both healing plants and Punishing Sting out. (Note: I will try summoning Vital Herb first to see if it will replace Creeper or Spidervine tomorrow. Basically, it seems that you can just have a maximum of three at a time. I haven't tried with Listless yet, so I'll also play with that tomorrow.)
3. If a cleric tries to purify the debuffs of Spellbound Sting or if a caster gets a puri proc from weapon, all the debuffs are immediately reapplied until the plants are killed or timer runs out on them.
4. The plants DEFINITELY wake up a sleeping target. So, trying to debuff with plants after you sleep won't work.


D. Remarks and Conclusions

1. The consistent debuffing is an improvement. This completely renders lysing of Spellbound Sting nearly pointless because the debuffs are always constant for the full duration of the plant's summoning.
2. The percentage debuffed and also the damage increase on Punishing Sting is a plus.
3. The AOE reduction is excellent! People will at least have to target a plant to get rid of it.
4. I miss being able to debuff after sleep but all in all I think it's worth the upgrade.
5. It could be annoying to proc a caster's puri wep while trying to debuff. The debuffs will continuously be applied so that's not a problem, BUT the antistun might be!


Will post updates later!

capnk

Upcoming skills in next China expansion:


Sage/Demon Vital Herb: increased healing based on your magic attack, healing increases over time. There's a % difference between the two versions but it's unspecified currently.

Sage/Demon Healing Herb: increased healing based on your magic attack. There is no listed difference between sage and demon

Nature's Barrier: reduced incoming damage received

Energy Leech: instant cast

Transfusion: boosted skill effect

=======================
Well hopefully this makes Vital and Healing Herb worth casting - currently they're pointless for any endgame things. Nature's Barrier needed a buff, it's a little weak. Energy Leech being instant is a big improvement. EDIT: I was confusing Transference and Transfusion. Transfusion is the heal-stealing chain. A boost to that will be very helpful in pvp.

chary

Vital/Healing Herb upgrade will be nice for pve. And Leech upgrade pretty much fixes all my gripes about trying to leech summons currently.​​

koryn7

Apparently in the main thread on the update they have also found a change in Salvation's warp shield skill? That could be interesting maybe...

---

Mystic
Energy Leech: Instant channel and cast, down from 1 second channeling and 1 second casting time.
Nature's Barrier: Damage reduction increased to 70% up from 50%.
Sublime Transfusion: Absorbs 45% of healing (up from 30%) from enemies of your level. Up to 70% (up from 40%) from enemies of lower level.
Healing Herb: Sage and demon version. Both heal an additional 33% of casters weapon damage and have a 40% chance to take only 1 damage. Sage heals 100HP more, demon has a 50% chance to take only 1 damage.
Vital Herb: Sage and demon version. Both heal an additional 20% of casters weapon damage. Sage increases healing added each pulse, demon increases initial healing amount.
Warp Shield (Salvations third skill): Shield amount gets increased depending on weapon damage.

---

capnk

If it's weapon damage then it's a worthless upgrade. Weapon damage is a weak stat, you want base damage preferably.

dregenfox

capnk wrote: »

If it's weapon damage then it's a worthless upgrade. Weapon damage is a weak stat, you want base damage preferably.

That's how all the pet skills work. I'm guessing it will be based on salvation's magic damage, so there won't be that much difference between a fully geared and low geared mystic.

Spellbound feels like an awesome skill for pve, but a wash for pvp.

If it didn't cost 30 chi it might be worth it, as it is now befuddling is what you actually want for a pvp debuff and instant-lysing makes casting the base version a non-issue.

Instant leech will be awesome. Not only does it enable easier kill combos, it also increases the "effective" time you get to use your buffs while also saving a bunch of cast/animation time. Also no more watching your pet die mid-leech is pretty huge.

Depending on how much new healing herb ticks it might definitely be worth using now. Vital herb used to have that annoying pseudo-lag-effect of ticks canceling out potential lethal-damage...idk if that can still happen now but it would be pretty awesome if it did.

dregenfox

Finally got the omega thicket book tonight, which allowed me to do some testing.

I have 129 attack levels. Tested on a noob cleric with 0 defense levels.

Regular thicket - 6080 x 4

Regular thicket without blessing - 5529 x 4

Omega thicket - 15977 x 4

Omega thicket without blessing - 13875 x 4

The numbers almost exactly coincide with 100% scaling on attack levels, while old thicket is consistent with 50% attack level scaling. So it only took a couple years, but our only worthwhile 2-spark ultimate finally scales 100% with gears. The upgrade is definitely worthwhile, since it is roughly 2.6x more damage.

Its still gonna suck against any defensive procs, though I havent tested whether omega sets off procs.

dregenfox

Well at this point I'm not sure if anyone is reading this or even cares, but I've done some further testing on voidbringer. .

The pet receives 100% scaling on gear, attack levels, hp, defense levels, and spirit. This is good news, since it hints that the devs are more open to increasing pet scaling issues.

There's some bad news as well - the damage that is redirected to the voidbringer is based off the voidbringer's defenses. If you take 1000 damage, voidbringer reduces this to 200, while the voidbringer will take at least 1600 damage. This means the actual "hp buffer" added by voidbringer is more like 10-20k instead of the full 35k+ hp of the voidbringer.

I'm guessing this is why the pet will often die instantly in pvp. A zerk crit from endgame sins can hit 20k+ on self-buffs, which would deal almost 40k to the pet. Taken in this context, wasting 3 seconds of your time to reduce a zerk crit from 20k to 4000 is a pretty bad deal, considering you could have just used that time to cast falling petals and heal back 25k hp in less than half the time.

During rounds of testing I also found something that could possibly be an exploit, but I'd have to test it more to see if it's actually a bug. Obviously I won't reveal it here but I will submit it as a ticket if confirmed.