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Oppressive Darkness + Exposed Weakness + Boons = AP Softcap?

trauthortrauthor Member Posts: 17 Arc User
edited May 2015 in The Thieves' Den
As I was agonizing over how much ArP I needed from my gear to reach 60% (Tiamat's resistance, so I've read), I started adding up the bonuses from passive effects:

Oppressive Darkness at Rank IV (Passive Ability): +30% (40%?) piercing damage when I have CA
5 ranks in Exposed Weakness (Feat): ignore 25% target resistance from stealth
Forbidden Piercing (Boon): ignore 3% DR
Draconic Armorbreaker (Boon): 400 ArP (or 4%)
============
Total: 62% (72%?)

At worst, if I don't understand how Oppressive Darkness works and the percentages have deceived me, that's 32% DR ignored without any ArP gear. My main and offhand, shirt and pants - there's really only one choice for these in the game - add up to 1500 ArP, we're now up to 46%. Add one maxed artifact and one maxed enchantment - voila! There's 60% when I'm stealthed and I haven't even looked at armor, accessories, companions, other artifacts or other enchantments.

At best, I now have 90% to 100% ArP (I don't know what the hard cap is), or possibly if I'm happy with 60% for 99 out of a 100 situations, I've made Oppressive Darkness completely superfluous and I can slot some other passive.

Am I totally off base here? Is the TR really "piercing" for this much? Because if so, it means that "out-of-the-box" the TR doesn't have to worry at all about gearing for TWO major stats - ArP and Crit (because I get 100% when stealthed.) Sure makes my gear choices easier.
Post edited by trauthor on

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    kriseinkrisein Member Posts: 84 Arc User
    edited April 2015
    trauthor wrote: »
    As I was agonizing over how much AP I needed from my gear to reach 60% (Tiamat's resistance, so I've read), I started adding up the bonuses from passive effects:

    Oppressive Darkness at Rank IV (Passive Ability): +30% (40%?) piercing damage when I have CA
    5 ranks in Exposed Weakness (Feat): ignore 25% target resistance from stealth
    Forbidden Piercing (Boon): ignore 3% DR
    Draconic Armorbreaker (Boon): 400 AP (or 4%)
    ============
    Total: 62% (72%?)

    At worst, if I don't understand how Oppressive Darkness works and the percentages have deceived me, that's 32% DR ignored without any AP gear. My main and offhand, shirt and pants - there's really only one choice for these in the game - add up to 1500 AP, we're now up to 46%. Add one maxed artifact and one maxed enchantment - voila! There's 60% when I'm stealthed and I haven't even looked at armor, accessories, companions, other artifacts or other enchantments.

    At best, I now have 90% to 100% AP (I don't know what the hard cap is), or possibly if I'm happy with 60% for 99 out of a 100 situations, I've made Oppressive Darkness completely superfluous and I can slot some other passive.

    Am I totally off base here? Is the TR really "piercing" for this much? Because if so, it means that "out-of-the-box" the TR doesn't have to worry at all about gearing for TWO major stats - AP and Crit (because I get 100% when stealthed.) Sure makes my gear choices easier.

    that's a good theory but it will only remain as that, a theory. go experience it for yourself. check your logs. then tell us what you think..
    It's more fun in the Philippines >:)
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    drkbodhidrkbodhi Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 2,378 Arc User
    edited April 2015
    Stealth attacks are not all ArPen AND Crits. I have looked at my logs, it does deliver 100% crits from at-wills. I discovered this during my time in Spinward. I watched my survivability go through the roof, compared to before I discovered this tactic.

    Most TRs may know this, but they may choose to use Encounters which end the stealth. I have that this keeps me from dying as well as doing more damage.

    Though I do wonder if Wicked Reminder may help more than we think.
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    onegaki101onegaki101 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 327 Arc User
    edited April 2015
    FYI, piercing damage is not Armor pen. Oppressive Darkness is a class feature that will do additional damage as piercing damage. Piercing damage ignores target's defense, it does not add to your armor penetration. So you actually have 32% armor pen in stealth, not 62%.
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    s1lv3rdrgnforums1lv3rdrgnforum Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 264 Arc User
    edited April 2015
    onegaki101 wrote: »
    FYI, piercing damage is not Armor pen. Oppressive Darkness is a class feature that will do additional damage as piercing damage. Piercing damage ignores target's defense, it does not add to your armor penetration. So you actually have 32% armor pen in stealth, not 62%.

    also Opp Darkness does not stack with your dmg - it does seperate dmg so it's 30% OF not +
    Bedlam: Creating chaos as a MI Exec TR
    Avariel Merilwen: Burn baby, MoF/Rene
    Aejun The Silver: Devoted to Healing, DevOP/Justice
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    trauthortrauthor Member Posts: 17 Arc User
    edited April 2015
    Ok, 32%. I was hoping OD was "ArP-like." The damage I saw from OD during testing has been ... unimpressive, to say the least.

    It turns out all of this is not so easy to test. I start with around 38% ArP after getting rid of all my ArP gear (more than I'd thought, I haven't figured out yet where the extra ArP is coming from, it isn't gear/companions.) I beat on critters with and without my gear, but the difference in damage so far has been only a couple/few thousand on, e.g., a Dazing Strike. (My gear adds about another 30% ArP.) I think I'm just not finding critters with high enough DR yet. Ideally, I want something Level 70, but if higher level critters will get me some unbiased results I can try that, too.

    I will say this, though. 38% ArP without gear may not be "game breaking," but it's still high enough that I'm really not finding it a factor in my gear choices for PvE. Add in the quest main and offhand (maxed) and my shirt/pants and the starting number is really about 53%, higher than I initially thought. That's only 7% away from the softcap, or about 700 ArP. I don't PvP, but I imagine those who gear for it shouldn't have a hard time maxing it past having to worry about debuffs.
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    nightwish021nightwish021 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 20 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    OP, I`m not sure if you are aware, but Oppressive Darkness doesn`t work the way you think. It is basically 40% (at rank 4) of your weapon damage, not 40% of the power which deals the damage. So, you can not add Oppressive Darkness to your equation. If you check the logs, you can see for yourself that Oppressive Darkness`s damage is always between 600 and 700, at least that`s how it is for me.
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    trauthortrauthor Member Posts: 17 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    OP, I`m not sure if you are aware, but Oppressive Darkness doesn`t work the way you think. It is basically 40% (at rank 4) of your weapon damage, not 40% of the power which deals the damage.

    Yeah, whenever I re-spec, OD is coming out. It's worthless.
    I will say this, though. 38% AP without gear may not be "game breaking," but it's still high enough that I'm really not finding it a factor in my gear choices for PvE. Add in the quest main and offhand (maxed) and my shirt/pants and the starting number is really about 53%, higher than I initially thought.

    In regard to the ArP/debuff part of the discussion, it gets better and better. Once I slotted a Greater Plaguefire, the 53% (stealthed) starting ArP/debuff number became 83%, which with a Perfect would be 98%, without any ArP gear. I main Duelist's Flurry, so I have had no problem keeping 3 charges. (I think Plaguefire is underrated, but that's another thread.) I can't help but be suspicious that the numbers are lying to me somehow, but that's how they add up and so far I've had no problem with any of the mobs through Spinward Rise. Well, if I'm able to confirm any of this somehow I'll post it.
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    s1lv3rdrgnforums1lv3rdrgnforum Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 264 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    It would help me greatly, and maybe others, if you would use the more common abbreviation for Armor Penetration which is ArP. AP, is Action Point(s) which is a completely different animal.

    Exposed Weakness is a great feat for exec. It's especially good for PvP types because player DR often exceeds 75%.
    Bedlam: Creating chaos as a MI Exec TR
    Avariel Merilwen: Burn baby, MoF/Rene
    Aejun The Silver: Devoted to Healing, DevOP/Justice
    Mina Rosepetal: Super Natural, Pathfinder/Melee
    Frost: Benchwarmer, Soulbinder/Fury
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    trauthortrauthor Member Posts: 17 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    It would help me greatly, and maybe others, if you would use the more common abbreviation for Armor Penetration which is ArP. AP, is Action Point(s) which is a completely different animal.

    Thanks for pointing that out, I went back and fixed it in my older posts.
    Exposed Weakness is a great feat for exec. It's especially good for PvP types because player DR often exceeds 75%.

    I'm glad that at least this part of the equation is working as I expected.
    Once I slotted a Greater Plaguefire, the 53% (stealthed) starting ArP/debuff number became 83%, which with a Perfect would be 98%, without any ArP gear.

    Here what I meant was "without any OTHER ArP gear," that is, other than my weapons and underclothes.
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