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Gift of Faith STILL bugged
chihuab
Member Posts: 71
BUG:
1) Gift of Faith still heals more than DC's max HP.
2) Should heal back the normal amount once Gift of Faith has reached DC's max HP.
1) Gift of Faith still heals more than DC's max HP.
2) Should heal back the normal amount once Gift of Faith has reached DC's max HP.
Post edited by chihuab on
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Just like any other bank, only instead of money it's an HP savings account that is drawn from the moment it's needed. The "HP 'savings account'" is created for yourself and all allies.
Reiteration: working as intended based on description.
If you've ever read Dev tracker then you'd know It's NOT WAI.
"Faithful: Agent of the Divine: The heal from this feat is now clamped and cannot exceed the target's Maximum HP."
I have Dev Tracker as my Forums home page. I remember that report. In which case, why the bug reporting telling them what they already know? (this isn't the first report of this "bug").
Now read the DevNote again: "Faithful: Agent of the Divine: The heal from this feat is now clamped and cannot exceed the target's Maximum HP."
Now read your report: "1) Gift of Faith still heals more than DC's max HP."
Maybe it's me, but I'm seeing a disconnect here. I believe it is WAI.
The point is that GoF works with respect to the *individual* HP, etc. If the target's max HP is 100 and the DC's max HP 25, how does healing the Target back to 100 (more than the DC's HP) a wrong thing? If you are experiencing something different, then detailed reproduction steps and any other verbose data is needed so the Devs (and others like me and other players) know clearly what you're talking about so it can be fixed.
But the basic description you've provided only describes the function working as it is supposed to. I'm not trying to debunk you, I'm trying to understand what your bug-complaint is really about, that's all.
As far as I can tell it is absolutely WAI.
so why isnt affect by Healing Depression ?
I wondered the same thing. If the heal can't exceed max hp does this mean the bank ONLY stores up to their max hp? If that were the case then with healing depression (reduced heals by 50%?) would mean a heal shouldn't bring them back to full health while under healing depression.
Okay so THIS is the real question the OP was asking (makes sense to me now). It's a Tenacity thing, right? If that's a yes, than I'll stand with you, cross my arms, tap my toe as I stink-eye in the direction of the Devs with this.
I am thinking that while the individual heals (exaltation) are capped at max HP, the group heals(Bastion, HW) are causing the Gift to count collective max HP as the cap.
In any case, it is not WAI at this time. It is definitely overhealing.
If that is fixed, however, I would really like the 2nd suggestion to go into effect - if the gift is filled to it's appropriate cap, then all healing goes back to normal HoT (maybe at 2/3 or 1/2 the effectiveness).
1)Gift of faith exceeds target's hp.While I have never seen 7-digit heals,you can see 6 digit ones quite regularly.
2)There is,in fact,a difference between having a cap and not,which is quite important in pvp.If you are at 50% hp and take a hit which lowers you to 10%,you would in theory get 100%*.5 (due to healing depression) 50% of your hp back,taking you back to 60% hp.Except,when you get 150k heals,you more than fully heal.
3)Gift of faith seems to build up much faster than it should.Even with no heals equipped,you can get crazy numbers in just a couple of minutes.For one,test of faith seems to build up gift of faith which I'm not sure it's supposed to happen,since the tooltip reads "Your healing spells now heal for 25% less..." and test of faith is a feat proc,not a heal spell.I assume heal spell means healing Powers,but I could be wrong.It also seems to build up those numbers equally fast in pvp as well,which makes me think (not sure on this) that the heals are stored prior to healing depression.So,if you were gonna cast a 10k (base value) heal,it would store up 2.5k and then apply HD to the remaining 7.5 k to heal your allies,instead of applying HD to 10k,lowering it to 5k and then saving up 1.25k and healing 3.75k.Again,I have not confirmed this,it's just a guess based on the fact that gift of faith seems to build up at roughly the same speed both in pve and pvp.
4)Sometime during the early testing of this feat,I remember I made a few posts mentioning it was sometimes not affecting allies.While that was not entirely correct,it isn't wrong either.Gift of faith seems to bug out on people if it procs,but does not get you over 45% hp.Basically what was happening was,an ally would get a big hit,leaving them with,say, 20%,then they'd get a small heal (if I hadn't healed them much before and they hadn't gotten many test of faith procs) to say 30% and after that,all my heals would not grant them gift of faith.All I was getting on my Battle Log was that my gift of faith healed (ally) for 0.They seem to have to get over 45% hp for the gift to proc.In short,instead of gift of faith proccing at any point when hp < 45%,it procs when your hp bar hits 45% from either direction (from full to under 45% or from under 45% to full).The 45% mark -has- to be hit for it to activate and that shouldn't be a requirement.
LOGIC: a dying concept.
Answer:
In short hd+cap= you should never get more than 50% of your hp back in pvp.And unless you somehow have 1 million max hp already,a 150k heal will grant you more than 100% of your hp.Where's the lack of logic in that?
That way no healing is wasted after reaching the cap and you can't be healed from 1% to 100% at once in PVP.
If shadowbladegr is right and Healing Depression is applied to a heal after storing 25% in the gift, that should be fixed too. Healing Depression has to be applied first.
The logic in that is that no matter how much heal you receive you cannot take more than your maximum HP. The rest is simply discarded. The rest is not "wasted" as long as the heal was effective. Plug in your phone to charge, once the battery is full then all that extra electricity is wasted, right? Except you don't have to pay any money for the healing power that goes poof like you do with electricity. Either way your battery can only take what it can hold and nothing more. Same concept.
As stated by GentlemanCrush (which I had already presumed) - you cannot receive any more HP than your max, no matter how much healing you receive. Your answer even admits it's "theory". The Devs have actual data we will never see, so the answer has no choice but to be theory.
If it's a question of Tenacity and healing depression and all that: fair enough. But beyond that the feat is WAI. I'll leave it to any Dev who chooses to contribute further on the subject. But in short: what's going on likely doesn't classify as a 'bug'.
~shrugs~
Awwh, you meanie. I love seeing those giant heals, even if they do no actual good. It's like fireworks for clerics
I think you are missing the point.... (and yes,I am talking about pvp,which I mentioned in my post and no,this part was not in "theory",only the HD not applying on stored hp was,based on the fact that you can get over 100k heals in pvp after only seconds of healing) Let me give you an example.
You have 50k hp.Gift of faith should heal up to 100% of your hp,so up to 50k hp.Now,in pvp,since heals are halved,you should get a maximum of 25k hp from a proc.This means that,if you are fighting and take a 40k hit,you dropped to 10k hp.You should get 25k max from a Gift of faith,which would get you back to 35k hp out of 50k.You are not fully healed..However,because gift doesn't cap at 100% hp,you can get 150k heals,which fully heals you.This is not WAI.
And yes,there is no difference in pve,but my post was on pvp,there is no HD in pve.I didn't complain about overhealing being "wasted",so I'm not sure why you keep stressing that.Unless your post was not referring to mine.
What I said I wasn't sure about,was the fact that Gift might store hp prior to HD being applied to the heal.This might be wrong,however I have noticed over 100k Gift heals in pvp, with just a rotation of healing encounters.The reason gift builds up so fast might lie elsewhere,however I mentioned that this could be the reason.
Edit: Also,yes,devs have the data, but bugs are bugs in the first place exactly because of the fact they don't behave as expected :P
Here's my suspicion why I suspect it's WAI and not actually a "bug" by definition (whether it's working "right" or not is another story altogether): Gift of Faith is simply an HP storage mechanism.
Before refrigerators and all that stuff, early man would fill gourds of water and burry it for future use in the off-season. (I'm not trying to educate anyone here, just using the example). Gift of Faith (GoF) does the same thing: it is simply a 'gourd' that stores some HP for future use. A "bank account" as I have exampled before.
So let's say a couple players: a DC and [name your class] are playing PvP, each with 100k HP (to keep numbers simple):
Normal DC healing (no Gift of Faith ability):
Other class get's hit for 70K (now at 30k), DC heals for 100K; Healing Depression cuts that in half, player receives 50K = new health is 30k+50k= 80k. I get it.
Same scenario WITH GoF:
Other class get's hit for 60K (now at 40k), DC heals for 100K,; Healing Depression cuts that in half to 50k. However, player receives 37,500 because 12,500 is put into "the bank". New health is 40k+37.5k=77.5k. GoF Bank holds 12.5k. NOTE: Healing Depression penalty has already been applied to both: what the user got and what went into GoF.
Next heal brings him back to full health - more HD healing and 25% of that deposited into GoF bank.
Repeat.
Repeat.
Repeat.
Repeat.
Repeat.
GoF bank keeps filling-up... now let's say it has 500k HP deposited...
Other player gets a BIG HIT - drops him down to 10k remaining. The GoF bank fills him back up to full health, remaining HP is discarded (he can only hold 100k total). No HD penalty because HD was already in effect during the first heals that filled the GoF bank to begin with. It wouldn't be fair to apply the HD "penalty" a second time.
I don't know it, but this is what I presume is happening; hence WAI.
This is my logical conclusion. Obviously if there is definitive proof that it's not working the way I describe, I have no qualms in admitting I am wrong. But my logic process brings me to this conclusion, that what complaining players are seeing is an illusion and not taking into account the initial heals that deposit into Gift of Faith pocket as having already HD applied.
TL;DR: My own logic concludes that Healing Depression is applied *before* 25% of the heal is deposited into the Gift of Faith; when Gift of Faith is used there is no Healing Depression applied a second time (because it was already applied the first time); Gift of Faith points are stored after Healing Depression was applied, not before healing depression is applied to the original heal.
1)HD is supposed to be applied prior to storage,in which case it makes sense not to apply HD on the gift proc itself.Then, gift should build up much slower than it does now.You would have to spam heals non-stop for a few minutes to get 100k gift procs,because your heals are already decreased.There are multiple reasons why this could be happening,such as HD bugging out on this and not being applied properly,or being built up by things that should not affect it,or the math behind it being wrong.I don't know what is causing it,but I do know that if it was working properly,getting 100k gifts should take much longer.
2)If HD is supposed to apply after Gift procs and is not applied to the initial stored hp,then that would explain why it is being built up so fast,but in this case you should not be getting gifts worth more than 50% of the target's hp.
This makes sense to me. So the question is *when* is the HD 'penalty' being applied, and is it consistent and is it being applied as intended. So, to me this would be a Healing Depression question (as it applies to GoF) rather than an outright GoF question. My personal conclusion is the prior scenario: HD is applied first, then the remainder of the heal is then split 75/25 for actual and GoF. To me this is how it should work (and seems the simplest to implement in a technical way - HD is always applied when DC casts the heal).
If the intended is scenario 2, then I agree that there is too much healing going on. But I suspect for technical reasons this is not the way (intended or not) it works, as new code logic would have to know when the GoF is feated then apply HD on only 75% of cast heals and NOT apply HD on 25% of those same cast heals, but always apply HD on proc'd heals... it gets all fuzzy and stuff. :-)
I proffer a theory that a lot of people are presuming scenario 2 is the way it's supposed to be happening - but since it's not it appears to be a bug (this being the "illusion" I referred to above).
Great conversation, Shadowblabegr - hopefully our ping-pong hypothesizing will provide a little food-for-thought fodder for the devs, should they choose to at least take another look at what's really going on; determine if it's really an issue or if players are misunderstanding.