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Trickster Re-balancing Ideas
kingsgrace
Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 15 Arc User
Some suggested changes to the current Trickster Rogue to re-balance the class.
1) Change 'Shadow Strike' encounter to a stealth bar regeneration effect instead of an instant refill.
2) Change 'Bait and Switch' to generate threat and add a reflect damage effect - remove stealth refill effect.
3) +50% chance to criticially hit during stealth.
4) Change 'Concussive Strikes' Scoundrel feat to add a slow effect instead of a daze.
5) Change 'Deft Strike' to add a 'Root' effect instead of a slow.
6) Change Saboteur feat '*' to add a slow effect to Gloaming cut.
*Can't remember what this feat is called atm and servers are on maintenance.
These are a few ideas I had to balance out the current permastealth and permadaze builds that are dominating and ruining PVP at the moment. These changes keep the rogues ability to deal massive damage, whilst making it more vulnerable and adding a new element to its CC abilities in the form of slow effects.
1) Change 'Shadow Strike' encounter to a stealth bar regeneration effect instead of an instant refill.
2) Change 'Bait and Switch' to generate threat and add a reflect damage effect - remove stealth refill effect.
3) +50% chance to criticially hit during stealth.
4) Change 'Concussive Strikes' Scoundrel feat to add a slow effect instead of a daze.
5) Change 'Deft Strike' to add a 'Root' effect instead of a slow.
6) Change Saboteur feat '*' to add a slow effect to Gloaming cut.
*Can't remember what this feat is called atm and servers are on maintenance.
These are a few ideas I had to balance out the current permastealth and permadaze builds that are dominating and ruining PVP at the moment. These changes keep the rogues ability to deal massive damage, whilst making it more vulnerable and adding a new element to its CC abilities in the form of slow effects.
Post edited by kingsgrace on
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Comments
i think these changes would kill the TR class lol
especially these,
1) Change 'Shadow Strike' encounter to a stealth bar regeneration effect instead of an instant refill.
2) Change 'Bait and Switch' to generate threat and add a reflect damage effect - remove stealth refill effect.
3) +50% chance to criticially hit during stealth.
4) Change 'Concussive Strikes' Scoundrel feat to add a slow effect instead of a daze.
6) Change Saboteur feat '*' to add a slow effect to Gloaming cut.
Without giving a reason why, your comment is pretty much pointless.
Well thank you for that intelligent and insightful response. I'll file that in the 'dumb troll' section.
1 - Stealth has been reworked over and over most recently with the 2 second exposure. You are not the first to suggest changes to how encounters interact with stealth, in fact it's been like this since the dawn of perma stealth.
2 - From all the things that make TR imba, stealth is not the cause of broken pvp, you clearly haven't played during mod 3 If you think permastealth is ruining pvp. Think better, maybe you are the one ruining pvp with your ignorance.
3 - Stop beating on a dead horse, countless players have suggested changes to the TR class. Do you really think, that devs will even consider what you posted here? They won't even read it.
4 - PvP is for pvpers and pvpers spend more time figuring a way to win the match than trying to reinvent the wheel (in this case the TR class) here on the forums.
5 - The changes you propose do nothing but ruin the stealth mechanic.
6 - Most powerful crowd controller in the game? So I guess I don't need my CW anymore. Bye wizard it was nice to meet you.
7 - From all the HAMSTER you said you forgot to mention that what plagues the TR class is the imbalanced dmg that comes from shadow of demise double proccing and SE not respecting any dmg resistance attribute which makes it indeed unfair for classes that cannot dodge it. Everything else is manageable, including the annoying scoundrel's daze.
8 - Troll post, I suggest a moderator to close the thread. It does not offer any meaningful insights but stimulates rage due to its controversial nature.
MAYBE also increase all cooldowns with 50% more in pvp. Maybe (this needs debate).
In this way, all problems are solved, pvp becomes much more technical and skill comes into play (not just 1-2 hitting enemies, which is how it is now)
How long a match will be?
This is not balance this is making class useless. Because of anti TR like you now TR have no stealth and have to one shot. But here you come again with destruction ideas. No words for these pseudo balance threads.
Asha-DC(Faithful-Anointed Champion)
Vilgefortz-CW(Thaumaturge-balance)
Why does it have to be all damage? Why not just reduce a few of the TR's DPS encounters/dailies?
I have no problem with GWF's DPS because they don't have stealth and they are a sitting duck.
Because the problems concerning general damage spikes are more or less common issue with all classes, sir.
Of course, even under that premise, certain particular TR builds/powers probably should be lowered in its damage - more so than other classes, admittedly - but that doesn't mean others are just fine, sir. Generally, the inflation of gear/stats over the years, have effected and increased damage levels much higher than defense levels.
Compared to about a year ago, sir, my guess is that we're all putting up at least three times higher damage than was possible, but our HP levels haven't even doubled. I remember myself being around 13k GS and 28k HP about a year ago. Already at that time, PvP builds have seen people standing at 30k~35k HP. Nowadays, I stand at 40k HP, sir, and while I've seen GF/GWFs going above 55k and into 60k in extreme cases, most top PvP players still stand at around 40k. Our defenses have not scaled at the same level as our offense, sir.
When it comes to normal PuG level players, they're still at the 25~28k range - basically exactly the same as one year ago... and I've seen varying cases of people at 16~18k GS and still only at that HP range. This is actually one of the problems with 'casual level' PvP players we see so much in domination, sir. The inadequacy of their builds is getting more evident, now that gear progression has pushed people to higher DPS output in general -- and yet still most people have the exact same HP pool as one year ago.. this means these unprepared people are dying just too easily, sir. For many of them, TRs are obviously the most 'noticeable' in that they just drop dead in 1 hit... but when they go against any other 'prepared PvP build people', they die just as easily, sir.
Who cares if it is fun!!
Sorry but you are wrong, a simple example : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nd8SUWztEaY
2) What? Why? To me, this seems completely useless.
3) TRs already have enough ability to generate crits as it is.
4) May work, it may not. Honestly, I can't see this making much of a difference.
5) If you want root effects, play an HR
6) Slow effect?! Why? Just no.
The Scoundrel daze happen just if you are BEHIND the foe and once they miss your first strike, then daze them is basically impossibile.
I can't believe people are seriously complaining about TR controls, when there are CW that have very high damage and control.
Executioner is even more fair.. Now people can spot you sooner for longer.. Accomplishing a Crit in stealth is very very difficult, and Executioner builds are based on hitting people in stealth, to deal high damages while taking high risks.. Because Executioner have NOTHING but the demage. No control, no stealth.. just the demage. Once you deal that demage, you better have killed your foe or you are dead.
I hope people will focus on the classes that really needs a nerf, such as CWs and DCs, instead of crying behind classes that have just been balanced and that are not used anymore to suck and be an easy kill as before.
~ Adam | Trickster Rogue | Master Infiltrator Saboteur
~ Essence | Hunter Ranger | Pathfinder Trapper
~ Veyl | Scourge Warlock | Soulbinder Fury
~ Abel | Trickster Rogue | Master Infiltrator Executioner
Waiting for DRUID and MONK!
I'm not sure where, or who the above statement is directed at, because I can't seem to find the source of the bold text saying; "Maby dmg is to high but how do you want to kill DC or protector tank with 70k hp and full defense, deflect regen etc. without high dmg?", sir.
But the general problems in survival should be addressed from an objective point of view, IMO. As repeated in many posts by many TR players, there is a certain amount of consensus in regards to how the Executioners are performing right now, and more and more TR players are flocking to Executioners rather than Scoundrels, or even Saboteuers, since after the "2nd revelation" changes. This much is true.
But all classes, more or less have nukes of their own, sir. Assuming similar gear levels a combat HR still easily hits for around half-HP bar with a single swipe of Fox's Shift against the more squishy classes, and the amount of DoTs dumped upon a player usually tends to gnaw away about 30~40% of the HP bar within the first 10 seconds of the fight. CW nukes have been nerfed a little, but Ice Knife still hurts really bad on all classes, as well as a well-hit CC combo is still a disaster to any. DPS DCs tend to deal DoT damage at a rate/duration that resembles the TR Disheartening Strikes before it was nerfed, and GWF/GF attacks also have high-hit potential, sir.
Like said, many TRs actually do agree on the need for nerf to the "1-shot" of the Executioners, but even when taking that into consideration, sir, generally all classes do way too high damage and the time required to kill a certain opponent, when the conditions are right, are much too short.
Ofcourse, a general decrease in damage (or conversely, inrcease in defense) would probably strengthen some classes that already have extreme defensive capabilities, but the means of taking down certain classes should not be handled through just raw damage alone, sir.
Take for example the tanky-healy DCs. This is just an example of the solutions I see as worthwhile. IMO, conceptually the Warlocks are at odds with the DC, and therefore IMO the SW class should remain the way as it is, a really risky, fragile glass cannon -- but in compensation, it should be given the tools to directly counter what a tanky DC can do to protect -- such as the ability to remove buffs the DC casts, or deal debuffs that is on par with the amount of buffs/heals a DC can put out, as to almost completely neutralize the effects and make it no more tankier than its default state. This way each of the classes have its own risk/rewards inside combat -- hence a DC or a GF or etc.. would be very difficult to kill even with a high damage TR, but when a SW is in the vicinity the opponents would be weakened severely.
Conversely, the SW can be a direct solution to the DCs and their buffs/heals, but SWs would be very weak and fragile as they are, and would probably become a priority target -- in which case a certain amount of team play is also required for each player to try and protect the SW as best as they can...
Just examples, sir.
haha!
When people say 'sir', especially to me, what I hear is '******' instead of 'sir'.