Laptop Neverwinter crashes during hi-violence battles :(

leafaye · June 2015

Hi All!

I wish to resurrect a Windows XP Pro Thinkpad R60e as a on-the-go game machine. It has a 55 gigabyte hard-drive and 1527 megs of memory. I installed NeverQuest on it and (just started) EverQuest and Royal Quest separately. They run pretty well, though slightly jerky in high action spots. However when I do really violent battle scenes in NeverQuest it has a nasty tendency to crash with a bug report box during the most important scenes -- like being the very last battle in a long quest!

Otherwise NeverQuest runs quit well. Some MMO sites say it depends if you use Arc or Steam to install Neverwinter because Steam supposedly stays and hogs your memory, but then I'm no techie! Would it be my memory or hard drive space or do I just pass up any battle play? I can free up 7 gigabytes on the hard drive by dumping Royal Quest or EverQuest but would like to avoid that if possible.

Any suggestions? Also on the side, your recommendations on NW /RQ -like games that can install under 8 gigs for my machine-type f you can!

Thanks & Take Care!

Leafa(ye)

Unknown · June 2015

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plasticbat · June 2015

Neverwinter itself takes 2GB of RAM or more.

k3ll0 · June 2015

Q: My laptop abacus can't run this game!
A: Don't play on an abacus.

str8slayer · June 2015

You will need a newer machine, that laptop is like... 12 years old at least lol

leafaye · June 2015

Thanks you all for replying so fast! Email surprise!!

I was just hoping to get helpful hints to push the impossible since for this penny-pinching grad student there'll just be this Thinkbook gift and my trusty ol' MacBook for a long while!

But I hope that it's not missed -- and that the GMs here PLEASE pass on my kudos to the great Cryptic dev and techie geniuses! -- that their advanced modern game still runs pretty decent -- outside of sometimes crashing you cold during savage melees like at the spellplague tower -- on a machine old as this! Sure, it's not the anime-smooth game stuff you see on Youtube, but hey, it's kind of like that old saying about the one-legged bear who can dance the moonwalk -- the wonder is not that it does the moonwalk but that it can dance at all!

On another MMO site gamers suggested that I can get max NW performance by pumping my Thinkpad to full 3gigs RAM for less than $25.00 on eBay, so I can definitely eat that over franks & beans for a month!

I'll keep all abreast! In the meantime I'll stick to less combative and crash-prone level 25 solo quests like some here suggested, thanks!!

Take Well & Care!

Leafa(ye)

str8slayer · June 2015

The game is meant to scale pretty low in the GFX department so people with potato comps can play as well. Upgrading the RAM might help alleviate the crashes a bit but it's doubtful performance will improve very much (if at all).

tvcity · June 2015

check your cpu/ gpu temperatures....mine will crash when it hits 90 degree celsius

ambisinisterr · June 2015

You're computer is simply way too old. The most honest and helpful, though brutal and cold, advice is to upgrade your computer.

55Gb Hard Drive? I believe my last laptop which I purchased in 2008 had 300 Gb and that was the minimum size from Dell. This alone tells me how old your computer is.

However here is the importance factor for Video Game Performance:

GPU > CPU > RAM

You do not have a dedicated GPU. In fact your APU (CPU GPU) is not even Intel HD. Frankly I am surprised the game even boots. However even the brand new Intel HD or whatever they call the garbage this day is still going to bog down during a standard NW gaming session at minimum settings.

Additionally your maximum RAM is 3 GB according to the manufacturer. It might help a bit but not much. The GPU and CPU performance is your main limiting factor. You're looking at spending $25 to go from a bad experience to a slightly less bad experience because the computer is, to quote Yoda, too old.

Penny pinching is fine but eventually those pennies are better pinched and saved for something better rather than burned away trying to delay the inevitable need to purchase a new CPU, GPU and new/more RAM.

I just ordered a new computer case for $700. Yes that is am empty shell for more than most people spend on an entire computer. You don't have to be stupid like me but there's a point in time where it makes more sense to save money for a few months and get something new and semi expensive rather than throwing money away delaying the inevitable.

Here is a video which I find explains this situation very well.

I never recommend buying $200 laptops. Ever. Under any circumstances gaming or not. If you plan on playing games I tell people you are looking closer to a $700 dollar minimum just to ensure you have a dedicated GPU which is not an option to forgo if you plan on playing anything other than games from over a decade ago such as Everquest.

However in this case I can guarantee you that $200 for a new laptop with a new APU and more RAM makes more sense then spending $25 now to not solve the problem. Wait a few months and try to get $300-$400 dollars together because it doesn't make sense to put money into something as old as your computer. I am sorry but that is the cold hard truth whether you are on a budget or not.

leafaye · June 2015

ambisinisterr wrote: »

You're computer is simply way too old. The most honest and helpful, though brutal and cold, advice is to upgrade your computer.

I'm not a hard-core gamer but a grad student who needs to feed a bursar's kitty over purchasing game tokens.

Again my point's missed that I'm happy to be able to play Neverwinter on a PC good enough for university work but supposedly shouldn't run Neverwinter _at all_. It whets my anticipation for the far day when I can afford to move on up to better "game-grade" machine to see Neverwinter strut all its glory. I can't praise the NW programmers enough of how much I admire that their work's adaptable enough for even "lowly" old machines to just get a taste of Neverwinter and make so otherwise passed-over future fans.

Thank you NW programmers and developers!

Meet you all in VRMMO!!

Take Care.

Leafa(ye)

twilightwatchman · June 2015

ambisinisterr wrote: »

You do not have a dedicated GPU. In fact your APU (CPU GPU) is not even Intel HD. Frankly I am surprised the game even boots. However even the brand new Intel HD or whatever they call the garbage this day is still going to bog down during a standard NW gaming session at minimum settings.

Actually, not so. My last laptop had the Intel HD onboard GPU and could run Neverwinter quite happily a medium or even mostly high settings (I had to develop a custom graphics setup rather than use the sliders). Neverwinter has a pretty low GPU load given the quality of the graphics.

Current laptop has a bog-standard dedicated GPU and can run NW at max graphics.

Unknown · June 2015

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Unknown · June 2015

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ambisinisterr · June 2015

leafaye wrote: »

I'm not a hard-core gamer but a grad student who needs to feed a bursar's kitty over purchasing game tokens.

You asked for a way to improve the crashes. The cold hard truth is the game shouldn't run on that machine and I am amazed it works at all as you keep saying you appreciate. The best advice is it doesn't matter if you are a hard core gamer or not it is much better to spend even $200 on a new computer not worth the money to begin with than it is to spend a single cent on that machine. That computer is long past the expiration date.

If you want to even casually play games I am going to say set a $500 budget minimum. However if the option is between spending $200 on a new computer which is not worth the money or a single cent on that old machine the answer is $200 on a new computer. If you can't afford it then don't spend a single cent.

twilightwatchman wrote: »

Actually, not so. My last laptop had the Intel HD onboard GPU and could run Neverwinter quite happily a medium

This is subjective. My brother installed a game I told him wouldn't run on his computer and he brought it to me saying "no it's working." If this game was playing at 1 FPS I would be surprised. The movement looked like Myst movement where he was teleporting instead of walking.

"It works!" he said. I responded "That is unplayable..." to which he said "No I can play it."

There's a difference between something being possible and something being practical.

The problem with APU's particularly on NW is that it will cause freezing and massive FPS drops when both graphical and CPU horse power is required at the same time and drops well below the playable theshold. Games below 30 FPS are not playable. I'm not the elitist snob that says you need 144 FPS or highest settings but you do need 30 FPS minimum and I know for a fact that combat in NW without a dedicated GPU on low settings drops below 30 FPS.

You might say "I can do it" but the answer is you shouldn't and doesn't mean your ability to not care means 99% of the people in the world don't. Being above 30 FPS makes things look better but being below 30 FPS is when the challenge shifts from fighting the AI to fighting the computer performance.

rollingonit · June 2015

Save your $25 and get something like this, if you are on a tight budget. Otherwise I suggest save even more and get a better one. Still with laptops you want a dedicated vid card.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834315016&leaderboard=1

With the specs it has, itll run Neverwinter easily. But dont expect it to run anything realllly graphical intensive.

PS even though I think these vanilla are a bit drab. I LUV gif signatures. DO NOT CHANGE

twilightwatchman · June 2015

ambisinisterr wrote: »

twilightwatchman wrote: »

Actually, not so. My last laptop had the Intel HD onboard GPU and could run Neverwinter quite happily a medium

This is subjective. My brother installed a game I told him wouldn't run on his computer and he brought it to me saying "no it's working." If this game was playing at 1 FPS I would be surprised. The movement looked like Myst movement where he was teleporting instead of walking.

"It works!" he said. I responded "That is unplayable..." to which he said "No I can play it."

There's a difference between something being possible and something being practical.

Well, yes - these things are always subjective. But my framerate was perfectly OK and the game was just as playable as on my current machine with a dedicated GPU. Just not as shiny. And with all due respect, you clearly haven't done any testing and are basing your opinion on extremely limited experience and what appears to be a degree of tech snobbery.

I am not for one minute suggesting that the OP's current rig won't struggle but the idea that NW is unplayable with ANY integrated GPU is simply false. From direct personal experience.

twilightwatchman · June 2015

ambisinisterr wrote: »

The problem with APU's particularly on NW is that it will cause freezing and massive FPS drops when both graphical and CPU horse power is required at the same time and drops well below the playable theshold. Games below 30 FPS are not playable. I'm not the elitist snob that says you need 144 FPS or highest settings but you do need 30 FPS minimum and I know for a fact that combat in NW without a dedicated GPU on low settings drops below 30 FPS.

You might say "I can do it" but the answer is you shouldn't and doesn't mean your ability to not care means 99% of the people in the world don't. Being above 30 FPS makes things look better but being below 30 FPS is when the challenge shifts from fighting the AI to fighting the computer performance.

Sorry - missed this pearler.

You are wrong. On two counts. First, my FPS on my old machine never dropped below 30 FPS except in heavily lagged-out instances where EVERYONE was in slide-show mode. Second, an FPS in the high twenties is, in fact, playable.

ambisinisterr · June 2015

I have tested it. Intel APU's can not run anything.

They have gotten better over the years but it is not playable. Additionally, most of those "everybody has it" issues are not in fact everybody. They are everybody with a low end, dated or non-dedicated GPU.

Without fail every single module there are complaints of framerate issues. Without fail I sit there and bite my tongue because those issues don't exist for me playing on max settings with a 4K monitor. However I also don't expect anybody to buy half the quality components that are in my system.

However there is a minimum. Intel APU's are below minimum. They exist for people who plan to play facebook games. Anything that actually requires processing power is going to require a dedicated GPU. If you are not noticing a huge difference it is more than likely because you bought one of those waste of money GPU's because the game does run fine at Max Settings on 1080p with just one GTX 780.

Do I recommend a 780? Or even a 970 now? No. A 750 Ti would probably be the best choice. An Intel HD is so far behind this is why people have issues to begin with. Once there is a dedicated GPU of at least $100 in the system the frame rate issues go away completely.

I don't have pictures of the test results from when I personally tried using an APU but the numbers denoting the difference of the lowest end NVidia GPU that isn't in the "not worth a single penny" threshold should make my point quite clear.

leafaye · June 2015

Greetings All!

A naive non-techie game-dabbler question especially to the game techies and developers here, please. (Is this also a general discussion topic question too?)

If my ancient crippled has-been R60e is so miserable at performance doing NW (unlike Royal Quest, Eldevin, Onigiri and RuneQuest so far) when it's not crashing now and then during heated battles, why am I (finally!)

at level 30? Would this imply that all the baddies and monsters and spies I sacked on my decrepit machine would be a slam-dunk one-night breeze from 1 to level 30 on a "appropriate" hi-powered NW game machine? Or does it mean that all the baddies I zeroed are really so lame in powers that most anybody even on a sluggish totally minimum game-configured machine without smooth action and where avatars skip than walk and it takes hitting keys mucho times just to make them turn and jump out of a ditch can have their baddie tushes whooped no "real skill or hard effort" needed on a "normal" machine?

Or does start getting super-tough after level 30 now?

Just asking since so many people seem to think that you can't climb anywhere on a golden-oldie clunker so how come I'm waving at 30?

Take Care and be Safe all!

Leafa(ye)

ambisinisterr · June 2015

The game does get harder as you level. In fact it is not an uncommon complaint that the game is too easy before level 40 if not 60.

Laptop Neverwinter crashes during hi-violence battles :(

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